July, 2016 Exam Update - How to Pass the Bar Exam (MEE Predictions, Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Fri Jun 05, 2015 11:53 pm

myrtlewinston wrote:
chrisz1423 wrote:
mr.hands wrote:
UndecidedMN wrote:
chrisz1423 wrote:Ok, just a quick update to close this out. I ended up buying this ebook called "The Bar Exam Trainer." I already read it and it had some helpful stuff about "optimizing" your lifestyle for the bar exam. Some of it I already knew, but overall it was actually pretty cool. Thanks everyone, happy studying!


Sorry I could not respond sooner. GL


Any specifics?


It talks about stress management, scheduling, and it also talks alot about eating healthy and exercising to improve your learning for the bar. Some cool info and resources. Not perfect but well worth the $9 or whatever it was.


Were there any particularly helpful tips? The isolation is getting to me.


Can you study with a friend or two? It helps.

myrtlewinston
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby myrtlewinston » Sat Jun 06, 2015 12:45 am

Good idea! I could also go to a place with good wifi and bingewatch the lectures.
PS. If only Tax were still an MBE subject.

rhs100
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby rhs100 » Sat Jun 06, 2015 11:20 am

Thank you OP for so many good suggestions, I find them very thoughtful. Question - did you do the State Distinction Assessments and CMR distinctions for your state? NY has so many subjects and distinctions. But I was thinking if I can skip those and focus on the MBE, only worrying about the distinctions when I do essay practices (and do the essays open book to learn the distinctions) - would that be good enough? I mean, I understand there are differences (and NY has so many) but it seems like as long as you can come up with a good structure for the essays, you may still get a passing score and I think knowing the MBE will get you there. What is your thought about that?

I am finding that working actively with the MBE answers are more useful for learning the law, instead of focusing on memorizing the BLL on my own/AMP. For that reason I am thinking of deprioritize the Diagnostics since that's more of BLL and at this point I am working with Critical Pass for the BLLs. Do you see any harm to doing that?
Last edited by rhs100 on Sat Jun 06, 2015 11:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

rhs100
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby rhs100 » Sat Jun 06, 2015 11:23 am

myrtlewinston wrote:Good idea! I could also go to a place with good wifi and bingewatch the lectures.
PS. If only Tax were still an MBE subject.


So what I do is I go to my local Panera where they have nice rectangular tables, wifi and good healthy-ish food (always a plus), and watch lectures there with my headphone on. By the time it gets crowded I am done with my lectures and take a lunch break, move to my local library for the rest of the day. Seems to work in terms of keeping it fun.

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Sat Jun 06, 2015 2:34 pm

rhs100 wrote:Thank you OP for so many good suggestions, I find them very thoughtful. Question - did you do the State Distinction Assessments and CMR distinctions for your state? NY has so many subjects and distinctions. But I was thinking if I can skip those and focus on the MBE, only worrying about the distinctions when I do essay practices (and do the essays open book to learn the distinctions) - would that be good enough? I mean, I understand there are differences (and NY has so many) but it seems like as long as you can come up with a good structure for the essays, you may still get a passing score and I think knowing the MBE will get you there. What is your thought about that?

I am finding that working actively with the MBE answers are more useful for learning the law, instead of focusing on memorizing the BLL on my own/AMP. For that reason I am thinking of deprioritize the Diagnostics since that's more of BLL and at this point I am working with Critical Pass for the BLLs. Do you see any harm to doing that?


Ok first. Regardless of what state you are in, if you are taking the MBE (49 states do), there is no state distinctions in the multiple choice. I would only worry about the the state distinctions for the essays.

As for your second questions, I stopped doing AMP after the first week. The flash cards for me were more than enough. You need to self-diagnose yourself by doing countless MBE questions. This will show you where you are lacking specifically in each subject. Do the MBE questions that barbri provides online. Not only will it let you focus on the subject, but also tell you specifically what you are wrong on (i.e. mortgages vs covenants you might be bad on but great on adverse possession.). GL

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Sat Jun 06, 2015 2:35 pm

rhs100 wrote:
myrtlewinston wrote:Good idea! I could also go to a place with good wifi and bingewatch the lectures.
PS. If only Tax were still an MBE subject.


So what I do is I go to my local Panera where they have nice rectangular tables, wifi and good healthy-ish food (always a plus), and watch lectures there with my headphone on. By the time it gets crowded I am done with my lectures and take a lunch break, move to my local library for the rest of the day. Seems to work in terms of keeping it fun.


I studies in the quiet section of the library with a few friends. Forced us to focus on studying because we could not really talk to each other, but we would take breaks around the same time so we could talk and decompress. Would recommend that.

rhs100
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby rhs100 » Sat Jun 06, 2015 3:38 pm

UndecidedMN wrote:Ok first. Regardless of what state you are in, if you are taking the MBE (49 states do), there is no state distinctions in the multiple choice. I would only worry about the the state distinctions for the essays.

As for your second questions, I stopped doing AMP after the first week. The flash cards for me were more than enough. You need to self-diagnose yourself by doing countless MBE questions. This will show you where you are lacking specifically in each subject. Do the MBE questions that barbri provides online. Not only will it let you focus on the subject, but also tell you specifically what you are wrong on (i.e. mortgages vs covenants you might be bad on but great on adverse possession.). GL


Thanks - yes I know the state distinctions are for Essays which is why I was wondering whether those barbri assignments for state distinctions are worth spending time on or waste of time given I could use that time on MBE questions instead.

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Sat Jun 06, 2015 7:42 pm

rhs100 wrote:
UndecidedMN wrote:Ok first. Regardless of what state you are in, if you are taking the MBE (49 states do), there is no state distinctions in the multiple choice. I would only worry about the the state distinctions for the essays.

As for your second questions, I stopped doing AMP after the first week. The flash cards for me were more than enough. You need to self-diagnose yourself by doing countless MBE questions. This will show you where you are lacking specifically in each subject. Do the MBE questions that barbri provides online. Not only will it let you focus on the subject, but also tell you specifically what you are wrong on (i.e. mortgages vs covenants you might be bad on but great on adverse possession.). GL


Thanks - yes I know the state distinctions are for Essays which is why I was wondering whether those barbri assignments for state distinctions are worth spending time on or waste of time given I could use that time on MBE questions instead.


If it were me, MBE is the most important thing so I would spend my time on that.

myrtlewinston
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby myrtlewinston » Sat Jun 06, 2015 7:54 pm

UndecidedMN wrote:
rhs100 wrote:
UndecidedMN wrote:Ok first. Regardless of what state you are in, if you are taking the MBE (49 states do), there is no state distinctions in the multiple choice. I would only worry about the the state distinctions for the essays.

As for your second questions, I stopped doing AMP after the first week. The flash cards for me were more than enough. You need to self-diagnose yourself by doing countless MBE questions. This will show you where you are lacking specifically in each subject. Do the MBE questions that barbri provides online. Not only will it let you focus on the subject, but also tell you specifically what you are wrong on (i.e. mortgages vs covenants you might be bad on but great on adverse possession.). GL


Thanks - yes I know the state distinctions are for Essays which is why I was wondering whether those barbri assignments for state distinctions are worth spending time on or waste of time given I could use that time on MBE questions instead.


If it were me, MBE is the most important thing so I would spend my time on that.


Doesn't that depend on how much weight the MBE carries in one's state?

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Sat Jun 06, 2015 7:56 pm

myrtlewinston wrote:
UndecidedMN wrote:
rhs100 wrote:
UndecidedMN wrote:Ok first. Regardless of what state you are in, if you are taking the MBE (49 states do), there is no state distinctions in the multiple choice. I would only worry about the the state distinctions for the essays.

As for your second questions, I stopped doing AMP after the first week. The flash cards for me were more than enough. You need to self-diagnose yourself by doing countless MBE questions. This will show you where you are lacking specifically in each subject. Do the MBE questions that barbri provides online. Not only will it let you focus on the subject, but also tell you specifically what you are wrong on (i.e. mortgages vs covenants you might be bad on but great on adverse possession.). GL


Thanks - yes I know the state distinctions are for Essays which is why I was wondering whether those barbri assignments for state distinctions are worth spending time on or waste of time given I could use that time on MBE questions instead.


If it were me, MBE is the most important thing so I would spend my time on that.


Doesn't that depend on how much weight the MBE carries in one's state?


Absolutely, but I am sure minimum most states between essays and multiple choice questions, that the MBE must be worth at least 50% UBE it is anywhere between 60 - 70%.

myrtlewinston
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby myrtlewinston » Sat Jun 06, 2015 8:08 pm

It's 40% in NY! Different strategy?

Tabirks
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby Tabirks » Sat Jun 06, 2015 8:37 pm

Does anyone have The Bar Code Cheat Sheets in Action, by Whitney Roberts, I am willing to purchase?

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Sat Jun 06, 2015 8:41 pm

myrtlewinston wrote:It's 40% in NY! Different strategy?


There is a thread by Desert Fox called Strong MBE = Autopass. From what I gather, he calculated a 160 MBE score is a 95% pass rate for NY. Makes sense, especially if you do well on the one MPT. Also remember that of the five essays, MBE subjects will probably be tested. Some stats for you.

160 scaled MBE is top 20% national in July of 2014. So it is hard but doable. Also, here is the link from the NY Bar regarding pass rates : http://www.nybarexam.org/ExamStats/2014 ... istics.pdf. 82% pass first shot. So don't freak too much. Also I love the fact that only 1 out of 6 students of non-aba law schools pass. Should show that stat to that jackass dean of that California non-aba school.

IMO, the majority of your time should be on the MBE. But NY state specific subjects need to be covered. GL

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Jay Heizenburg
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby Jay Heizenburg » Sat Jun 06, 2015 9:22 pm

Tabirks wrote:Does anyone have The Bar Code Cheat Sheets in Action, by Whitney Roberts, I am willing to purchase?


I have a copy for sell. PM me if you're interested.

Geaux12
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby Geaux12 » Sun Jun 07, 2015 5:29 pm

I'm getting bogged down with these Kaplan videos/trying to fill out the BarNotes, and my practice Q time is suffering. I'm already 2/3 days behind. I'm struggling to figure out how to adjust my approach here. Just say fuck it to the videos, blaze through not REALLY paying attention, just filling in the blanks, and then go straight to practice questions/filling out flash cards?

orangecup
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby orangecup » Sun Jun 07, 2015 6:52 pm

Geaux12 wrote:I'm getting bogged down with these Kaplan videos/trying to fill out the BarNotes, and my practice Q time is suffering. I'm already 2/3 days behind. I'm struggling to figure out how to adjust my approach here. Just say fuck it to the videos, blaze through not REALLY paying attention, just filling in the blanks, and then go straight to practice questions/filling out flash cards?


I've been doing vids at 1.5x speed while filling in the blanks. Usually finish around 1pm or so. I then take a break and work out. Get back at 230-3. Then I spend time before dinner doing a bunch of MBE practice Qs. Haven't even looked at flash cards yet. Do those seem useful?

UndecidedMN
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby UndecidedMN » Sun Jun 07, 2015 9:23 pm

orangecup wrote:
Geaux12 wrote:I'm getting bogged down with these Kaplan videos/trying to fill out the BarNotes, and my practice Q time is suffering. I'm already 2/3 days behind. I'm struggling to figure out how to adjust my approach here. Just say fuck it to the videos, blaze through not REALLY paying attention, just filling in the blanks, and then go straight to practice questions/filling out flash cards?


I've been doing vids at 1.5x speed while filling in the blanks. Usually finish around 1pm or so. I then take a break and work out. Get back at 230-3. Then I spend time before dinner doing a bunch of MBE practice Qs. Haven't even looked at flash cards yet. Do those seem useful?


Flashcards will help you more in July then now. Right now you are getting the framework of each subject and being exposed to them again. As you probably took contracts over 2.5 years ago, you need to be re-introduced to it. Once you have finished all of the lectures is when the flash cards show their value.

Geaux12
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby Geaux12 » Mon Jun 08, 2015 10:16 am

orangecup wrote:
Geaux12 wrote:I'm getting bogged down with these Kaplan videos/trying to fill out the BarNotes, and my practice Q time is suffering. I'm already 2/3 days behind. I'm struggling to figure out how to adjust my approach here. Just say fuck it to the videos, blaze through not REALLY paying attention, just filling in the blanks, and then go straight to practice questions/filling out flash cards?


I've been doing vids at 1.5x speed while filling in the blanks. Usually finish around 1pm or so. I then take a break and work out. Get back at 230-3. Then I spend time before dinner doing a bunch of MBE practice Qs. Haven't even looked at flash cards yet. Do those seem useful?


What time to you usually end up in bed? I'm not even finished with contracts. I think I'm going to blow through all the Contracts lectures & fill out the BarNotes as fast as possible, saving all the QBank questions until the end. Then I can catchup on the Essay Workshop + Torts. Hopefully be caught up by the weekend.

The cards seem incredibly helpful, if you're willing to take the time to use them. My problem is finding that time. I think I want to prioritize them over any of Kaplan's prep tools (One Sheets, for example, or Flex Cards). Although I've heard the Flex cards are good for state distinctions in things like Evidence...

orangecup
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby orangecup » Mon Jun 08, 2015 1:28 pm

Thanks OP!

Geaux12 wrote:What time to you usually end up in bed? I'm not even finished with contracts. I think I'm going to blow through all the Contracts lectures & fill out the BarNotes as fast as possible, saving all the QBank questions until the end. Then I can catchup on the Essay Workshop + Torts. Hopefully be caught up by the weekend.

The cards seem incredibly helpful, if you're willing to take the time to use them. My problem is finding that time. I think I want to prioritize them over any of Kaplan's prep tools (One Sheets, for example, or Flex Cards). Although I've heard the Flex cards are good for state distinctions in things like Evidence...


Around midnight. I've been keeping pace with the lectures, and have condensed the bar notes (in outline form, roughly 10 pages each) for almost everything so far. If you include the checkpoint quizzes, then I've been doing an avg of 30 MBE Qs a day (weekdays). I've only outlined 2 practice essays and 1 MPT so far though. I think I need to find a way to incorporate those more throughout the week (or use the weekends to catch up). One caveat: I generally stop working after dinner. I'll wrap up review of MBE Qs, e.g., but I won't start something new. This will probably have to change as we get deeper into June/July.

Good to hear. I decided to forego one sheets entirely. I figured condensing as outlines was more useful for me. And I haven't looked at Flex cards yet either. If it's useful for distinctions, I may take a look at that in July, I guess?

A side note: I think I'm going to wait to do MBE questions on a particular subject until after ALL the videos. I've found that there's too much content overlap (a negligence issue may implicate defenses, and you may not have covered that yet, e.g.) so it makes it a bit hard. Of course, that's a good way to learn too, I suppose.... but I might just allocate that time to MBE Qs for previously covered topics instead.

Geaux12
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby Geaux12 » Mon Jun 08, 2015 3:13 pm

orangecup wrote:
A side note: I think I'm going to wait to do MBE questions on a particular subject until after ALL the videos. I've found that there's too much content overlap (a negligence issue may implicate defenses, and you may not have covered that yet, e.g.) so it makes it a bit hard. Of course, that's a good way to learn too, I suppose.... but I might just allocate that time to MBE Qs for previously covered topics instead.


That's exactly what I'm going to do. If I haven't covered modification, I don't want to waste a question on modification. I'm getting incredibly concerned/anxious because I'm taking 6 hours to finish a 3.5 hour lecture because I'm filling in/formatting my Bar Notes...I don't know what I need to change.

orangecup
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby orangecup » Mon Jun 08, 2015 3:34 pm

Geaux12 wrote:
orangecup wrote:
A side note: I think I'm going to wait to do MBE questions on a particular subject until after ALL the videos. I've found that there's too much content overlap (a negligence issue may implicate defenses, and you may not have covered that yet, e.g.) so it makes it a bit hard. Of course, that's a good way to learn too, I suppose.... but I might just allocate that time to MBE Qs for previously covered topics instead.


That's exactly what I'm going to do. If I haven't covered modification, I don't want to waste a question on modification. I'm getting incredibly concerned/anxious because I'm taking 6 hours to finish a 3.5 hour lecture because I'm filling in/formatting my Bar Notes...I don't know what I need to change.


I've been viewing the lectures at 1.5x and it takes me roughly the time of the lecture (a 3.5 hour lecture takes 3.5 hours) to complete it, along with pauses to fill in the blanks (if needed), and mini-breaks. Granted, I'm a fairly fast typer (100-120 WPM), so it may be a little harder if you can't type quite as fast.

I don't spend time formatting the notes until later (when I condense into my shorter outlines). What do you find is eating up the most time when going through those lectures?

myrtlewinston
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby myrtlewinston » Mon Jun 08, 2015 3:45 pm

Orangecup,
I'm in awe of your ability to be on schedule. How long does it take you to go through the lecture notes for one subject?

It makes sense to me to do the lectures first. E.g. There are things in the Agency and New York Practice that would have helped in answering Negligence questions.

Geaux12
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby Geaux12 » Mon Jun 08, 2015 3:46 pm

orangecup wrote:
Geaux12 wrote:
orangecup wrote:
A side note: I think I'm going to wait to do MBE questions on a particular subject until after ALL the videos. I've found that there's too much content overlap (a negligence issue may implicate defenses, and you may not have covered that yet, e.g.) so it makes it a bit hard. Of course, that's a good way to learn too, I suppose.... but I might just allocate that time to MBE Qs for previously covered topics instead.


That's exactly what I'm going to do. If I haven't covered modification, I don't want to waste a question on modification. I'm getting incredibly concerned/anxious because I'm taking 6 hours to finish a 3.5 hour lecture because I'm filling in/formatting my Bar Notes...I don't know what I need to change.


I've been viewing the lectures at 1.5x and it takes me roughly the time of the lecture (a 3.5 hour lecture takes 3.5 hours) to complete it, along with pauses to fill in the blanks (if needed), and mini-breaks. Granted, I'm a fairly fast typer (100-120 WPM), so it may be a little harder if you can't type quite as fast.

I don't spend time formatting the notes until later (when I condense into my shorter outlines). What do you find is eating up the most time when going through those lectures?


Formatting, without a doubt. I'm spending a ton of time deleting blank lines, bolding, underlining, etc.

orangecup
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby orangecup » Mon Jun 08, 2015 3:52 pm

myrtlewinston wrote:Orangecup,
I'm in awe of your ability to be on schedule. How long does it take you to go through the lecture notes for one subject?

It makes sense to me to do the lectures first. E.g. There are things in the Agency and New York Practice that would have helped in answering Negligence questions.


Haha, I feel like I still get behind since I haven't focused much on essays yet. Condensing them, you mean? I'd say it takes 3-4 hours, but that's just a guess. I tend to do it in short spurts. Do 20-30 minutes after dinner, then relax with some TV, etc.

Geaux12 wrote:Formatting, without a doubt. I'm spending a ton of time deleting blank lines, bolding, underlining, etc.


I don't spend any time deleting blank lines. I also just highlight important things, which means I don't have to click around too much. IF you find outlining useful (not everyone does), then I'd suggest scrapping the formatting while watching the lecture.

rhs100
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Re: How to Pass the Bar Exam (Tips, Outlines and Strategies)

Postby rhs100 » Wed Jun 10, 2015 8:27 am

Any tips for essays? I did a contracts essay yesterday and I felt like there were so many things I should talk about - not sure how I will ever be able to do this under timed condition, I'm a detailed oriented person. Every time I have to practice writing an essay, that ends up being my worst day(s) of my week.




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