2018 February CA Bar

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woowoo

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby woowoo » Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:15 pm

First-time taker here -- out-of-state attorney who recently moved to CA (taken and passed two other bar exams, but it's been a while, and CA is clearly on another level). Enrolled in BarBri's "attorney course" and subscribed to BarEssays.com. I can elect to take the one-day essay-only attorney's exam, but based on everything I've read and seen, looks like it's much better raw odds to take the full exam, so that's where I'm at right now.

Anybody working FT and studying? Any Bay Area study groups? I've just started my prep, but going to kick it in full gear here pretty soon. Good luck to everyone!

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a male human

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby a male human » Wed Dec 20, 2017 12:03 am

justanotheruser wrote:
mcmand wrote:
PorscheFanatic wrote:Just want to get your thoughts on my study plan...

So right now I'm writing out about 8 essays per week on whichever topic I'm working on that week. The first 2-3 essays I write, I feel like it's a better use of my time to write them with an open outline, while I'm learning and memorizing the law better still. It seems like it would be a waste of my time to write those first couple essays completely closed book if I only have 1 page of information in my head or if I would completely miss issues because of lack of law knowledge.

Is this an ok strategy? This way I'm still writing out 5-6 essays each week completely closed book.


I pretty much did this up until a couple days before the July exam. I did not have the extra time to separately memorize stuff, and I wanted to do more essays and get familiar with topics, so I figured practicing with notes would help it stick.

Probably should still do some memorization at some point but I think open note essays is okay to start. If I still missed stuff or saw helpful rule statements in the model answers, I copied those onto flash carfs afterward.


Other than this, is there another way people would advise on approaching one's very first essays? It just doesn't make sense for me to approach the first few essays pretty much cold (though I may know more than I think I do because of MBE practice).

Another related question... I know quality > quantity but, ideally, how many total essays will you want to have done (both in total and per subject) by bar exam week? I know a male human's talked about essay cooking and I can sorta compensate for being pressed for time by focusing a bit more on the BarSecrets/Saccuzzo essays predictions.

Thanks!


For your first essays, I think it's totally fine to do them open book and untimed. Just try to get through an essay as best you can, and study the answer to see how you could do better next time (and remember it).

As you do more, you'll see similar fact patterns and issues. At some point, try them closed book because that'll force you to recall the material.

It's also okay to redo the same essays later. The issues are finite, and there's a good chance you'll see those same issues you see now on the bar.

4-10 essays per subject would probably cover most, if not all, of the major issues a subject could test you on. It may not sound like a lot, but at least in the beginning, a lot of time will be spent on the backend (after you do an essay/outline) to learn how to approach these essays, and redoing them at a later time to confirm that you have a good handle. For instance, can you identify the issues reliably and confidently? Feel free to do more if you'd like, but the point isn't to just go through the motions without learning anything.

Powering through several essays a day in the last few weeks (via essay cooking/outlining issues and rules) will probably occupy most of your essay practice. Right now, untimed is fine, full essays are fine, and open book is fine. The advantage of the February bar is that you get more time.

Baller31

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby Baller31 » Wed Dec 20, 2017 12:33 am

Is anybody interested in studying together? Not necessarily a study group but just to study in order to keep each other honest. I found an ideal place at Loyola Marymount University where one can study even after hours as well as during the holiday season where most libraries and/or study rooms are closed.

lawschoolgradz1

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby lawschoolgradz1 » Wed Dec 20, 2017 3:48 pm

Baller31 wrote:Is anybody interested in studying together? Not necessarily a study group but just to study in order to keep each other honest. I found an ideal place at Loyola Marymount University where one can study even after hours as well as during the holiday season where most libraries and/or study rooms are closed.



LMU undergraduate campus or Loyola Law in dtla?

carcollector

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby carcollector » Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:15 pm

Baller31 wrote:Is anybody interested in studying together? Not necessarily a study group but just to study in order to keep each other honest. I found an ideal place at Loyola Marymount University where one can study even after hours as well as during the holiday season where most libraries and/or study rooms are closed.

I’m interested for a once or twice a week meetup. I’m in Orange County so it’s a bit of a drive. But if it helps keep me accountable I’m up for it.

Also if there’s any interest in OC let me know. We can just meet up and study at a library.
Last edited by carcollector on Wed Dec 20, 2017 7:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

justanotheruser

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby justanotheruser » Wed Dec 20, 2017 6:34 pm

Is anyone having trouble copying/pasting answer explanations from adaptibar or is it just me?

Baller31

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby Baller31 » Wed Dec 20, 2017 6:39 pm

lawschoolgradz1 wrote:
Baller31 wrote:Is anybody interested in studying together? Not necessarily a study group but just to study in order to keep each other honest. I found an ideal place at Loyola Marymount University where one can study even after hours as well as during the holiday season where most libraries and/or study rooms are closed.



LMU undergraduate campus or Loyola Law in dtla?


LMU undergraduate campus. There is a place you can study when the library is closed. I also study at Loyola Law as well but they do not have the same options, as the campus after Thursday will be closed until next year.

woowoo

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby woowoo » Wed Dec 20, 2017 7:04 pm

Posting again to see if there might be any folks in the Bay Area that would be interested in study meetups/sessions/motivation-by-numbers. I live in the Peninsula but am in the city a good bit. Thanks!

PorscheFanatic

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby PorscheFanatic » Wed Dec 20, 2017 7:13 pm

carcollector wrote:
Baller31 wrote:Is anybody interested in studying together? Not necessarily a study group but just to study in order to keep each other honest. I found an ideal place at Loyola Marymount University where one can study even after hours as well as during the holiday season where most libraries and/or study rooms are closed.

I’m interested for a once or twice a week meetup. I’m in Orange County so it’s a bit of a drive. But if it helps keep me accountable I’m up for it.

Also if there’s any interest in OC let me know. We can just meet up and study at a library.


Where in OC are you? Not sure that I would do much in the way of group studying, as I typically study better alone and do a lot of my studying in the office during my work days. Mostly just curious as I'm new to OC as of a few months ago from the east coast.

onlyoncemore

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby onlyoncemore » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:04 pm

onlythreemonths wrote:
maxmartin wrote:
a male human wrote:....
Better that AdaptiBar kicks your ass than the bar. Nowhere to go but up!


Exactly, it will get better and better!


Feeling like shit too. Wondering if I'm really going to be able to remember enough of the rules. But it's only been 2.5 weeks, so we probably should feel terrible. If we keep going, I'm sure we'll feel much differently come February. LET'S DO THIS!


and @FinallyPassedTheBar

thanks guys/gals. I really shouldn't be putting too much weight on the Adaptibar %s but it's hard to ignore when i see the damn number every time i log on. Ah screw it. At least I'm done with my worst subjects!

Let's keep it up everyone! 2months and 8days left 'till this hell is over - over for FOREVEEEEER.

carcollector

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby carcollector » Thu Dec 21, 2017 3:27 pm

PorscheFanatic wrote:
carcollector wrote:
Baller31 wrote:Is anybody interested in studying together? Not necessarily a study group but just to study in order to keep each other honest. I found an ideal place at Loyola Marymount University where one can study even after hours as well as during the holiday season where most libraries and/or study rooms are closed.

I’m interested for a once or twice a week meetup. I’m in Orange County so it’s a bit of a drive. But if it helps keep me accountable I’m up for it.

Also if there’s any interest in OC let me know. We can just meet up and study at a library.


Where in OC are you? Not sure that I would do much in the way of group studying, as I typically study better alone and do a lot of my studying in the office during my work days. Mostly just curious as I'm new to OC as of a few months ago from the east coast.


Central OC. PM me if you’re interested.

Snowflake1

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby Snowflake1 » Fri Dec 22, 2017 8:08 pm

For those of you interested in an additional discussion forum for the Feb 2018 Cal Bar Exam, I ran across this Facebook group - https://www.facebook.com/groups/11156342729/

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a male human

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby a male human » Fri Dec 22, 2017 8:43 pm

Snowflake1 wrote:For those of you interested in an additional discussion forum for the Feb 2018 Cal Bar Exam, I ran across this Facebook group - https://www.facebook.com/groups/11156342729/

This one too: https://www.facebook.com/groups/MTYLT/

carcollector

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby carcollector » Sat Dec 30, 2017 5:36 pm

Anyone have experience with Adaptibar or BarMax?

I am trying to decide which would be a better choice for MBE prep without consideration to price. Thanks!

FinallyPassedTheBar

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby FinallyPassedTheBar » Sat Dec 30, 2017 9:57 pm

carcollector wrote:Anyone have experience with Adaptibar or BarMax?

I am trying to decide which would be a better choice for MBE prep without consideration to price. Thanks!



IMHO, there is no way I would have passed the exam without the help of Adaptibar. I used their "performance table" statistics to track my progress throughout my review. I think that was very helpful. it allowed me to identify the exact issues that were giving me trouble.

Private message me if you would like a discount coupon for Adaptibar.

Snowflake1

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby Snowflake1 » Sun Dec 31, 2017 5:47 pm

FinallyPassedTheBar wrote:
carcollector wrote:Anyone have experience with Adaptibar or BarMax?

I am trying to decide which would be a better choice for MBE prep without consideration to price. Thanks!



IMHO, there is no way I would have passed the exam without the help of Adaptibar. I used their "performance table" statistics to track my progress throughout my review. I think that was very helpful. it allowed me to identify the exact issues that were giving me trouble.

Private message me if you would like a discount coupon for Adaptibar.


Don't they all just use the same released questions? I use the Strategies and Tactics book, which I think is great and also wayyy cheaper than the online programs. I don't get the advantage of the online programs if they are the exact same questions.

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby a male human » Sun Dec 31, 2017 6:10 pm

They're both excellent resources. You can do well with either one.


Pros of AdaptiBar – convenience and comprehensiveness

- Pulls from a database of 1,500+ real questions (more than you need)
- Adapts to your strengths and weaknesses (score weighting allows you to target your weaknesses without doing so manually)
- Designed to encourage you to practice and get feedback (exam mode, timer, and explanations), which is the process to improve your score as long as you learn from the process
- Offers detailed explanations so you can validate your understanding or learn from your mistakes

Neutral

- Video lectures don’t detract from the question-and-feedback system, which is the meat of the program; you can ignore the videos if you dislike long lectures, but they’re there if you want help understanding a particular concept or like video lectures
- Better or alternative answer explanations may be available elsewhere (like S&T)

Cons – costly technology

- Questions are on screen, i.e., it may be tiring to stare at the screen, and it doesn’t give you a paper-and-pencil practice environment
- Pricey @ $395 ($365 with coupon) w/ no refund policy that I know of (plus, some video lectures cost extra)

Pulled from in-depth review here


S&T on the flip side:

- Excellent explanations!
- Short primer for each subject
- $70 or so
- Paper-and-pencil mode for those who prefer that (also simulates bar conditions if you read questions on paper)

- 650 or so questions, including a full-length practice exam (more if you get the second volume)
- Gotta track your own performance

FinallyPassedTheBar

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby FinallyPassedTheBar » Sun Dec 31, 2017 11:29 pm

Snowflake1 wrote:
FinallyPassedTheBar wrote:
carcollector wrote:Anyone have experience with Adaptibar or BarMax?

I am trying to decide which would be a better choice for MBE prep without consideration to price. Thanks!



IMHO, there is no way I would have passed the exam without the help of Adaptibar. I used their "performance table" statistics to track my progress throughout my review. I think that was very helpful. it allowed me to identify the exact issues that were giving me trouble.

Private message me if you would like a discount coupon for Adaptibar.


Don't they all just use the same released questions? I use the Strategies and Tactics book, which I think is great and also wayyy cheaper than the online programs. I don't get the advantage of the online programs if they are the exact same questions.



Yes, Adaptibar uses the same released questions as other programs. But I feel the statistics tracking that Adaptibar provides is an invaluable service. It allowed me to pinpoint the exact areas I was having trouble with. Yes, I know one can also manually track their progress using hard copy materials. I just felt it was much easier to do so using Adaptibar. That's juts my opinion though. Others might prefer reviewing using hard copy materials.

YuckNotTheBar

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby YuckNotTheBar » Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:25 am

woowoo wrote:First-time taker here -- out-of-state attorney who recently moved to CA (taken and passed two other bar exams, but it's been a while, and CA is clearly on another level). Enrolled in BarBri's "attorney course" and subscribed to BarEssays.com. I can elect to take the one-day essay-only attorney's exam, but based on everything I've read and seen, looks like it's much better raw odds to take the full exam, so that's where I'm at right now.

Anybody working FT and studying? Any Bay Area study groups? I've just started my prep, but going to kick it in full gear here pretty soon. Good luck to everyone!


I am in the exact same boat. Passed 2 other bars and trying to study working FT. I can obviously take the MBE but am not inclined to do so. The pass rates are higher for attys taking the general exam than the atty exam, but I believe that is bloated by young lawyers (less than four years of practice and you are forced into the gen test) who are closer to law school and another barbri course. They are bright-eyed and energetic, and I am old and cranky and impatient.

Right now I score 70-75% on barbri practice so I know the MBE will probably be helpful to my overall score, but the idea of a 2-day bar when I could take only one is.... Yuck. How are you making the choice?

The California bar sucks.

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a male human

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby a male human » Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:35 am

YuckNotTheBar wrote:
woowoo wrote:First-time taker here -- out-of-state attorney who recently moved to CA (taken and passed two other bar exams, but it's been a while, and CA is clearly on another level). Enrolled in BarBri's "attorney course" and subscribed to BarEssays.com. I can elect to take the one-day essay-only attorney's exam, but based on everything I've read and seen, looks like it's much better raw odds to take the full exam, so that's where I'm at right now.

Anybody working FT and studying? Any Bay Area study groups? I've just started my prep, but going to kick it in full gear here pretty soon. Good luck to everyone!


I am in the exact same boat. Passed 2 other bars and trying to study working FT. I can obviously take the MBE but am not inclined to do so. The pass rates are higher for attys taking the general exam than the atty exam, but I believe that is bloated by young lawyers (less than four years of practice and you are forced into the gen test) who are closer to law school and another barbri course. They are bright-eyed and energetic, and I am old and cranky and impatient.

Right now I score 70-75% on barbri practice so I know the MBE will probably be helpful to my overall score, but the idea of a 2-day bar when I could take only one is.... Yuck. How are you making the choice?

The California bar sucks.

Well, it used to be 3 days, so I imagine even a 2-day bar is a blessing and doable (the pass rates went up since last year, too).

To me, it seems more of a choice of whether you want to hedge your MBE performance with extra studying and extra essay subjects, as opposed to whether it's 1 or 2 days long.

YuckNotTheBar

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby YuckNotTheBar » Mon Jan 01, 2018 5:57 pm

You're definitely right. It is not about the 2 days vs 1, although it is appealing on the surface to jet out after Day 1. My choices are:

1. Study a bit less by focusing exclusively on the essays. Could work out just fine if I don't get a crazy essay or make one dumb mistake that unravels an entire essay. I would also plan to kill the PT to make up for any deficiencies on the essays (this should be my strong suit given it is my day job).

2. Study a bit more, and hope something doesn't go outrageously sideways on the MBE. It's far more predictable than the essays, but it requires a decent amount of practice and repetition as you all know. While it would *likely* pad my score, you can never be entirely sure. In other words, while I am probably buying an insurance policy, I could also be buying a liability....

I am leaning toward #1 -- this way, I can devote more time to focused studying without spreading myself too thin. If I fail this will have been a colossal error in judgment!

Funny thing is, I actually don't know how well I did on the MBE on the two bars I passed. A third bar that I waived into required a scaled MBE of 133 so I know I at least got there, but I have no idea how much above it I ran (and in any case that was a long time ago).

Those who are experienced in California -- what is the lowest an essay score can be, if you can get down something/anything on paper? 50? I've tinkered with the averages a bit and I *think* can withstand one bad essay if I do well on the others and the PT.

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby a male human » Mon Jan 01, 2018 6:15 pm

The lowest possible score if you put something legible is a 40.

This might be of interest to you when planning, although I would take the estimates with a fistful of salt: https://one-timers.com/one-timers-bar-exam-calculator/

rationaljd

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby rationaljd » Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:32 am

Is it too soon to freak out...? I haven't done any practice essays... Been able to do only about 10-20 MBE per day because I'm reviewing each answer. Where did December go? I took last weekend off because I was already burned out. Now 8 weeks out, and I'm just freaking out!!!

PorscheFanatic

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby PorscheFanatic » Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:11 pm

What kind of percentages is everyone getting on Adaptibar at this point? Curious how much my score could go up over the next 8 weeks or whatever it is.

onlyoncemore

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Re: 2018 February CA Bar

Postby onlyoncemore » Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:56 pm

HAPPY 2018 FELLOW FEB BAR TAKERRRRSS
side note: 7 weeks until bar. fuck.

@rationaljd, i am definitely with you about freaking out. I haven't done as many essays as I should have.... but it's still 7 weeks out. we should start on it ASAP. At least I'm doing more MBE's!... not that it's going that great though. Scores still suck balls.

On that note, @PorscheFanatic ; do you mean weekly performance wise? Last week I was at 63%. It's definitely not the 70% I want to be at but definitely creeping up there. Though on the front "Total" %, I am butt fucked - shows a 54% at 570 questions done. Granted, (1) I am not doing the Adaptibar recommended schedule (they recommend doing 50/subject first and keep going randomly) and (2) I started with my worst subjects so that probably skews my numbers.

Let's keep swimming guys and gals. we got this.
Last edited by onlyoncemore on Tue Jan 02, 2018 6:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.



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