What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

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musicfor18

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What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby musicfor18 » Tue Jul 14, 2015 8:45 am

So, if you have a big law job starting in the fall, but you fail the July bar, what typically happens? Assuming your firm doesn't fire you, do you usually keep working until the February bar?

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Elston Gunn

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby Elston Gunn » Tue Jul 14, 2015 8:58 am

If you search you'll find a bunch of threads about this. Yeah, you keep working til February, though I think you usually take a couple weeks off right before the test. You won't get fired from a big firm for failing the first time, but you will if you fail the second.

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thesealocust

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby thesealocust » Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:03 am

Not much - you generally take some time off before the February bar and otherwise are expected to study for your re-take on your own terms while continuing to work. It's not a huge deal, everyone I know who went through the process turned out fine.

musicfor18

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby musicfor18 » Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:27 am

Do people at top firms fail?

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CardozoLaw09

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby CardozoLaw09 » Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:35 am

musicfor18 wrote:Do people at top firms fail?


It's conceivable if there's a lack of preparation, sure.

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thesealocust

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby thesealocust » Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:35 am

musicfor18 wrote:Do people at top firms fail?


Yes. At my firm's introduction whatever for new associates one of the speeches was basically "Yes, people at [fancy firm] have failed the bar, if you did, you won't be the first, and you'll just take it again."
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musicfor18

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby musicfor18 » Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:36 am

CardozoLaw09 wrote:
musicfor18 wrote:Do people at top firms fail?


It's conceivable if there's a lack of preparation, sure.


Looking for actual anecdotes, if possible.

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby Hutz_and_Goodman » Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:39 am

musicfor18 wrote:
CardozoLaw09 wrote:
musicfor18 wrote:Do people at top firms fail?


It's conceivable if there's a lack of preparation, sure.


Looking for actual anecdotes, if possible.


The only way you will fail is if you have a nervous breakdown during the exam (I recognize your username from other threads and I know you did very well on simulated MBE). Study 7-8 hours a day now until the test. I am doing two subjects each day and pairing subjects that are connected (ex. NY Practice and Admin Law). Practice writing essays especially when you get a question where you do not remember the law and are forced to make up a rule and apply it. You can get a passing score on an essay even when completely missing 1-2 main issues.

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A. Nony Mouse

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:44 am

musicfor18 wrote:
CardozoLaw09 wrote:
musicfor18 wrote:Do people at top firms fail?


It's conceivable if there's a lack of preparation, sure.


Looking for actual anecdotes, if possible.

Yes, I know someone at a top firm who failed. She took it in February and passed and all was well. What I heard was that she got sick right before the exam, though I don't know for certain if that's true.

Generally speaking, anyone *can* fail if they don't put in the work. My school has a 94% bar passage rate. The people I know who didn't pass overwhelmingly didn't do anything in their bar prep class. It's true that a tiny fraction get sick (like above) or are those unfortunate souls whose brains just really really don't work the way the bar requires (I know the "I'm bad at standardized testing" thing gets bashed a lot here, but I think it can be true, just not usually for as many people as want it to be true. And I doubt people at T14s fall into this category because you have to be good at standardized tests to get there). But generally if you put in the work, you'll pass. (Caveat: not one of the hard states, but not a fancy school, either.)

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby SpAcEmAn SpLiFF » Tue Jul 14, 2015 1:42 pm

musicfor18 wrote:
CardozoLaw09 wrote:
musicfor18 wrote:Do people at top firms fail?


It's conceivable if there's a lack of preparation, sure.


Looking for actual anecdotes, if possible.

I know someone that did. He passed on the second try. The one thing that sucks the most about having to retake it is that the stress of the billable hour doesn't go away. Invariably, retakers are going to cut back drastically on work in order to study. They have to spend the rest of the year making up those hours. Thus, at the end of the year, a lot of them are completely burnt out and some of them just never manage to make it up. It's a setback, but it's not the end of the world.

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby kaiser » Tue Jul 14, 2015 1:45 pm

musicfor18 wrote:
CardozoLaw09 wrote:
musicfor18 wrote:Do people at top firms fail?


It's conceivable if there's a lack of preparation, sure.


Looking for actual anecdotes, if possible.


One person in my entering class at my firm didn't pass (largely because English was her second language). She took some time off early the next year, and passed in February. Essentially all big firms give you one extra bite at the apple.

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rpupkin

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby rpupkin » Tue Jul 14, 2015 2:10 pm

musicfor18 wrote:Do people at top firms fail?

Yes, especially in California. If a firm has a large incoming associate class, it's normal for at least one or two associates to fail the bar. That's true for the very top firms, btw.

Also, although the conventional wisdom is that you're done if you fail the bar twice, I know of two folks who failed twice and yet still kept their big law jobs. (And both passed the third time.) It's not a hard-and-fast rule. As with many things in life, your fate will depend on whether influential people like you.

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rpupkin

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby rpupkin » Tue Jul 14, 2015 2:15 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
rpupkin wrote:
musicfor18 wrote:Do people at top firms fail?

Yes, especially in California. If a firm has a large incoming associate class, it's normal for at least one or two associates to fail the bar. That's true for the very top firms, btw.

Also, although the conventional wisdom is that you're done if you fail the bar twice, I know of two folks who failed twice and yet still kept their big law jobs. (And both passed the third time.) It's not a hard-and-fast rule. As with many things in life, your fate will depend on whether influential people like you.


I know someone who got immediately fired after failing twice.

So do I.

I'm not saying that you won't get fired for failing twice--that obviously happens a lot. I'm just saying it's not a hard rule at all big law firms.

In any event, tcr is pass the bar the first time.

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby 071816 » Tue Jul 14, 2015 3:03 pm

tcr is retake. hth.

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thesealocust

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby thesealocust » Tue Jul 14, 2015 3:48 pm

chimp wrote:tcr is retake. hth.


TLS comes full circle

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby musicfor18 » Tue Jul 14, 2015 3:52 pm

thesealocust wrote:
chimp wrote:tcr is retake. hth.


TLS comes full circle


How much do "softs" count?

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby despina » Tue Jul 14, 2015 6:04 pm

musicfor18 wrote:
thesealocust wrote:
chimp wrote:tcr is retake. hth.


TLS comes full circle


How much do "softs" count?


Biglaw salary = $160,000, so I can pay off $300,000 loans in two years as long as I pass the bar the first time, right?

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robinhoodOO

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby robinhoodOO » Wed Jul 15, 2015 7:34 pm

despina wrote:
musicfor18 wrote:
thesealocust wrote:
chimp wrote:tcr is retake. hth.


TLS comes full circle


How much do "softs" count?


Biglaw salary = $160,000, so I can pay off $300,000 loans in two years as long as I pass the bar the first time, right?


lol

InTheWideLand I Walk

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby InTheWideLand I Walk » Thu Jul 16, 2015 12:06 pm

robinhoodOO wrote:
despina wrote:
musicfor18 wrote:
thesealocust wrote:
chimp wrote:tcr is retake. hth.


TLS comes full circle


How much do "softs" count?


Biglaw salary = $160,000, so I can pay off $300,000 loans in two years as long as I pass the bar the first time, right?


lol


lol as well. yeah maybe if ur living with ur mom who is paying for everything for you or you have an extreme amount of self-discipline when it comes to saving money. and there is interest as well so you have to account for that.

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Emma.

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby Emma. » Thu Jul 16, 2015 12:27 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
rpupkin wrote:
musicfor18 wrote:Do people at top firms fail?

Yes, especially in California. If a firm has a large incoming associate class, it's normal for at least one or two associates to fail the bar. That's true for the very top firms, btw.

Also, although the conventional wisdom is that you're done if you fail the bar twice, I know of two folks who failed twice and yet still kept their big law jobs. (And both passed the third time.) It's not a hard-and-fast rule. As with many things in life, your fate will depend on whether influential people like you.


I know someone who got immediately fired after failing twice.


Me too.

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Emma.

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby Emma. » Thu Jul 16, 2015 12:29 pm

InTheWideLand I Walk wrote:
robinhoodOO wrote:
despina wrote:
musicfor18 wrote:
thesealocust wrote:
chimp wrote:tcr is retake. hth.


TLS comes full circle


How much do "softs" count?


Biglaw salary = $160,000, so I can pay off $300,000 loans in two years as long as I pass the bar the first time, right?


lol


lol as well. yeah maybe if ur living with ur mom who is paying for everything for you or you have an extreme amount of self-discipline when it comes to saving money. and there is interest as well so you have to account for that.


Taxes, bro.

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robinhoodOO

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby robinhoodOO » Thu Jul 16, 2015 1:25 pm

Emma. wrote:
InTheWideLand I Walk wrote:
robinhoodOO wrote:
despina wrote:
musicfor18 wrote:
thesealocust wrote:
chimp wrote:tcr is retake. hth.


TLS comes full circle


How much do "softs" count?


Biglaw salary = $160,000, so I can pay off $300,000 loans in two years as long as I pass the bar the first time, right?


lol


lol as well. yeah maybe if ur living with ur mom who is paying for everything for you or you have an extreme amount of self-discipline when it comes to saving money. and there is interest as well so you have to account for that.


Taxes, bro.


I'm assuming the OP was being facetious...haha

That said, I fully intend to pay off my $125K in loans with my salary of $100K/year in 1 year, because fuck math. Fuck math right in the butt...

despina

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Re: What happens if you fail the bar and have a big law job?

Postby despina » Thu Jul 16, 2015 1:29 pm

Yes, I was definitely joking. Was trying to jump on the "0L TLS tropes that reappear in the bar prep forum" train.

Seriously? What are you waiting for?

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