Themis July 2019

Discussions related to the bar exam are found in this forum
AussieAustin

New
Posts: 41
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:40 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby AussieAustin » Wed Jun 12, 2019 4:30 pm

sadfishe wrote:I'm really not satisfied with my graded essays so far and don't really know how to feel. My Grader's notes are definitely true and they are helpful, but I got a 60% and 50% respectively on these essays, using notes and taking additional time. I'm just not sure how I'm going to be able to write a passing essay if basically cheating yields those results. I feel a little adrift at the moment. Any suggestions here on what I can do? The sample answers are presumably about 100% scoring answers, but what on earth does a 65% essay look like?


I would be looking at what type of feedback you’re getting. Is it just the law you’re getting wrong, or is it the structure of your essays? Either way, you either need to learn more of the law or tweak how you are writing the essays. You can do it!

AussieAustin

New
Posts: 41
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:40 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby AussieAustin » Wed Jun 12, 2019 4:32 pm

jc9812 wrote:Does anyone know how many MBE questions Themis has? I ask because when I click on my breakdown of MBE questions, it seems to include only questions from PQ sets and practice tests.

I am basically wondering whether the questions in quiz builder are included in my breakdown of MBE questions - it seems they are not. I'm also trying to figure out how many MBE questions there are total, so I can pace myself on MBE questions/quiz builder if need be.

I don’t think they are counted. They are separate. I’m sure you can click on that part of the course progress and see your results.

barryzee

New
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2019 7:17 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby barryzee » Wed Jun 12, 2019 8:08 pm

AussieAustin wrote:
jc9812 wrote:Does anyone know how many MBE questions Themis has? I ask because when I click on my breakdown of MBE questions, it seems to include only questions from PQ sets and practice tests.

I am basically wondering whether the questions in quiz builder are included in my breakdown of MBE questions - it seems they are not. I'm also trying to figure out how many MBE questions there are total, so I can pace myself on MBE questions/quiz builder if need be.

I don’t think they are counted. They are separate. I’m sure you can click on that part of the course progress and see your results.


I think it depends where you're looking. If you're looking at Account / Home / Progress Overview, via the MBE PQs link on the course progress page, I'm pretty sure it counts all questions (Quizbuilder included), both for the headline stats and the subject stats on the left. If you click on a particular subjects (Account / Home / MBE PQs / Subjects), it includes all questions BUT excludes repeated questions in the tally (I believe excluding all wrong answers once you get the answer correct). There are other places on the site that exclude Quizbuilder questions.

ipsares

New
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon May 27, 2019 7:56 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby ipsares » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:47 pm

jc9812 wrote:Does anyone know how many MBE questions Themis has? I ask because when I click on my breakdown of MBE questions, it seems to include only questions from PQ sets and practice tests.

I am basically wondering whether the questions in quiz builder are included in my breakdown of MBE questions - it seems they are not. I'm also trying to figure out how many MBE questions there are total, so I can pace myself on MBE questions/quiz builder if need be.



I think in one of the intro lectures they say if you complete 100 percent of the course it will be around 2000-2200 questions assigned. They might have around 3-4k total tho. i don't remember where i saw that.

fan1430

New
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:22 am

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby fan1430 » Thu Jun 13, 2019 1:44 am

sadfishe wrote:I'm really not satisfied with my graded essays so far and don't really know how to feel. My Grader's notes are definitely true and they are helpful, but I got a 60% and 50% respectively on these essays, using notes and taking additional time. I'm just not sure how I'm going to be able to write a passing essay if basically cheating yields those results. I feel a little adrift at the moment. Any suggestions here on what I can do? The sample answers are presumably about 100% scoring answers, but what on earth does a 65% essay look like?



I'm happy to send you my essays so you can have a look. I got a 67 on the first one and an 83 on the second one. I didn't use notes, and I don't think my rule statements are perfect or anything. I think it really comes down to how you apply the facts in the analysis and to make sure you hit all the issues. Anyways feel free to send me a message with your email if you want to see what a 67% and 83% essay looks like and I can send it over.

AussieAustin

New
Posts: 41
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:40 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby AussieAustin » Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:25 pm

I'm so over the MBE today. I started so well doing Con law yesterday, great result on my first intro practice questions and then down hill for the next two sets of PQ. Do the questions just get harder with each set? I'm also noticing a lot of questions regarding things that weren't covered in the lectures, or are they even in the condensed outline. I have read through the full outline, but like to think I can rely on the smaller version for the majority if the content. Even my flash cards don't have a lot of the clauses on them that these practice questions are asking. My spouse keeps telling me to stick at it (they've done and passed two bar exams already) because it'll eventually click. Right now it doesn't feel like it will. I thought I was supposed to get better with each set of PQ. Right now I feel like I'm constantly just writing down rules that I don't know. It's never ending!! There must be a better way :(

Ok, rant over.

JusPassItToWill

New
Posts: 82
Joined: Wed Apr 22, 2015 10:26 am

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby JusPassItToWill » Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:25 am

Does anyone have any tips on how to memorize for someone who is not good at memorizing? I've been doing fine on the MBE questions because my mind works such that I can tell when something is wrong with how they recited the elements, but if you asked me to state what the actual elements were off the top of my head I wouldn't be able to do it. Because of that, I am having a lot of trouble with the practice essays since I can give a rough estimate of what a rule is but not what it is exactly.

Anyone else having this problem?

EDIT: For reference, I did a torts practice essay today and did pretty mediocre on it despite studying torts just last night in anticipation of the essay.

2k16L1

New
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 1:30 am

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby 2k16L1 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:57 am

JusPassItToWill wrote:Does anyone have any tips on how to memorize for someone who is not good at memorizing? I've been doing fine on the MBE questions because my mind works such that I can tell when something is wrong with how they recited the elements, but if you asked me to state what the actual elements were off the top of my head I wouldn't be able to do it. Because of that, I am having a lot of trouble with the practice essays since I can give a rough estimate of what a rule is but not what it is exactly.

Anyone else having this problem?

EDIT: For reference, I did a torts practice essay today and did pretty mediocre on it despite studying torts just last night in anticipation of the essay.


I just submitted that essay. Completely messed up on issue spotting lol

cavalier1138

Platinum
Posts: 5984
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 8:01 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby cavalier1138 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 12:27 pm

JusPassItToWill wrote:Does anyone have any tips on how to memorize for someone who is not good at memorizing? I've been doing fine on the MBE questions because my mind works such that I can tell when something is wrong with how they recited the elements, but if you asked me to state what the actual elements were off the top of my head I wouldn't be able to do it. Because of that, I am having a lot of trouble with the practice essays since I can give a rough estimate of what a rule is but not what it is exactly.

Anyone else having this problem?

EDIT: For reference, I did a torts practice essay today and did pretty mediocre on it despite studying torts just last night in anticipation of the essay.


Honestly, I think you're probably in good shape with that.

Yes, you're going to lose points on the essays in terms of the rule statements. But your analysis can still be good. And a solid MBE can make up for any weakness in the essays (especially if that weakness won't carry over the MPT).

Dunnkirk85

New
Posts: 35
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 10:49 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby Dunnkirk85 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:06 pm

Did OK on the torts essay, thought it was the easiest of the 3 graded so far. How are people doing on the MBE questions? I've done around 750 questions - what is the average % we should be at? Any ideas?

2k16L1

New
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 1:30 am

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby 2k16L1 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:26 pm

Dunnkirk85 wrote:Did OK on the torts essay, thought it was the easiest of the 3 graded so far. How are people doing on the MBE questions? I've done around 750 questions - what is the average % we should be at? Any ideas?


Don't know where we're supposed to be at...but I'm averaging 66% on 857 questions. I've done Contracts, Real Property, Torts, Civil Procedure, and working through Evidence right now. I have also done the Themis Quiz Builder, which are included in the statistic.

Dunnkirk85

New
Posts: 35
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 10:49 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby Dunnkirk85 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:32 pm

2k16L1 wrote:
Dunnkirk85 wrote:Did OK on the torts essay, thought it was the easiest of the 3 graded so far. How are people doing on the MBE questions? I've done around 750 questions - what is the average % we should be at? Any ideas?


Don't know where we're supposed to be at...but I'm averaging 66% on 857 questions. I've done Contracts, Real Property, Torts, Civil Procedure, and working through Evidence right now. I have also done the Themis Quiz Builder, which are included in the statistic.


I’m at around 67-68% including the quiz builder so right there. Hopefully we’re in good shape, but I wish Themis provided percentile metrics like Bar Bri.

cavalier1138

Platinum
Posts: 5984
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 8:01 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby cavalier1138 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:06 pm

Dunnkirk85 wrote:
2k16L1 wrote:
Dunnkirk85 wrote:Did OK on the torts essay, thought it was the easiest of the 3 graded so far. How are people doing on the MBE questions? I've done around 750 questions - what is the average % we should be at? Any ideas?


Don't know where we're supposed to be at...but I'm averaging 66% on 857 questions. I've done Contracts, Real Property, Torts, Civil Procedure, and working through Evidence right now. I have also done the Themis Quiz Builder, which are included in the statistic.


I’m at around 67-68% including the quiz builder so right there. Hopefully we’re in good shape, but I wish Themis provided percentile metrics like Bar Bri.


Why does percentile matter?

The threshold for a passing MBE score is roughly 60%. If you're over that on both your MBE and essay practice, you're doing fine. That would be true if that performance put you in the top 1% of people using Themis or in the top 99% of people using Themis. The bar isn't curved.

2k16L1

New
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 1:30 am

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby 2k16L1 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:11 pm

cavalier1138 wrote:
Dunnkirk85 wrote:
2k16L1 wrote:
Dunnkirk85 wrote:Did OK on the torts essay, thought it was the easiest of the 3 graded so far. How are people doing on the MBE questions? I've done around 750 questions - what is the average % we should be at? Any ideas?


Don't know where we're supposed to be at...but I'm averaging 66% on 857 questions. I've done Contracts, Real Property, Torts, Civil Procedure, and working through Evidence right now. I have also done the Themis Quiz Builder, which are included in the statistic.


I’m at around 67-68% including the quiz builder so right there. Hopefully we’re in good shape, but I wish Themis provided percentile metrics like Bar Bri.


Why does percentile matter?

The threshold for a passing MBE score is roughly 60%. If you're over that on both your MBE and essay practice, you're doing fine. That would be true if that performance put you in the top 1% of people using Themis or in the top 99% of people using Themis. The bar isn't curved.


Because more metrics help you visualize which subjects and sub-topics you need to improve on. For me, I'm in CA so I need at least a 67.5% to pass.

cavalier1138

Platinum
Posts: 5984
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 8:01 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby cavalier1138 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:26 pm

2k16L1 wrote:
cavalier1138 wrote:
Dunnkirk85 wrote:
2k16L1 wrote:
Dunnkirk85 wrote:Did OK on the torts essay, thought it was the easiest of the 3 graded so far. How are people doing on the MBE questions? I've done around 750 questions - what is the average % we should be at? Any ideas?


Don't know where we're supposed to be at...but I'm averaging 66% on 857 questions. I've done Contracts, Real Property, Torts, Civil Procedure, and working through Evidence right now. I have also done the Themis Quiz Builder, which are included in the statistic.


I’m at around 67-68% including the quiz builder so right there. Hopefully we’re in good shape, but I wish Themis provided percentile metrics like Bar Bri.


Why does percentile matter?

The threshold for a passing MBE score is roughly 60%. If you're over that on both your MBE and essay practice, you're doing fine. That would be true if that performance put you in the top 1% of people using Themis or in the top 99% of people using Themis. The bar isn't curved.


Because more metrics help you visualize which subjects and sub-topics you need to improve on. For me, I'm in CA so I need at least a 67.5% to pass.


Totally get that. But a percentile metric isn't a valuable metric for knowing that information. All a percentile tells you is how well you're performing in relation to everyone else using these practice questions. If you're getting more than a 67.5%, then you're passing in California. And it doesn't matter if 90% of Themis users are also getting that result.

If you want to know which sub-topics are causing you the most trouble, just click on the broader subject heading when looking at your MBE progress as a whole. It breaks down your question performance by topic.

I know we have an ingrained paranoia about how well we're doing in relation to everyone else, because that's what 3 years of the curve does to a person. But it's not important anymore. You're not being compared to anyone.

sadfishe

New
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:27 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby sadfishe » Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:55 pm

I mean, the value in percentiles is that, in my state and school for example, the pass rate is well over 80%, school rate is significantly higher, and with bar prep completion supposedly close to 97%. So if someone right now is performing at a level comparable to or better than everyone else, the math suggests they are on pace to pass with overwhelming odds.

Dunnkirk85

New
Posts: 35
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 10:49 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby Dunnkirk85 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:07 pm

It is a helpful metric because if you're getting 5/10 questions correct in one topic but still doing worse than 85% of other Themis users in that topic, you know that you're missing out on easy points. Even if your total % correct is still evening out fine. It's just helpful (to me) to see if other users are struggling in the same areas. Also could be a confidence booster (or killer) which is probably why they don't do it.

ipsares

New
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon May 27, 2019 7:56 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby ipsares » Fri Jun 14, 2019 6:37 pm

Dunnkirk85 wrote:It is a helpful metric because if you're getting 5/10 questions correct in one topic but still doing worse than 85% of other Themis users in that topic, you know that you're missing out on easy points. Even if your total % correct is still evening out fine. It's just helpful (to me) to see if other users are struggling in the same areas. Also could be a confidence booster (or killer) which is probably why they don't do it.



I believe they do do it. You can check from a laptop/desktop go to "Course Progress" to "View Overall Progress" to "View Details" under the MBE PQs. From there you can click on whatever topic and it will break down your average vs national average and state average and even breaks it down by sub topic within each subject.

So from Themis I can see my overall Civ Pro is 67% national average is 63% and CA is at 64%
Under Subject Matter Jx questions Im at, 77%, National is 73% and Cal is 77%

Is that what you are looking for? or more?


Also i found that in the quiz builder people in the past complained you could do questions from a specific subtopic of a topic but you can. If you click on the plus sign next to the topic a menu will fold down and you can choose what subtopics you want the questions from.
For Example:
MBE TORTS
INTENTIONAL TORTS INVOLVING PERSONAL INJURY
DEFENSES TO INTENTIONAL TORTS INVOLVING PERSONAL INJURY
HARMS TO PERSONAL PROPERTY AND LAND
NEGLIGENCE
STRICT LIABILITY
PRODUCTS LIABILITY
DEFAMATION, INVASION OF PRIVACY, AND BUSINESS TORTS



Also- for adaptibar users - there has been complaints that their explanations are bad - if you are using from a desktop they have beta versions of longer explanations - probably too long to be useful but can be nice and i had no idea till i logged in from a desktop to use it.

AussieAustin

New
Posts: 41
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:40 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby AussieAustin » Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:37 pm

ipsares wrote:
Dunnkirk85 wrote:It is a helpful metric because if you're getting 5/10 questions correct in one topic but still doing worse than 85% of other Themis users in that topic, you know that you're missing out on easy points. Even if your total % correct is still evening out fine. It's just helpful (to me) to see if other users are struggling in the same areas. Also could be a confidence booster (or killer) which is probably why they don't do it.



I believe they do do it. You can check from a laptop/desktop go to "Course Progress" to "View Overall Progress" to "View Details" under the MBE PQs. From there you can click on whatever topic and it will break down your average vs national average and state average and even breaks it down by sub topic within each subject.

So from Themis I can see my overall Civ Pro is 67% national average is 63% and CA is at 64%
Under Subject Matter Jx questions Im at, 77%, National is 73% and Cal is 77%

Is that what you are looking for? or more?


Also i found that in the quiz builder people in the past complained you could do questions from a specific subtopic of a topic but you can. If you click on the plus sign next to the topic a menu will fold down and you can choose what subtopics you want the questions from.
For Example:
MBE TORTS
INTENTIONAL TORTS INVOLVING PERSONAL INJURY
DEFENSES TO INTENTIONAL TORTS INVOLVING PERSONAL INJURY
HARMS TO PERSONAL PROPERTY AND LAND
NEGLIGENCE
STRICT LIABILITY
PRODUCTS LIABILITY
DEFAMATION, INVASION OF PRIVACY, AND BUSINESS TORTS



Also- for adaptibar users - there has been complaints that their explanations are bad - if you are using from a desktop they have beta versions of longer explanations - probably too long to be useful but can be nice and i had no idea till i logged in from a desktop to use it.


That’s good to know about the quiz builders. It doesn’t seem to work on an iPad though. Nothing happens when I click on the + which is why I thought you couldn’t break down by topic. I prefer doing these on my iPad to change things up a little. I guess I’ll have to try on my laptop instead.

RioGrandeLaw

New
Posts: 33
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2016 11:46 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby RioGrandeLaw » Fri Jun 14, 2019 9:44 pm

In case anyone hasn't seen it: https://www.jdadvising.com/j-d-advising ... edictions/

I'm not so sure about their Secured transactions vs. Real Property prediction: I think Family law is equally likely, so I'm studying all three pretty hard. You can see the frequency chart at https://www.jdadvising.com/wp-content/u ... b-2019.png. I think Agency and Partnerships and Conflict of laws will not be tested, and I'm almost positive Trusts and Future interests wont be tested (was on the last 2 exams), whereas Wills seems an almost sure bet.

My plan for the low likelihood subjects like Trusts, Agency & Partnerships and Conflict of Laws is to just review the outline a couple of days before the exam, and not work too hard trying to stuff my brain full of rules. I'm triageing and putting more work into memorizing rules from the MEE only subjects like ST, Family Law and Wills, plus Real Property since that's my lowest MBE score. Torts is a possible repeat from Feb, but I think it's a low likelihood, and because I scored very high on the MBE PQs (79%) and have clerked for firms that do a lot of tort work, I think I can wing it without too much study. I'm also using the SmartBarPrep and Studicata Frequency analysis of the sub-topics to guide me on which of the rules I need to memorize.

This is just my strategy. Others who easily memorize or who are farther ahead in the course may want to do the full monty.

cavalier1138

Platinum
Posts: 5984
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 8:01 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby cavalier1138 » Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:09 am

Has anyone else had an issue with overwrite mode kicking in during their essay questions? I'm not hitting a button that would make it happen, and it only seems to be applying it to previously-entered paragraphs in the text box.

justanormalperson

New
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu May 23, 2019 10:48 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby justanormalperson » Sun Jun 16, 2019 3:08 pm

Anybody feel like Civ Pro Lectures are very inefficient? I am not sure whether its the organization of it or the professor, I kinda feel its all over the place and don't think I really learned anything useful to be able to tackle MBE Civ Pro.

ballet2014

New
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:09 am

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby ballet2014 » Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:17 am

I didn't find the civ pro lectures helpful at all tbh. They skipped over so many important rules regarding timing. I've found myself going back to review my 1L outline - lectures were a waste of time

kasap

New
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Jun 08, 2019 11:17 pm

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby kasap » Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:43 am

I really messed up on the Evidence PQs. Anyone has any advice on Evidence?

strawberrieee

Bronze
Posts: 228
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2011 3:27 am

Re: Themis July 2019

Postby strawberrieee » Mon Jun 17, 2019 12:08 pm

Does anyone know a good way to memorize timing/filing deadlines in Civ Pro (21 days, 14 days, 30 days etc.)?



Return to “Bar Exam Prep and Discussion Forum?

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 28 guests