Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

fadedsunrise
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby fadedsunrise » Wed Jul 15, 2015 6:23 pm

coffeeandcream wrote:
CurryWithTheShot wrote:Does anyone know how much harder (or easier) the Kaplan MBE questions are compared to the actual exam? Every test I take I'm in the 55%-60% range and I'm struggling to increase my results. Just wondering if Kaplan questions are on par with the actual exam.

If it makes you feel better, when I first started doing them, I scored in that range too. I freaked out for three days in early July and did nothing but MC. By the end of the three days, I was getting closer to 65-70%. BUT - I didn't just review the questions I got wrong, but also the ones were I was 50-50 on as well


Same, I couldn't get above ~60% right on anything for all of June, with some scores in the 30/40%, and a midterm about 58%. Then I mass grinded MC and reread all the outlines, and am now averaging 65-70%. I either write the rule statements out on paper for the ones I was 50/50 on, or add the fact pattern as an example if I got it wrong because I didn't interpret the rule right.

Unfortunately, it also kind seems like Kaplan's questions are more less on par with real questions, if Emanuels uses real questions. The basic schemes seem the same, but Kaplan's are written just...a little more muddy? Sometimes I dont' get what they're asking even if I can spot issues in the facts.

theramblinman
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby theramblinman » Wed Jul 15, 2015 8:01 pm

So does anyone here actually understand commercial paper? Any helpful resources?

despina
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby despina » Wed Jul 15, 2015 8:05 pm

theramblinman wrote:So does anyone here actually understand commercial paper? Any helpful resources?


I'm still struggling with it, but the summary in this thread definitely helped me get started: viewtopic.php?f=41&t=249162

odoylerulez
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby odoylerulez » Wed Jul 15, 2015 8:19 pm

I'm really starting to feel like I'm going to kill the MBE, but the essays have me rattled. I can't remember much from any lecture after the midterm.

I'm half-confident with Wills and Estates and Family Law ... and Trusts, somewhat... but the rest of the essay subjects... I'm mostly lost. I'm trying to sort out Corporations and Secured Transactions tonight before Kaplan's final.

The problem is that my brain doesn't seem to be able to consume any new knowledge. What I've got in there is solid, but making any progress from here on out is going to be excruciatingly painful.

theramblinman
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby theramblinman » Wed Jul 15, 2015 8:23 pm

despina wrote:
theramblinman wrote:So does anyone here actually understand commercial paper? Any helpful resources?


I'm still struggling with it, but the summary in this thread definitely helped me get started: viewtopic.php?f=41&t=249162


Thanks for this! It is helpful for other subjects as well.

coffeeandcream
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby coffeeandcream » Wed Jul 15, 2015 8:23 pm

odoylerulez wrote:I'm really starting to feel like I'm going to kill the MBE, but the essays have me rattled. I can't remember much from any lecture after the midterm.

I'm half-confident with Wills and Estates and Family Law ... and Trusts, somewhat... but the rest of the essay subjects... I'm mostly lost. I'm trying to sort out Corporations and Secured Transactions tonight before Kaplan's final.

The problem is that my brain doesn't seem to be able to consume any new knowledge. What I've got in there is solid, but making any progress from here on out is going to be excruciatingly painful.


I'm in the same boat. Fine with the MBEs, and then I try one of those non-MBE topic essays, and all my confidence is completely deflated. I don't know why Kaplan put these off so late in the game. My boyfriend is doing Barbri, and he finished his lectures weeks ago, and has spent the past week or so just practicing things.

Edit: And worse, I was on schedule mostly up until we started all the essay stuff. Now I'm about 4 substantive days behind thanks to family law and secured transactions, and I don't really know how to catch up

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robinhoodOO
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby robinhoodOO » Wed Jul 15, 2015 8:33 pm

coffeeandcream wrote:
odoylerulez wrote:I'm really starting to feel like I'm going to kill the MBE, but the essays have me rattled. I can't remember much from any lecture after the midterm.

I'm half-confident with Wills and Estates and Family Law ... and Trusts, somewhat... but the rest of the essay subjects... I'm mostly lost. I'm trying to sort out Corporations and Secured Transactions tonight before Kaplan's final.

The problem is that my brain doesn't seem to be able to consume any new knowledge. What I've got in there is solid, but making any progress from here on out is going to be excruciatingly painful.


I'm in the same boat. Fine with the MBEs, and then I try one of those non-MBE topic essays, and all my confidence is completely deflated. I don't know why Kaplan put these off so late in the game. My boyfriend is doing Barbri, and he finished his lectures weeks ago, and has spent the past week or so just practicing things.

Edit: And worse, I was on schedule mostly up until we started all the essay stuff. Now I'm about 4 substantive days behind thanks to family law and secured transactions, and I don't really know how to catch up


I finished the essays 5 days early because of their stupid fucking schedule and I still feel behind because I'm scrambling to actually learn the State materials and one-note them, etc...Kaplan will be my failure scapegoat for this BS schedule.

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a male human
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby a male human » Thu Jul 16, 2015 1:20 am

If you need more scapegoats, I failed the first time I studied with Kaplan. Then I passed after I got some used Barbri books and studied on my own.

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robinhoodOO
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby robinhoodOO » Thu Jul 16, 2015 1:40 am

a male human wrote:If you need more scapegoats, I failed the first time I studied with Kaplan. Then I passed after I got some used Barbri books and studied on my own.

Haha; Don't tell me that shit...No, seriously. Don't.

coffeeandcream
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby coffeeandcream » Thu Jul 16, 2015 9:33 am

robinhoodOO wrote:
a male human wrote:If you need more scapegoats, I failed the first time I studied with Kaplan. Then I passed after I got some used Barbri books and studied on my own.

Haha; Don't tell me that shit...No, seriously. Don't.



I sometimes get frustrated and steal my BF's barbri books (because Kaplan's minor errors send me into a tail spin - like COME ON MAN, THE F. R. Civ. Pro SAYS EFFECTIVE ON SERVICE, SERVICE, SERVICE SO WHY DO MY BAR NOTES AND THE LECTURER BOTH SAY FILING??!!) but they tend to be much more dry than Kaplan, and organized less like an outline.

Now the lecturers. That's a whole different story. Some of the barbri lecturers are just fantastic.

I watched Chemerinsky for Con Law, and then whoever they had for Torts because Levine sounded drunk, and then Epstein because he coauthored my textbook back in the day for business associations and it was the best textbook I ever had.

Florence Night
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby Florence Night » Thu Jul 16, 2015 3:18 pm

odoylerulez wrote:
despina wrote:How many Qbank Q's have folks done at this point? I've done all of the assigned sets in the syllabus, plus random sets on my own as I go back and review specific topics (or really anything to pretend I'm being productive while procrastinating writing essays). I just passed 1000 Q's today, which seems like a LOT, but it seems like a lot of folks are doing a lot of extra ones?

I also feel like I'm plateauing with the MBE as my memory of topics I haven't reviewed in a while starts to atrophy. Any ideas for how to get beyond this besides... review everything, all the time?


Around 1,300 QBank questions, and another 600 or so from other sources (Foundation videos, Blue Book, CPQs, etc.).

I noticed a huge spike in my scores at around 1,800. I've heard that tends to happen at around 2,000 for a lot of people, plus or minus a couple hundred.My goal was to hit a minimum of 2,000 before the exam and get as close as I could to 3,000. 3,000 seems like it will be overkill for me though so I'm going to start backing off soon.

I think I'm going to try to hit the 2,300-2,400 range. 200 from the final, and average 33 a day or so for the remaining time. 33 isn't too bad -- that's about 2 hours of work for me.



This has actually been my experience as well. I'm at around 1700 in the Qbank, so about 2000 questions total when you factor in the practice tests, and I'm 83 for my last 100 in the Q bank. Can't think of any reason other than I've just hit the critical mass of questions that leads get a big jump. A lot of questions I don't even know the exact rule, but somehow I've seen enough that I can intuit the right answer? I don't know.

Unfortunately, I've had exactly one essay question be graded and I still don't know state law 11 days out. :|
Last edited by Florence Night on Sat Jul 18, 2015 11:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

dat209
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby dat209 » Thu Jul 16, 2015 5:09 pm

Just completed the NY practice test and did surprisingly well on the essays (I'm a NY/NJ taker and have been struggling on NJ essays, which from what I hear are supposed to be easier.).

The one thing I did not really understand on the model answers for the NY essays was why do they go into such detail on issues that they just go ahead and say are irrelevant later. For example, there was a separation agreement that the prompt stated was valid and properly filed with the county clerk, but then the video going over the essays stated all the rules and requirements for a separation agreement to be valid. I was under the impression that if they gave us something in the facts as being properly executed, filed, perfected, etc. that we did not have to then go and discuss that fact because we could take it for face value.

Any input on this type of thing?

EZ as AsDf
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby EZ as AsDf » Thu Jul 16, 2015 6:05 pm

"Even Scant Evidence..."

gregfootball2001
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby gregfootball2001 » Thu Jul 16, 2015 6:09 pm

Anyone feel like the final was harder than the midterm? My score went down by a few points. I just spent the past however many days doing the essay lectures, so I don't think it's a big thing - but man that was kinda hard.

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robinhoodOO
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby robinhoodOO » Thu Jul 16, 2015 6:12 pm

gregfootball2001 wrote:Anyone feel like the final was harder than the midterm? My score went down by a few points. I just spent the past however many days doing the essay lectures, so I don't think it's a big thing - but man that was kinda hard.


State subjects were made easier for me personally because I intentionally finished the lectures sooner and spent additional time reviewing the material. I highly recommend spend some time focusing on state materials now, intermixing MBE's to keep those subjects fresh, etc.

breeze3213
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby breeze3213 » Thu Jul 16, 2015 6:58 pm

Ok, I need to vent. I am so annoyed with these kitchen sink model answers! There is no way this much detail can be written in 40 mins. At least I don't know how to do it. I wish the model answers were more realistic for these NY essays. I cannot get a real gauge for how I would perform on the exam. I am really at a lost on what to do. Like seriously, how much do I need to write to PASS; I'm not looking for perfection here. Ugh!

fadedsunrise
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby fadedsunrise » Thu Jul 16, 2015 7:03 pm

dat209 wrote:Just completed the NY practice test and did surprisingly well on the essays (I'm a NY/NJ taker and have been struggling on NJ essays, which from what I hear are supposed to be easier.).

The one thing I did not really understand on the model answers for the NY essays was why do they go into such detail on issues that they just go ahead and say are irrelevant later. For example, there was a separation agreement that the prompt stated was valid and properly filed with the county clerk, but then the video going over the essays stated all the rules and requirements for a separation agreement to be valid. I was under the impression that if they gave us something in the facts as being properly executed, filed, perfected, etc. that we did not have to then go and discuss that fact because we could take it for face value.

Any input on this type of thing?


In CA, but this is what I don't understand about some of the essays either. I did CA July 2003 (I think) Torts this morning and the calls of the question were "Will Paula succeed on her suit" and "Will Mayor succeed on his suit against Paula and radio station," or something along those lines. Thought that meant to talk about the most likely scenario and just went with one tort each. Model answers actually talk about all the possible torts they could have sued on, even if some were clearly off.

When are we supposed to issue spot and throw in the kitchen sink and when are we not? I remember the essay training webinars all "if you throw in the irrelevant issues, the bar examiners will hate you and think you don't know what to focus on." :?

dat209
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby dat209 » Thu Jul 16, 2015 7:14 pm

fadedsunrise wrote:
dat209 wrote:Just completed the NY practice test and did surprisingly well on the essays (I'm a NY/NJ taker and have been struggling on NJ essays, which from what I hear are supposed to be easier.).

The one thing I did not really understand on the model answers for the NY essays was why do they go into such detail on issues that they just go ahead and say are irrelevant later. For example, there was a separation agreement that the prompt stated was valid and properly filed with the county clerk, but then the video going over the essays stated all the rules and requirements for a separation agreement to be valid. I was under the impression that if they gave us something in the facts as being properly executed, filed, perfected, etc. that we did not have to then go and discuss that fact because we could take it for face value.

Any input on this type of thing?


In CA, but this is what I don't understand about some of the essays either. I did CA July 2003 (I think) Torts this morning and the calls of the question were "Will Paula succeed on her suit" and "Will Mayor succeed on his suit against Paula and radio station," or something along those lines. Thought that meant to talk about the most likely scenario and just went with one tort each. Model answers actually talk about all the possible torts they could have sued on, even if some were clearly off.

When are we supposed to issue spot and throw in the kitchen sink and when are we not? I remember the essay training webinars all "if you throw in the irrelevant issues, the bar examiners will hate you and think you don't know what to focus on." :?


EXACTLY!!

I had one essay question on a homicide where the victim was severely intoxicated but the defendant was sober. Model answer has a section on why the defendant has no intoxication self-defense. Well why would I even bother mentioning an intoxication defense if the defendant was sober? Wouldn't mentioning a completely inapplicable defense show the grader that I do not understand what is going on?

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robinhoodOO
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby robinhoodOO » Thu Jul 16, 2015 7:49 pm

dat209 wrote:
fadedsunrise wrote:
dat209 wrote:Just completed the NY practice test and did surprisingly well on the essays (I'm a NY/NJ taker and have been struggling on NJ essays, which from what I hear are supposed to be easier.).

The one thing I did not really understand on the model answers for the NY essays was why do they go into such detail on issues that they just go ahead and say are irrelevant later. For example, there was a separation agreement that the prompt stated was valid and properly filed with the county clerk, but then the video going over the essays stated all the rules and requirements for a separation agreement to be valid. I was under the impression that if they gave us something in the facts as being properly executed, filed, perfected, etc. that we did not have to then go and discuss that fact because we could take it for face value.

Any input on this type of thing?


In CA, but this is what I don't understand about some of the essays either. I did CA July 2003 (I think) Torts this morning and the calls of the question were "Will Paula succeed on her suit" and "Will Mayor succeed on his suit against Paula and radio station," or something along those lines. Thought that meant to talk about the most likely scenario and just went with one tort each. Model answers actually talk about all the possible torts they could have sued on, even if some were clearly off.

When are we supposed to issue spot and throw in the kitchen sink and when are we not? I remember the essay training webinars all "if you throw in the irrelevant issues, the bar examiners will hate you and think you don't know what to focus on." :?


EXACTLY!!

I had one essay question on a homicide where the victim was severely intoxicated but the defendant was sober. Model answer has a section on why the defendant has no intoxication self-defense. Well why would I even bother mentioning an intoxication defense if the defendant was sober? Wouldn't mentioning a completely inapplicable defense show the grader that I do not understand what is going on?


I've noticed this too. The selected answers almost seem to be selected just because the writer wrote a lot of shit...I saw a selected answer which discussed using the Lost Volume Seller remedy in a services contract...They're over-inclusive to the point of ignorance. How can they take an answer seriously when they're spouting off about irrelevant issues? Who knows.

orangecup
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby orangecup » Thu Jul 16, 2015 9:21 pm

I'm up to 1630 questions on the Qbank now, but that obviously excludes the 200 in the midterm and the 200 I just did now in the final review.

I'll probably get in another ~200-300 before the exam.

Absolutely read the answers to the questions you got wrong. In fact, I read them for EVERY one I got right as well. Just to reinforce the law.

Has anyone else taken the final mbe review? I thought it was incredibly difficult, but I somehow scored 77.5% on it. I felt like a lot of it was lucky guessing/going with my gut, but I guess I'll see with the review video.

redblueyellow
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby redblueyellow » Thu Jul 16, 2015 9:42 pm

Fed Civ Pro question:

Citizen of State A sues Corporation incorporated in State B under a products liability. Corporation impleads Manufacturer (incorporated in state A) for indemnification.

Citizen is given leave to amend the complaint to allege negligent manufacture against the Manufacturer.

Manufacturer then moves to dismiss citizen's action against it for lack of subject matter jurisdiction.

Which of the following is true?

Answer: The motion should be granted, because diversity is lacking.

I'm guessing if the P had not added the additional claim of negligent manufacturer and just left the Manufacturer to serve as indemnification, it would have been proper SMJ?
_______________

Please confirm the following hypos I just made up:

Scenario 1:

1. Case is valid under diversity JX.
2. Def impleads third party defendant for whatever purpose
3. Third party defendant is from the same state as Plaintiff
4. There is still diversity present.

Correct?

Scenario 2:

1. Case is valid under diversity JX.
2. Def impleads third party defendant for whatever purpose
3. Third party defendant is from the same state as Plaintiff
4. Third party defendant alleges cause of action against Plaintiff
4. There is still diversity present.

Correct?

Scenario 3

1. Case is valid under diversity JX.
2. Def impleads third party defendant for whatever purpose
3. Third party defendant is from the same state as Plaintiff
4. Plaintiff alleges cause of action against third party defendant
4. DIVERSITY IS DESTROYED.

Correct?

orangecup
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby orangecup » Thu Jul 16, 2015 9:49 pm

^ Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think for Scenario 2, the third party defendant would only be allowed to allege a cause of action against Plaintiff if it arose from the same transaction/occurrence as the underlying claim (thereby getting ancillary/supplemental jurisdiction). Each claim has to have an independent basis for SMJ -- some are achieved through ancillary/supplemental jurisdiction (like compulsory cross-claims), others are achieved through traditional bases for diversity jurisdiction, and obviously others are federal questions.

redblueyellow
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby redblueyellow » Thu Jul 16, 2015 10:07 pm

Why is Kaplan testing us on pendant vs ancillary jurisdiction when all throughout law school (and Wikipedia!) it was taught that those no longer have any special distinction anymore and just to use the supplemental JX moniker?

redblueyellow
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby redblueyellow » Thu Jul 16, 2015 10:08 pm

orangecup wrote:^ Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think for Scenario 2, the third party defendant would only be allowed to allege a cause of action against Plaintiff if it arose from the same transaction/occurrence as the underlying claim (thereby getting ancillary/supplemental jurisdiction). Each claim has to have an independent basis for SMJ -- some are achieved through ancillary/supplemental jurisdiction (like compulsory cross-claims), others are achieved through traditional bases for diversity jurisdiction, and obviously others are federal questions.


Speaking of ancillary JX, were you taught that in school? We heard it mentioned (along with pendant JX), but were taught to just use and learn supplemental JX instead.

EDIT: And yes, in Scenario 2, assume it was a claim from the same transaction or occurrence.

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robinhoodOO
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Re: Kaplan Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby robinhoodOO » Thu Jul 16, 2015 11:34 pm

redblueyellow wrote:Fed Civ Pro question:

Citizen of State A sues Corporation incorporated in State B under a products liability. Corporation impleads Manufacturer (incorporated in state A) for indemnification.

Citizen is given leave to amend the complaint to allege negligent manufacture against the Manufacturer.

Manufacturer then moves to dismiss citizen's action against it for lack of subject matter jurisdiction.

Which of the following is true?

Answer: The motion should be granted, because diversity is lacking.

I'm guessing if the P had not added the additional claim of negligent manufacturer and just left the Manufacturer to serve as indemnification, it would have been proper SMJ?
_______________

Please confirm the following hypos I just made up:

Scenario 1:

1. Case is valid under diversity JX.
2. Def impleads third party defendant for whatever purpose
3. Third party defendant is from the same state as Plaintiff
4. There is still diversity present.

Correct?

Scenario 2:

1. Case is valid under diversity JX.
2. Def impleads third party defendant for whatever purpose
3. Third party defendant is from the same state as Plaintiff
4. Third party defendant alleges cause of action against Plaintiff
4. There is still diversity present.

Correct?

Scenario 3

1. Case is valid under diversity JX.
2. Def impleads third party defendant for whatever purpose
3. Third party defendant is from the same state as Plaintiff
4. Plaintiff alleges cause of action against third party defendant
4. DIVERSITY IS DESTROYED.

Correct?


The answer to your question is yes, but the why is more important. Supplemental jurisdiction applies to impleader (Rule 14), but NOT by the original P against the third-party defendant where the case is brought through diversity. This is an exception to the rule. It's because a 'devious' Plaintiff could use this as a back-door to get into federal court.

Example: P sues employer in diversity, but not employee who hit him in his car because there would be no diversity and he doesn't want federal court. He can't, thereafter, get the benefit of the bargain when Employer impleads Employee and then maintain jurisdiction via diversity after the fact. It's duplicitous.

Thus, just remember: For P to maintain a claim against the third-party defendant (or any party joined after the fact), he needs diversity or FQ and cannot rely on supplemental jurisdiction.

Scenario 1: Supplemental jurisdiction only between 3P and original D. Diversity only as to original D and P. So, this is fine.

Scenario 2: It completely depends on the basis the claim is brought as to whether (1) it should be denied because the third-party defendant is improperly bringing a claim or (2) Whether diversity is destroyed.

Under Rule 14, the third-party defendant MAY only assert (1) Defenses he would have against the original D (now also the third-party plaintiff) and (2) claims arising out of the same transaction or occurrence as P's original claim.

If the 3rd party D does this, it would invoke compulsory claims of P, which requires diversity only--no supplemental jurisdiction for these types of claims.

Scenario 3: Correct.




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