2018 February CA Bar Forum

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maxmartin

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by maxmartin » Fri May 18, 2018 5:55 pm

What'sUP? wrote:
lawschool11111111 wrote:
tulanelaw123 wrote:The essay scaling was released and it is lower than July, so that is great news :cry:

Written scaled score = (Raw written score x 4.6947) – 601.6471.

For comparison, July was (Raw written score x 4.3038) - 420.5653
Where did you find this information? Can you provide the link?

I am very surprised, this is very high for February.

For comparison purposes, February 2017 scale was "Written scaled score = (Raw written score x 3.0730) – 488.1300."

Based on February 2017 scale...if you averaged 65 across all essays/PT your raw written score would have been 655, and your written scaled score would have been 1509.32.

But based on the February 2018 scale above, if you averaged 65 across all essays/PT your raw written score would have been 455, and your written scaled score would have been 1534.4.

I wonder what accounted for this
So, is that good for F18 test takers?
It is obviously bad for F18. You just need to plug in the number to see the difference between J17 and F18. These are the only two CA exam with equal 50% weight.

But F is always worse than J in terms of scale, so it is somewhat expected.

YuckNotTheBar

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by YuckNotTheBar » Fri May 18, 2018 5:56 pm

This waiting thing is not fun.
Good luck everyone.

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a male human

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by a male human » Fri May 18, 2018 5:57 pm

What'sUP? wrote:
lawschool11111111 wrote:
tulanelaw123 wrote:The essay scaling was released and it is lower than July, so that is great news :cry:

Written scaled score = (Raw written score x 4.6947) – 601.6471.

For comparison, July was (Raw written score x 4.3038) - 420.5653
Where did you find this information? Can you provide the link?

I am very surprised, this is very high for February.

For comparison purposes, February 2017 scale was "Written scaled score = (Raw written score x 3.0730) – 488.1300."

Based on February 2017 scale...if you averaged 65 across all essays/PT your raw written score would have been 655, and your written scaled score would have been 1509.32.

But based on the February 2018 scale above, if you averaged 65 across all essays/PT your raw written score would have been 455, and your written scaled score would have been 1534.4.

I wonder what accounted for this
So, is that good for F18 test takers?
It's good in the sense that a 65 essay got you more scaled points. But was it harder to get the 65 in the first place? Were the graders lenient? We don't know. It's even more difficult to tell when the grading system is different from last year.

In any case, this likely has no bearing on your hopes and dreams since the same performance theoretically should get you to the same scaled score anyway. Adjustment for difficulty is assumed to be baked into these formulas.

justanotheruser

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by justanotheruser » Fri May 18, 2018 6:07 pm

TurkeyDay wrote: I they they found it here: http://www.calbar.ca.gov/Portals/0/docu ... tr0218.pdf

Also interesting is the way that California Bar identified the topics of the essays? I would never have called Q3 Real Property and considered it a Torts question. Thoughts?

Question 1: Professional Responsibility / Contracts
Question 2: Constitutional Law
Question 3: Real Property
Question 4: Criminal Law and Procedure
Question 5: Wills / Community Property
PT Task: Objective Memorandum - Contracts
Yeah, at most I thought Q3 would be classified as a Torts / Property crossover. But I'm a bit concerned that it was classified wholly as a Real Property question. Part A was torts-focused, though some of it could be property-related torts. Part B was clearly property-focused.

*shrugs*

anon0515

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by anon0515 » Fri May 18, 2018 6:09 pm

TurkeyDay wrote:
lawschool11111111 wrote:
tulanelaw123 wrote:The essay scaling was released and it is lower than July, so that is great news :cry:

Written scaled score = (Raw written score x 4.6947) – 601.6471.

For comparison, July was (Raw written score x 4.3038) - 420.5653
Where did you find this information? Can you provide the link?

I am very surprised, this is very high for February.

For comparison purposes, February 2017 scale was "Written scaled score = (Raw written score x 3.0730) – 488.1300."

Based on February 2017 scale...if you averaged 65 across all essays/PT your raw written score would have been 655, and your written scaled score would have been 1509.32.

But based on the February 2018 scale above, if you averaged 65 across all essays/PT your raw written score would have been 455, and your written scaled score would have been 1534.4.

I wonder what accounted for this
I they they found it here: http://www.calbar.ca.gov/Portals/0/docu ... tr0218.pdf

Also interesting is the way that California Bar identified the topics of the essays? I would never have called Q3 Real Property and considered it a Torts question. Thoughts?

Question 1: Professional Responsibility / Contracts
Question 2: Constitutional Law
Question 3: Real Property
Question 4: Criminal Law and Procedure
Question 5: Wills / Community Property
PT Task: Objective Memorandum - Contracts
I also thought Q3 was more a torts questions and focused on a nuisance claim and then takings just for the last part of the question... seems it should at least be classified as a crossover question, unless I was completely off base :(

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lawschool11111111

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by lawschool11111111 » Fri May 18, 2018 6:21 pm

What'sUP? wrote:
lawschool11111111 wrote:
tulanelaw123 wrote:The essay scaling was released and it is lower than July, so that is great news :cry:

Written scaled score = (Raw written score x 4.6947) – 601.6471.

For comparison, July was (Raw written score x 4.3038) - 420.5653
Where did you find this information? Can you provide the link?

I am very surprised, this is very high for February.

For comparison purposes, February 2017 scale was "Written scaled score = (Raw written score x 3.0730) – 488.1300."

Based on February 2017 scale...if you averaged 65 across all essays/PT your raw written score would have been 655, and your written scaled score would have been 1509.32.

But based on the February 2018 scale above, if you averaged 65 across all essays/PT your raw written score would have been 455, and your written scaled score would have been 1534.4.

I wonder what accounted for this
So, is that good for F18 test takers?
Well it depends. "A male human" was correct above in that you needed to have gotten more raw essay points to get the same scaled score but only in the lower range of scores.

For example, if you got an average of 70 across all essays/PT in February 18' your scaled score = 1698.7559, which would have been higher than your scaled score in July 17' which would have been = 1688.2967

But say for example you got an average of 60 across all essays/PT in February 18' your scaled score = 1370.1269, which would have been lower than your scaled score in July 17' would have been = 1387.0307.

So it really depends

Nightcrawler

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by Nightcrawler » Fri May 18, 2018 6:31 pm

TurkeyDay wrote:
lawschool11111111 wrote:
tulanelaw123 wrote:The essay scaling was released and it is lower than July, so that is great news :cry:

Written scaled score = (Raw written score x 4.6947) – 601.6471.

For comparison, July was (Raw written score x 4.3038) - 420.5653
Where did you find this information? Can you provide the link?

I am very surprised, this is very high for February.

For comparison purposes, February 2017 scale was "Written scaled score = (Raw written score x 3.0730) – 488.1300."

Based on February 2017 scale...if you averaged 65 across all essays/PT your raw written score would have been 655, and your written scaled score would have been 1509.32.

But based on the February 2018 scale above, if you averaged 65 across all essays/PT your raw written score would have been 455, and your written scaled score would have been 1534.4.

I wonder what accounted for this
I they they found it here: http://www.calbar.ca.gov/Portals/0/docu ... tr0218.pdf

Also interesting is the way that California Bar identified the topics of the essays? I would never have called Q3 Real Property and considered it a Torts question. Thoughts?

Question 1: Professional Responsibility / Contracts
Question 2: Constitutional Law
Question 3: Real Property
Question 4: Criminal Law and Procedure
Question 5: Wills / Community Property
PT Task: Objective Memorandum - Contracts
Yeah, so weird. Q3 felt like Torts x Con Law. Aren't takings Con Law stuff? Anyway, hopefully the essay scaling compensated for the lower MBE scaling and kicked us past the 1440 line. We will know in 2.5 hours.

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a male human

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by a male human » Fri May 18, 2018 6:31 pm

Yeah, it's kind of a small detail, especially 2.5 hours before results are coming out.

It's good if you passed.

ooda

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by ooda » Fri May 18, 2018 6:54 pm

this scaling business has given me something to occupy my brain for a bit, so i'm grateful for that. not like i've been remotely productive at work anyways... :lol:

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BrainToast

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by BrainToast » Fri May 18, 2018 7:27 pm

ooda wrote:this scaling business has given me something to occupy my brain for a bit, so i'm grateful for that. not like i've been remotely productive at work anyways... :lol:
Yeah i just did a bunch of house cleaning at the office today. Nothing involving any brain power.

attyapp

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by attyapp » Fri May 18, 2018 8:29 pm

a male human wrote:
lawschool11111111 wrote:Does anyone know how graders/examiners determine what a "passing" essay score is?

Certainly not all essays are designed to be of equal difficulty, and there must be a way that they account for this.

Is there a set "passing" score they have in mind for each essay prior to applicants' essays being graded (i.e. they determine all applicants will need a 65 on Essay #1 to pass) or do they wait until all the essays are graded and then determine what a "passing" score for each essay should be based on how the applicants performed overall on each essay?

I would assume it is the latter. But what do I know
I believe it's more like the latter. There's no "passing" essay score, only a score that has historically put you on track to get a 1440 written scaled score, which would put you on track to passing once combined with a 1440 MBE scaled score. That score is approximately 62.5; so it's advised to try to aim for at least 65 on average.
How much does a good PT score help? Is it worth as much as an essay? I think I did an ok job on the PT and am hoping that can help lift me up after messing up some rules in the essays. Thanks!

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a male human

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by a male human » Fri May 18, 2018 9:00 pm

attyapp wrote:
a male human wrote:
lawschool11111111 wrote:Does anyone know how graders/examiners determine what a "passing" essay score is?

Certainly not all essays are designed to be of equal difficulty, and there must be a way that they account for this.

Is there a set "passing" score they have in mind for each essay prior to applicants' essays being graded (i.e. they determine all applicants will need a 65 on Essay #1 to pass) or do they wait until all the essays are graded and then determine what a "passing" score for each essay should be based on how the applicants performed overall on each essay?

I would assume it is the latter. But what do I know
I believe it's more like the latter. There's no "passing" essay score, only a score that has historically put you on track to get a 1440 written scaled score, which would put you on track to passing once combined with a 1440 MBE scaled score. That score is approximately 62.5; so it's advised to try to aim for at least 65 on average.
How much does a good PT score help? Is it worth as much as an essay? I think I did an ok job on the PT and am hoping that can help lift me up after messing up some rules in the essays. Thanks!
It's worth twice as much as an essay. Not sure if that's all that helpful now that it's 6:00 now... :)

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a male human

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by a male human » Fri May 18, 2018 9:04 pm

Holy SHIT...

Only 27.3% passed

http://www.calbar.ca.gov/Portals/0/docu ... y.0218.pdf


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a male human

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by a male human » Fri May 18, 2018 9:08 pm


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chicoalto0649

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by chicoalto0649 » Fri May 18, 2018 9:11 pm

attyapp wrote:
a male human wrote:
lawschool11111111 wrote:Does anyone know how graders/examiners determine what a "passing" essay score is?

Certainly not all essays are designed to be of equal difficulty, and there must be a way that they account for this.

Is there a set "passing" score they have in mind for each essay prior to applicants' essays being graded (i.e. they determine all applicants will need a 65 on Essay #1 to pass) or do they wait until all the essays are graded and then determine what a "passing" score for each essay should be based on how the applicants performed overall on each essay?

I would assume it is the latter. But what do I know
I believe it's more like the latter. There's no "passing" essay score, only a score that has historically put you on track to get a 1440 written scaled score, which would put you on track to passing once combined with a 1440 MBE scaled score. That score is approximately 62.5; so it's advised to try to aim for at least 65 on average.
How much does a good PT score help? Is it worth as much as an essay? I think I did an ok job on the PT and am hoping that can help lift me up after messing up some rules in the essays. Thanks!
I passed. Still in shock. Started studying in October with a full time job. This was my third time. I was ready to quit after the second but lesson is never give up. He’s re to help anyone who wasn’t successful with ideas and recommendations.

ooda

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by ooda » Fri May 18, 2018 9:24 pm

i passed!

Got'eem

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by Got'eem » Fri May 18, 2018 9:27 pm

Unsuccessful. Congrats to those who conquered this beast

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justanotheruser

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by justanotheruser » Fri May 18, 2018 9:29 pm

This was my 5th or 6th attempt at the bar. I've seriously lost count.

I finally passed. Words can't describe the relief and gratitude I feel for finally being done with this.

For those who got bad news, don't give up.

scard

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by scard » Fri May 18, 2018 9:29 pm

Well I get to retake.. 27.3% passrate this time around.. great

Mxmasterr

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by Mxmasterr » Fri May 18, 2018 9:36 pm

attyapp wrote:
a male human wrote:
lawschool11111111 wrote:Does anyone know how graders/examiners determine what a "passing" essay score is?

Certainly not all essays are designed to be of equal difficulty, and there must be a way that they account for this.

Is there a set "passing" score they have in mind for each essay prior to applicants' essays being graded (i.e. they determine all applicants will need a 65 on Essay #1 to pass) or do they wait until all the essays are graded and then determine what a "passing" score for each essay should be based on how the applicants performed overall on each essay?

I would assume it is the latter. But what do I know
I believe it's more like the latter. There's no "passing" essay score, only a score that has historically put you on track to get a 1440 written scaled score, which would put you on track to passing once combined with a 1440 MBE scaled score. That score is approximately 62.5; so it's advised to try to aim for at least 65 on average.
How much does a good PT score help? Is it worth as much as an essay? I think I did an ok job on the PT and am hoping that can help lift me up after messing up some rules in the essays. Thanks!
howd everyone do? Now I want to see the model answers i figured theyd post those now too. Big weight off the shoulders, but these last post told me that I really did not know how this damn exam was scored, which is ridiculous. I'm sorry for those who did not make the arbitrary cut.

BrainToast

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by BrainToast » Fri May 18, 2018 9:52 pm

Passed.

Good luck to everyone.

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patentlawgeek

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by patentlawgeek » Fri May 18, 2018 10:13 pm

Did not pass for the second time :(((

Has anyone transferred their MBE score from CA to DC? If so, how much would it approximately cost, and how soon can one get licensed? I figured that since I am doing patent law, I do not necessarily need CA bar? Any thoughts or recommendations would be appreciated.

Failing for the second time sucks even more than the first time, especially since I was so close to passing the first time. Not sure if it is worth the pain to go through it a third time, with the possibility of failing again...

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chicoalto0649

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by chicoalto0649 » Fri May 18, 2018 10:43 pm

Today the State Bar of California released the results of the February 2018 California Bar Exam, and announced that 1,282 people (27.3 percent of applicants) passed the General Bar Exam. If those applicants satisfy all other requirements for admission, they will be eligible to be licensed by the State Bar to practice law in California.

"I warmly congratulate the 1,282 applicants who passed the latest California Bar Exam. I also want to acknowledge a low overall pass rate," said Leah T. Wilson, Executive Director of the State Bar of California. "In order to help improve performance on the bar exam, we recently launched the Productive Mindset Intervention Program. Through this program and ongoing study, we hope to better understand the downward trend of bar exam pass rates."

The mean scaled Multistate Bar Examination score on the February 2018 General Bar Exam in California was 1,355; the national average was 1,341.

The Productive Mindset Intervention Program will be available to applicants beginning with the July 2018 Bar Exam. This program is a partnership with researchers at Stanford University, the University of Southern California, and Indiana University. The program is designed to improve exam performance across the board, with a particular boost for people of color and women. More than 1,700 applicants who are registered for the July 2018 California Bar Exam have registered for the program.

After historically low passage rates last year, the State Bar commissioned California’s first-ever comprehensive series of studies of the bar exam, including a review of the passing score and whether the content of the bar exam is appropriate to test the knowledge and skills needed by entry level attorneys. Based on the information available, no changes to the passing score or the content of the exam were adopted.

The State Bar is now preparing to undertake a California attorney job Analysis Study to collect information about the knowledge and skills that entry level attorneys need. The study results will provide the foundation for future evaluation of the content, format, and pass line of the California Bar Exam.

"Over the long term, we need to be sure that we are testing for the skills and content that new attorneys need, and that we are doing so in the right format," Wilson said.

Preliminary statistical analyses from the February 2018 General Bar Exam:

4,701 applicants completed the exam
1,267 (27 percent) were first-time applicants
The passing rate for first-time applicants was 39 percent overall
3,434 applicants were repeat applicants
The passing rate for repeat applicants was 23 percent overall
Passing rate (rounded to whole numbers) by law school type:

School Type
First-Timers
Repeaters
California ABA
46%
31%
Out-of-State ABA
35%
27%
California Accredited (but not ABA)
23%
9%
Unaccredited: Fixed-Facility
33%
5%
Unaccredited: Correspondence
14%
13%
Unaccredited Distance Learning
24%
5%
All Others
43%
19%
All Applicants

redmessengerbag

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by redmessengerbag » Fri May 18, 2018 11:19 pm

I achieved minimum competence today!

Thanks guys for entertaining and responding to my posts over the past few weeks, it helped get through the nervous/anxious period. I do wish they release the scores to see how well I did, but I don't care, and I'm glad I'm not getting that packet in the mail.

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Post by Bla Bla Bla Blah » Sat May 19, 2018 12:07 am

Didn't bring my bar exam number with me tonight because I didn't want to deal with the anxiety... but when everyone started texting me about it, logged into my account. All done :)


Hope everyone did well! Plenty of study materials if anyone's interested, and passed with 3 weeks study. I'll talk more about what I did to go into the bar confidently tomorrow... when I'm not so God damned drunk.

Best wishes to everyone.

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