2019 July California Bar

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superzhouya

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby superzhouya » Sun Jul 28, 2019 9:31 pm

chrisokc wrote:
2807 wrote:Old timer here.

Back in it for a friend taking this test.

Can anyone give some direction on Remedy/Con Law ?

I saw a few posts/concerns already, but wondering if anyone new has some advice on these two together?

You think this is a remedy that is unconcstutnoial ?

Or a constitutional remedy for an alleged government (or private) wrong? (ie: all this current immigration stuff, or funding for the wall ..?)
Or maybe like the bakery that refuses to make a cake for a protected class...?

Hmmm... yep.

Any thoughts?

thanks folks

Good luck to you all.

A MALE HUMAN ?? WHERE ARE YOU ol Buddy !?

I think the fact that remedies is listed before con law in the name of the question may have some significance. For example, in February 2019, Question 4 was identified as "evidence/civil procedure," but civ pro was just a very minor portion. If con law is just a very minor issue, the question would be what remedy would have a constitutional implication.


I read some Reddit posts, they bet on equitable remedies question relating to requesting injunctive relief from a statute that infringes a constitutional right. Could be equal protection or 1st Amendment.

Because damage remedy or other cause of action will inevitably include a third topic.

34percent

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby 34percent » Sun Jul 28, 2019 10:38 pm

Happy88 wrote:is it realistic to dream of improving my overall score by 300+ points?



Depends on what type of reality you live in. Has it been done before, maybe. Will it be easy, doubt it. You will really have to put in the work, cause a score like that indicates a lot of problems in your writing, as well as comprehension of the law.

But, don't give up!

34percent

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby 34percent » Sun Jul 28, 2019 10:39 pm

Animal_Activist wrote:I am taking the exam in Ontario as well. I took it last time in Pasadena. For anyone taking it in Pasadena, my advice is to bring your own lunch but given the fact that there are about 5-6 restaurant choices right across the street from the convention center, if you can get out of the examination room faster than half the people slowly walking out, you could quickly be seated for lunch at Islands, Rubios, or any of the few other food places. Pasadena was also a great experience for me and the room was kept cool but not freezing.




You can't bring food in, so you'd have to check your bag, and that sucks.

34percent

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby 34percent » Sun Jul 28, 2019 10:45 pm

robinhoodOO wrote:
DodgerBlues1991 wrote:Are we certain they can't just change the questions now?


Absolutely zero chance of this happening. It takes them weeks (if not, months) to write and finalize these questions, they can't reprint and distribute everything in time, and then they'd have to deal with the added fallout of a "head fake".



They 100% have a backup set of questions, and more than 48 hours to distribute them out. But they won't.

Happy88

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby Happy88 » Sun Jul 28, 2019 11:39 pm


Pema

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby Pema » Sun Jul 28, 2019 11:56 pm



"The memo was a routine invitation
to observe a calibration session of the grading process "

The more they reveal the worse it looks.

Moabit

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby Moabit » Sun Jul 28, 2019 11:56 pm


How will this event affect the scoring of the exam?
We anticipate using the same scoring protocol and procedures as have been used in the past.
We will make every effort to assess what the impact will be on student performance and will
carefully monitor this aspect to preserve the integrity of the bar exam.


In other words, we will do whatever we decide to do and we won't tell you anything.

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rcharter1978

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby rcharter1978 » Mon Jul 29, 2019 12:46 am

Pema wrote:


"The memo was a routine invitation
to observe a calibration session of the grading process "

The more they reveal the worse it looks.


LOL, all of the schools with deans who "inadvertently" received the topics all appear to be from no-name tier III/IIII schools who likely have very low pass rates and should be worried about potentially having their accreditation pulled.

The exception is Hastings, but that school had a big decrease in bar passage that made news a few years ago. But the people I know from Hastings didn't get additional information so there is that.

If the email goes out after the bar exam and is to observe a calibration session, why was it necessary to ever include a list of topics? The list of topics wouldn't make a difference as to whether you'd attend or not.

FinallyPassedTheBar

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby FinallyPassedTheBar » Mon Jul 29, 2019 10:29 am

rcharter1978 wrote:If the email goes out after the bar exam and is to observe a calibration session, why was it necessary to ever include a list of topics? The list of topics wouldn't make a difference as to whether you'd attend or not.



Agreed.

Happy88

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby Happy88 » Mon Jul 29, 2019 11:39 am

rcharter1978 wrote:
Pema wrote:


"The memo was a routine invitation
to observe a calibration session of the grading process "

The more they reveal the worse it looks.


LOL, all of the schools with deans who "inadvertently" received the topics all appear to be from no-name tier III/IIII schools who likely have very low pass rates and should be worried about potentially having their accreditation pulled.

The exception is Hastings, but that school had a big decrease in bar passage that made news a few years ago. But the people I know from Hastings didn't get additional information so there is that.

If the email goes out after the bar exam and is to observe a calibration session, why was it necessary to ever include a list of topics? The list of topics wouldn't make a difference as to whether you'd attend or not.


What baffles me too it’s also in “order”

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Atmosphere

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby Atmosphere » Mon Jul 29, 2019 11:41 am

Pema wrote:Now they must show the error was immaterial and did not affect the outcome. To do this, after many calculations, the pass rate will be identical to July 2018.


we don’t know how many times this has happened, or whether this is an institutionalized handicap to assist struggling CA schools. The email sent out sounds like an “oops we got caught” rather than “this terrible thing has happened”.

good luck everyone, don’t let it take you out of your game.

deem

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby deem » Mon Jul 29, 2019 1:11 pm

34percent wrote:
Animal_Activist wrote:I am taking the exam in Ontario as well. I took it last time in Pasadena. For anyone taking it in Pasadena, my advice is to bring your own lunch but given the fact that there are about 5-6 restaurant choices right across the street from the convention center, if you can get out of the examination room faster than half the people slowly walking out, you could quickly be seated for lunch at Islands, Rubios, or any of the few other food places. Pasadena was also a great experience for me and the room was kept cool but not freezing.




You can't bring food in, so you'd have to check your bag, and that sucks.


I am also taking it in Ontario (and staying in a nearby hotel). Does anyone know if we are allowed to bring bags in and leave them in the hallway? I have heard that there can be long lines to get in, so I’d like to have the option of reviewing my lean sheets while waiting, but I will leave them in the hotel room if bringing a bag will cause problems. Thanks for any insight and good luck to everyone taking the exam!

moreperfect

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby moreperfect » Mon Jul 29, 2019 1:25 pm

rcharter1978 wrote:...If the email goes out after the bar exam and is to observe a calibration session, why was it necessary to ever include a list of topics? The list of topics wouldn't make a difference as to whether you'd attend or not.


The FAQ answers this question already. "Other law school staff often attend, depending on the subject matter used in the exam, which is why this information is included in the invitation." It would make sense that - based on the questions on a given exam - a law school dean might ask that a Civil Procedure or Criminal Law professor attend the calibration session rather than an Evidence professor or someone who specializes in Property law. I don't think this is as nefarious as everyone seems to think.

arose928

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby arose928 » Mon Jul 29, 2019 1:56 pm

deem wrote:
34percent wrote:
Animal_Activist wrote:I am taking the exam in Ontario as well. I took it last time in Pasadena. For anyone taking it in Pasadena, my advice is to bring your own lunch but given the fact that there are about 5-6 restaurant choices right across the street from the convention center, if you can get out of the examination room faster than half the people slowly walking out, you could quickly be seated for lunch at Islands, Rubios, or any of the few other food places. Pasadena was also a great experience for me and the room was kept cool but not freezing.




You can't bring food in, so you'd have to check your bag, and that sucks.


I am also taking it in Ontario (and staying in a nearby hotel). Does anyone know if we are allowed to bring bags in and leave them in the hallway? I have heard that there can be long lines to get in, so I’d like to have the option of reviewing my lean sheets while waiting, but I will leave them in the hotel room if bringing a bag will cause problems. Thanks for any insight and good luck to everyone taking the exam!


I took it in Oakland and a lot of people left their bags in the hallway. But FWIW I wouldn't advise cramming lean sheets on your way in. Either the information is already in your head or it isn't, and I think it's better to just go in with a clear, focused mind rather than one that's swimming with information.

ReasonablePersonSSC

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby ReasonablePersonSSC » Mon Jul 29, 2019 2:46 pm

deem wrote:
34percent wrote:
Animal_Activist wrote:I am taking the exam in Ontario as well. I took it last time in Pasadena. For anyone taking it in Pasadena, my advice is to bring your own lunch but given the fact that there are about 5-6 restaurant choices right across the street from the convention center, if you can get out of the examination room faster than half the people slowly walking out, you could quickly be seated for lunch at Islands, Rubios, or any of the few other food places. Pasadena was also a great experience for me and the room was kept cool but not freezing.




You can't bring food in, so you'd have to check your bag, and that sucks.


I am also taking it in Ontario (and staying in a nearby hotel). Does anyone know if we are allowed to bring bags in and leave them in the hallway? I have heard that there can be long lines to get in, so I’d like to have the option of reviewing my lean sheets while waiting, but I will leave them in the hotel room if bringing a bag will cause problems. Thanks for any insight and good luck to everyone taking the exam!


I sat for it in Ontario last July and we could leave bags in the hallway. Yes, there were long lines to get in (it was 104 degrees outside) but they managed it fairly well.

ipsares

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby ipsares » Mon Jul 29, 2019 2:50 pm

taking in ontario - anyone know when the doors open? i def rather go early than stand in line

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Atmosphere

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby Atmosphere » Mon Jul 29, 2019 3:46 pm

ipsares wrote:taking in ontario - anyone know when the doors open? i def rather go early than stand in line


they were relatively on time in feb

bacillusanthracis

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby bacillusanthracis » Mon Jul 29, 2019 4:06 pm

arose928 wrote:Ah the email the Hastings dean sent out clarifies things a little bit. Apparently some deans/professors were invited to a thingie *after* the bar to see how the grading is calibrated. Included in that invitation was an attachment of the list of the subjects on this year's bar. The dean didn't notice it and said another professor noticed it but assumed it was confidential.

So it doesn't *seem* like it was a 'HEY PSSSST PASS THIS ON TO YOUR STUDENTS' kinda thing. Just a run of the mill fuck up, lol.


Oh no. Fuuuuuuuck that. I already passed the bar and I'm an attorney, but no, no, no. You do NOT cut these bastards that kind of slack. Heads need to roll. Here's why. If you or any examinee, student, or graduate had committed such an error you'd be done, over, kaput. You'd be kicked out of school, a permanent, enormous black mark would be on your academic record and you wouldn't be allowed to practice law ever in this lifetime or any other for that matter. Your future would be screwed.

Show these SOBs no sympathy. NEVER show anyone at the State Bar of California the slightest sympathy because they wouldn't show it to you and they don't show it to other students.

"Oopsy, I didn't notice it"? Hell no. Is that the standard you were held to in law school? I doubt it.

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Atmosphere

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby Atmosphere » Mon Jul 29, 2019 4:20 pm

bacillusanthracis wrote:
arose928 wrote:Ah the email the Hastings dean sent out clarifies things a little bit. Apparently some deans/professors were invited to a thingie *after* the bar to see how the grading is calibrated. Included in that invitation was an attachment of the list of the subjects on this year's bar. The dean didn't notice it and said another professor noticed it but assumed it was confidential.

So it doesn't *seem* like it was a 'HEY PSSSST PASS THIS ON TO YOUR STUDENTS' kinda thing. Just a run of the mill fuck up, lol.


Oh no. Fuuuuuuuck that. I already passed the bar and I'm an attorney, but no, no, no. You do NOT cut these bastards that kind of slack. Heads need to roll. Here's why. If you or any examinee, student, or graduate had committed such an error you'd be done, over, kaput. You'd be kicked out of school, a permanent, enormous black mark would be on your academic record and you wouldn't be allowed to practice law ever in this lifetime or any other for that matter. Your future would be screwed.

Show these SOBs no sympathy. NEVER show anyone at the State Bar of California the slightest sympathy because they wouldn't show it to you and they don't show it to other students.

"Oopsy, I didn't notice it"? Hell no. Is that the standard you were held to in law school? I doubt it.


"and by the way we're raising our annual fees"

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Atmosphere

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby Atmosphere » Mon Jul 29, 2019 4:20 pm

,

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rcharter1978

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby rcharter1978 » Mon Jul 29, 2019 4:42 pm

moreperfect wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:...If the email goes out after the bar exam and is to observe a calibration session, why was it necessary to ever include a list of topics? The list of topics wouldn't make a difference as to whether you'd attend or not.


The FAQ answers this question already. "Other law school staff often attend, depending on the subject matter used in the exam, which is why this information is included in the invitation." It would make sense that - based on the questions on a given exam - a law school dean might ask that a Civil Procedure or Criminal Law professor attend the calibration session rather than an Evidence professor or someone who specializes in Property law. I don't think this is as nefarious as everyone seems to think.


They dont have enough room for all the dean's but now you can invite multiple subject matter experts? Pffffffft.

And literally what does it matter, it's unlikely they are going to test the same subject area in the next few administrations (unless it's PR) they certainly aren't going to test the same subtopic and the professors have no say in the calibration.

Moabit

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby Moabit » Mon Jul 29, 2019 5:20 pm

I agree with Rcharter. Of course, there can be some benign tortured explanation behind this mess, but the optics are pretty bad. Try to appear in the same light in your moral character application to CA bar and see how readily they will give you the benefit of doubt.

JulyRepeater

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby JulyRepeater » Mon Jul 29, 2019 6:38 pm

Absolutely agree!! I am already an attorney also, but half of my anxiety from day 1 was not knowing what subject I'd be flipping to and have to apply next. It would have been a hell of a lot better to know what to focus on. There has got to be a more effective remedy that would make this process fair to all past, current, and future bar examiners.

bacillusanthracis wrote:
arose928 wrote:Ah the email the Hastings dean sent out clarifies things a little bit. Apparently some deans/professors were invited to a thingie *after* the bar to see how the grading is calibrated. Included in that invitation was an attachment of the list of the subjects on this year's bar. The dean didn't notice it and said another professor noticed it but assumed it was confidential.

So it doesn't *seem* like it was a 'HEY PSSSST PASS THIS ON TO YOUR STUDENTS' kinda thing. Just a run of the mill fuck up, lol.


Oh no. Fuuuuuuuck that. I already passed the bar and I'm an attorney, but no, no, no. You do NOT cut these bastards that kind of slack. Heads need to roll. Here's why. If you or any examinee, student, or graduate had committed such an error you'd be done, over, kaput. You'd be kicked out of school, a permanent, enormous black mark would be on your academic record and you wouldn't be allowed to practice law ever in this lifetime or any other for that matter. Your future would be screwed.

Show these SOBs no sympathy. NEVER show anyone at the State Bar of California the slightest sympathy because they wouldn't show it to you and they don't show it to other students.

"Oopsy, I didn't notice it"? Hell no. Is that the standard you were held to in law school? I doubt it.

JDMBALLMMS

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby JDMBALLMMS » Tue Jul 30, 2019 9:03 pm

How did it go with folks? Was it easier with the "leak" or just the same? Or people ran out of time due to prior knowledge of what to write?
I think it is a no-win situation for many.

ReasonablePersonSSC

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Re: 2019 July California Bar

Postby ReasonablePersonSSC » Tue Jul 30, 2019 9:14 pm

JDMBALLMMS wrote:How did it go with folks? Was it easier with the "leak" or just the same? Or people ran out of time due to prior knowledge of what to write?
I think it is a no-win situation for many.


After all the speculation, what was the Remedies/Con Law question? Curious minds want to know.



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