NY July 2015 Support Group Forum

[tiau1424]

PASSED!!
MBE 134.6
Guess the essays saved me!

Thanks everyone for the support

[nyfailedjuly2015]

However, first time around I used the sub-question as my issue statement, which is explicitly prohibited in the instructions.

What do you mean by this?

If the subquestion asks "Will Jim's adverse possession claim be successful?"

And you say "The issue is whether Jim's adverse possession will be successful. Under New York law, an adverse possession claim requires 1)..., 2)... 3)... 4)..."

Is that prohibited in the instructions?

[udonisandtrinity]

Yes. You are instructed not to use the question as the issue header. When I started my MPT, I went back and read the instructions and said fuck it because it was too late. So using your example, you need to say something like “The issue is whether the statute of limitations prevented Jim from asserting an adverse possession claim. Under New York Law, an adverse possession claim requires 1, 2, 3, 4, however the statute of limitations…”

Fuck, I'm not even sure. Why take advice from someone who failed twice.

The questions ask you to identify specific (issues). Gotta incorporate that bullshit in the issue header. Even though I did this, I came out with a better score than this past July’s exam. I really thought I nailed the SOB.

[rexfesler]

Passed. 142.9 MBE. 112 or so in Kaplan finals. English as second language. Thanks for everyone for holding me through this hell waiting. Good luck with every retaker!

[AReasonableMan]

Yes. You are instructed not to use the question as the issue header. When I started my MPT, I went back and read the instructions and said fuck it because it was too late. So using your example, you need to say something like “The issue is whether the statute of limitations prevented Jim from asserting an adverse possession claim. Under New York Law, an adverse possession claim requires 1, 2, 3, 4, however the statute of limitations…”

Fuck, I'm not even sure. Why take advice from someone who failed twice.

The questions ask you to identify specific (issues). Gotta incorporate that bullshit in the issue header. Even though I did this, I came out with a better score than this past July’s exam. I really thought I nailed the SOB.

I didn't any IRAC or use any headers, didn't know that was a thing on the bar. I think if you keep it neat and coherent, they're gonna find all your points. It's not like a law school exam. I'm sure they read the answers closely.

[nyfailedjuly2015]

Yes. You are instructed not to use the question as the issue header. When I started my MPT, I went back and read the instructions and said fuck it because it was too late. So using your example, you need to say something like “The issue is whether the statute of limitations prevented Jim from asserting an adverse possession claim. Under New York Law, an adverse possession claim requires 1, 2, 3, 4, however the statute of limitations…”

Fuck, I'm not even sure. Why take advice from someone who failed twice.

The questions ask you to identify specific (issues). Gotta incorporate that bullshit in the issue header. Even though I did this, I came out with a better score than this past July’s exam. I really thought I nailed the SOB.

That may be part of why my essay scores were so poor. I'm still skeptical about whether they graded my essays properly or whether they even received the full essays. I scored less than 40 on all but one. You can say that I didn't know the law, but I also scored less than 40 on the MPT (where you didn't need to know any law). I answered each of the client's questions and IRAC'd each question citing the two cases and the restatement that were provided. I don't see how the fuck that could get a grade of 39. I know I sound like I'm in denial, but I really don't believe they actually scored my MPT. I'm going to order copies of my answers just to see if they can produce them.

[AReasonableMan]

Yes. You are instructed not to use the question as the issue header. When I started my MPT, I went back and read the instructions and said fuck it because it was too late. So using your example, you need to say something like “The issue is whether the statute of limitations prevented Jim from asserting an adverse possession claim. Under New York Law, an adverse possession claim requires 1, 2, 3, 4, however the statute of limitations…”

Fuck, I'm not even sure. Why take advice from someone who failed twice.

The questions ask you to identify specific (issues). Gotta incorporate that bullshit in the issue header. Even though I did this, I came out with a better score than this past July’s exam. I really thought I nailed the SOB.

That may be part of why my essay scores were so poor. I'm still skeptical about whether they graded my essays properly or whether they even received the full essays. I scored less than 40 on all but one. You can say that I didn't know the law, but I also scored less than 40 on the MPT (where you didn't need to know any law). I answered each of the client's questions and IRAC'd each question citing the two cases and the restatement that were provided. I don't see how the fuck that could get a grade of 39. I know I sound like I'm in denial, but I really don't believe they actually scored my MPT. I'm going to order copies of my answers just to see if they can produce them.

If it's consistent on both the essays and the MPT, it may be something in how you're writing your answers. Your grammar and cohesiveness of thought suggest that should not be an issue. It's possible there was a software glitch. That examsoft stuff was a pain in the ass, and they made us pay $150 for the privilege. Good luck!

[boringlisa]

Passed with 139.1 MBE. I think I really did shit on MC and MPT but have solid essay answers. Took barbri and finished about 75% of the course. Barbri midterm was like 120 sth. English as the second language. Now waiting for the NJ results. Big relief...

[NY PI]

First and foremost, the CLE emails conspiracy theory was proved wrong early this morning at about 12:00 a.m. as I received zero CLE emails and passed the NYS Bar! 147 on the MBE, didn't finish the MPT, and felt okay on the essays! Guess my essays kicked ass! Thank you guys for making this wait a little more comforting along the way! Good luck to all who have yet to open their email or are waiting in other jurisdictions. And good luck to those who will be taking this exam again.

[Kiwi3891]

just came across this... http://abovethelaw.com/2015/10/new-york ... cade/?rf=1

[dietcoke0]

I think California is going to be a bloodbath. Could drop to under 45% overall, under 55% for first timers.

[charlesxavier]

I think California is going to be a bloodbath. Could drop to under 45% overall, under 55% for first timers.

Probably. But, the stats are tricky. The pass rate for 1st time takers from decent schools still doesn't look that bad. In Arizona the overall pass rate looked like it took an awful nosedive but Arizona and ASU were around 83% and Arizona Summit was 30%. It dragged the overall pass rate to 65%. NY was 79% for 1st time ABA school grads. It's the low tier and/or unaccredited schools that are dragging down rates.

[BarTaker]

just came across this... http://abovethelaw.com/2015/10/new-york ... cade/?rf=1

Results were quite similar to February 2015, no?

[BarTaker]

First and foremost, the CLE emails conspiracy theory was proved wrong early this morning at about 12:00 a.m. as I received zero CLE emails and passed the NYS Bar! 147 on the MBE, didn't finish the MPT, and felt okay on the essays! Guess my essays kicked ass! Thank you guys for making this wait a little more comforting along the way! Good luck to all who have yet to open their email or are waiting in other jurisdictions. And good luck to those who will be taking this exam again.

Absolutely! I've received many of them and I failed the Bar. This morning I've blocked and unsubscribed all of them.

[Jag388]

Passed with a 125.9 mbe!

[BarTaker]

Passed with 139.1 MBE. I think I really did shit on MC and MPT but have solid essay answers. Took barbri and finished about 75% of the course. Barbri midterm was like 120 sth. English as the second language. Now waiting for the NJ results. Big relief...

Surely you passed NJ too! Congratulations!!!

[Uk_Law15]

Passed the bar and scored 146 on the MBE. This is such a relief! Well done to all those who have succeeded too and commiserations to the unlucky ones. Chin up, you'll get through next time.

[bear patrol]

NY results this year (from BOLE):

All Candidates = 61 percent passed

All First-Time Takers = 70 percent passed

All First-Time ABA Takers = 79 percent passed

"For the July 2015 exam, 3,154 foreign-educated examinees sat for the test, accounting for 29 percent of all candidates who took the exam. The pass rate for this group was an astoundingly low 33 percent."

[jamesm722]

Yes. You are instructed not to use the question as the issue header. When I started my MPT, I went back and read the instructions and said fuck it because it was too late. So using your example, you need to say something like “The issue is whether the statute of limitations prevented Jim from asserting an adverse possession claim. Under New York Law, an adverse possession claim requires 1, 2, 3, 4, however the statute of limitations…”

Fuck, I'm not even sure. Why take advice from someone who failed twice.

The questions ask you to identify specific (issues). Gotta incorporate that bullshit in the issue header. Even though I did this, I came out with a better score than this past July’s exam. I really thought I nailed the SOB.

I didn't any IRAC or use any headers, didn't know that was a thing on the bar. I think if you keep it neat and coherent, they're gonna find all your points. It's not like a law school exam. I'm sure they read the answers closely.

I'm pretty sure the issue header wasn't prohibited on the essays, just the MPT. I did CRAC, as my bar exam company instructed (Pieper, who only does NY) and passed mostly because of my essays.

They don't read the answers closely at all. You are supposed to be short with your answers and IRAC/CRAC format. Bar examiners spend about 2-4 minutes grading an essay. IRAC lays everything out simply for them and allows them to find the specific points much more easily. You get a much better essay score by doing so. The people that run Pieper have taken the NY bar like 50+ times combined and have experimented to see the difference.

[BarbriSlave]

I think California is going to be a bloodbath. Could drop to under 45% overall, under 55% for first timers.

Probably. But, the stats are tricky. The pass rate for 1st time takers from decent schools still doesn't look that bad. In Arizona the overall pass rate looked like it took an awful nosedive but Arizona and ASU were around 83% and Arizona Summit was 30%. It dragged the overall pass rate to 65%. NY was 79% for 1st time ABA school grads. It's the low tier and/or unaccredited schools that are dragging down rates.

I'm a 4 tier first timer and passed. Many of my peers did too. Would appreciate it if you didnt assume facts not in evidence.

[charlesxavier]

.

[dietcoke0]

I think California is going to be a bloodbath. Could drop to under 45% overall, under 55% for first timers.

Probably. But, the stats are tricky. The pass rate for 1st time takers from decent schools still doesn't look that bad. In Arizona the overall pass rate looked like it took an awful nosedive but Arizona and ASU were around 83% and Arizona Summit was 30%. It dragged the overall pass rate to 65%. NY was 79% for 1st time ABA school grads. It's the low tier and/or unaccredited schools that are dragging down rates.

I'm a 4 tier first timer and passed. Many of my peers did too. Would appreciate it if you didnt assume facts not in evidence.

Congrats. I don't think he meant any disrespect to yours or any other legitimate school, and certainly not to any student. He was referencing cash cow predatory law school diploma mills. Especially non-ABA accredited. It's been a serious problem in the last 20 years, and is being attributed to the decline of passage rates across the country.

[charlesxavier]

I think California is going to be a bloodbath. Could drop to under 45% overall, under 55% for first timers.

Probably. But, the stats are tricky. The pass rate for 1st time takers from decent schools still doesn't look that bad. In Arizona the overall pass rate looked like it took an awful nosedive but Arizona and ASU were around 83% and Arizona Summit was 30%. It dragged the overall pass rate to 65%. NY was 79% for 1st time ABA school grads. It's the low tier and/or unaccredited schools that are dragging down rates.

I'm a 4 tier first timer and passed. Many of my peers did too. Would appreciate it if you didnt assume facts not in evidence.

Congrats. I don't think he meant any disrespect to yours or any other legitimate school, and certainly not to any student. He was referencing cash cow predatory law school diploma mills. Especially non-ABA accredited. It's been a serious problem in the last 20 years, and is being attributed to the decline of passage rates across the country.

Agreed. I was thinking about Arizona Summit (previously Phoenix) where over 100 people took the AZ bar and 30% passed. I know plenty of great lawyers from all ranks of law school. Same with Ohio. One school had an abysmal pass rate last year yet was above average in expense.

[Danger Zone]

I think California is going to be a bloodbath. Could drop to under 45% overall, under 55% for first timers.

Probably. But, the stats are tricky. The pass rate for 1st time takers from decent schools still doesn't look that bad. In Arizona the overall pass rate looked like it took an awful nosedive but Arizona and ASU were around 83% and Arizona Summit was 30%. It dragged the overall pass rate to 65%. NY was 79% for 1st time ABA school grads. It's the low tier and/or unaccredited schools that are dragging down rates.

I'm a 4 tier first timer and passed. Many of my peers did too. Would appreciate it if you didnt assume facts not in evidence.

The facts are that bar passage rates for tier 4 schools are fucking atrocious, but thanks for your anecdata.

[nyfailedjuly2015]

Yes. You are instructed not to use the question as the issue header. When I started my MPT, I went back and read the instructions and said fuck it because it was too late. So using your example, you need to say something like “The issue is whether the statute of limitations prevented Jim from asserting an adverse possession claim. Under New York Law, an adverse possession claim requires 1, 2, 3, 4, however the statute of limitations…”

Fuck, I'm not even sure. Why take advice from someone who failed twice.

The questions ask you to identify specific (issues). Gotta incorporate that bullshit in the issue header. Even though I did this, I came out with a better score than this past July’s exam. I really thought I nailed the SOB.

I didn't any IRAC or use any headers, didn't know that was a thing on the bar. I think if you keep it neat and coherent, they're gonna find all your points. It's not like a law school exam. I'm sure they read the answers closely.

I'm pretty sure the issue header wasn't prohibited on the essays, just the MPT. I did CRAC, as my bar exam company instructed (Pieper, who only does NY) and passed mostly because of my essays.

They don't read the answers closely at all. You are supposed to be short with your answers and IRAC/CRAC format. Bar examiners spend about 2-4 minutes grading an essay. IRAC lays everything out simply for them and allows them to find the specific points much more easily. You get a much better essay score by doing so. The people that run Pieper have taken the NY bar like 50+ times combined and have experimented to see the difference.

Oh, I didn't quote the question prompt in the MPT. For the MPT, my answer was addressed directly to the client as if I were writing him a real opinion letter. I addressed each of his questions with an IRAC paragraph. Instead of saying "The issue is whether..." I said "First, you asked whether [issue 1]." I cited both cases and the Restatement, compared the client's situation with the provided law, made conclusions, and then ghost-signed it with the partner's name as it said in the instructions. Somehow, it was scored 39. I simply don't believe it.