March 2017 MPRE

User avatar
runthetrap1990
Posts: 361
Joined: Wed Dec 24, 2014 5:38 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby runthetrap1990 » Sun Mar 19, 2017 6:02 pm

Thrive wrote:
Toubro wrote:I find this whole "more difficult" thing hard to buy . . . The MPRE scaled score is the result of statistical equating, which means that the score on any one test needs to be comparable to the score on another test, accounting for varying difficulty. If the test randomly became "more difficult" in March 2017, does that mean an 86 in March isn't the same as an 86 from November 2016?

Even if the test was substantively harder, I think the equating will make it so that the the amount of knowledge/performance required to get any one scaled score would remain the same regardless of which test you took. That's the whole point of equating.


Right. So theoretically, if it is indeed harder, then perhaps a 28-30 out of 50 gets you the 85. But I don't know about that. I thought the exam was very chill and I did it faster than I had ever completed a practice exam. I know for a fact a got a few wrong but the general feeling from others about the exam makes it seem like maybe it was indeed more difficult and I just missed important nuances.

Guess we'll find out soon enough


I walked out of it feeling rather meh. I did about a week of prep, but I still felt beaten up after the exam. During the exam, I did feel like there were more "man this didn't seem to be covered in any of the prep material" moments though; however, I'm not sure how much of that is just on me. All of that said, the exam did not feel markedly harder than any of my practice exams/questions.

Just praying for that pass so I can be at peace.

Blackhawks_Fan
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:34 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Blackhawks_Fan » Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:16 pm

I studied for March 2017 using Themis. I thought it was a good course. Actually did a lot of revision, way, way more than most people I know. But, even with all that study, I found the exam so so tough. Doubt I've passed, really tricky exam. Also, how friggin long were the majority of the scenarios?!!! Normally you'll get long scenarios but they follow those with a shortie or two. Not here. No, I had to keep checking the date to see it wasn't April Fools Day. Person next to me didn't even finish, and nobody left during the exam because they finished early which is pretty much unheard of....

LegalTrooper
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:39 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby LegalTrooper » Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:51 pm

I did all the lectures for two courses and took notes, reviewed and highlighted the lecture handouts, did about three practice tests and probably about 90 practice questions, and still found this VERY challenging. I kept scratching my head. About half of the questions or a little less than half were similar to practice questions I had done, and I did those with ease. The other half, however, were bizarre, tricky, and simply out of the blue. I thought it was really rough. After checking, I know I got about 10 questions wrong for sure in addition to whatever else I got wrong. I checked my answers when I came home and found some of the stuff I didn't know or felt confused about HIDDEN in the long commercial outlines or I realized the trick afterwards. Had an "ah huh" moment - AFTER the test - about stuff that's not written on the rules, but rather implied. I wouldn't be shocked if I have to take it again in August. In fact, I'm expecting that, but I would definitely say they made it harder. However, if they gave me that same test again, I'd do better as I came back and highlighted all the stuff I didn't know from the lectures and the practice questions in the long commercial outlines for Themis and Kaplan.

User avatar
Sprout
Posts: 369
Joined: Sun Nov 15, 2015 4:46 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Sprout » Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:56 pm

Blackhawks_Fan wrote:I studied for March 2017 using Themis. I thought it was a good course. Actually did a lot of revision, way, way more than most people I know. But, even with all that study, I found the exam so so tough. Doubt I've passed, really tricky exam. Also, how friggin long were the majority of the scenarios?!!! Normally you'll get long scenarios but they follow those with a shortie or two. Not here. No, I had to keep checking the date to see it wasn't April Fools Day. Person next to me didn't even finish, and nobody left during the exam because they finished early which is pretty much unheard of....

Yeah I had never taken it before, but friends had told me that I would have plenty of time (even knowing how shitty I am at mult choice/how slow of a reader I am comparatively) to finish the exam. I think there was one single person that left my testing room early. Everyone else used all the time. It wasn't a small room.

Toubro
Posts: 36
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2014 7:18 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Toubro » Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:08 pm

My guess is that scores will be out on Monday, April 17.

Sameboat
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 8:06 am

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Sameboat » Mon Mar 20, 2017 8:28 am

That was a ruff test. I felt the questions are getting just like those mbe questions, not quite as brutal but close. I did feel somewhat OK when I left, but not wanting to b cocky just have to wait and see...Did 3 practice tests...should have memorized more about the Musts & May shit

happyhour1122
Posts: 175
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2017 5:08 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby happyhour1122 » Mon Mar 20, 2017 8:51 am

Toubro wrote:My guess is that scores will be out on Monday, April 17.



I say April 24th
Unless NY bar results come out first.

Thrive
Posts: 69
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 11:01 am

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Thrive » Mon Mar 20, 2017 9:24 am

LegalTrooper wrote:I did all the lectures for two courses and took notes, reviewed and highlighted the lecture handouts, did about three practice tests and probably about 90 practice questions, and still found this VERY challenging. I kept scratching my head. About half of the questions or a little less than half were similar to practice questions I had done, and I did those with ease. The other half, however, were bizarre, tricky, and simply out of the blue. I thought it was really rough. After checking, I know I got about 10 questions wrong for sure in addition to whatever else I got wrong. I checked my answers when I came home and found some of the stuff I didn't know or felt confused about HIDDEN in the long commercial outlines or I realized the trick afterwards. Had an "ah huh" moment - AFTER the test - about stuff that's not written on the rules, but rather implied. I wouldn't be shocked if I have to take it again in August. In fact, I'm expecting that, but I would definitely say they made it harder. However, if they gave me that same test again, I'd do better as I came back and highlighted all the stuff I didn't know from the lectures and the practice questions in the long commercial outlines for Themis and Kaplan.


But if you feel like you answered half the exam with ease, why even worry? If true, you'd only have to get what, one-sixth of the other half of the exam right to probably pass?

Thrive
Posts: 69
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 11:01 am

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Thrive » Mon Mar 20, 2017 10:25 am

Toubro wrote:I find this whole "more difficult" thing hard to buy . . . The MPRE scaled score is the result of statistical equating, which means that the score on any one test needs to be comparable to the score on another test, accounting for varying difficulty. If the test randomly became "more difficult" in March 2017, does that mean an 86 in March isn't the same as an 86 from November 2016?

Even if the test was substantively harder, I think the equating will make it so that the the amount of knowledge/performance required to get any one scaled score would remain the same regardless of which test you took. That's the whole point of equating.


So, having done further research, it seems like this might be incorrect. It looks like the difficulty in achieving a passing score has increased a bit over the last several years (i.e.., it seems like an 85 was the 25th percentile in 2009 and in 2016, it was around the 32nd percentile).

Weird.

Edit: Actually, doesn't that also imply that the test has objectively gotten easier?

Toubro
Posts: 36
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2014 7:18 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Toubro » Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:39 pm

Thrive wrote:
Toubro wrote:I find this whole "more difficult" thing hard to buy . . . The MPRE scaled score is the result of statistical equating, which means that the score on any one test needs to be comparable to the score on another test, accounting for varying difficulty. If the test randomly became "more difficult" in March 2017, does that mean an 86 in March isn't the same as an 86 from November 2016?

Even if the test was substantively harder, I think the equating will make it so that the the amount of knowledge/performance required to get any one scaled score would remain the same regardless of which test you took. That's the whole point of equating.


So, having done further research, it seems like this might be incorrect. It looks like the difficulty in achieving a passing score has increased a bit over the last several years (i.e.., it seems like an 85 was the 25th percentile in 2009 and in 2016, it was around the 32nd percentile).

Weird.

Edit: Actually, doesn't that also imply that the test has objectively gotten easier?


It wouldn't matter what the percentiles are. The fact that it was the 32nd percentile in 2016 just means that since 2009 more people have fallen below 85. The test isn't "curved" - it wouldn't matter what the distribution is in any one year or administration. The scaling is done to ensure that test scores are comparable over time.

Now some test scores have an expiry date - Like the SAT score has a soft expiry of 5 years or something. That's because the test makers can't guarantee scaling over that whole period because the test becomes more difficult or easy. But the MPRE doesn't have an inherent expiry date, unless the jurisdiction applies one (NY has a 3 year expiry).

Toubro
Posts: 36
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2014 7:18 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Toubro » Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:49 pm

happyhour1122 wrote:
Toubro wrote:My guess is that scores will be out on Monday, April 17.



I say April 24th
Unless NY bar results come out first.


Why would the MPRE scores be affected by the NY Bar results?

Thrive
Posts: 69
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 11:01 am

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Thrive » Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:55 pm

Toubro wrote:
Thrive wrote:
Toubro wrote:I find this whole "more difficult" thing hard to buy . . . The MPRE scaled score is the result of statistical equating, which means that the score on any one test needs to be comparable to the score on another test, accounting for varying difficulty. If the test randomly became "more difficult" in March 2017, does that mean an 86 in March isn't the same as an 86 from November 2016?

Even if the test was substantively harder, I think the equating will make it so that the the amount of knowledge/performance required to get any one scaled score would remain the same regardless of which test you took. That's the whole point of equating.


So, having done further research, it seems like this might be incorrect. It looks like the difficulty in achieving a passing score has increased a bit over the last several years (i.e.., it seems like an 85 was the 25th percentile in 2009 and in 2016, it was around the 32nd percentile).

Weird.

Edit: Actually, doesn't that also imply that the test has objectively gotten easier?


It wouldn't matter what the percentiles are. The fact that it was the 32nd percentile in 2016 just means that since 2009 more people have fallen below 85. The test isn't "curved" - it wouldn't matter what the distribution is in any one year or administration. The scaling is done to ensure that test scores are comparable over time.

Now some test scores have an expiry date - Like the SAT score has a soft expiry of 5 years or something. That's because the test makers can't guarantee scaling over that whole period because the test becomes more difficult or easy. But the MPRE doesn't have an inherent expiry date, unless the jurisdiction applies one (NY has a 3 year expiry).


Interesting. So the knowledge required to score an 85 is the same. And if combined with the apparent increase in raw score to get the 85 (from 53% in 2009 to about 60% in 2013). That means, the test itself has actually gotten relatively easier as compared to previous years (hence the scaling up of raw score) but the reduction in knowledge among test-takers has increased faster than the test has gotten easier?

If true, that's insane.

happyhour1122
Posts: 175
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2017 5:08 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby happyhour1122 » Mon Mar 20, 2017 2:08 pm

Toubro wrote:
happyhour1122 wrote:
Toubro wrote:My guess is that scores will be out on Monday, April 17.



I say April 24th
Unless NY bar results come out first.


Why would the MPRE scores be affected by the NY Bar results?



No idea. just a random date guess without thinking. :lol:

LegalTrooper
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:39 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby LegalTrooper » Mon Mar 20, 2017 7:35 pm

Thrive wrote:
LegalTrooper wrote:I did all the lectures for two courses and took notes, reviewed and highlighted the lecture handouts, did about three practice tests and probably about 90 practice questions, and still found this VERY challenging. I kept scratching my head. About half of the questions or a little less than half were similar to practice questions I had done, and I did those with ease. The other half, however, were bizarre, tricky, and simply out of the blue. I thought it was really rough. After checking, I know I got about 10 questions wrong for sure in addition to whatever else I got wrong. I checked my answers when I came home and found some of the stuff I didn't know or felt confused about HIDDEN in the long commercial outlines or I realized the trick afterwards. Had an "ah huh" moment - AFTER the test - about stuff that's not written on the rules, but rather implied. I wouldn't be shocked if I have to take it again in August. In fact, I'm expecting that, but I would definitely say they made it harder. However, if they gave me that same test again, I'd do better as I came back and highlighted all the stuff I didn't know from the lectures and the practice questions in the long commercial outlines for Themis and Kaplan.


But if you feel like you answered half the exam with ease, why even worry? If true, you'd only have to get what, one-sixth of the other half of the exam right to probably pass?


That's true! Good logic... assuming I actually got at least 2/3 of that half right and didn't just miss the point. We'll see. I just need an 85. Fingers crossed. Otherwise, August it is... it just sucks to have admission delayed because of the MPRE.

lolabear727
Posts: 48
Joined: Mon Jan 02, 2017 9:07 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby lolabear727 » Tue Mar 21, 2017 10:05 am

Toubro wrote:
Thrive wrote:
Toubro wrote:I find this whole "more difficult" thing hard to buy . . . The MPRE scaled score is the result of statistical equating, which means that the score on any one test needs to be comparable to the score on another test, accounting for varying difficulty. If the test randomly became "more difficult" in March 2017, does that mean an 86 in March isn't the same as an 86 from November 2016?

Even if the test was substantively harder, I think the equating will make it so that the the amount of knowledge/performance required to get any one scaled score would remain the same regardless of which test you took. That's the whole point of equating.


So, having done further research, it seems like this might be incorrect. It looks like the difficulty in achieving a passing score has increased a bit over the last several years (i.e.., it seems like an 85 was the 25th percentile in 2009 and in 2016, it was around the 32nd percentile).

Weird.

Edit: Actually, doesn't that also imply that the test has objectively gotten easier?


It wouldn't matter what the percentiles are. The fact that it was the 32nd percentile in 2016 just means that since 2009 more people have fallen below 85. The test isn't "curved" - it wouldn't matter what the distribution is in any one year or administration. The scaling is done to ensure that test scores are comparable over time.

Now some test scores have an expiry date - Like the SAT score has a soft expiry of 5 years or something. That's because the test makers can't guarantee scaling over that whole period because the test becomes more difficult or easy. But the MPRE doesn't have an inherent expiry date, unless the jurisdiction applies one (NY has a 3 year expiry).


My exact issue and the reason I'm having to retake... ugh. Thanks NY.

Toubro
Posts: 36
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2014 7:18 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Toubro » Wed Mar 22, 2017 11:34 am


happyhour1122
Posts: 175
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2017 5:08 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby happyhour1122 » Wed Mar 22, 2017 12:40 pm



OMG thank you!
April 13 is really early!
My life will be filled with exam results this month.
NYLE... april 1st week. MPRE on the 2-3rd week. Bar exam 4th week. sigh...life
I need to pass all...

Toubro
Posts: 36
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2014 7:18 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Toubro » Wed Mar 22, 2017 12:49 pm

happyhour1122 wrote:


OMG thank you!
April 13 is really early!
My life will be filled with exam results this month.
NYLE... april 1st week. MPRE on the 2-3rd week. Bar exam 4th week. sigh...life
I need to pass all...


You might get NYLE sooner - last time it was like 5 days after the test.

User avatar
Harvard_Naw
Posts: 22
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:00 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Harvard_Naw » Wed Mar 22, 2017 1:19 pm

Toubro wrote:
happyhour1122 wrote:


OMG thank you!
April 13 is really early!
My life will be filled with exam results this month.
NYLE... april 1st week. MPRE on the 2-3rd week. Bar exam 4th week. sigh...life
I need to pass all...


You might get NYLE sooner - last time it was like 5 days after the test.


Do you know if they notify you by email?

attorneybill
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Mar 22, 2017 12:54 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby attorneybill » Wed Mar 22, 2017 2:21 pm

DELETED
Last edited by attorneybill on Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

Toubro
Posts: 36
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2014 7:18 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Toubro » Wed Mar 22, 2017 3:08 pm

Harvard_Naw wrote:
Toubro wrote:
happyhour1122 wrote:


OMG thank you!
April 13 is really early!
My life will be filled with exam results this month.
NYLE... april 1st week. MPRE on the 2-3rd week. Bar exam 4th week. sigh...life
I need to pass all...


You might get NYLE sooner - last time it was like 5 days after the test.


Do you know if they notify you by email?


Yep, they do

Blackhawks_Fan
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:34 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Blackhawks_Fan » Wed Mar 22, 2017 3:11 pm

....
Last edited by Blackhawks_Fan on Thu Mar 23, 2017 12:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Blackhawks_Fan
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:34 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Blackhawks_Fan » Wed Mar 22, 2017 3:12 pm

Nice sunny day out in NY.
Last edited by Blackhawks_Fan on Thu Mar 23, 2017 12:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Blackhawks_Fan
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:34 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby Blackhawks_Fan » Wed Mar 22, 2017 3:14 pm

So much so, clearly (accidentally) had to post that twice.

lolabear727
Posts: 48
Joined: Mon Jan 02, 2017 9:07 pm

Re: March 2017 MPRE

Postby lolabear727 » Wed Mar 22, 2017 5:07 pm

Deleted.
Last edited by lolabear727 on Thu Mar 23, 2017 3:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.




Return to “Bar Exam Prep and Discussion Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: gboston87, logicspeaks, LurkerTurnedMember, ur_hero, virgoyum and 23 guests