July, 2016 Exam Update - How to Pass the Bar Exam (MEE Predictions, Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

numbertwo88
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby numbertwo88 » Mon May 25, 2015 2:04 am

orangecup wrote:
numbertwo88 wrote:
orangecup wrote:Thanks for the awesome post!

Do you recommend making our own outlines? If so, when is the best time to start on those? After we finish a subject by lecture? In July?

Also, do you think outlines of your length (just a few pages in length) are most useful?

I made my own outlines for every MBE subject and every essay subject. I'd definitely aim to have them all done by July 1st 1- at that point you can just read and review them and have spend all of your other time practicing. You don't want to waste much of July learning material from scratch.

The essay subject outlines weren't as detailed as the MBE subjects - they literally just covered the most frequently tested areas on the exam.


I'm using Kaplan and they have NY subjects up til July 15 (the core is finished by July 10). Does that mean I should be working ahead of schedule (e.g., instead of spending 3 days on Property, doing it in 2..... OR spending time on weekends)?


I started early and spent perhaps 1.5 months outlining? I still did MBE questions (single subject every single day without missing a beat) and graded essays per the schedule. Even so, if you finish the core by July 15th and you still have your own outlines in your own words that you wrote along the way you'll be in a good place! After my outlines were done I was in a pretty strict review, MBE, essay regimen for the last month that I planned for myself (I used Themis).

Like you I did 3 days per MBE subject so I wouldn't change that! Maybe on weekends do 1 state essay outline? I kept my weekends light -- it's necessary for sanity!

So many people cram the law because much of June (hourly) is lectures/handouts. You want to retain & absorb the information as best as you can as you go along. I took maybe a morning or afternoon with each MBE outline after reading about the subject (for me lectures were too passive - I preferred reading long outlines/critical pass cards). Essay subjects are a tad easier to write as well (mine were like 1 to 2 pages), so finishing those outlines later is totally fine because they're not as time consuming.

I swear the people who go insane after July 4th haven't been sponges throughout the entire process. I didn't increase the hours I did work in the last month either due in part to retaining much of the law from the first 1.5 months.

Since it's still early in the game you'll definitely find your groove and fall into it :)

orangecup
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby orangecup » Mon May 25, 2015 2:25 am

UndecidedMN wrote:They are doing MBE subjects until the 10th? I hope not. Barbri finishes those (in MN anyway) by June 23.

I do not recommend making any sort of outline until you have watched the lecture of the subject, especially on subjects you have not taken. The lecturers will tell you where to focus your time because they know where the bar exam likes to hit. If you look at your prep book outline, you might see a ton of stuff on product liability, but the lecturer may say skip it because NY never tests it. Worst case, spend most of your time on the MBE and let your essays suffer. So spend the three days on Property. You just may want to get your MBE outlines done early, buy flashcards, or use someone else's outline.

I just looked at NY on Barbri's schedule. Man that sucks. Can't wait for that state to become UBE. Going back to your question, putting extra time on the weekends is never a bad thing. However, be careful you do not burn yourself out before the 4th of July. That is when you will go hardcore. I know during June I only spent 3-4 hours a weekend so I could maintain my sanity. Hope I answered your question.


Sorry, I should have been more clear. It looks like Kaplan finishes the MBE subjects by June 19 (with a mid-term review on June 22). It then switches to NY subjects, which end on July 15. Based on what Numbertwo said, it seems like it'd be fine to have the MBE subjects outlined pre-July 4, and then have the NY subjects outlined by ~July 15?

As for the rest of your advice, that makes a lot of sense. Thanks!

orangecup
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby orangecup » Mon May 25, 2015 2:29 am

numbertwo88 wrote:I started early and spent perhaps 1.5 months outlining? I still did MBE questions (single subject every single day without missing a beat) and graded essays per the schedule. Even so, if you finish the core by July 15th and you still have your own outlines in your own words that you wrote along the way you'll be in a good place! After my outlines were done I was in a pretty strict review, MBE, essay regimen for the last month that I planned for myself (I used Themis).

Like you I did 3 days per MBE subject so I wouldn't change that! Maybe on weekends do 1 state essay outline? I kept my weekends light -- it's necessary for sanity!

So many people cram the law because much of June (hourly) is lectures/handouts. You want to retain & absorb the information as best as you can as you go along. I took maybe a morning or afternoon with each MBE outline after reading about the subject (for me lectures were too passive - I preferred reading long outlines/critical pass cards). Essay subjects are a tad easier to write as well (mine were like 1 to 2 pages), so finishing those outlines later is totally fine because they're not as time consuming.

I swear the people who go insane after July 4th haven't been sponges throughout the entire process. I didn't increase the hours I did work in the last month either due in part to retaining much of the law from the first 1.5 months.

Since it's still early in the game you'll definitely find your groove and fall into it :)


I'm definitely going to try to keep up with the bolded! It looks like Kaplan has a bank of ~2200 online, so an average of 33-40 a day would deplete them.

As for the underlined, I'd imagine if I put in some work on the weekends (and got a little ahead of schedule), I could dedicate the last 2-3 weeks entirely to outline review/flash cards, MBE Qs, and essays.

Thanks for the advice. One additional question that popped into my mind: it looks like the Kaplan course has the first half dedicated to MBE, and the second half dedicated to NY subjects (with continued MBE drilling each day). Is this the norm? I just feel like I'd forgot a lot of the MBE stuff, but I suppose it'd be wise to go ahead and review outlines along with MBE drilling (at least briefly)?

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Mon May 25, 2015 9:54 am

orangecup wrote:
numbertwo88 wrote:
Thanks for the advice. One additional question that popped into my mind: it looks like the Kaplan course has the first half dedicated to MBE, and the second half dedicated to NY subjects (with continued MBE drilling each day). Is this the norm? I just feel like I'd forgot a lot of the MBE stuff, but I suppose it'd be wise to go ahead and review outlines along with MBE drilling (at least briefly)?


This is the norm. The MBE is where most of your bar exam score will come from. You want to learn that first. When you start getting to your state specific stuff, you should still be doing a couple of hours a day of MBE. Example: You get a day of agency and partnership. The lecture was about three hours with 1.25x speed online. You do the lecture, take a break for a half hour, then do an two hours of an MBE subject. The next day or two I did my outline for Agency. You want to spread out a little your learning/review of a subject, not just cram it all one day so you will retain more. Mean while you are still practicing the MBE almost everyday which is most important.

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LetsGoLAW
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby LetsGoLAW » Mon May 25, 2015 11:51 am

At what point did you create your own outlines, after the lecture or a later date? Any preference?

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Mon May 25, 2015 12:07 pm

LetsGoLAW wrote:At what point did you create your own outlines, after the lecture or a later date? Any preference?


My MBE outlines, which was my flashcards with notes added, I made once I finished all of my video lectures on the MBE subjects. I wanted to watch those lectures first and do some workshops and practice questions. So I would say about by the last week of June at the latest.

As to the MEE, I only finished those about 2 weeks before the bar. You want to spend most of your time on the MBE. Using UBE as example, 20% of your score is from MPT, 50% from MBE multiple choice, and then of the 6 essays, there has always been at least 2 if not 3 from MBE subjects. July of 2014 bar exam, 65% of your grade was from MBE subjects, 20% MPT, and 15% MEE subjects.

My short-outlines kept that scoring system in mind. Figure I spent three hours on the lectures, two hours making the outline, about two hours doing essays, and maybe another hour reviewing my outlines. So at most I spent 9 hours total studying per MEE subject and probably less. Although I know Civ Pro I spent a little more because it was always on the MEE prior to becoming a MBE subject.

In short, do your MBE outline/flash cards once you have finished all of the MBE video lectures. First, this allows your mind to focus on the specific MBE subject being taught during the lecture. Second, this gives you a good review to refresh after the lecture. And last, gives you plenty of time to drill before the bar.

GL

My_name_is_jimmothy
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby My_name_is_jimmothy » Mon May 25, 2015 2:41 pm

I didn't do any outlines.

My secret was using a modified IRAC and writing about 40 practice essays. I practiced about 5 PTs (CBX) and used barbri amp until I basically memorized every section.

The modified IRAC was called ILFAC.

Issue
Law
Facts
Analysis/conclusion

The only real difference is the fact section. I was taught to transcribe the facts word for word from the essay questions.

And I passed...

Don't stress and don't waste time on outlines because you don't get points for outlining.

sparty99
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby sparty99 » Mon May 25, 2015 3:10 pm

I didn't do 2,000 questions. NEver did the mix Themis question set. Never practiced a MPT. However I passed on the first try.

You need to understand why you get the questions wrong and why the answer is the correct answer. That is more important than doing a significant amount of MBE questions. The videos are a waste of time. Making your own mini-outlines for every course is probably a waste of time as well.

numbertwo88
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby numbertwo88 » Mon May 25, 2015 4:58 pm

orangecup wrote:Thanks for the advice. One additional question that popped into my mind: it looks like the Kaplan course has the first half dedicated to MBE, and the second half dedicated to NY subjects (with continued MBE drilling each day). Is this the norm? I just feel like I'd forgot a lot of the MBE stuff, but I suppose it'd be wise to go ahead and review outlines along with MBE drilling (at least briefly)?

You definitely won't forget the MBE stuff! In drilling MBE questions all aspects of black letter law are constantly being reinforced so don't worry about it at all. & that pattern is definitely the norm with MBE first and state-specific second (I had friends take NY and with a variety of Kaplan, Barbri, and Themis among them and it was the commonality among us).

The great thing about the MBE is that once you do so many questions, you literally start seeing patterns because there are only so many ways to test the law in a multiple choice format. I'm a part of the 2,000+ MBE question camp (with reviewing wrong/confusing answers of course) however from the various replies everyone definitely masters the MBE differently.

Geaux12
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby Geaux12 » Mon May 25, 2015 8:45 pm

I've got the Critical Pass flashcards sitting in front of me. How should I use them? Should I go through an entire subject all at once on the day we cover the topic, adding state-specific distinctions/notes as required? How did everyone else use them?

I'm using Kaplan, FTR.

waxecstatic
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby waxecstatic » Mon May 25, 2015 8:47 pm

UndecidedMN wrote:
LetsGoLAW wrote:At what point did you create your own outlines, after the lecture or a later date? Any preference?


My MBE outlines, which was my flashcards with notes added, I made once I finished all of my video lectures on the MBE subjects. I wanted to watch those lectures first and do some workshops and practice questions. So I would say about by the last week of June at the latest.

As to the MEE, I only finished those about 2 weeks before the bar. You want to spend most of your time on the MBE. Using UBE as example, 20% of your score is from MPT, 50% from MBE multiple choice, and then of the 6 essays, there has always been at least 2 if not 3 from MBE subjects. July of 2014 bar exam, 65% of your grade was from MBE subjects, 20% MPT, and 15% MEE subjects.

My short-outlines kept that scoring system in mind. Figure I spent three hours on the lectures, two hours making the outline, about two hours doing essays, and maybe another hour reviewing my outlines. So at most I spent 9 hours total studying per MEE subject and probably less. Although I know Civ Pro I spent a little more because it was always on the MEE prior to becoming a MBE subject.

In short, do your MBE outline/flash cards once you have finished all of the MBE video lectures. First, this allows your mind to focus on the specific MBE subject being taught during the lecture. Second, this gives you a good review to refresh after the lecture. And last, gives you plenty of time to drill before the bar.

GL


Why do you need to do all this when you're just going to end up with an outline similar to or identical to the conviser mini review which you can get on eBay for like 20 bucks? Honestly, why would anyone do all that work when all that matters is that you pass the test and you can pass the test by just memorizing the conviser mini review? The lectures are a complete waste of time btw. Again, you will end up with an outline almost identical to the conviser mini review. And with the shitload of outlines other people have made on the internet, why would anyone waste time making their own outline? Just do the conviser mini review and the practice questions. Outlining, watching lectures, totally inefficient use of time. As someone said, you don't get any points for your outlines.

waxecstatic
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby waxecstatic » Mon May 25, 2015 8:50 pm

Geaux12 wrote:I've got the Critical Pass flashcards sitting in front of me. How should I use them? Should I go through an entire subject all at once on the day we cover the topic, adding state-specific distinctions/notes as required? How did everyone else use them?

I'm using Kaplan, FTR.


They're good but they just sort of give you the elements of each law and don't really explain how it works. Obviously it's hard to go into detail on certain areas that are inherently more complicated like the parol evidence. But if you're gonna do torts, criminal law, or evidence, and you're basically just spitting out elements of a tort, naming the exceptions to a hearsay rule, or defining a crime, they're great. BTW, I bought the version that you can get on your phone as well but it's just not the same as having the cards in front of you. The font is ridiculously small. Another great resource is quizlet which you can be a member of for free and use on your laptop.
Last edited by waxecstatic on Mon May 25, 2015 9:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Mon May 25, 2015 9:00 pm

Geaux12 wrote:I've got the Critical Pass flashcards sitting in front of me. How should I use them? Should I go through an entire subject all at once on the day we cover the topic, adding state-specific distinctions/notes as required? How did everyone else use them?

I'm using Kaplan, FTR.


I used them as a resource after the lecture. I took my lecture notes and added to the cards where I think I was lacking. Until I really had a subject down, I would go through like five or ten at a time. Once I got them well enough, I would go through the next five. In the last two weeks I was going through a subject at a time. Usually took about a half-hour to an hour once I had them really down.

myrtlewinston
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby myrtlewinston » Tue May 26, 2015 11:47 pm

UndecidedMN wrote:
Geaux12 wrote:I've got the Critical Pass flashcards sitting in front of me. How should I use them? Should I go through an entire subject all at once on the day we cover the topic, adding state-specific distinctions/notes as required? How did everyone else use them?

I'm using Kaplan, FTR.


I used them as a resource after the lecture. I took my lecture notes and added to the cards where I think I was lacking. Until I really had a subject down, I would go through like five or ten at a time. Once I got them well enough, I would go through the next five. In the last two weeks I was going through a subject at a time. Usually took about a half-hour to an hour once I had them really down.


Did you do anything to prepare for the lectures?

You're right. As much as I'd like to make my own flashcards, that time and energy is better saved for practise and memorisation.

It's only been a week, and I'm rebelling against Barbri. ;-)

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Wed May 27, 2015 8:03 am

myrtlewinston wrote:
UndecidedMN wrote:
Geaux12 wrote:I've got the Critical Pass flashcards sitting in front of me. How should I use them? Should I go through an entire subject all at once on the day we cover the topic, adding state-specific distinctions/notes as required? How did everyone else use them?

I'm using Kaplan, FTR.


I used them as a resource after the lecture. I took my lecture notes and added to the cards where I think I was lacking. Until I really had a subject down, I would go through like five or ten at a time. Once I got them well enough, I would go through the next five. In the last two weeks I was going through a subject at a time. Usually took about a half-hour to an hour once I had them really down.


Did you do anything to prepare for the lectures?

You're right. As much as I'd like to make my own flashcards, that time and energy is better saved for practise and memorisation.

It's only been a week, and I'm rebelling against Barbri. ;-)


I think in the beginning I did some AMP and reviewed the CMR. But really when I got in the groove, no. I know for all of the MEE subjects I just went straight into the lectures. I would just do that for everything.

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Danger Zone
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby Danger Zone » Thu May 28, 2015 10:33 pm

This is all really helpful. I'm on BarBri and just realizing that half of this shit won't actually help me retain anything. Ordered the Critical Pass flash cards yesterday. Gonna hit those hard daily along with the Conviser.

orangecup
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby orangecup » Thu May 28, 2015 10:44 pm

Danger Zone wrote:This is all really helpful. I'm on BarBri and just realizing that half of this shit won't actually help me retain anything. Ordered the Critical Pass flash cards yesterday. Gonna hit those hard daily along with the Conviser.


Does critical pass have Civ Pro flashcards now? Their website makes it seem like no.

Edit: NM, I'm dumb the purchase page says yes. They just haven't updated the other parts of their website.

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Danger Zone
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby Danger Zone » Thu May 28, 2015 10:47 pm

orangecup wrote:
Danger Zone wrote:This is all really helpful. I'm on BarBri and just realizing that half of this shit won't actually help me retain anything. Ordered the Critical Pass flash cards yesterday. Gonna hit those hard daily along with the Conviser.


Does critical pass have Civ Pro flashcards now? Their website makes it seem like no.

Edit: NM, I'm dumb the purchase page says yes. They just haven't updated the other parts of their website.

Critical Pass FAQ page wrote:Does Critical Pass include Civil Procedure?

Yes! As of October 2014, the revised and updated set includes Civil Procedure, which will be added to the MBE for the February 2015 exam. Unfortunately, Civil Procedure is not available for sale as an individual subject purchase.


Also, if anyone else decides to purchase the Crit Pass cards, I'd appreciate if you used my referral link:

http://criticalpass.refr.cc/XN994X4

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Thu May 28, 2015 11:20 pm

Danger Zone wrote:This is all really helpful. I'm on BarBri and just realizing that half of this shit won't actually help me retain anything. Ordered the Critical Pass flash cards yesterday. Gonna hit those hard daily along with the Conviser.


I would use your lecture notes over conviser.

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Thu May 28, 2015 11:22 pm

orangecup wrote:
Danger Zone wrote:This is all really helpful. I'm on BarBri and just realizing that half of this shit won't actually help me retain anything. Ordered the Critical Pass flash cards yesterday. Gonna hit those hard daily along with the Conviser.


Does critical pass have Civ Pro flashcards now? Their website makes it seem like no.

Edit: NM, I'm dumb the purchase page says yes. They just haven't updated the other parts of their website.


Yeah. From what I have been told by other people, the civ pro cards are just as good as the rest of the MBE subjects.

Geaux12
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby Geaux12 » Thu May 28, 2015 11:23 pm

Danger Zone wrote:
Also, if anyone else decides to purchase the Crit Pass cards, I'd appreciate if you used my referral link:

http://criticalpass.refr.cc/XN994X4


Yeah, I bet you would.

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Thu May 28, 2015 11:46 pm

Something else I would emphasis. I would not really spend time on essays right now, but more on the multiple choice for MBE subjects. You have taken numerous essay questions in law school, but not really if any multiple choice. Just getting used to the format of the MBE question can make a world of difference. GL.

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Danger Zone
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby Danger Zone » Fri May 29, 2015 1:19 am

Geaux12 wrote:
Danger Zone wrote:
Also, if anyone else decides to purchase the Crit Pass cards, I'd appreciate if you used my referral link:

http://criticalpass.refr.cc/XN994X4


Yeah, I bet you would.

Ehh at least I was honest about it instead of shamelessly linking without disclosure like the OP

MPTPWZ1026
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby MPTPWZ1026 » Fri May 29, 2015 9:51 pm

myrtlewinston wrote:
UndecidedMN wrote:
Geaux12 wrote:I've got the Critical Pass flashcards sitting in front of me. How should I use them? Should I go through an entire subject all at once on the day we cover the topic, adding state-specific distinctions/notes as required? How did everyone else use them?

I'm using Kaplan, FTR.


I used them as a resource after the lecture. I took my lecture notes and added to the cards where I think I was lacking. Until I really had a subject down, I would go through like five or ten at a time. Once I got them well enough, I would go through the next five. In the last two weeks I was going through a subject at a time. Usually took about a half-hour to an hour once I had them really down.


Did you do anything to prepare for the lectures?

You're right. As much as I'd like to make my own flashcards, that time and energy is better saved for practise and memorisation.

It's only been a week, and I'm rebelling against Barbri. ;-)


I just use them with Barbri. I read the CMR to "prepare" for the lecture. I then watch the lecture and fill out the lecture notes while also adding anything the cards are lacking to them. It's mainly bar tips and then all caps for things like "always tested," "rarely tested," or "know this well." I plan on using them for my after subject review if I can ever get around to actually doing it.

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Fri May 29, 2015 10:03 pm

MPTPWZ1026 wrote:
myrtlewinston wrote:
UndecidedMN wrote:
Geaux12 wrote:I've got the Critical Pass flashcards sitting in front of me. How should I use them? Should I go through an entire subject all at once on the day we cover the topic, adding state-specific distinctions/notes as required? How did everyone else use them?

I'm using Kaplan, FTR.


I used them as a resource after the lecture. I took my lecture notes and added to the cards where I think I was lacking. Until I really had a subject down, I would go through like five or ten at a time. Once I got them well enough, I would go through the next five. In the last two weeks I was going through a subject at a time. Usually took about a half-hour to an hour once I had them really down.


Did you do anything to prepare for the lectures?

You're right. As much as I'd like to make my own flashcards, that time and energy is better saved for practise and memorisation.

It's only been a week, and I'm rebelling against Barbri. ;-)


I just use them with Barbri. I read the CMR to "prepare" for the lecture. I then watch the lecture and fill out the lecture notes while also adding anything the cards are lacking to them. It's mainly bar tips and then all caps for things like "always tested," "rarely tested," or "know this well." I plan on using them for my after subject review if I can ever get around to actually doing it.


Essentially what I did, although not the rarely tested part. If you guys want, I can make a doc that has my notes on each card with the card numbers listed. Only will do this if people actually want it because it is a ton of work.




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