NY July 2015 Support Group

User avatar
rickgrimes69
Posts: 1107
Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2012 8:56 am

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby rickgrimes69 » Wed Jul 15, 2015 3:02 pm

Anyone have any advice about how to learn NY Practice? I've got the statute of limitations stuff down, but I'm at a loss as to how we're supposed to remember all 1000 of these random rules and exceptions. It's like Civ Pro all over again, except more arbitrary.

User avatar
Danger Zone
Posts: 7317
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:36 am

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby Danger Zone » Wed Jul 15, 2015 3:14 pm

rickgrimes69 wrote:Anyone have any advice about how to learn NY Practice? I've got the statute of limitations stuff down, but I'm at a loss as to how we're supposed to remember all 1000 of these random rules and exceptions. It's like Civ Pro all over again, except more arbitrary.

Focus on the important ones. You'll go nuts trying to memorize it all.

Hutz_and_Goodman
Posts: 1413
Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2012 10:42 am

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby Hutz_and_Goodman » Wed Jul 15, 2015 3:18 pm

Danger Zone wrote:
rickgrimes69 wrote:Anyone have any advice about how to learn NY Practice? I've got the statute of limitations stuff down, but I'm at a loss as to how we're supposed to remember all 1000 of these random rules and exceptions. It's like Civ Pro all over again, except more arbitrary.

Focus on the important ones. You'll go nuts trying to memorize it all.


+1

past essays test SOL all the time
the Domestic Relations stuff is important
I also think that the Article 78 stuff may come up in the context of an Admin law question

User avatar
rickgrimes69
Posts: 1107
Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2012 8:56 am

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby rickgrimes69 » Wed Jul 15, 2015 3:55 pm

Danger Zone wrote:
rickgrimes69 wrote:Anyone have any advice about how to learn NY Practice? I've got the statute of limitations stuff down, but I'm at a loss as to how we're supposed to remember all 1000 of these random rules and exceptions. It's like Civ Pro all over again, except more arbitrary.

Focus on the important ones. You'll go nuts trying to memorize it all.


which ones are the important ones

HLBE689
Posts: 59
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:27 am

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby HLBE689 » Wed Jul 15, 2015 4:06 pm

SUCH a stupid question but hey one of those days

For NY Distinctions re: defenses versus affirmative defenses - is there a list anywhere of defenses and for affirmative defenses?

For defenses - it's D saying "I didn't do it" - right? (e.g., alibi defense - what else?)

Affirmative defenses - D is saying "Yeah, I did it but I here is why I should not be criminally charged" (e.g., self-defense, insanity, durress)

User avatar
Danger Zone
Posts: 7317
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:36 am

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby Danger Zone » Wed Jul 15, 2015 4:10 pm

HLBE689 wrote:SUCH a stupid question but hey one of those days

For NY Distinctions re: defenses versus affirmative defenses - is there a list anywhere of defenses and for affirmative defenses?

For defenses - it's D saying "I didn't do it" - right? (e.g., alibi defense - what else?)

Affirmative defenses - D is saying "Yeah, I did it but I here is why I should not be criminally charged" (e.g., self-defense, insanity, durress)

Important thing to remember about defenses is that the inability of the prosecution to prove ANY ELEMENT beyond a reasonable doubt is a defense. So think about the acts, mens rea, and attendant circumstances.

User avatar
2014
Posts: 5834
Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 3:53 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby 2014 » Wed Jul 15, 2015 4:17 pm

So are we all copping the $20 turkey sandwich in Albany? Seems legit.

xfer2013
Posts: 48
Joined: Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:25 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby xfer2013 » Wed Jul 15, 2015 6:55 pm

So I just got 7 correct out of 28 on barbri's NY practice multiple choice. How concerned should I be about this?

I scored 77th percentile on the simulated MBE, and score consistently passing/slightly above passing on the essays. Can I afford to suck at NY multiple choice?

xfer2013
Posts: 48
Joined: Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:25 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby xfer2013 » Wed Jul 15, 2015 6:58 pm

Hutz_and_Goodman wrote:
Danger Zone wrote:
rickgrimes69 wrote:Anyone have any advice about how to learn NY Practice? I've got the statute of limitations stuff down, but I'm at a loss as to how we're supposed to remember all 1000 of these random rules and exceptions. It's like Civ Pro all over again, except more arbitrary.

Focus on the important ones. You'll go nuts trying to memorize it all.


+1

past essays test SOL all the time
the Domestic Relations stuff is important
I also think that the Article 78 stuff may come up in the context of an Admin law question


This is helpful to know... What domestic relations stuff are you referring to?

User avatar
Danger Zone
Posts: 7317
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:36 am

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby Danger Zone » Wed Jul 15, 2015 7:00 pm

xfer2013 wrote:So I just got 7 correct out of 28 on barbri's NY practice multiple choice. How concerned should I be about this?

I scored 77th percentile on the simulated MBE, and score consistently passing/slightly above passing on the essays. Can I afford to suck at NY multiple choice?

You're fine with that MBE

myrtlewinston
Posts: 401
Joined: Sun May 24, 2015 8:39 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby myrtlewinston » Wed Jul 15, 2015 7:33 pm

rickgrimes69 wrote:
Danger Zone wrote:
rickgrimes69 wrote:Anyone have any advice about how to learn NY Practice? I've got the statute of limitations stuff down, but I'm at a loss as to how we're supposed to remember all 1000 of these random rules and exceptions. It's like Civ Pro all over again, except more arbitrary.

Focus on the important ones. You'll go nuts trying to memorize it all.


which ones are the important ones


There's a useful chart in the CMR.

myrtlewinston
Posts: 401
Joined: Sun May 24, 2015 8:39 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby myrtlewinston » Wed Jul 15, 2015 7:35 pm

Hutz_and_Goodman wrote:
Danger Zone wrote:
rickgrimes69 wrote:Anyone have any advice about how to learn NY Practice? I've got the statute of limitations stuff down, but I'm at a loss as to how we're supposed to remember all 1000 of these random rules and exceptions. It's like Civ Pro all over again, except more arbitrary.

Focus on the important ones. You'll go nuts trying to memorize it all.


+1

past essays test SOL all the time
the Domestic Relations stuff is important
I also think that the Article 78 stuff may come up in the context of an Admin law question


I have that hunch too, but I hope we won't get it in an essay. It's a new subject, and didn't crop up in Feb.

myrtlewinston
Posts: 401
Joined: Sun May 24, 2015 8:39 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby myrtlewinston » Wed Jul 15, 2015 7:35 pm

xfer2013 wrote:
Hutz_and_Goodman wrote:
Danger Zone wrote:
rickgrimes69 wrote:Anyone have any advice about how to learn NY Practice? I've got the statute of limitations stuff down, but I'm at a loss as to how we're supposed to remember all 1000 of these random rules and exceptions. It's like Civ Pro all over again, except more arbitrary.

Focus on the important ones. You'll go nuts trying to memorize it all.


+1

past essays test SOL all the time
the Domestic Relations stuff is important
I also think that the Article 78 stuff may come up in the context of an Admin law question


This is helpful to know... What domestic relations stuff are you referring to?


Annulment, Separation, Divorce, Custody etc.

myrtlewinston
Posts: 401
Joined: Sun May 24, 2015 8:39 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby myrtlewinston » Wed Jul 15, 2015 7:43 pm

Besides SoLs and elements of crimes, what do we have to memorise cold in NY?

antlp
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Jul 23, 2013 5:56 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby antlp » Wed Jul 15, 2015 8:15 pm

Danger Zone wrote:
HLBE689 wrote:SUCH a stupid question but hey one of those days

For NY Distinctions re: defenses versus affirmative defenses - is there a list anywhere of defenses and for affirmative defenses?

For defenses - it's D saying "I didn't do it" - right? (e.g., alibi defense - what else?)

Affirmative defenses - D is saying "Yeah, I did it but I here is why I should not be criminally charged" (e.g., self-defense, insanity, durress)

Important thing to remember about defenses is that the inability of the prosecution to prove ANY ELEMENT beyond a reasonable doubt is a defense. So think about the acts, mens rea, and attendant circumstances.


I don't think you can generalize a hard and fast rule for distinguishing between defenses and affirmative defenses; it's defined by statute (although yes, something like an alibi or the absence of an element of a crime would be a defense).

The CMR kind of provides a list though it's not all in one place. According to CMR, in NY:
Justification defenses (e.g. self defense) = defense, i.e. the prosecution must disprove beyond a reasonable doubt
Excuse defenses (e.g. duress, entrapment, insanity) = affirmative defense, i.e. the defendant must prove by a preponderance

NY puts necessity in the justification category, so that is a defense, not an affirmative defense.

Other offense-specific affirmative defenses include withdrawal (for conspiracy), abandonment (for attempt) and renunciation (for solicitation).

User avatar
northwood
Posts: 4872
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 7:29 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby northwood » Wed Jul 15, 2015 9:47 pm

victortsoi wrote:how much time are you allotting to the nymc on the actual exam? We have to plan our own time....



I gave myself a little over a minute per question. if I didn't know it, I just guessed, bubbled and moved on. make sure to bubble them in before you start your essays so you don't forget later on/ run out of time and fail to do so.

xfer2013
Posts: 48
Joined: Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:25 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby xfer2013 » Wed Jul 15, 2015 10:17 pm

northwood wrote:
victortsoi wrote:how much time are you allotting to the nymc on the actual exam? We have to plan our own time....



I gave myself a little over a minute per question. if I didn't know it, I just guessed, bubbled and moved on. make sure to bubble them in before you start your essays so you don't forget later on/ run out of time and fail to do so.

So you did the multiple choice first?

I was planning to do the essays first because if time gets tight I'd rather be guessing on multiple choice (statistically getting 25% points) than leaving issues blank on an essay (0% points). Am I missing something?

jamesm722
Posts: 76
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2012 3:21 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby jamesm722 » Thu Jul 16, 2015 11:11 pm

[/quote]

Justification defenses (e.g. self defense) = defense, i.e. the prosecution must disprove beyond a reasonable doubt

Excuse defenses (e.g. duress, entrapment, insanity) = affirmative defense, i.e. the defendant must prove by a preponderance

NY puts necessity in the justification category, so that is a defense, not an affirmative defense.

Other offense-specific affirmative defenses include withdrawal (for conspiracy), abandonment (for attempt) and renunciation (for solicitation).[/quote]

There's a bunch more for ordinary defenses besides justification, but I don't think it's necessary to know them all. It's a waste of time to try to memorize them everything, same as all the SOLs. Just know the main stuff

orangecup
Posts: 266
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:41 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby orangecup » Fri Jul 17, 2015 12:24 pm

^
Agreed. Although I think it's worth it to include alibi in ordinary offense since I feel like I've seen alibi on a couple of old essays.

User avatar
northwood
Posts: 4872
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 7:29 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby northwood » Fri Jul 17, 2015 8:36 pm

xfer2013 wrote:
northwood wrote:
victortsoi wrote:how much time are you allotting to the nymc on the actual exam? We have to plan our own time....



I gave myself a little over a minute per question. if I didn't know it, I just guessed, bubbled and moved on. make sure to bubble them in before you start your essays so you don't forget later on/ run out of time and fail to do so.

So you did the multiple choice first?

I was planning to do the essays first because if time gets tight I'd rather be guessing on multiple choice (statistically getting 25% points) than leaving issues blank on an essay (0% points). Am I missing something?



people have their own unique approach to the exam. I did NYMC first this because the NYMC is worth 10% of your grade on the exam. Depending on how well you manage your time you may run the risk of having an incomplete answer sheet ( you have to put your pencils down when they call time). If you are getting pressed for time on an essay you can at least outline a rough response... i.e. issue spot, basic elements defns and applicable facts and get partial points for that essay. knowing that the NYMC was over allowed me to adjust my allotted time per essay response. ( I naturally do MC questions quick, so I had extra time per essay to write).

Hutz_and_Goodman
Posts: 1413
Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2012 10:42 am

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby Hutz_and_Goodman » Fri Jul 17, 2015 8:51 pm

Can someone help me understand Javits center policy on food? Can I bring a sandwich or smdo I have to pay $20 for the lunch they offer?

Thanks

astorian
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2014 4:13 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby astorian » Sat Jul 18, 2015 12:12 pm

Does anybody know if are allowed to to take multiple mock exams on Examsoft? or has done it? i just want to refamilirize myself with the software and am worried if multiple mocks will mess up their records or something. Examsoft does not answer that question in their FAQs :(

astorian
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2014 4:13 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby astorian » Sat Jul 18, 2015 12:22 pm

Hutz_and_Goodman wrote:Can someone help me understand Javits center policy on food? Can I bring a sandwich or smdo I have to pay $20 for the lunch they offer?

Thanks


you can bring whatever fits in your ziplock. As for bringing anything additional you would have to put it in the other room.. and i am told that the line to get in and out of that room can be long

victortsoi
Posts: 448
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2010 7:51 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby victortsoi » Sat Jul 18, 2015 4:14 pm

Two questions- on the essays, is tcr to actually write out "Issue" "rule" "Analysis" as headings? That was unclear from barbri.

Is anyone struggling on time for the essays?

orangecup
Posts: 266
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:41 pm

Re: NY July 2015 Support Group

Postby orangecup » Sat Jul 18, 2015 4:17 pm

victortsoi wrote:Two questions- on the essays, is tcr to actually write out "Issue" "rule" "Analysis" as headings? That was unclear from barbri.

Is anyone struggling on time for the essays?


I don't. I just write signaling transitions, like : "The issue is whether ____" or "In this case _____" or "Therefore _____"

I actually haven't had a problem with time. I used to, but once you start knowing the law better, I find that time constraints aren't generally a problem




Return to “Bar Exam Prep and Discussion Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests