Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

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robin600
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby robin600 » Thu Jul 27, 2017 9:06 am

I feel the MBE was harder than the first time I took the test but I felt it was easier than the Themis questions and a lot of answers popped out at me, but now I'm wondering if that's a bad sign

anabasis
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby anabasis » Thu Jul 27, 2017 9:19 am

My feeling was that the actual questions were a bit harder. My overall average on Themis practice questions was 79%, but I think I dropped between 5-10% on the actual exam. Still a pass, if the consensus about scoring is in the ballpark. There were about 40 questions where I know I guessed between 2 or 3 choices. And of course you always get some wrong that you are "sure" about.

I'm hoping that many of those guesses were on the 25 new/test questions that don't count.

LSSS
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby LSSS » Thu Jul 27, 2017 9:55 am

robin600 wrote:I feel the MBE was harder than the first time I took the test but I felt it was easier than the Themis questions and a lot of answers popped out at me, but now I'm wondering if that's a bad sign


I agree.

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MT Cicero
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby MT Cicero » Thu Jul 27, 2017 10:47 am

LSSS wrote:
robin600 wrote:I feel the MBE was harder than the first time I took the test but I felt it was easier than the Themis questions and a lot of answers popped out at me, but now I'm wondering if that's a bad sign


I agree.


Same here. Also, I felt the morning was a touch easier than the afternoon. I was a consistent mid-70s Themiser down the stretch, and would honestly be surprised if it was less than that for the morning. Afternoon, could've potentially run a bit colder if I came out on the bad statistical end. But still would be surprised at anything below mid-60s.

Like you both, I have 2+ months to consider whether those decent feelings meant what I think they meant.

logicspeaks
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby logicspeaks » Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:31 am

My understanding is that Barbri doesn't assign as many practice MBE questions as Themis does, so that might have something to do with it.

I felt like our test definitely had questions addressing topics I don't remember Themis covering, but that's to be expected just due to the massive amount of content the MBE covers. I did the 21 practice problems on the NCBE website about a week ago, and I learned then that their questions are different enough to cause some anxiety. However, I scored better on those questions than my average in Themis, and while it's definitely a small sample size, it made me realize that I would see some weird shit on test day and to just trust my instincts after studying for 2-3 months.

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whats an updog
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby whats an updog » Thu Jul 27, 2017 1:19 pm

Have the opposite feeling. My average was 76% for about 1700 qs with Themis, plus a boat load of adaptibar at a similar % and I felt the MBE was extremely difficult. Maybe I just psyched myself out too much but the number of standard of review qs regarding various types of rulings was unexpected for me. Themis seemed to heavily test the distinction between review of district court findings of fact and findings of law, but not much else about standard of review in my experience. Who knows. But what I do know is that adequate assurances better only be for the UCC because I directly asked that question to Themis earlier this month after some friends taking Barbri told me that adequate assurances were available under CL.

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby bmmccb223 » Thu Jul 27, 2017 1:35 pm

whats an updog wrote:Have the opposite feeling. My average was 76% for about 1700 qs with Themis, plus a boat load of adaptibar at a similar % and I felt the MBE was extremely difficult. Maybe I just psyched myself out too much but the number of standard of review qs regarding various types of rulings was unexpected for me. Themis seemed to heavily test the distinction between review of district court findings of fact and findings of law, but not much else about standard of review in my experience. Who knows. But what I do know is that adequate assurances better only be for the UCC because I directly asked that question to Themis earlier this month after some friends taking Barbri told me that adequate assurances were available under CL.


I think the curve will straighten all this out. I just find it remarkable that bar examiners keep making tests of ever increasing complexity. Who is benefited by it? Oh wait, Themis, Barbri, Kaplan, etc.

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cron1834
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby cron1834 » Thu Jul 27, 2017 2:45 pm

I was told pretty much universally by ppl a class year ahead of me, and by TLS, that actual MBE questions were easier. Definitely didn't get that feeling. I'm mildly encouraged by the likelihood that many of the bizarre civ pro questions I had were experimental. It felt like I had about 40 civ pro questions, so a bunch of them must have been.

Samarcan
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby Samarcan » Thu Jul 27, 2017 2:55 pm

cron1834 wrote:I was told pretty much universally by ppl a class year ahead of me, and by TLS, that actual MBE questions were easier. Definitely didn't get that feeling. I'm mildly encouraged by the likelihood that many of the bizarre civ pro questions I had were experimental. It felt like I had about 40 civ pro questions, so a bunch of them must have been.



Yes. This. If I fail, which I very well may, when I study again there are two very definite lessons I've learned. First, contrary to what people on TLS have seemed to consistently say, the actual MBE questions were more tricky and difficult than Barbri and Themis, not less. Second, I am totally disregarding this notion of "minimum competence," which is bullshit by any measure. If I fail it will be my own fault, but relying on others' characterization of the relative difficulty of the MBE certainly did not help.

dimetech
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby dimetech » Thu Jul 27, 2017 3:15 pm

Samarcan wrote:
cron1834 wrote:I was told pretty much universally by ppl a class year ahead of me, and by TLS, that actual MBE questions were easier. Definitely didn't get that feeling. I'm mildly encouraged by the likelihood that many of the bizarre civ pro questions I had were experimental. It felt like I had about 40 civ pro questions, so a bunch of them must have been.



Yes. This. If I fail, which I very well may, when I study again there are two very definite lessons I've learned. First, contrary to what people on TLS have seemed to consistently say, the actual MBE questions were more tricky and difficult than Barbri and Themis, not less. Second, I am totally disregarding this notion of "minimum competence," which is bullshit by any measure. If I fail it will be my own fault, but relying on others' characterization of the relative difficulty of the MBE certainly did not help.


I agree, but with a caveat. I think when they mean minimum competence, they don't mean law school student minimum competence, they mean attorney minimum competence. That's always been my take on it, cuz certainly law school minimum competence will not fly at all, but that's all bar takers really have experience understanding cuz they don't fully think like attorneys yet. To pass, you gotta think like an attorney, not a student taking a test. Kinda gotta weed through all the BS and red herrings; be able to spot relevant facts and such instead of getting bogged down.

anonymousanon
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby anonymousanon » Thu Jul 27, 2017 3:22 pm

whats an updog wrote:Have the opposite feeling. My average was 76% for about 1700 qs with Themis, plus a boat load of adaptibar at a similar % and I felt the MBE was extremely difficult. Maybe I just psyched myself out too much but the number of standard of review qs regarding various types of rulings was unexpected for me. Themis seemed to heavily test the distinction between review of district court findings of fact and findings of law, but not much else about standard of review in my experience. Who knows. But what I do know is that adequate assurances better only be for the UCC because I directly asked that question to Themis earlier this month after some friends taking Barbri told me that adequate assurances were available under CL.


Mod Edit: This was enough detail for me to know what question you're talking about so ban.

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whats an updog
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby whats an updog » Thu Jul 27, 2017 4:06 pm

anonymousanon wrote:
whats an updog wrote:Have the opposite feeling. My average was 76% for about 1700 qs with Themis, plus a boat load of adaptibar at a similar % and I felt the MBE was extremely difficult. Maybe I just psyched myself out too much but the number of standard of review qs regarding various types of rulings was unexpected for me. Themis seemed to heavily test the distinction between review of district court findings of fact and findings of law, but not much else about standard of review in my experience. Who knows. But what I do know is that adequate assurances better only be for the UCC because I directly asked that question to Themis earlier this month after some friends taking Barbri told me that adequate assurances were available under CL.


I think I know which prob we're talking about...bleeeeeeeeeeeeep


fml, i dont remember exactly the details of the q, but bleeeeeeeeeeeeep. oh well.

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SeewhathappensLarry
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby SeewhathappensLarry » Thu Jul 27, 2017 4:52 pm

Samarcan wrote:
cron1834 wrote:I was told pretty much universally by ppl a class year ahead of me, and by TLS, that actual MBE questions were easier. Definitely didn't get that feeling. I'm mildly encouraged by the likelihood that many of the bizarre civ pro questions I had were experimental. It felt like I had about 40 civ pro questions, so a bunch of them must have been.



Yes. This. If I fail, which I very well may, when I study again there are two very definite lessons I've learned. First, contrary to what people on TLS have seemed to consistently say, the actual MBE questions were more tricky and difficult than Barbri and Themis, not less. Second, I am totally disregarding this notion of "minimum competence," which is bullshit by any measure. If I fail it will be my own fault, but relying on others' characterization of the relative difficulty of the MBE certainly did not help.



Yeah I agree with all of this. I found a few MBE questions to be insanely easy, but then there were many others where I just had no idea wtf was going on. After the essay day I thought to myself at least I'll have the MBE to raise my score. Now I'm just hoping I some how knocked the essays out of the park

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robin600
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby robin600 » Thu Jul 27, 2017 5:33 pm

MT Cicero wrote:
LSSS wrote:
robin600 wrote:I feel the MBE was harder than the first time I took the test but I felt it was easier than the Themis questions and a lot of answers popped out at me, but now I'm wondering if that's a bad sign


I agree.


Same here. Also, I felt the morning was a touch easier than the afternoon. I was a consistent mid-70s Themiser down the stretch, and would honestly be surprised if it was less than that for the morning. Afternoon, could've potentially run a bit colder if I came out on the bad statistical end. But still would be surprised at anything below mid-60s.


Like you both, I have 2+ months to consider whether those decent feelings meant what I think they meant.


I was doing high 60s - low 70s at the end, but I know Themis tends to put questions for your weaknesses in the mixed sets to make them harder than an average MBE. Maybe I have a different perspective because I'm not fresh out of law school and took the test before (and passed), but now I'm starting to really freak!

villanovajew
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby villanovajew » Fri Jul 28, 2017 7:23 am

Time for a real and helpful question. I felt alright about the bar exam....MPT/MEE went solidly and the MBE was not easy but I feel like I probably did okay. However, I can't help but look at Themis's guarantee and I can't understand it. This is the text:

THEMIS GUARANTEE: If you take a Themis full bar review course for the first time and you do not pass that jurisdiction's bar exam (or do not take that state's bar exam) and you inform Themis within 30 days of your scheduled bar exam, you may repeat the same course for the same jurisdiction for the next bar exam administration at no additional cost. Your repeat course is only available for the next exam administration and does not include a second set of books or any additional items, such as the iPad Tech Package or Lecture Handouts binder. If you would like a new set of books, you must pay a $250 book fee, plus shipping and handling fees.

https://www.themisbar.com/enrollment-policies

Can someone explain to me how you could "inform Themis within 30 days of your scheduled bar exam" whether or not you will "not pass that jurisdiction's bar exam"? Would you essentially just guess that you failed? Or are they saying to inform them once you know whether you failed or not? It's a pretty poorly written clause for a bar review company.

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dans1006
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby dans1006 » Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:59 am

villanovajew wrote:Time for a real and helpful question. I felt alright about the bar exam....MPT/MEE went solidly and the MBE was not easy but I feel like I probably did okay. However, I can't help but look at Themis's guarantee and I can't understand it. This is the text:

THEMIS GUARANTEE: If you take a Themis full bar review course for the first time and you do not pass that jurisdiction's bar exam (or do not take that state's bar exam) and you inform Themis within 30 days of your scheduled bar exam, you may repeat the same course for the same jurisdiction for the next bar exam administration at no additional cost. Your repeat course is only available for the next exam administration and does not include a second set of books or any additional items, such as the iPad Tech Package or Lecture Handouts binder. If you would like a new set of books, you must pay a $250 book fee, plus shipping and handling fees.

https://www.themisbar.com/enrollment-policies

Can someone explain to me how you could "inform Themis within 30 days of your scheduled bar exam" whether or not you will "not pass that jurisdiction's bar exam"? Would you essentially just guess that you failed? Or are they saying to inform them once you know whether you failed or not? It's a pretty poorly written clause for a bar review company.


It is poorly written but I believe it is to be read that if you find out you did not pass the bar exam you have 30 days to notify them OR if you didn't take the exam as planned, you have 30 days from the day of the exam you skipped, to let them know.

poupeetttee
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby poupeetttee » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:12 pm

bmmccb223 wrote:
Slytherpuff wrote:Although having completed the whole exam now, I think Themis prepared me pretty well for the MEE and MPT.


I agree. Looking at reactions on TLS, it seems BarBri takers were generally unprepared for the MBE. While I found the MBE quite difficult, I think Themis generally did a good job prepping us. I just think there's going to be a generous curve to account for the difficulty. In regards to the MPT, I found it quite strange. It took me some time to figure out what was going on and some of the Library materials seemed kinda useless. But I think I still did alright. We shall see.


I was actually looking for people commenting on the MPT..... I was fine with essays and MBE. But I found the MPT very strange, took me awhile to figure out what was going on... I never had issue with MPT but for the first time was felt like I was struggling a bit. Maybe because both were long and lot of useless info? no clue what happened to me haha

bmmccb223
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby bmmccb223 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 6:19 pm

poupeetttee wrote:
bmmccb223 wrote:
Slytherpuff wrote:Although having completed the whole exam now, I think Themis prepared me pretty well for the MEE and MPT.


I agree. Looking at reactions on TLS, it seems BarBri takers were generally unprepared for the MBE. While I found the MBE quite difficult, I think Themis generally did a good job prepping us. I just think there's going to be a generous curve to account for the difficulty. In regards to the MPT, I found it quite strange. It took me some time to figure out what was going on and some of the Library materials seemed kinda useless. But I think I still did alright. We shall see.


I was actually looking for people commenting on the MPT..... I was fine with essays and MBE. But I found the MPT very strange, took me awhile to figure out what was going on... I never had issue with MPT but for the first time was felt like I was struggling a bit. Maybe because both were long and lot of useless info? no clue what happened to me haha


Yeah it was very strange. I think I did alright but it was definitely difficult to get a handle on.

TXBar2017
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby TXBar2017 » Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:12 am

Reviving. Anyone have any feedback from how the Themis practice tests and questions compared to the real deal?

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Slytherpuff
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby Slytherpuff » Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:35 am

TXBar2017 wrote:Reviving. Anyone have any feedback from how the Themis practice tests and questions compared to the real deal?

MEE was pretty spot-on, MBE was very different (but that seemed to be the case for Barbri too).

TXBar2017
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby TXBar2017 » Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:42 am

Slytherpuff wrote:
TXBar2017 wrote:Reviving. Anyone have any feedback from how the Themis practice tests and questions compared to the real deal?

MEE was pretty spot-on, MBE was very different (but that seemed to be the case for Barbri too).


Do you mean just how you felt about it or your actual scores? I thought the Themis and AdaptiBar MBE questions were pretty spot on, albeit some of the likely experimental questions were pretty odd.

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Slytherpuff
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby Slytherpuff » Fri Sep 08, 2017 12:00 pm

TXBar2017 wrote:
Slytherpuff wrote:
TXBar2017 wrote:Reviving. Anyone have any feedback from how the Themis practice tests and questions compared to the real deal?

MEE was pretty spot-on, MBE was very different (but that seemed to be the case for Barbri too).


Do you mean just how you felt about it or your actual scores? I thought the Themis and AdaptiBar MBE questions were pretty spot on, albeit some of the likely experimental questions were pretty odd.

Oh I thought you were just asking how similar the questions were to the actual test - didn't see that you'd taken the bar in July. I don't have my score so I have no clue yet!

greenerfolife
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby greenerfolife » Fri Sep 08, 2017 12:40 pm

First time posting, and wanted to let people know who may have struggled with their scores on the practice exams, that all hope is not lost. I never scored higher than a 62% on my practice MBE, and I received a 151 on the actual test. I know it's not amazing, but I passed. I'm sure that it's difficult waiting for your results, but I am confident you all did great.

sdancer89
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby sdancer89 » Sat Sep 09, 2017 12:09 am

TXBar2017 wrote:Reviving. Anyone have any feedback from how the Themis practice tests and questions compared to the real deal?


I had a 20+ point bump from my simulated on test day. I spent a lot of time worried I would fail and looking at statistics/the AUTOPASS thread and should have chilled out a bit. Good luck to everyone waiting- what a stressful/miserable process!!

TXBar2017
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2017

Postby TXBar2017 » Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:58 pm

Any other Themisers with their results want to help fuel my speculation?




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