Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Special forum where professionals are encouraged to help law school applicants, students, and graduates.

What movie should we all watch at the Spivey Consulting Firm Retreat?

The Town
21
14%
Interstellar
60
40%
Cabin in the Woods
37
25%
Logan
31
21%
 
Total votes: 149

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rowdy
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby rowdy » Thu Jun 22, 2017 1:15 pm

sdavis wrote:
rowdy wrote:
MikeSpivey wrote:
sdavis wrote:
rowdy wrote:I have been through your archive, and I don't recall a post on deciding to which schools (or how many schools) one should apply. TLS "conventional wisdom" is apply broadly, blanket T14 (or lower T14 -T20 if you're a splitter), apply to a few regional schools in the area you want to practice. I'm curious what the Spivey consulting take is on that advice, or other considerations.

An interesting idea, rowdy, thanks for the suggestion and a good one to blog about at this point in the cycle. We'll keep it in mind! A quick note on "regional wisdom" -- it's not for everyone. One person's T14 isn't another person's T14. As for the regional approach, it's a solid one. Wow, I feel like I could write quite a bit about this...perhaps you'll see a blog post on this sooner than later!


T14 died this March anyway :)


We all know it's really T[whatever the rank is of the school I attend].


So true. Oh, and I meant to type "conventional wisdom" in my earlier reply, but I figured you got the gist!


The quotation marks made it clear, don't worry. Thanks for answering! I'm looking forward to the blog post.

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Experiment626
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby Experiment626 » Thu Jun 22, 2017 1:30 pm

Going through your blog to June of 2016 I didn't see this topic but perhaps addressing being a non-traditional applicant. Not the year or two off camp but closer to 10+ years post college and that applicant experience/expectations would be a good subject.

sdavis
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby sdavis » Fri Jun 23, 2017 5:06 pm

vtdelt wrote:Going through your blog to June of 2016 I didn't see this topic but perhaps addressing being a non-traditional applicant. Not the year or two off camp but closer to 10+ years post college and that applicant experience/expectations would be a good subject.

Another good suggestion! It does seem that most info out there is geared toward the K-JD crowd or 1-2 years out. Will add your idea to our possibilities, thanks vtdelt!

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perfunctory
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby perfunctory » Thu Jun 29, 2017 7:22 pm

For transfer admissions, why are some people with my stats, even though we went complete around the same date, hearing back (rejected, waitlisted) while I am not? Is this an unofficial hold? If so, is it better than a waitlist (i really wish)? Also curious - are transfer apps usually approved by one admissions officer or is there an actual committee? I do imagine your answer being: it depends. Would appreciate any type of response!

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Thu Jun 29, 2017 8:56 pm

perfunctory wrote:For transfer admissions, why are some people with my stats, even though we went complete around the same date, hearing back (rejected, waitlisted) while I am not? Is this an unofficial hold? If so, is it better than a waitlist (i really wish)? Also curious - are transfer apps usually approved by one admissions officer or is there an actual committee? I do imagine your answer being: it depends. Would appreciate any type of response!


It's probably a hold of sorts, which means you are likely on the bubble of admit or WL (if it is indeed a hold I know little variables here). So better than a WL. Put another way, it's not like your application is so bad they are waiting to reject you extra late, so you are doing better than the already rejected people.

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rowdy
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby rowdy » Fri Jun 30, 2017 1:25 pm

Awesome predictions post today Spivey & co. Re: the higher LSAT trend - you indicated in the blog it may not impact admissions chances. If it does though, won't it have a disproportionate impact on splitters? Won't law schools have more options to keep their LSAT median up, other than scraping the bottom of the GPA barrel?

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Walliums
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby Walliums » Fri Jun 30, 2017 2:25 pm

rowdy wrote:Awesome predictions post today Spivey & co. Re: the higher LSAT trend - you indicated in the blog it may not impact admissions chances. If it does though, won't it have a disproportionate impact on splitters? Won't law schools have more options to keep their LSAT median up, other than scraping the bottom of the GPA barrel?


Also on this same topic, curious as to your predictions on how this will affect scholarship offers?

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Fri Jun 30, 2017 2:53 pm

rowdy wrote:Awesome predictions post today Spivey & co. Re: the higher LSAT trend - you indicated in the blog it may not impact admissions chances. If it does though, won't it have a disproportionate impact on splitters? Won't law schools have more options to keep their LSAT median up, other than scraping the bottom of the GPA barrel?


With each permutation, these predictions get a bit more loose. Heck for all I know applications won't even be up, it's not like we got it right the last two years in a row....(that's me being horribly jackass, because we did :) But who knows these things for sure?

But anyway, my best guess would be that a number of schools at best held par on LSAT score this year. So high LSAT scorers, even splitters, will have a good early run until schools realize then can be more selective and slow it down. But when I say that in here it's not like applicants are the only people who read on TLS, so there's a lot of stuff I don't say for other reasons. So again, who knows. Which is also why I won't comment on scholarship! Hope this helps. Actually I hope this doesn't hurt.

Bottom line. A strong LSAT score is a very good thing to have LSAT score 160 and over are down 61% since 2010. So we are still in a nice age for applicants with them.

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rowdy
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby rowdy » Fri Jun 30, 2017 3:54 pm

MikeSpivey wrote:
rowdy wrote:Awesome predictions post today Spivey & co. Re: the higher LSAT trend - you indicated in the blog it may not impact admissions chances. If it does though, won't it have a disproportionate impact on splitters? Won't law schools have more options to keep their LSAT median up, other than scraping the bottom of the GPA barrel?


With each permutation, these predictions get a bit more loose. Heck for all I know applications won't even be up, it's not like we got it right the last two years in a row....(that's me being horribly jackass, because we did :) But who knows these things for sure?

But anyway, my best guess would be that a number of schools at best held par on LSAT score this year. So high LSAT scorers, even splitters, will have a good early run until schools realize then can be more selective and slow it down. But when I say that in here it's not like applicants are the only people who read on TLS, so there's a lot of stuff I don't say for other reasons. So again, who knows. Which is also why I won't comment on scholarship! Hope this helps. Actually I hope this doesn't hurt.

Bottom line. A strong LSAT score is a very good thing to have LSAT score 160 and over are down 61% since 2010. So we are still in a nice age for applicants with them.


TY based Spivey

happytransfer13
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby happytransfer13 » Tue Jul 04, 2017 10:45 pm

Hi, I've lurked on this site several times before but never really contributed and have never written an on-line "review" of any kind on any site but I feel like Mike Spivey is a worthy exception. I had a mediocre LSAT and a very low GPA and ended up going to a decent school for 1L. After doing pretty well my first semester, I contacted Mike about transferring. He is very energetic and straight forward. After a few conversations with him, he knows exactly what you want without you having to even say it and I could tell from the tone of his voice that he will do all he can to get you there. His firm doesn't advertise so I didn't know that much about him until I found him on-line through other websites very late in my 0L application cycle. When I realized how respected he is in his field, I was worried I was going to be just another applicant in the million he has when I contacted him several months later, but that was definitely not the case. He is very good at what he does and tries to learn everything about you and how those things could play out in your favor with law school admissions without wasting time. He also knows most, if not all, of the top schools' deans personally or well enough to know what they want to hear and what the don't want to hear and information like that is so valuable when it comes to putting together your applications. I can honestly go on and on writing about how satisfied I am with Spivey's services but at the end of the day, I signed a contract with him targeting two T15-20 schools and ended up with (so far) four T14 schools (3 of them in the T10) and only one denial (from a lower T14 that was my last choice and that accepts very very few transfers). I am very happy with my decision to work with Mike for the last 7 months as it was really worth the investment. Law school admissions can be really tedious and having someone help navigate you through making a school list, helping with essays, revising e-mail communications between you and the law schools and your current professors, etc. is a million times better and easier when you are working with someone who really knows what they're doing and genuinely cares about your success. I couldn't be happier with my results and my only regret is that I didn't find him sooner during my 0L year. If anyone has any questions about working with Mike Spivey, feel free to PM me.

latetothis
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby latetothis » Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:07 pm

June 2017 LSAT/Waitlist Question

Will schools where I am waitlisted automatically receive my June LSAT score or should I call/email each admissions office to notify them of the update?

I got a 164 twice and now got a 165. It's a minuscule bump, though I'm now in the 92nd percentile (as opposed to 89th). Is a one-point gain worth sharing? I'm waitlisted at Columbia, NYU, Northwestern, Georgetown, George Washington, and Washington University at St. Louis. It seems many of these schools don't even consider the June LSAT, but a few do. Thanks for reading!

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KarenButtenbaum
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby KarenButtenbaum » Thu Jul 06, 2017 9:09 am

latetothis wrote:June 2017 LSAT/Waitlist Question

Will schools where I am waitlisted automatically receive my June LSAT score or should I call/email each admissions office to notify them of the update?

I got a 164 twice and now got a 165. It's a minuscule bump, though I'm now in the 92nd percentile (as opposed to 89th). Is a one-point gain worth sharing? I'm waitlisted at Columbia, NYU, Northwestern, Georgetown, George Washington, and Washington University at St. Louis. It seems many of these schools don't even consider the June LSAT, but a few do. Thanks for reading!


All of the schools should automatically get an update in their database with new LSAT scores, but not all schools are anticipating this update for WL candidates, so they may not go searching for it in your file. It won't hurt to give them the update and remind them of your interest in attending! But if the score is still below the school's median, it may not be helpful in that regard (but the reminder that you are interested is helpful!)

KB

latetothis
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby latetothis » Thu Jul 06, 2017 10:35 am

KarenButtenbaum wrote:
All of the schools should automatically get an update in their database with new LSAT scores, but not all schools are anticipating this update for WL candidates, so they may not go searching for it in your file. It won't hurt to give them the update and remind them of your interest in attending! But if the score is still below the school's median, it may not be helpful in that regard (but the reminder that you are interested is helpful!)

KB


Thank you for the helpful response! I really appreciate it.

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Thu Jul 06, 2017 10:26 pm

Thanks HappyTransfer :) (I think I know who you are) Congrats on the success!

cremdelacrem
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby cremdelacrem » Sat Jul 08, 2017 12:44 am

If got a 170 on the June LSAT and a 3.56 GPA from Cornell (triple major taking 20+ credits a semester and a 3.8+ every semester except freshmen year which was a 1.7 and thus dragged my overall GPA down), should I apply early with my stats OR retake the LSAT and apply later in October?

My top choice is Columbia followed by NYU.

What would be most helpful? I have read that increasing my score even as little as 2 points will improve my chances significantly.

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Sat Jul 08, 2017 9:38 am

cremdelacrem wrote:If got a 170 on the June LSAT and a 3.56 GPA from Cornell (triple major taking 20+ credits a semester and a 3.8+ every semester except freshmen year which was a 1.7 and thus dragged my overall GPA down), should I apply early with my stats OR retake the LSAT and apply later in October?

My top choice is Columbia followed by NYU.

What would be most helpful? I have read that increasing my score even as little as 2 points will improve my chances significantly.


We really can't get into "do this for this specific school" but I bet this blog Karen and I wrote for Powerscore helps :)

http://blog.powerscore.com/lsat/do-law- ... a-negative

abskate36
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby abskate36 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 12:44 pm

Thanks for taking questions Spivey

I am wondering if I can get your opinion... I've accepted 48k a year at GW with a 3.7 and 166, and am regretting a bit that I didn't get your assistance earlier.
I studied for the LSAT for about 2 months while on a Rhodes scholarship this fall and applied to schools in January. I'm about 5 years out of college and interested in international law work so I'm interested in starting sooner rather than later.
Perhaps I'm just having cold feet about GW but I am wondering what advice you would give someone in this position...
Thanks in advance!

cremdelacrem
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby cremdelacrem » Sat Jul 08, 2017 1:27 pm

MikeSpivey wrote:
cremdelacrem wrote:If got a 170 on the June LSAT and a 3.56 GPA from Cornell (triple major taking 20+ credits a semester and a 3.8+ every semester except freshmen year which was a 1.7 and thus dragged my overall GPA down), should I apply early with my stats OR retake the LSAT and apply later in October?

My top choice is Columbia followed by NYU.

What would be most helpful? I have read that increasing my score even as little as 2 points will improve my chances significantly.


We really can't get into "do this for this specific school" but I bet this blog Karen and I wrote for Powerscore helps :)

http://blog.powerscore.com/lsat/do-law- ... a-negative


Thank you for the link! A quick question about this sentence from your blog: " For many on the WL, a simple increase in 1-2 points from the Feb or June LSAT can make all the difference."
Does this mean that it is the most optimal course of action is to apply with the score I have now - hope for admittance or more likely WL, resubmit a higher score from the September LSAT (if applicable) and hope to get off the waitlist? No specifics, but do I apply to T14 (T6) as early as possible with my current score (in September) and then attempt to update the score in October? Or not risk a potential rejection and just apply in October even though it is a month later and thus reduces chances of being accepted?

cinderellasyndrome
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby cinderellasyndrome » Sun Jul 09, 2017 4:25 pm

Hey, I'm not sure if I'm too late here, but I've got a question.

I applied very late in this cycle to a school I really want to go to (regional out of state) and was waitlisted. I followed up with a LOCI and a phone call. They ended up accepting me off the waitlist, after saying it was very unlikely they'd take anyone, and giving me scholarship money. With that said, between the time I was waitlisted and the time they accepted me, I got to thinking that I should wait one more cycle (for multiple reasons, personal health being primary) and settled on that pretty quickly.

My question is, given all they did for me this cycle, am I shooting myself in the foot by turning down their offer, citing my desire to wait a cycle, and applying pretty much as soon as my September LSATs come in? It's my top choice school and I'm almost positive it will be next year as well; I'm just not ready to start law school and I'm thinking it will end up being a mistake to start this fall.

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Sun Jul 09, 2017 7:26 pm

cinderellasyndrome wrote:Hey, I'm not sure if I'm too late here, but I've got a question.

I applied very late in this cycle to a school I really want to go to (regional out of state) and was waitlisted. I followed up with a LOCI and a phone call. They ended up accepting me off the waitlist, after saying it was very unlikely they'd take anyone, and giving me scholarship money. With that said, between the time I was waitlisted and the time they accepted me, I got to thinking that I should wait one more cycle (for multiple reasons, personal health being primary) and settled on that pretty quickly.

My question is, given all they did for me this cycle, am I shooting myself in the foot by turning down their offer, citing my desire to wait a cycle, and applying pretty much as soon as my September LSATs come in? It's my top choice school and I'm almost positive it will be next year as well; I'm just not ready to start law school and I'm thinking it will end up being a mistake to start this fall.


You might be for sure with THAT school. I have a feeling if it is where you wanted to be, it may be problematic next cycle.

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Sun Jul 09, 2017 7:31 pm

Hi world.

Could you do me a favor and listen to this podcast from Sept. of last year. And share with people. Share anywhere you'd like -- TLS, Reddit, Kik (I actually don't know what this is)

http://blog.spiveyconsulting.com/podcas ... ons-cycle/

Here are the benefits for you,

1. You can hear my giggle like an idiot a few times. No idea why I was doing this.

2. It will greatly relieve many later this year, come Nov, of feeling panic attacks set in.

3. It dispels like 72 law school admissions myths.

4. It explains what a counter-cycle is.

5. It gives the singular most important admissions date there is, and why.

Benefits to me,

1. It will save me so much time is questions, emails, PMS, phone calls, etc that I can take my dog for an extra walk each day.

Thanks all! Have a great cycle!

Mike

cinderellasyndrome
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby cinderellasyndrome » Sun Jul 09, 2017 8:12 pm

MikeSpivey wrote:
cinderellasyndrome wrote:Hey, I'm not sure if I'm too late here, but I've got a question.

I applied very late in this cycle to a school I really want to go to (regional out of state) and was waitlisted. I followed up with a LOCI and a phone call. They ended up accepting me off the waitlist, after saying it was very unlikely they'd take anyone, and giving me scholarship money. With that said, between the time I was waitlisted and the time they accepted me, I got to thinking that I should wait one more cycle (for multiple reasons, personal health being primary) and settled on that pretty quickly.

My question is, given all they did for me this cycle, am I shooting myself in the foot by turning down their offer, citing my desire to wait a cycle, and applying pretty much as soon as my September LSATs come in? It's my top choice school and I'm almost positive it will be next year as well; I'm just not ready to start law school and I'm thinking it will end up being a mistake to start this fall.


You might be for sure with THAT school. I have a feeling if it is where you wanted to be, it may be problematic next cycle.


So my options are to go to my dream school before I'm ready and go into way more debt than I'm comfortable with to do it, or to give up on the school entirely? :(

Does the answer change if I get my LSAT score up?

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Sun Jul 09, 2017 8:22 pm

cinderellasyndrome wrote:
MikeSpivey wrote:
cinderellasyndrome wrote:Hey, I'm not sure if I'm too late here, but I've got a question.

I applied very late in this cycle to a school I really want to go to (regional out of state) and was waitlisted. I followed up with a LOCI and a phone call. They ended up accepting me off the waitlist, after saying it was very unlikely they'd take anyone, and giving me scholarship money. With that said, between the time I was waitlisted and the time they accepted me, I got to thinking that I should wait one more cycle (for multiple reasons, personal health being primary) and settled on that pretty quickly.

My question is, given all they did for me this cycle, am I shooting myself in the foot by turning down their offer, citing my desire to wait a cycle, and applying pretty much as soon as my September LSATs come in? It's my top choice school and I'm almost positive it will be next year as well; I'm just not ready to start law school and I'm thinking it will end up being a mistake to start this fall.


You might be for sure with THAT school. I have a feeling if it is where you wanted to be, it may be problematic next cycle.


So my options are to go to my dream school before I'm ready and go into way more debt than I'm comfortable with to do it, or to give up on the school entirely? :(

Does the answer change if I get my LSAT score up?


Or ask for a deferral. Or yes retake and if you get a better score let them know you still hope to be there you were just worried about debt. If you weren't ready why did you apply this cycle? (asking for law school -- who will have the same exact question if you reapply, and think you didn't actually get your real dream school).

cinderellasyndrome
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby cinderellasyndrome » Sun Jul 09, 2017 8:35 pm

MikeSpivey wrote:
cinderellasyndrome wrote:
MikeSpivey wrote:
cinderellasyndrome wrote:Hey, I'm not sure if I'm too late here, but I've got a question.

I applied very late in this cycle to a school I really want to go to (regional out of state) and was waitlisted. I followed up with a LOCI and a phone call. They ended up accepting me off the waitlist, after saying it was very unlikely they'd take anyone, and giving me scholarship money. With that said, between the time I was waitlisted and the time they accepted me, I got to thinking that I should wait one more cycle (for multiple reasons, personal health being primary) and settled on that pretty quickly.

My question is, given all they did for me this cycle, am I shooting myself in the foot by turning down their offer, citing my desire to wait a cycle, and applying pretty much as soon as my September LSATs come in? It's my top choice school and I'm almost positive it will be next year as well; I'm just not ready to start law school and I'm thinking it will end up being a mistake to start this fall.


You might be for sure with THAT school. I have a feeling if it is where you wanted to be, it may be problematic next cycle.


So my options are to go to my dream school before I'm ready and go into way more debt than I'm comfortable with to do it, or to give up on the school entirely? :(

Does the answer change if I get my LSAT score up?


Or ask for a deferral. Or yes retake and if you get a better score let them know you still hope to be there you were just worried about debt. If you weren't ready why did you apply this cycle? (asking for law school -- who will have the same exact question if you reapply, and think you didn't actually get your real dream school).


It sort of took me a while to realize I wasn't ready. I definitely have plans to ask about deferral and remain in very close contact with them to reassure them of my continued interest.

I'm confused by your last comment. You're saying that the school will think they're not my dream school and that I'm lying to them somehow?

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Sun Jul 09, 2017 8:54 pm

cinderellasyndrome wrote:
MikeSpivey wrote:
cinderellasyndrome wrote:
MikeSpivey wrote:
cinderellasyndrome wrote:Hey, I'm not sure if I'm too late here, but I've got a question.

I applied very late in this cycle to a school I really want to go to (regional out of state) and was waitlisted. I followed up with a LOCI and a phone call. They ended up accepting me off the waitlist, after saying it was very unlikely they'd take anyone, and giving me scholarship money. With that said, between the time I was waitlisted and the time they accepted me, I got to thinking that I should wait one more cycle (for multiple reasons, personal health being primary) and settled on that pretty quickly.

My question is, given all they did for me this cycle, am I shooting myself in the foot by turning down their offer, citing my desire to wait a cycle, and applying pretty much as soon as my September LSATs come in? It's my top choice school and I'm almost positive it will be next year as well; I'm just not ready to start law school and I'm thinking it will end up being a mistake to start this fall.


You might be for sure with THAT school. I have a feeling if it is where you wanted to be, it may be problematic next cycle.


So my options are to go to my dream school before I'm ready and go into way more debt than I'm comfortable with to do it, or to give up on the school entirely? :(

Does the answer change if I get my LSAT score up?


Or ask for a deferral. Or yes retake and if you get a better score let them know you still hope to be there you were just worried about debt. If you weren't ready why did you apply this cycle? (asking for law school -- who will have the same exact question if you reapply, and think you didn't actually get your real dream school).


It sort of took me a while to realize I wasn't ready. I definitely have plans to ask about deferral and remain in very close contact with them to reassure them of my continued interest.

I'm confused by your last comment. You're saying that the school will think they're not my dream school and that I'm lying to them somehow?


You told them they are your dream school and yet after they admitted you, you are now not going and taking the LSAT. So they will be suspicious. Or at least most would be. Every year almost every school gets burned by just this. So yes, they possibly will think you were telling multiple schools that each was the dream school when the one you really want you weren't admitted to. The fact that you thought to ask makes me also think instinctually you get all of this.


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