Hm okay. I remember reading something about how this might be a problem because of different burdens of proof in various types of cases, but I don't remember the context (criminal/civil, or something totally different).Tiago Splitter wrote:Yep. Fine to use offensively as long as not unfair to the other side. Would be ok there.brotherdarkness wrote:Any problems using issue preclusion between criminal and civil cases. Example: State charges Dave with murder of Victoria. Dave is found guilty of murdering Victoria. Now Victoria's estate wants to bring a wrongful death action (or something) against Dave. Victoria's estate can use offensive collateral estoppel to conclusively establish that Dave did in fact kill Victoria?
BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam Forum
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- brotherdarkness
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
- Tiago Splitter
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
Yeah the state wouldn't be able to do it in its case against Dave because the standard of proof is higher, but issue preclusion in a wrongful death case after a murder conviction happens all the time.brotherdarkness wrote:Hm okay. I remember reading something about how this might be a problem because of different burdens of proof in various types of cases, but I don't remember the context (criminal/civil, or something totally different).Tiago Splitter wrote:Yep. Fine to use offensively as long as not unfair to the other side. Would be ok there.brotherdarkness wrote:Any problems using issue preclusion between criminal and civil cases. Example: State charges Dave with murder of Victoria. Dave is found guilty of murdering Victoria. Now Victoria's estate wants to bring a wrongful death action (or something) against Dave. Victoria's estate can use offensive collateral estoppel to conclusively establish that Dave did in fact kill Victoria?
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
I think I'm a bit dense, so bear with me. If the civil case for wrongful death was before the criminal case, the state couldn't subsequently use issue preclusion in its criminal case?Tiago Splitter wrote:Yeah the state wouldn't be able to do it in its case against Dave because the standard of proof is higher, but issue preclusion in a wrongful death case after a murder conviction happens all the time.brotherdarkness wrote:Hm okay. I remember reading something about how this might be a problem because of different burdens of proof in various types of cases, but I don't remember the context (criminal/civil, or something totally different).Tiago Splitter wrote:Yep. Fine to use offensively as long as not unfair to the other side. Would be ok there.brotherdarkness wrote:Any problems using issue preclusion between criminal and civil cases. Example: State charges Dave with murder of Victoria. Dave is found guilty of murdering Victoria. Now Victoria's estate wants to bring a wrongful death action (or something) against Dave. Victoria's estate can use offensive collateral estoppel to conclusively establish that Dave did in fact kill Victoria?
- rickgrimes69
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
Correct, because the burden of proof is higher in criminal cases. You could do it the other way around, though.brotherdarkness wrote:I think I'm a bit dense, so bear with me. If the civil case for wrongful death was before the criminal case, the state couldn't subsequently use issue preclusion in its criminal case?Tiago Splitter wrote:Yeah the state wouldn't be able to do it in its case against Dave because the standard of proof is higher, but issue preclusion in a wrongful death case after a murder conviction happens all the time.brotherdarkness wrote:Hm okay. I remember reading something about how this might be a problem because of different burdens of proof in various types of cases, but I don't remember the context (criminal/civil, or something totally different).Tiago Splitter wrote:Yep. Fine to use offensively as long as not unfair to the other side. Would be ok there.brotherdarkness wrote:Any problems using issue preclusion between criminal and civil cases. Example: State charges Dave with murder of Victoria. Dave is found guilty of murdering Victoria. Now Victoria's estate wants to bring a wrongful death action (or something) against Dave. Victoria's estate can use offensive collateral estoppel to conclusively establish that Dave did in fact kill Victoria?
- brotherdarkness
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
Great, got it. Thanks!rickgrimes69 wrote:Correct, because the burden of proof is higher in criminal cases. You could do it the other way around, though.
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
Have we determined whether Barbri scores our essays based on raw or scaled scores?
Isn't true in every state that essay scores are scaled as well? If so, what kind of bump is usually given to essays?
Isn't true in every state that essay scores are scaled as well? If so, what kind of bump is usually given to essays?
- Good Guy Gaud
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
also interested (in AZ, they are scaled to 100 and I have no idea how it gets there)Kage3212 wrote:Have we determined whether Barbri scores our essays based on raw or scaled scores?
Isn't true in every state that essay scores are scaled as well? If so, what kind of bump is usually given to essays?
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
Doing an old question set I had never gotten around to and was greeted with this in the BARBRI answer:
This question is difficult because each of the choices appears to present a good argument.
This question is difficult because each of the choices appears to present a good argument.
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
does everyone get the same amount added to their raw score? like does someone who scores 120 raw get 15 added to get to 135 scaled, and someone who gets a 135 raw also gets 15 added to get to 150 scaled? or is it like a % bump instead of a hard # bump?kykiske wrote:Random thought when jamming to Taylor Swift in the shower:
Let's say you score a 130/200 on Barbri's simulated MBE. And because of the "Barbri" effect, on exam day, you score a 140/200. Then, you get 15 points added to your scaled score. 155/200 scaled.
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
No, it is a scaled score, by some magical formula that NCBE applies. +15 is just a conventional wisdomPoopface wrote: does everyone get the same amount added to their raw score? like does someone who scores 120 raw get 15 added to get to 135 scaled, and someone who gets a 135 raw also gets 15 added to get to 150 scaled? or is it like a % bump instead of a hard # bump?
- Good Guy Gaud
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q ... GU&cad=rjakyle010723 wrote:No, it is a scaled score, by some magical formula that NCBE applies. +15 is just a conventional wisdomPoopface wrote: does everyone get the same amount added to their raw score? like does someone who scores 120 raw get 15 added to get to 135 scaled, and someone who gets a 135 raw also gets 15 added to get to 150 scaled? or is it like a % bump instead of a hard # bump?
link to a pdf with raw score conversions (not sure how accurate it is but because i have nothing else to go off of i'll accept it)
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
No one scored higher than a 173 raw? That's an impressive score, but I assumed that there'd be a couple of people out there acing the MBE.Good Guy Gaud wrote:https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q ... GU&cad=rjakyle010723 wrote:No, it is a scaled score, by some magical formula that NCBE applies. +15 is just a conventional wisdomPoopface wrote: does everyone get the same amount added to their raw score? like does someone who scores 120 raw get 15 added to get to 135 scaled, and someone who gets a 135 raw also gets 15 added to get to 150 scaled? or is it like a % bump instead of a hard # bump?
link to a pdf with raw score conversions (not sure how accurate it is but because i have nothing else to go off of i'll accept it)
- RaleighStClair
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
I don't think anyone knows exactly how it's scaled. I know it varies test to test. But - hate to be a downer here - remember the raw is out of 190 on the real thing. 10 are experimental/ungraded.Poopface wrote:does everyone get the same amount added to their raw score? like does someone who scores 120 raw get 15 added to get to 135 scaled, and someone who gets a 135 raw also gets 15 added to get to 150 scaled? or is it like a % bump instead of a hard # bump?kykiske wrote:Random thought when jamming to Taylor Swift in the shower:
Let's say you score a 130/200 on Barbri's simulated MBE. And because of the "Barbri" effect, on exam day, you score a 140/200. Then, you get 15 points added to your scaled score. 155/200 scaled.
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
Is anyone actually completing the "Review CMR Outline" assignments from the actual CMR? Or rather or you just using the time to go back over lecture notes?
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
I use the time to go over my outlines/lecture notes/whatever I'm using to review for that subject. But once I make that material I don't look at the CMR again unless it's to verify something I missed in an essay.Kage3212 wrote:Is anyone actually completing the "Review CMR Outline" assignments from the actual CMR? Or rather or you just using the time to go back over lecture notes?
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
Kage3212 wrote:Is anyone actually completing the "Review CMR Outline" assignments from the actual CMR? Or rather or you just using the time to go back over lecture notes?
I just read the outlines that I have/ smart bar essay outlines and check it off
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
how worthwhile are the test review videos?? i already reviewed my answers. does it give tips and tricks or is it just basically a video of the explanations?
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
Nothing ground shattering. Except you get to learn about how to pass the real estate licensing exam.N.P.H. wrote:how worthwhile are the test review videos?? i already reviewed my answers. does it give tips and tricks or is it just basically a video of the explanations?
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
I am going over lecture notes, except the state distinctions, I flipped through those in CMR (not really all that important in my state).Kage3212 wrote:Is anyone actually completing the "Review CMR Outline" assignments from the actual CMR? Or rather or you just using the time to go back over lecture notes?
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
Yep. I've completely abandoned barbri.N.P.H. wrote:how worthwhile are the test review videos?? i already reviewed my answers. does it give tips and tricks or is it just basically a video of the explanations?
Starting tomorrow, I'm going to print out all 27 outlines and read them all one-by-one the next few days.
- smokeylarue
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
Just HOW different is Emmanuel questions compared to Barbri. I've done pretty much all the Barbri MBE practice questions possible, I've seen a lot of comments in this thread that they "feel different." Are the BARBRI questions that different than the real thing?
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
No clue about the "real thing" since none of us took it yet. Emanuel "feels" very different as in its questions make you feel uncomfortable. But usually ended up doing ok percentage wise.smokeylarue wrote:Just HOW different is Emmanuel questions compared to Barbri. I've done pretty much all the Barbri MBE practice questions possible, I've seen a lot of comments in this thread that they "feel different." Are the BARBRI questions that different than the real thing?
- Good Guy Gaud
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
They're pretty different but what you've learned in BarBri will still typically get you to the correct answer choice. I think most of us see improved scores with Emanual's (which are all actual questions [save for the civ pro] as far as I understand it) as compared to BarBri's.smokeylarue wrote:Just HOW different is Emmanuel questions compared to Barbri. I've done pretty much all the Barbri MBE practice questions possible, I've seen a lot of comments in this thread that they "feel different." Are the BARBRI questions that different than the real thing?
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
Emanuel S&T is a compilation of released questions, S&T2 are questions written by Emanuel himself (I think)?Good Guy Gaud wrote: They're pretty different but what you've learned in BarBri will still typically get you to the correct answer choice. I think most of us see improved scores with Emanual's (which are all actual questions [save for the civ pro] as far as I understand it) as compared to BarBri's.
On that note, did anyone read the subject notes on Emanuel (the few pages before question sets)? I dove right into questions so I skipped them. Are they worth reading?
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Re: BarBri Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam
Sorry to hear that. I lost my Dad to cancer during law school. My biggest regret is not spending more time with him. Instead, I was too focused on grades and studying instead of maximizing my time with my Dad. Don't make that mistake. There will always be another opportunity to take the bar exam. But you won't have another opportunity to spend this precious time with your father. Just one perspective from someone who, unfortunately, has been through what you're going through. PM me if you ever need to talk or vent.thewaterlanding wrote:My dad was diagnosed with Stage 4 cancer like 3-4 weeks ago.
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