THEMIS JULY 2018 - DISCUSSION Forum

[MGH1989]

Anyone else still feel like they are having trouble memorizing? I'm not talking like obscure things, but not necessarily something simple. For instance, the elements of an injunction, or the elements for a class action. Its like I intuitively know these type of things (at least enough to answer a question about them on the MBE), but when I'm under the pressure of an essay I can't for the life of my recite shit to have a decent rule statement. I feel like come exam day I'm gonna be wording things incorrectly and just making up rules.

I have this issue with torts because every single tort has 5+ elements. I've been typing out elements of rules over and over again to memorize.

At the end of the day, I think i'm going to have to wing a couple of rules on the essays because it's impossible to remember all the elements of all the obscure rules.

Exactly what I'm doing. Reading over outlines and just trying to recite every element of every rule I can remember.

[dlrkgml]

I just talked with a Themis rep who suggested that I re-type out the final review outlines for each MBE and MEE subject to help with memorization + organization of ideas (I don't have an attack outline/outline of my own and am okay not having any). Thoughts on this?

I'm concerned that the final review outlines are too bare bone and so won't do much for me- I have an okay understanding of the general ideas for each subject (the MBEs anyway) and the MBEs test us on obscure details that the FROs won't help much with. Might try it with the MEE FROs since they're shorter and I've been putting off MEE for forever.

[Lawworld19]

I am using CP flashcards for the next week and a half. Pretty brutal going thru them on top of bar prep, but mega helpful.

[Neilt001]

Anyone else still feel like they are having trouble memorizing? I'm not talking like obscure things, but not necessarily something simple. For instance, the elements of an injunction, or the elements for a class action. Its like I intuitively know these type of things (at least enough to answer a question about them on the MBE), but when I'm under the pressure of an essay I can't for the life of my recite shit to have a decent rule statement. I feel like come exam day I'm gonna be wording things incorrectly and just making up rules.

If you go through CP flashcards you will realize there is no way to memorize ever element. If some people can they deserve to pass and I deserve to fail. I am getting 60-70% correct on MBE mixed sets, graduated from a normal state law school, I should pass. If I don't, so be it. Better luck next time. I will work as hard as possible up until test day, but I really doubt we have to know every element cold to pass. I mean what do they expect us to do. live in a North Korean prison camp for three months?

Lol exactly.

And this, folks, is why it's about minimum competency and just getting that magical ~66%. You don't need to remember all the elements. That's the beauty of it. You just need to be in the ballpark, and know a little more than half. let's say you get only 3 of 5 elements? That's still a pass. Don't worry about the details and just do your best to get the general gist of it. Of course you can never remember all of it. That's the point. But most people still pass.

And as for essays, never underestimate the power of IRAC and decent bullshit. I nailed the MEE while basically inventing two of the essays cause I had no clue what they were asking. Doesn't matter.

Happy studying...

[Tala29]

Chances of family law being tested seem really low. Is anyone skipping this topic completely?

How did you come to this conclusion?

Not skipping, but barely focusing on it tbh because I also don't think it will be tested since it was in February. But not sure if that's a good call

[Tala29]

Anyone else still feel like they are having trouble memorizing? I'm not talking like obscure things, but not necessarily something simple. For instance, the elements of an injunction, or the elements for a class action. Its like I intuitively know these type of things (at least enough to answer a question about them on the MBE), but when I'm under the pressure of an essay I can't for the life of my recite shit to have a decent rule statement. I feel like come exam day I'm gonna be wording things incorrectly and just making up rules.

If you go through CP flashcards you will realize there is no way to memorize ever element. If some people can they deserve to pass and I deserve to fail. I am getting 60-70% correct on MBE mixed sets, graduated from a normal state law school, I should pass. If I don't, so be it. Better luck next time. I will work as hard as possible up until test day, but I really doubt we have to know every element cold to pass. I mean what do they expect us to do. live in a North Korean prison camp for three months?

Lol exactly.

And this, folks, is why it's about minimum competency and just getting that magical ~66%. You don't need to remember all the elements. That's the beauty of it. You just need to be in the ballpark, and know a little more than half. let's say you get only 3 of 5 elements? That's still a pass. Don't worry about the details and just do your best to get the general gist of it. Of course you can never remember all of it. That's the point. But most people still pass.

And as for essays, never underestimate the power of IRAC and decent bullshit. I nailed the MEE while basically inventing two of the essays cause I had no clue what they were asking. Doesn't matter.

Happy studying...

I am so HOPELESS at bullshitting So what if we don't know the answer at all? You just make it up completely?!

[arose928]

I just talked with a Themis rep who suggested that I re-type out the final review outlines for each MBE and MEE subject to help with memorization + organization of ideas (I don't have an attack outline/outline of my own and am okay not having any). Thoughts on this?

I'm concerned that the final review outlines are too bare bone and so won't do much for me- I have an okay understanding of the general ideas for each subject (the MBEs anyway) and the MBEs test us on obscure details that the FROs won't help much with. Might try it with the MEE FROs since they're shorter and I've been putting off MEE for forever.

Tbh that seems like a really useless suggestion. Thanks Themis. The FROs are usually 10-20 pages each, the amount of time you would take typing 100+ pages seems really not worth it for the amount you would retain. I know for me at least I've tried re-typing some rule statements from the sample essay answer and I retain almost nothing from it, with typing its really easy to just zone out and not actually digest the information.

Themis' continued suggestions to just "re-read the outline" or "type it out" are frustratingly unhelpful. All this from a company that touts itself as being based on the most advanced cognitive research and techniques

FWIW what I've started doing is, on the mixed MBE sets, I pull the flashcards for each question I missed and then that's my stack of flashcards for the day (I bought the Critical Pass flashcards). Then I re-visit it and go through the stack a couple times throughout the day in between doing other tasks to reinforce those things. Then at the end of the day I put them all back and start over the next day. It feels more manageable and is helping me focus on the areas I consistently am missing.

[Lawworld19]

I just talked with a Themis rep who suggested that I re-type out the final review outlines for each MBE and MEE subject to help with memorization + organization of ideas (I don't have an attack outline/outline of my own and am okay not having any). Thoughts on this?

I'm concerned that the final review outlines are too bare bone and so won't do much for me- I have an okay understanding of the general ideas for each subject (the MBEs anyway) and the MBEs test us on obscure details that the FROs won't help much with. Might try it with the MEE FROs since they're shorter and I've been putting off MEE for forever.

Tbh that seems like a really useless suggestion. Thanks Themis. The FROs are usually 10-20 pages each, the amount of time you would take typing 100+ pages seems really not worth it for the amount you would retain. I know for me at least I've tried re-typing some rule statements from the sample essay answer and I retain almost nothing from it, with typing its really easy to just zone out and not actually digest the information.

Themis' continued suggestions to just "re-read the outline" or "type it out" are frustratingly unhelpful. All this from a company that touts itself as being based on the most advanced cognitive research and techniques

FWIW what I've started doing is, on the mixed MBE sets, I pull the flashcards for each question I missed and then that's my stack of flashcards for the day (I bought the Critical Pass flashcards). Then I re-visit it and go through the stack a couple times throughout the day in between doing other tasks to reinforce those things. Then at the end of the day I put them all back and start over the next day. It feels more manageable and is helping me focus on the areas I consistently am missing.

I am using critical pass as well. I go thru all sets every three days. I HATE it, it is brutal in my opinion but helping more than anything. I do civ pro, torts and con law one day, crim/crim pro contracts, then property/evidence. It really solidifying my knowledge but its a bitch. So many cards.

[Lawworld19]

Then I hit Fro's for all non MBE like corp, wills, etc.

[SloppyHandwriting]

I just talked with a Themis rep who suggested that I re-type out the final review outlines for each MBE and MEE subject to help with memorization + organization of ideas (I don't have an attack outline/outline of my own and am okay not having any). Thoughts on this?

I'm concerned that the final review outlines are too bare bone and so won't do much for me- I have an okay understanding of the general ideas for each subject (the MBEs anyway) and the MBEs test us on obscure details that the FROs won't help much with. Might try it with the MEE FROs since they're shorter and I've been putting off MEE for forever.

Tbh that seems like a really useless suggestion. Thanks Themis. The FROs are usually 10-20 pages each, the amount of time you would take typing 100+ pages seems really not worth it for the amount you would retain. I know for me at least I've tried re-typing some rule statements from the sample essay answer and I retain almost nothing from it, with typing its really easy to just zone out and not actually digest the information.

Themis' continued suggestions to just "re-read the outline" or "type it out" are frustratingly unhelpful. All this from a company that touts itself as being based on the most advanced cognitive research and techniques

FWIW what I've started doing is, on the mixed MBE sets, I pull the flashcards for each question I missed and then that's my stack of flashcards for the day (I bought the Critical Pass flashcards). Then I re-visit it and go through the stack a couple times throughout the day in between doing other tasks to reinforce those things. Then at the end of the day I put them all back and start over the next day. It feels more manageable and is helping me focus on the areas I consistently am missing.

Agreed, I re-typed a few of the final outlines because what the hell. Did not learn anything new or memorize anything. After a while, it just became a challenge to see how quickly I could finish retyping so I could stop the exercise.

I am awful at flashcards, so what worked (and continues to work) is just drilling the shit out of MBE questions. Every time I get a wrong answer, I plug it into a "barebones outline" I created. By barebones, I mean just the headings. So, at the end of the day, my barebones outline is full of mortgages and random con-law nuances. That way, it's really just the stuff I keep missing.

Also, with regard to flashcards.. the Themis flashcards are the stupidest thing on the planet. It's only accessible when you're on their site via computer or tablet.. somehow they haven't worked out how to make it accessible on mobile? Waste of time.

[Lawworld19]

agreed with above poster. From your username good that you aren't making your own note cards.

I know, not funny. Just bored and burnt from studying today.

[dlrkgml]

I just talked with a Themis rep who suggested that I re-type out the final review outlines for each MBE and MEE subject to help with memorization + organization of ideas (I don't have an attack outline/outline of my own and am okay not having any). Thoughts on this?

I'm concerned that the final review outlines are too bare bone and so won't do much for me- I have an okay understanding of the general ideas for each subject (the MBEs anyway) and the MBEs test us on obscure details that the FROs won't help much with. Might try it with the MEE FROs since they're shorter and I've been putting off MEE for forever.

Tbh that seems like a really useless suggestion. Thanks Themis. The FROs are usually 10-20 pages each, the amount of time you would take typing 100+ pages seems really not worth it for the amount you would retain. I know for me at least I've tried re-typing some rule statements from the sample essay answer and I retain almost nothing from it, with typing its really easy to just zone out and not actually digest the information.

Themis' continued suggestions to just "re-read the outline" or "type it out" are frustratingly unhelpful. All this from a company that touts itself as being based on the most advanced cognitive research and techniques

FWIW what I've started doing is, on the mixed MBE sets, I pull the flashcards for each question I missed and then that's my stack of flashcards for the day (I bought the Critical Pass flashcards). Then I re-visit it and go through the stack a couple times throughout the day in between doing other tasks to reinforce those things. Then at the end of the day I put them all back and start over the next day. It feels more manageable and is helping me focus on the areas I consistently am missing.

Agreed, I re-typed a few of the final outlines because what the hell. Did not learn anything new or memorize anything. After a while, it just became a challenge to see how quickly I could finish retyping so I could stop the exercise.

I am awful at flashcards, so what worked (and continues to work) is just drilling the shit out of MBE questions. Every time I get a wrong answer, I plug it into a "barebones outline" I created. By barebones, I mean just the headings. So, at the end of the day, my barebones outline is full of mortgages and random con-law nuances. That way, it's really just the stuff I keep missing.

Also, with regard to flashcards.. the Themis flashcards are the stupidest thing on the planet. It's only accessible when you're on their site via computer or tablet.. somehow they haven't worked out how to make it accessible on mobile? Waste of time.

Thank you both for the feedback!! I also felt like I would ultimately just end up being distracted and seeing if I could up my typing speed lol

[mike241]

I took the Simulated MBE today. 73 in the AM session; 60 in the PM session. Kind of inconsistent? A little concerned about that because I felt unsure as I was taking it. I’ve been consistently scoring around 66% on the mixed exams.

I hope I can get a good cushion on the MBE because my state specific is known to be tough.

[Findedeux]

I took the Simulated MBE today. 73 in the AM session; 60 in the PM session. Kind of inconsistent? A little concerned about that because I felt unsure as I was taking it. I’ve been consistently scoring around 66% on the mixed exams.

I hope I can get a good cushion on the MBE because my state specific is known to be tough.

I thought both sessions were pretty hard but scored a little higher on the second session.

I wouldn't worry about each session and focus more if the average is high enough.

I usually finish with a fair amount of time but was using pretty much all my time in this exam.

[Lawworld19]

I took the Simulated MBE today. 73 in the AM session; 60 in the PM session. Kind of inconsistent? A little concerned about that because I felt unsure as I was taking it. I’ve been consistently scoring around 66% on the mixed exams.

I hope I can get a good cushion on the MBE because my state specific is known to be tough.

What state are you taking?

[Lawworld19]

Is anyone taking Ohio?

[hahayahah]

After getting mid-lower 60s on the first few, I finally broke in the 70s on PQ 4--but I'm convinced it's because the sets are just throwing easier questions my way.

Is this just impostor syndrome run amok or is there some merit to the idea that this is easier than what we'll be dealing with on test day?

[Findedeux]

After getting mid-lower 60s on the first few, I finally broke in the 70s on PQ 4--but I'm convinced it's because the sets are just throwing easier questions my way.

Is this just impostor syndrome run amok or is there some merit to the idea that this is easier than what we'll be dealing with on test day?

Some of the questions sets are generally easy.

I took a set two days ago and got about 90%.

I looked at the difficulty and most of them were easy.

I think the practice exams have been more reflective of actual difficulty.

[NotSkadden]

I just finished the simulated MPT/MEE and MBE, is it worth listening to these analysis videos?

I'm doing pretty well on the MBE but feel awful about the MEE so I kind of would like to skip these videos. What did people think about them?

I'm only 73% through the course so I'm trying to cut corners here and there now and focusing on my weaknesses.

[Lawworld19]

People who get 80+ on these tests and 90% on these mixed did you guys go to top top level schools or were you top of your class/law review?

I am honestly just curious.

[Lawworld19]

Is everyone here coming from top schools?

I'm just coming from a run of the mill state school in the Midwest.

[dabigchina]

I just finished the simulated MPT/MEE and MBE, is it worth listening to these analysis videos?

I'm doing pretty well on the MBE but feel awful about the MEE so I kind of would like to skip these videos. What did people think about them?

I'm only 73% through the course so I'm trying to cut corners here and there now and focusing on my weaknesses.

U should not watch those videos. Useless.

[dabigchina]

People who get 80+ on these tests and 90% on these mixed did you guys go to top top level schools or were you top of your class/law review?

I am honestly just curious.

Who the hell is getting 90%+ on mixed sets? I did well at a good school and am getting nowhere near 90% on the mixed sets.

We're gonna be fine.

[NotSkadden]

People who get 80+ on these tests and 90% on these mixed did you guys go to top top level schools or were you top of your class/law review?

I am honestly just curious.

Who the hell is getting 90%+ on mixed sets? I did well at a good school and am getting nowhere near 90% on the mixed sets.

We're gonna be fine.

I got a 90% on mixed set 4, but I think it was just significantly easier than most. Now If only I could get 90% on the MBE and not have to write anything for the MEE...

Also, TTT grad checking in.

[NotSkadden]

I just finished the simulated MPT/MEE and MBE, is it worth listening to these analysis videos?

I'm doing pretty well on the MBE but feel awful about the MEE so I kind of would like to skip these videos. What did people think about them?

I'm only 73% through the course so I'm trying to cut corners here and there now and focusing on my weaknesses.

U should not watch those videos. Useless.

Hmmm. I see you can skip around to each question within the video. I think I might do that since I was only planning on reviewing questions I got wrong, or marked confusing.

I feel like I'm so behind everyone.