Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

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anon sequitur
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby anon sequitur » Sun Jul 19, 2015 2:07 pm

These are tricky for me too, but I know if I see the words "first recorded," it's either a race or race-notice statute. I literally zero in on the word "first" if I see it. If I see "good faith" or the more obvious "without notice" I know it's notice or race-notice. Those are the words I focus on, and if you see both sets, you've got a race-notice statute.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I recall Themis saying that notice and race-notice are the most heavily MBE tested recording acts.


This is a good method, I'm gonna try, it seems like this is one of the top topics tested in property (why? who the hell knows). And you're right, the property lecturer said that they mostly test between race-notice and notice statute, maybe because race statutes are easier to read and understand.

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annapach
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby annapach » Sun Jul 19, 2015 2:14 pm

Confused7 wrote:
annapach wrote:
Confused7 wrote:
Pleasye wrote:
Robert Paulson wrote:Anyone else abandon the schedule and focusing on short outlines and memorization? My state weights essays heavily, so I am just focusing on the BLL for now.

Yup! My suggested pace is up to 2.5% lol


Same. I think I'd go crazy if I were to follow the directed study for the last week. I'm just reviewing 2 subjects via outlines per day and doing 1 mixed MBE set. I should be done with all of that by next weekend, at which point I'll look over the remaining practice essays.



That's exactly what I'm doing!


Yay study twins! :lol: I'm a huge believer that too much stress at this point in the game will do no good. I'm just going to take it easy with my study schedule and stagger it. It's definitely not 10-12 hours a day, but at the pace I'm going now I'll prolly still reach 100%.



I switched from 12 hours of studying a day to 6 and I am retaining so much more. SO much more.

amorsebu14
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby amorsebu14 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 2:15 pm

sd5289 wrote:
amorsebu14 wrote:Does anyone have any clever methods of distinguishing the types of notice statutes? Our professor in law school never covered these, since he favored ancient and medieval property rights, and as a result, I'm just guessing, here.


These are tricky for me too, but I know if I see the words "first recorded," it's either a race or race-notice statute. I literally zero in on the word "first" if I see it. If I see "good faith" or the more obvious "without notice" I know it's notice or race-notice. Those are the words I focus on, and if you see both sets, you've got a race-notice statute.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I recall Themis saying that notice and race-notice are the most heavily MBE tested recording acts.


Thank you so much!

Also, I'm so sick of this.

Confused7
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby Confused7 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 2:19 pm

annapach wrote: I switched from 12 hours of studying a day to 6 and I am retaining so much more. SO much more.


Yesssss. My routine is to now wake up at noon and study for 6 hours until dinner time. :lol:

smalogna
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby smalogna » Sun Jul 19, 2015 3:18 pm

Robert Paulson wrote:Anyone else abandon the schedule and focusing on short outlines and memorization? My state weights essays heavily, so I am just focusing on the BLL for now.


What is your definition of weighs heavily? > 50%? I'm taking exam in states with 40% weight and 50% weight so I'm not sure if I should be putting more effort into essay memorization.

zot1
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zot1 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 3:21 pm

smalogna wrote:
Robert Paulson wrote:Anyone else abandon the schedule and focusing on short outlines and memorization? My state weights essays heavily, so I am just focusing on the BLL for now.


What is your definition of weighs heavily? > 50%? I'm taking exam in states with 40% weight and 50% weight so I'm not sure if I should be putting more effort into essay memorization.


I think they mean 65%

smalogna
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby smalogna » Sun Jul 19, 2015 3:21 pm

Confused7 wrote:
annapach wrote: I switched from 12 hours of studying a day to 6 and I am retaining so much more. SO much more.


Yesssss. My routine is to now wake up at noon and study for 6 hours until dinner time. :lol:


I've been studying for an hour, taking a 20 minute break. It's been pretty effective at this late stage.

Confused7
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby Confused7 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 3:25 pm

God the NY civ pro is the most insufferable and tortuous thing I've ever seen.

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sopranorleone
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby sopranorleone » Sun Jul 19, 2015 3:32 pm

Confused7 wrote:God the NYCA civ pro is the most insufferable and tortuous thing I've ever seen.


FTFM

smalogna
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby smalogna » Sun Jul 19, 2015 3:47 pm

Confused7 wrote:God the NY civ pro is the most insufferable and tortuous thing I've ever seen.


I think this is another place where keeping the big picture in mind may be important. The benefit of memorizing all of the SoLs and other nit picky details based on the points you will earn (maybe a small sub issue in an essay or a MC question) may not be worth the effort.

....at least this is what my adviser says.

eloise16
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby eloise16 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 3:49 pm

zot1 wrote:
smalogna wrote:
Robert Paulson wrote:Anyone else abandon the schedule and focusing on short outlines and memorization? My state weights essays heavily, so I am just focusing on the BLL for now.


What is your definition of weighs heavily? > 50%? I'm taking exam in states with 40% weight and 50% weight so I'm not sure if I should be putting more effort into essay memorization.


I think they mean 65%


Yeah in MD, our essays are worth 67%... :shock: That's what I would call weighted heavily.

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paulshortys10
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby paulshortys10 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 3:59 pm

Is there a difference between a non-hearsay state of mind statement, and the hearsay exception to state of mind/physical condition? am i confusing these concepts?

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annapach
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby annapach » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:04 pm

paulshortys10 wrote:Is there a difference between a non-hearsay state of mind statement, and the hearsay exception to state of mind/physical condition? am i confusing these concepts?


I'm not sure if this what you're getting at but

hearsay exception: really anything a declarant said in the present/future tense describing their state of mind for the truth of the matter asserted


non-hearsay state of mind could be something like, "I am a golden god!" - it was a state of mind but you're not trying to prove the truth of the matter asserted

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zot1 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:07 pm

eloise16 wrote:
zot1 wrote:
smalogna wrote:
Robert Paulson wrote:Anyone else abandon the schedule and focusing on short outlines and memorization? My state weights essays heavily, so I am just focusing on the BLL for now.


What is your definition of weighs heavily? > 50%? I'm taking exam in states with 40% weight and 50% weight so I'm not sure if I should be putting more effort into essay memorization.


I think they mean 65%


Yeah in MD, our essays are worth 67%... :shock: That's what I would call weighted heavily.


Yeah that sure sucks. Essays are definitely not my strong suit, so I'm happy mine only count for 50%.

I'd say rule memorization would be a priority. If at all enough to spot the issues and write some sort of version of the rule.

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paulshortys10
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby paulshortys10 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:11 pm

annapach wrote:
paulshortys10 wrote:Is there a difference between a non-hearsay state of mind statement, and the hearsay exception to state of mind/physical condition? am i confusing these concepts?


I'm not sure if this what you're getting at but

hearsay exception: really anything a declarant said in the present/future tense describing their state of mind for the truth of the matter asserted


non-hearsay state of mind could be something like, "I am a golden god!" - it was a state of mind but you're not trying to prove the truth of the matter asserted



got it! thanks!

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zot1 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:12 pm

So getting rid of the safety blanket is not such a bad idea.

My advisor had told me that for the next few days, I should randomly draw subjects to take essays for, rather than whatever my direct schedule tells me to do. The purpose of it to get used to the randomized nature of the actual exam.

I tried that today and I sort of liked it. I drew contracts and then secured transactions. As soon as I saw the subjects I remember thinking "ugh, but I haven't reviewed that one in a while!" (My direct schedule usually has me review a subject before taking an essay question). Yet, I managed to come up with the major issues if by making up a rule once (for contracts).

I'd say that it was good practice for what the exam would be like, so I thought I'd share for the fellow takers who, like me, are worried about the essays.

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zor
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zor » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:33 pm

All of you people getting advice from your advisers: are you reaching out to them? Or are they proactively reaching out to you? Because I haven't heard squat from my "adviser" during this entire project, except the one time I asked about rule statements and was told not to worry about memorizing them. And the one time I asked for a substantive rule clarification, it took like five days for a response and the response was useless. I feel very much on my own.

In other news, finally broke 75%. My study strategy has been to make flashcards for the NY subjects (someone mentioned Anki--I use a free alternative, Repetitions, that syncs to my iPhone). Each time I sit down to make flashcards for the subject I'm writing out the rules and this has been pretty effective studying in addition to actually reviewing the flashcards. Only done one Mixed MBE set so far but doing it in test mode so I don't get bogged down with explanations. It's much faster to only revisit the questions I was uncertain about or got wrong.

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annapach
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby annapach » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:37 pm

lol Themis


"Because Congress is vested by Article I with “all legislative powers,” it may not delegate that power to any other branch of government. This principle is known as the “nondelegation doctrine.”

...

"EXAM NOTE: Because there is almost no limitation on the ability of Congress to delegate to the executive and judiciary branches, an answer choice on the MBE indicating that Congress has “exceeded its power to delegate” is almost always incorrect."

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zot1 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:39 pm

zor wrote:All of you people getting advice from your advisers: are you reaching out to them? Or are they proactively reaching out to you? Because I haven't heard squat from my "adviser" during this entire project, except the one time I asked about rule statements and was told not to worry about memorizing them. And the one time I asked for a substantive rule clarification, it took like five days for a response and the response was useless. I feel very much on my own.

In other news, finally broke 75%. My study strategy has been to make flashcards for the NY subjects (someone mentioned Anki--I use a free alternative, Repetitions, that syncs to my iPhone). Each time I sit down to make flashcards for the subject I'm writing out the rules and this has been pretty effective studying in addition to actually reviewing the flashcards. Only done one Mixed MBE set so far but doing it in test mode so I don't get bogged down with explanations. It's much faster to only revisit the questions I was uncertain about or got wrong.


My advisor sends emails every so often with general info (Milestone exams are coming! Where should you be right now? What to do if you have a question about x?). She also called people halfway through the course but I missed her call. She then emailed everyone and said she was just checking in and if we needed something to just call her. I did but several weeks after. She then called a few days ago and provided some "last few days advice". So in total I've spoken with her twice, only once because of her initiative. I hope that helps.

Confused7
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby Confused7 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:41 pm

I've been doing surprisingly well in the last few mixed MBE sets. 83%, 74%, 78%, and 84%. :shock: Now I'm scared to start another set out of fear it'll be a huge disappointment and ruin my motivation for the rest of the day.

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zot1 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:43 pm

Confused7 wrote:I've been doing surprisingly well in the last few mixed MBE sets. 83%, 74%, 78%, and 84%. :shock: Now I'm scared to start another set out of fear it'll be a huge disappointment and ruin my motivation for the rest of the day.


Wow! I'm so jealous. Well done, dude.

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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zot1 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:44 pm

annapach wrote:lol Themis


"Because Congress is vested by Article I with “all legislative powers,” it may not delegate that power to any other branch of government. This principle is known as the “nondelegation doctrine.”

...

"EXAM NOTE: Because there is almost no limitation on the ability of Congress to delegate to the executive and judiciary branches, an answer choice on the MBE indicating that Congress has “exceeded its power to delegate” is almost always incorrect."


So which one is it?

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anon sequitur
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby anon sequitur » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:44 pm

annapach wrote:lol Themis


"Because Congress is vested by Article I with “all legislative powers,” it may not delegate that power to any other branch of government. This principle is known as the “nondelegation doctrine.”

...

"EXAM NOTE: Because there is almost no limitation on the ability of Congress to delegate to the executive and judiciary branches, an answer choice on the MBE indicating that Congress has “exceeded its power to delegate” is almost always incorrect."


Ouch. That's ridiculous. That explanation also looks pretty bad in general, since there are tons of questions about proper delegation of administrative duties; the exam note is on point with all the questions I remember. Sometimes I think they write out explanations even though they don't really understand why the NCBE thinks an answer is right or wrong.

charlieMF
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby charlieMF » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:56 pm

zot1 wrote:
annapach wrote:lol Themis


"Because Congress is vested by Article I with “all legislative powers,” it may not delegate that power to any other branch of government. This principle is known as the “nondelegation doctrine.”

...

"EXAM NOTE: Because there is almost no limitation on the ability of Congress to delegate to the executive and judiciary branches, an answer choice on the MBE indicating that Congress has “exceeded its power to delegate” is almost always incorrect."


So which one is it?


It's both. Congress technically is bound by the the nondelegation doctrine and cannot delegate its core duties to the executive branch. However, SCOTUS has said as long as they give the agency an "intelligible principle" then they can delegate to a certain point. Over the years the intelligible principal test has been completely watered down, as often happens with SCOTUS doctrines. In modern jurisprudence, the teeth have been completely pulled out of the nondelgation doctrine and no law will ever be struck down for not having an intelligible principal. The one exception might be something like "the goodness and niceness commission" that is just suppose to help promote positive things in the world.

zot1
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Re: Themis Bar Review Hangout - July 2015 Exam

Postby zot1 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:58 pm

charlieMF wrote:
zot1 wrote:
annapach wrote:lol Themis


"Because Congress is vested by Article I with “all legislative powers,” it may not delegate that power to any other branch of government. This principle is known as the “nondelegation doctrine.”

...

"EXAM NOTE: Because there is almost no limitation on the ability of Congress to delegate to the executive and judiciary branches, an answer choice on the MBE indicating that Congress has “exceeded its power to delegate” is almost always incorrect."


So which one is it?


It's both. Congress technically is bound by the the nondelegation doctrine and cannot delegate its core duties to the executive branch. However, SCOTUS has said as long as they give the agency an "intelligible principle" then they can delegate to a certain point. Over the years the intelligible principal test has been completely watered down, as often happens with SCOTUS doctrines. In modern jurisprudence, the teeth have been completely pulled out of the nondelgation doctrine and no law will ever be struck down for not having an intelligible principal. The one exception might be something like "the goodness and niceness commission" that is just suppose to help promote positive things in the world.


Thanks for explaining that. I knew Congress could delegate, so I was thrown off by the Themis explanation.




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