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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:08 am
by zot1
annapach wrote:Can someone please explain supp jurisdiction to me? It is just not sticking for some reason.


If a second P had claim arising out of the same transaction, it comes if complete diversity can be maintained (P is not from same state as D). AIC does not matter.

D can cross-claim and implead. For those two, diversity or AIC does not matter.

These are the only rules that come to mind at the moment.

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:21 am
by Raiden
zot1 wrote:
Raiden wrote:At 63%, I definitely feel I am not doing the bar exam prep dance properly.


Have you finished all the lectures?


Yes. Just wondering where would be the best time to devote my resources. I want to learn all of the essay rules, fast.

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:29 am
by zot1
Raiden wrote:
zot1 wrote:
Raiden wrote:At 63%, I definitely feel I am not doing the bar exam prep dance properly.


Have you finished all the lectures?


Yes. Just wondering where would be the best time to devote my resources. I want to learn all of the essay rules, fast.


I don't know of a way to learn them fast. I'm still struggling and I've completed a bit more. My strategy at the moment is MBE exam, two essays, and then review the rest of the day. The MBE allows me to keep reviewing rules. The essays I do for practice to see what rules I can make up/remember. And the reviewing is self-explanatory.

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:31 am
by anon sequitur
zot1 wrote:
If a second P had claim arising out of the same transaction, it comes if complete diversity can be maintained (P is not from same state as D). AIC does not matter.

D can cross-claim and implead. For those two, diversity or AIC does not matter.

These are the only rules that come to mind at the moment.


The other tricky situation that seems to come up sometimes is when a P wants to add a second D; can only do this if claim against second D meets FQ or DJ on its own. This is to prevent P's from bringing a diversity claim against D1 just so they can use supplemental jx to get at their real target, a non-diverse D2. I feel like learning the rationale behind these is the only way I can possibly remember them.

I also like to think of supplemental jurisdiction as tag-along jurisdiction, makes more sense to me that way. It's for when you've already got a valid claim between P and D, then want to add another claim to tag-along. The tag-along has to be subservient, can't ruin diversity, has to have something in common with everyone else.

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 8:40 am
by smalogna
Well directed study wants me doing 250 MBE questions today. HA!

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 8:46 am
by InternationalShoe
How many MBE questions are you guys doing per day? I've been doing one mixed set of 50 questions per day (although now I'll be getting into the 100 question mixed sets). Directed study has me scheduled for 200 questions today, plus 5 essays, which is really not going to happen. I'm not sure if the system is just resetting to try and to get me to 100% course completion by test day or if that's really where I should be focused. Themis NY sent an email last week saying that if we've completed around 1,000 MBEs + 300 from the milestone exams, we've likely covered enough. Just curious what you all are doing. I've completed around 86% of the course and I think my strategy for the next week is going to heavily focus on the essays while doing one MBE set max per day to stay fresh.

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 8:56 am
by eloise16
InternationalShoe wrote:How many MBE questions are you guys doing per day? I've been doing one mixed set of 50 questions per day (although now I'll be getting into the 100 question mixed sets). Directed study has me scheduled for 200 questions today, plus 5 essays, which is really not going to happen. I'm not sure if the system is just resetting to try and to get me to 100% course completion by test day or if that's really where I should be focused. Themis NY sent an email last week saying that if we've completed around 1,000 MBEs + 300 from the milestone exams, we've likely covered enough. Just curious what you all are doing. I've completed around 86% of the course and I think my strategy for the next week is going to heavily focus on the essays while doing one MBE set max per day to stay fresh.


Your plan sounds consistent with what every one else on here has been posting! It's pretty much what I'm doing too. Although today I am going to solely focus on my state specific non-MBE subjects and not do any MBE questions. But for the past week I've been doing one MBE per day and then review all day/do essays. The only thing that bothers me is how damn long it takes to review the MBE questions afterwards... Especially the 100 question sets.

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 9:11 am
by Ahyis
I stopped doing the practice MPTs a while ago when I realized that I had begun to memorize fake law from the fact patterns...

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 9:12 am
by laduper
Have any NY people made a functional condensed CPLR outline? I didn't go to law school in NY and the amount of info is... overwhelming. I have pretty good condensed outlines for every other topic, should ya want em!

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:11 am
by 2014
InternationalShoe wrote:How many MBE questions are you guys doing per day? I've been doing one mixed set of 50 questions per day (although now I'll be getting into the 100 question mixed sets). Directed study has me scheduled for 200 questions today, plus 5 essays, which is really not going to happen. I'm not sure if the system is just resetting to try and to get me to 100% course completion by test day or if that's really where I should be focused. Themis NY sent an email last week saying that if we've completed around 1,000 MBEs + 300 from the milestone exams, we've likely covered enough. Just curious what you all are doing. I've completed around 86% of the course and I think my strategy for the next week is going to heavily focus on the essays while doing one MBE set max per day to stay fresh.

I do at least 1 set sometimes 2 a day, I'm trying to get through them all by Sunday. I'm scheduled to do 100 MBEs today, 200 tomorrow, and 200 thurs though lol

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:46 am
by annapach
Ahyis wrote:I stopped doing the practice MPTs a while ago when I realized that I had begun to memorize fake law from the fact patterns...



Haha this is amazing. I have become like this too. About everything. My girlfriend sent me a long news article to read yesterday and I was like there's no room in my brain for that sorry

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:50 am
by Mad Hatter
If anyone wants an interesting defamation review:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/ ... rried.html

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 11:40 am
by 2014
Anyone know if there is somewhere else to get NY MC questions? Out of Themis ones and still suck

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:34 pm
by Pickled
Help please:

When is extrinsic evidence of character allowed?

Thanks

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:49 pm
by ineptimusprime
Pickled wrote:Help please:

When is extrinsic evidence of character allowed?

Thanks


All reputation and opinion evidence is going to be extrinsic evidence, no? So pretty much if character evidence is allowed, it can be proven extrinsically, right? (somebody correct me if I'm wrong)

Do you mean specific instances of conduct? That's allowed for MIMIC, when character is at issue (civ & criminal), and on cross examination of a character witness (about the person they're testifying about)

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:53 pm
by sd5289
ineptimusprime wrote:
Pickled wrote:Help please:

When is extrinsic evidence of character allowed?

Thanks


All reputation and opinion evidence is going to be extrinsic evidence, no? So pretty much if character evidence is allowed, it can be proven extrinsically, right?

Do you mean specific instances of conduct? That's allowed for MIMIC, when character is at issue (civ & criminal), and on cross examination of a character witness (about the person they're testifying about)


No, they mean other evidence besides the witness's testimony. Right now the only thing that sticks in my mind is if you're impeaching a character witness (testifying about another witness's character) via a specific instance of conduct, you cannot use extrinsic evidence if the witness denies the specific instance.

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:06 pm
by ineptimusprime
sd5289 wrote:
ineptimusprime wrote:
Pickled wrote:Help please:

When is extrinsic evidence of character allowed?

Thanks


All reputation and opinion evidence is going to be extrinsic evidence, no? So pretty much if character evidence is allowed, it can be proven extrinsically, right?

Do you mean specific instances of conduct? That's allowed for MIMIC, when character is at issue (civ & criminal), and on cross examination of a character witness (about the person they're testifying about)


No, they mean other evidence besides the witness's testimony. Right now the only thing that sticks in my mind is if you're impeaching a character witness (testifying about another witness's character) via a specific instance of conduct, you cannot use extrinsic evidence if the witness denies the specific instance.


You also can't use extrinsic evidence when you're impeaching a character witness by his character for untruthfulness through a specific instance of conduct (i.e. if you ask him about a bad check he wrote and he denies it, you can't bust out the check). I do think evidence by reputation or opinion is "extrinsic" by definition, cause you're calling a separate character witness to testify about the witness, or am I just deeply confused?

These rules are all so easy to conflate

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:13 pm
by zor
Pickled wrote:Help please:

When is extrinsic evidence of character allowed?

Thanks


Assuming extrinsic means proof by additional witnesses or documents of SPECIFIC occasions, the answer is basically never.

The only exceptions are sex crimes: to show def's sex-related traits in sexual offenses/child molestation, or to show victim's traits. Then basically the barn doors are open.

But it's not permissible when:
- def wants to show that his character is inconsistent with crime
- prosecutor wants to know def's character is consistent with crime
- def wants to show victim's trait (aggressiveness)
- prosecutor wants to show victim's trait (peacefulness)

Extrinsic evidence is OK for non-character impeachment though (except specific contradiction b/c of collateral evidence rule).

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:18 pm
by zor
To those of you struggling with character evidence, feel free to reference this chart I made when I took the class.

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:45 pm
by amorsebu14
zor wrote:To those of you struggling with character evidence, feel free to reference this chart I made when I took the class.


I love you. That is all.

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:51 pm
by Pickled
Thank you all very much.

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:53 pm
by sp1kedrat
zor wrote:To those of you struggling with character evidence, feel free to reference this chart I made when I took the class.


this is awesome. thanks a ton

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 2:27 pm
by zot1
So I got my last graded essay back. THIS TIME, even though I missed some issues, made up some rules, and deviated from the sample answer analysis, the grader gave me a "passing grade" (67) when she would otherwise give me a 33. Do I assume that maybe she had been grading harder before because she wanted to encourage me to do better/try harder, or do I just assume I actually did better this time (even though it really wasn't that different from my other essays...)?

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 3:08 pm
by UnamSanctam
zot1 wrote:So I got my last graded essay back. THIS TIME, even though I missed some issues, made up some rules, and deviated from the sample answer analysis, the grader gave me a "passing grade" (67) when she would otherwise give me a 33. Do I assume that maybe she had been grading harder before because she wanted to encourage me to do better/try harder, or do I just assume I actually did better this time (even though it really wasn't that different from my other essays...)?


I think at this point it's about just not reading the tea leaves.

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 3:12 pm
by zot1
UnamSanctam wrote:
zot1 wrote:So I got my last graded essay back. THIS TIME, even though I missed some issues, made up some rules, and deviated from the sample answer analysis, the grader gave me a "passing grade" (67) when she would otherwise give me a 33. Do I assume that maybe she had been grading harder before because she wanted to encourage me to do better/try harder, or do I just assume I actually did better this time (even though it really wasn't that different from my other essays...)?


I think at this point it's about just not reading the tea leaves.


Ok.