Themis July 2019

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AussieAustin

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby AussieAustin » Wed Jul 03, 2019 6:55 pm

cherryfilter wrote:
AussieAustin wrote:
cherryfilter wrote:Random Q: Does anyone if we're given hard copies of the questions for MEE? (if you're registered to take it on your laptop)

Thanks!


I'm pretty sure you get all the questions in hard copy. I know you do for the essays I'm doing in Texas, so I would assume it's the same for the MEE. I would HATE to have to read the questions on-line.


Ah that's a relief.. I hate taking the essay tests online...can't underline or make notes... :/ sucks.


For the practice essays that I do, I copy and paste the essay to a word doc, print it out and read, make notes etc., and then type it up in word and copy it onto Themis. I want more of a simulation of the real thing, and like you, like to underline and make notes. I see no point in doing it all on-line when that's not how your'e taking the test. If it takes a couple of extra minutes to print it, so be it.

Cmal123

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby Cmal123 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 6:14 am

ADAPTIBAR $50 off code... “PASS50”

(Soo worth it btw!!)

Jcanqueen12

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby Jcanqueen12 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:06 am

Macjack wrote:
Jcanqueen12 wrote:I just want to say Civ Pro sucks and these 97 pages don't make it any better. It's like reading big slabs of rules, that just seems isolated...and my poor brain trying to make sense of it. Sigh...Dear Lord, help it make sense. :(


something that really helps me is finding old exam questions (pull out 5 old civ pro questions) and the model answers. read the question and pull out the key issues tested. do this for all 5 and you'll see the patterns of what really matters. that helps bring topics into focus for me.


Thank you! I appreciate your advice, I actually did this and it helped with understanding the information. In addition, a friend also suggested this and I think it helped because my scores have drastically improved for civil.

Also, does anyone know what the benchmark percentages mean? what does it represent?

cavalier1138

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby cavalier1138 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:12 am

Jcanqueen12 wrote:Also, does anyone know what the benchmark percentages mean? what does it represent?


If you're referring to the goals Themis sets for each MBE practice set, it's what Themis thinks an ideal performance level is for that particular set of questions. I think by the time you're doing mixed-subject questions, all the goals are going to be 65%, because that's roughly a "passing" MBE score.

Jcanqueen12

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby Jcanqueen12 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:16 am

cavalier1138 wrote:
Jcanqueen12 wrote:I just want to say Civ Pro sucks and these 97 pages don't make it any better. It's like reading big slabs of rules, that just seems isolated...and my poor brain trying to make sense of it. Sigh...Dear Lord, help it make sense. :(


If it helps (no guarantees), imagine a fake case and put it through each stage of the process. The outline is actually fairly linear; it takes you straight from pre-filing questions through post-trial procedure. So every rule could come into play to a single civil suit.


Thanks for the advice! I think my problem was that, I graduated from law school in 2016 (a bit rusty), coming from a common law jurisdiction, the Caribbean to be more exact, wasn't exposed to US civil procedure so subjects like Real Property and Torts came easier to me but US constitutional law and civil took me a longer time to grasp. Now after reading through essays on those problem areas, my scores for those two subjects are wayyyyy better.

Jcanqueen12

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby Jcanqueen12 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:21 am

cavalier1138 wrote:
Jcanqueen12 wrote:Also, does anyone know what the benchmark percentages mean? what does it represent?


If you're referring to the goals Themis sets for each MBE practice set, it's what Themis thinks an ideal performance level is for that particular set of questions. I think by the time you're doing mixed-subject questions, all the goals are going to be 65%, because that's roughly a "passing" MBE score.


I'm referring to the overall goals for each MBE subject. Like when you click on the progress overview for the MBE PQs on the progress bar. It tells you your percentage for each subject, overall timing and how many questions answered so far. When I click on for example my real property is at 70% but i see a benchmark for state and national at 52%, what does that mean? Does it mean I only need to get 52% or above for real property to pass or that's like a overall average for state and national for real property?

AussieAustin

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby AussieAustin » Sat Jul 06, 2019 10:00 am

Jcanqueen12 wrote:
cavalier1138 wrote:
Jcanqueen12 wrote:Also, does anyone know what the benchmark percentages mean? what does it represent?


If you're referring to the goals Themis sets for each MBE practice set, it's what Themis thinks an ideal performance level is for that particular set of questions. I think by the time you're doing mixed-subject questions, all the goals are going to be 65%, because that's roughly a "passing" MBE score.


I'm referring to the overall goals for each MBE subject. Like when you click on the progress overview for the MBE PQs on the progress bar. It tells you your percentage for each subject, overall timing and how many questions answered so far. When I click on for example my real property is at 70% but i see a benchmark for state and national at 52%, what does that mean? Does it mean I only need to get 52% or above for real property to pass or that's like a overall average for state and national for real property?


I think its the average of what other Themis people are doing. I would Just be focusing on yourself. It’s irrelevant what other people are doing or what national averages etc are. If you’re doing what you need to be doing, that’s all that matters.

meghant

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby meghant » Sat Jul 06, 2019 10:32 am

I've watched all the lectures and filled in all the blanks on the lecture handouts.
Is it enough to review/memorize these or do I have to review all of the long outlines as well?
Panicking now that I'm running out of time.

Anon2468

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby Anon2468 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 2:17 pm

meghant wrote:I've watched all the lectures and filled in all the blanks on the lecture handouts.
Is it enough to review/memorize these or do I have to review all of the long outlines as well?
Panicking now that I'm running out of time.


I barely touch the long outlines--I review the short final outlines sometimes, but mostly learn the law through practice MC/practice essays

cavalier1138

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby cavalier1138 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 3:24 pm

Anon2468 wrote:
meghant wrote:I've watched all the lectures and filled in all the blanks on the lecture handouts.
Is it enough to review/memorize these or do I have to review all of the long outlines as well?
Panicking now that I'm running out of time.


I barely touch the long outlines--I review the short final outlines sometimes, but mostly learn the law through practice MC/practice essays


Yeah, I wouldn't review the long outlines. The only exception for that might be reviewing weird specific areas that get tested a lot (like future interests and mortgages, for example).

But I wouldn't rely on the lecture handouts exclusively; the lectures skip over a bunch of stuff that you'll get if you read the condensed outlines.

The_miss

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby The_miss » Sat Jul 06, 2019 4:21 pm

I am really struggling with that MPT. I just can’t get it done in time. I feel like I need to read everything twice to know how to organize it all. I’m not a bad writer, I don’t think, but I am slow (plus I just learned how to touch type recently and still need lots of practice). Any advice?? I got a 85% on a mixed MBE set this morning and was feelin good, now i’m back to feeling like i’m gonna fail.

AussieAustin

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby AussieAustin » Sat Jul 06, 2019 4:42 pm

Is anyone else who has done quite a few quiz builder questions now noticing they are popping up in the mixed PQ sets? Im hoping the sets will still have a lot of new questions so I don’t get a false sense of security with how well I’m doing.

nrthwst4now

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby nrthwst4now » Sat Jul 06, 2019 4:44 pm

The_miss wrote:I am really struggling with that MPT. I just can’t get it done in time. I feel like I need to read everything twice to know how to organize it all. I’m not a bad writer, I don’t think, but I am slow (plus I just learned how to touch type recently and still need lots of practice). Any advice?? I got a 85% on a mixed MBE set this morning and was feelin good, now i’m back to feeling like i’m gonna fail.


I just did a graded MPT on Friday and felt tight on time...we will see what they say. As for the 100 question MBE PQ.

I got 73/100. I was surprised the "benchmark" was 70.

letsplayball

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby letsplayball » Sat Jul 06, 2019 5:43 pm

Can somebody reaffirm that the multiple choice questions are easier on the actual bar?

I'm having a difficult time believing that the actual bar's questions are as difficult and complicated as some of these Themis questions.

cavalier1138

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby cavalier1138 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 5:55 pm

nrthwst4now wrote:
The_miss wrote:I am really struggling with that MPT. I just can’t get it done in time. I feel like I need to read everything twice to know how to organize it all. I’m not a bad writer, I don’t think, but I am slow (plus I just learned how to touch type recently and still need lots of practice). Any advice?? I got a 85% on a mixed MBE set this morning and was feelin good, now i’m back to feeling like i’m gonna fail.


I just did a graded MPT on Friday and felt tight on time...we will see what they say. As for the 100 question MBE PQ.

I got 73/100. I was surprised the "benchmark" was 70.


The graded MPT was definitely more of a speed test than any of the other examples.

@The_miss: Have you been keeping track of which parts of the MPT are slowing you down the most? Are you starting to write at the 45 minute mark?

Dunnkirk85

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby Dunnkirk85 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:07 pm

letsplayball wrote:Can somebody reaffirm that the multiple choice questions are easier on the actual bar?

I'm having a difficult time believing that the actual bar's questions are as difficult and complicated as some of these Themis questions.


That's the rumor. But then I looked at reddit and there's a whole thread from august 2018 about how much harder the bar questions were than Themis/bar Bri questions. How are you doing on the mixed sets? I definitely have come to expect at least 6-8/34 to be testing little obscure things. Which is fine in practice but would be problematic on test day.

letsplayball

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby letsplayball » Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:52 pm

Dunnkirk85 wrote:
letsplayball wrote:Can somebody reaffirm that the multiple choice questions are easier on the actual bar?

I'm having a difficult time believing that the actual bar's questions are as difficult and complicated as some of these Themis questions.


That's the rumor. But then I looked at reddit and there's a whole thread from august 2018 about how much harder the bar questions were than Themis/bar Bri questions. How are you doing on the mixed sets? I definitely have come to expect at least 6-8/34 to be testing little obscure things. Which is fine in practice but would be problematic on test day.


I've been doing okay. Mostly within 60-65%, but rarely breaking 70% yet. This is a bit worrying lol

Dunnkirk85

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby Dunnkirk85 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 9:20 pm

Honestly if you're consistently above 60% you should be fine, according to my Themis rep. 70% is really giving yourself a big cushion. Themis questions are designed to teach, that's their program strategy. In contrast, Barbri students do about 1/3 the amount of the questions we're going to do, but they spend more time drilling black letter law. For Themis, If you're getting every practice question right, are you really learning anything? At least that's how it was explained to me and it kind of calmed my nerves. I also think that the 70% target on some quizzes is high, although I didn't think that 100 question one was very bad at all, relatively speaking. I really like Themis so far, but sometimes I wonder if they take the "scare tactics" too far when compared to other bar courses. See MBE primer #1&#2

letsplayball

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby letsplayball » Sat Jul 06, 2019 9:44 pm

Dunnkirk85 wrote:Honestly if you're consistently above 60% you should be fine, according to my Themis rep. 70% is really giving yourself a big cushion. Themis questions are designed to teach, that's their program strategy. In contrast, Barbri students do about 1/3 the amount of the questions we're going to do, but they spend more time drilling black letter law. For Themis, If you're getting every practice question right, are you really learning anything? At least that's how it was explained to me and it kind of calmed my nerves. I also think that the 70% target on some quizzes is high, although I didn't think that 100 question one was very bad at all, relatively speaking. I really like Themis so far, but sometimes I wonder if they take the "scare tactics" too far when compared to other bar courses. See MBE primer #1&#2



Ok so this is exactly what I'm talking about. I'm doing NY bar which requires getting ~67% to pass. So that means getting 70% of the questions right is just barely passing lol.

So are the themis questions designed to be ridiculously hard to teach minor point that might come up in the bar? Or are they a fair reflection of the difficulty of the questions on the bar? Because just getting above 60% on the MBE on the actual day of the bar probably won't be cutting it

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cub1014

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby cub1014 » Sun Jul 07, 2019 1:23 am

I think you misunderstand the scoring scale for the UBE. In New York you have to get a scaled score of 133 on the MBE to pass (assuming you score the same on essay day as well). That would be 67% correct if it were 133/200 and all 200 questions were graded. That's not the case though because the test is scaled as a result of only 175 of the 200 questions being scored. 67% IS NOT the minimum passing score. It is significantly lower and closer to 60% raw, at least as far as MBE is concerned.

cavalier1138

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby cavalier1138 » Sun Jul 07, 2019 6:48 am

letsplayball wrote:So are the themis questions designed to be ridiculously hard to teach minor point that might come up in the bar?


Partially. But remember that the ridiculously hard questions that turn on minor points are usually teaching an exception to the broader rule. So even if you get the question wrong, you're reinforcing the underlying rule. The particular exception might not show up on the exam, but the rule probably will.

nrthwst4now

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby nrthwst4now » Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:58 am

cub1014 wrote:I think you misunderstand the scoring scale for the UBE. In New York you have to get a scaled score of 133 on the MBE to pass (assuming you score the same on essay day as well). That would be 67% correct if it were 133/200 and all 200 questions were graded. That's not the case though because the test is scaled as a result of only 175 of the 200 questions being scored. 67% IS NOT the minimum passing score. It is significantly lower and closer to 60% raw, at least as far as MBE is concerned.


Yeah, cub1014 is right. Don't forget to factor in the scaling. Here is an OLD chart that is not 100% accurate, but it gives you the general idea on how that works.

https://www.jdadvising.com/percentage-m ... -pass-mbe/

cherryfilter

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby cherryfilter » Sun Jul 07, 2019 10:17 am

Here's what I found on JD Advising:


These are the approximate scores you want to aim for in order to have a passing MBE score:

If you are aiming for a MBE converted score of 131-135 (which is a passing score in most jurisdictions that require scores of 262-270 to pass), you should aim for 58%-62%. We suggest aiming for at least 60% to be safe. This means you should get 60-62 questions correct on a 100-question practice test or 120-124 questions correct on a full MBE exam.

If you are aiming for an MBE score of 136-140 (which is a passing MBE score in jurisdictions that require a 272-280 to pass) you should aim for 62%-65%. This means you should get 62-65 questions correct on a 100-question practice test or 124-130 questions correct on a full MBE exam.

If you are aiming for an MBE score of 144 (which is considered passing in California), you should aim for about a 67%. This means you should get 67 questions correct on a 100-question practice exam or 134 questions correct on a 200-question practice exam.

So, as a general rule, if you are answering somewhere between 60 and 67%, your MBE raw score is in the “passing zone” depending on the jurisdiction you are in.

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Dcc617

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby Dcc617 » Sun Jul 07, 2019 12:54 pm

I have taken the first two mixed questions and scored 70% on each. However, I have only gotten one civ pro answer right between the two tests. I did fine on all the civ pro tests before (between 60 and 80%), so I don't know if I need to study civ pro more or if Themis has just made those questions super duper hard.

letsplayball

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Re: Themis July 2019

Postby letsplayball » Sun Jul 07, 2019 1:26 pm

Ok I had no idea about the scaling (i.e. they just add points to your score lol). Giving me hope!



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