Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

User avatar
zot1
Posts: 3142
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 12:53 am

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zot1 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:08 am

annapach wrote:Can someone please explain supp jurisdiction to me? It is just not sticking for some reason.


If a second P had claim arising out of the same transaction, it comes if complete diversity can be maintained (P is not from same state as D). AIC does not matter.

D can cross-claim and implead. For those two, diversity or AIC does not matter.

These are the only rules that come to mind at the moment.

User avatar
Raiden
Posts: 333
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:11 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby Raiden » Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:21 am

zot1 wrote:
Raiden wrote:At 63%, I definitely feel I am not doing the bar exam prep dance properly.


Have you finished all the lectures?


Yes. Just wondering where would be the best time to devote my resources. I want to learn all of the essay rules, fast.

User avatar
zot1
Posts: 3142
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 12:53 am

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zot1 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:29 am

Raiden wrote:
zot1 wrote:
Raiden wrote:At 63%, I definitely feel I am not doing the bar exam prep dance properly.


Have you finished all the lectures?


Yes. Just wondering where would be the best time to devote my resources. I want to learn all of the essay rules, fast.


I don't know of a way to learn them fast. I'm still struggling and I've completed a bit more. My strategy at the moment is MBE exam, two essays, and then review the rest of the day. The MBE allows me to keep reviewing rules. The essays I do for practice to see what rules I can make up/remember. And the reviewing is self-explanatory.

User avatar
anon sequitur
Posts: 506
Joined: Sun Jun 10, 2012 2:14 am

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby anon sequitur » Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:31 am

zot1 wrote:
If a second P had claim arising out of the same transaction, it comes if complete diversity can be maintained (P is not from same state as D). AIC does not matter.

D can cross-claim and implead. For those two, diversity or AIC does not matter.

These are the only rules that come to mind at the moment.


The other tricky situation that seems to come up sometimes is when a P wants to add a second D; can only do this if claim against second D meets FQ or DJ on its own. This is to prevent P's from bringing a diversity claim against D1 just so they can use supplemental jx to get at their real target, a non-diverse D2. I feel like learning the rationale behind these is the only way I can possibly remember them.

I also like to think of supplemental jurisdiction as tag-along jurisdiction, makes more sense to me that way. It's for when you've already got a valid claim between P and D, then want to add another claim to tag-along. The tag-along has to be subservient, can't ruin diversity, has to have something in common with everyone else.

smalogna
Posts: 119
Joined: Thu May 28, 2015 2:25 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby smalogna » Tue Jul 21, 2015 8:40 am

Well directed study wants me doing 250 MBE questions today. HA!

InternationalShoe
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed May 20, 2015 1:24 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby InternationalShoe » Tue Jul 21, 2015 8:46 am

How many MBE questions are you guys doing per day? I've been doing one mixed set of 50 questions per day (although now I'll be getting into the 100 question mixed sets). Directed study has me scheduled for 200 questions today, plus 5 essays, which is really not going to happen. I'm not sure if the system is just resetting to try and to get me to 100% course completion by test day or if that's really where I should be focused. Themis NY sent an email last week saying that if we've completed around 1,000 MBEs + 300 from the milestone exams, we've likely covered enough. Just curious what you all are doing. I've completed around 86% of the course and I think my strategy for the next week is going to heavily focus on the essays while doing one MBE set max per day to stay fresh.

eloise16
Posts: 67
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2015 2:48 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby eloise16 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 8:56 am

InternationalShoe wrote:How many MBE questions are you guys doing per day? I've been doing one mixed set of 50 questions per day (although now I'll be getting into the 100 question mixed sets). Directed study has me scheduled for 200 questions today, plus 5 essays, which is really not going to happen. I'm not sure if the system is just resetting to try and to get me to 100% course completion by test day or if that's really where I should be focused. Themis NY sent an email last week saying that if we've completed around 1,000 MBEs + 300 from the milestone exams, we've likely covered enough. Just curious what you all are doing. I've completed around 86% of the course and I think my strategy for the next week is going to heavily focus on the essays while doing one MBE set max per day to stay fresh.


Your plan sounds consistent with what every one else on here has been posting! It's pretty much what I'm doing too. Although today I am going to solely focus on my state specific non-MBE subjects and not do any MBE questions. But for the past week I've been doing one MBE per day and then review all day/do essays. The only thing that bothers me is how damn long it takes to review the MBE questions afterwards... Especially the 100 question sets.

Ahyis
Posts: 61
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 9:25 am

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby Ahyis » Tue Jul 21, 2015 9:11 am

I stopped doing the practice MPTs a while ago when I realized that I had begun to memorize fake law from the fact patterns...

laduper
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 4:00 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby laduper » Tue Jul 21, 2015 9:12 am

Have any NY people made a functional condensed CPLR outline? I didn't go to law school in NY and the amount of info is... overwhelming. I have pretty good condensed outlines for every other topic, should ya want em!

User avatar
2014
Posts: 5834
Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 3:53 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby 2014 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:11 am

InternationalShoe wrote:How many MBE questions are you guys doing per day? I've been doing one mixed set of 50 questions per day (although now I'll be getting into the 100 question mixed sets). Directed study has me scheduled for 200 questions today, plus 5 essays, which is really not going to happen. I'm not sure if the system is just resetting to try and to get me to 100% course completion by test day or if that's really where I should be focused. Themis NY sent an email last week saying that if we've completed around 1,000 MBEs + 300 from the milestone exams, we've likely covered enough. Just curious what you all are doing. I've completed around 86% of the course and I think my strategy for the next week is going to heavily focus on the essays while doing one MBE set max per day to stay fresh.

I do at least 1 set sometimes 2 a day, I'm trying to get through them all by Sunday. I'm scheduled to do 100 MBEs today, 200 tomorrow, and 200 thurs though lol

User avatar
annapach
Posts: 53
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 4:24 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby annapach » Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:46 am

Ahyis wrote:I stopped doing the practice MPTs a while ago when I realized that I had begun to memorize fake law from the fact patterns...



Haha this is amazing. I have become like this too. About everything. My girlfriend sent me a long news article to read yesterday and I was like there's no room in my brain for that sorry

User avatar
Mad Hatter
Posts: 655
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2012 10:38 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby Mad Hatter » Tue Jul 21, 2015 10:50 am

If anyone wants an interesting defamation review:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/ ... rried.html

User avatar
2014
Posts: 5834
Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 3:53 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby 2014 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 11:40 am

Anyone know if there is somewhere else to get NY MC questions? Out of Themis ones and still suck

Pickled
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon May 25, 2015 2:03 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby Pickled » Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:34 pm

Help please:

When is extrinsic evidence of character allowed?

Thanks

ineptimusprime
Posts: 356
Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 1:51 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby ineptimusprime » Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:49 pm

Pickled wrote:Help please:

When is extrinsic evidence of character allowed?

Thanks


All reputation and opinion evidence is going to be extrinsic evidence, no? So pretty much if character evidence is allowed, it can be proven extrinsically, right? (somebody correct me if I'm wrong)

Do you mean specific instances of conduct? That's allowed for MIMIC, when character is at issue (civ & criminal), and on cross examination of a character witness (about the person they're testifying about)

User avatar
sd5289
Posts: 1624
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2011 2:02 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby sd5289 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:53 pm

ineptimusprime wrote:
Pickled wrote:Help please:

When is extrinsic evidence of character allowed?

Thanks


All reputation and opinion evidence is going to be extrinsic evidence, no? So pretty much if character evidence is allowed, it can be proven extrinsically, right?

Do you mean specific instances of conduct? That's allowed for MIMIC, when character is at issue (civ & criminal), and on cross examination of a character witness (about the person they're testifying about)


No, they mean other evidence besides the witness's testimony. Right now the only thing that sticks in my mind is if you're impeaching a character witness (testifying about another witness's character) via a specific instance of conduct, you cannot use extrinsic evidence if the witness denies the specific instance.

ineptimusprime
Posts: 356
Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 1:51 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby ineptimusprime » Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:06 pm

sd5289 wrote:
ineptimusprime wrote:
Pickled wrote:Help please:

When is extrinsic evidence of character allowed?

Thanks


All reputation and opinion evidence is going to be extrinsic evidence, no? So pretty much if character evidence is allowed, it can be proven extrinsically, right?

Do you mean specific instances of conduct? That's allowed for MIMIC, when character is at issue (civ & criminal), and on cross examination of a character witness (about the person they're testifying about)


No, they mean other evidence besides the witness's testimony. Right now the only thing that sticks in my mind is if you're impeaching a character witness (testifying about another witness's character) via a specific instance of conduct, you cannot use extrinsic evidence if the witness denies the specific instance.


You also can't use extrinsic evidence when you're impeaching a character witness by his character for untruthfulness through a specific instance of conduct (i.e. if you ask him about a bad check he wrote and he denies it, you can't bust out the check). I do think evidence by reputation or opinion is "extrinsic" by definition, cause you're calling a separate character witness to testify about the witness, or am I just deeply confused?

These rules are all so easy to conflate

User avatar
zor
Posts: 263
Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2011 1:36 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zor » Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:13 pm

Pickled wrote:Help please:

When is extrinsic evidence of character allowed?

Thanks


Assuming extrinsic means proof by additional witnesses or documents of SPECIFIC occasions, the answer is basically never.

The only exceptions are sex crimes: to show def's sex-related traits in sexual offenses/child molestation, or to show victim's traits. Then basically the barn doors are open.

But it's not permissible when:
- def wants to show that his character is inconsistent with crime
- prosecutor wants to know def's character is consistent with crime
- def wants to show victim's trait (aggressiveness)
- prosecutor wants to show victim's trait (peacefulness)

Extrinsic evidence is OK for non-character impeachment though (except specific contradiction b/c of collateral evidence rule).

User avatar
zor
Posts: 263
Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2011 1:36 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zor » Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:18 pm

To those of you struggling with character evidence, feel free to reference this chart I made when I took the class.

amorsebu14
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 10:07 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby amorsebu14 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:45 pm

zor wrote:To those of you struggling with character evidence, feel free to reference this chart I made when I took the class.


I love you. That is all.

Pickled
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon May 25, 2015 2:03 pm

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby Pickled » Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:51 pm

Thank you all very much.

sp1kedrat
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2014 12:35 am

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby sp1kedrat » Tue Jul 21, 2015 1:53 pm

zor wrote:To those of you struggling with character evidence, feel free to reference this chart I made when I took the class.


this is awesome. thanks a ton

User avatar
zot1
Posts: 3142
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 12:53 am

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zot1 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 2:27 pm

So I got my last graded essay back. THIS TIME, even though I missed some issues, made up some rules, and deviated from the sample answer analysis, the grader gave me a "passing grade" (67) when she would otherwise give me a 33. Do I assume that maybe she had been grading harder before because she wanted to encourage me to do better/try harder, or do I just assume I actually did better this time (even though it really wasn't that different from my other essays...)?

User avatar
UnamSanctam
Posts: 7175
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 3:17 am

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby UnamSanctam » Tue Jul 21, 2015 3:08 pm

zot1 wrote:So I got my last graded essay back. THIS TIME, even though I missed some issues, made up some rules, and deviated from the sample answer analysis, the grader gave me a "passing grade" (67) when she would otherwise give me a 33. Do I assume that maybe she had been grading harder before because she wanted to encourage me to do better/try harder, or do I just assume I actually did better this time (even though it really wasn't that different from my other essays...)?


I think at this point it's about just not reading the tea leaves.

User avatar
zot1
Posts: 3142
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 12:53 am

Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zot1 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 3:12 pm

UnamSanctam wrote:
zot1 wrote:So I got my last graded essay back. THIS TIME, even though I missed some issues, made up some rules, and deviated from the sample answer analysis, the grader gave me a "passing grade" (67) when she would otherwise give me a 33. Do I assume that maybe she had been grading harder before because she wanted to encourage me to do better/try harder, or do I just assume I actually did better this time (even though it really wasn't that different from my other essays...)?


I think at this point it's about just not reading the tea leaves.


Ok.




Return to “Bar Exam Prep and Discussion Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Yukos and 6 guests