Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

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not guilty

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby not guilty » Thu Jul 26, 2018 4:17 pm

Not sure why my last post in here discussing areas of law was deleted?

anyway....

arbitration gets appeal to dca? circuit?

florida2015

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby florida2015 » Thu Jul 26, 2018 6:23 pm

Anyone know how to go about reporting a proctor issue to the Bar?

FLBAR0718

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby FLBAR0718 » Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:46 pm

florida2015 wrote:Anyone know how to go about reporting a proctor issue to the Bar?


Let me guess... the female proctor with the really loud heels?

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby florida2015 » Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:01 pm

FLBAR0718 wrote:
florida2015 wrote:Anyone know how to go about reporting a proctor issue to the Bar?


Let me guess... the female proctor with the really loud heels?


I did hear that lady! That was annoying.

Unfortunately, I'm talking about the proctor who used the unoccupied side of my table to store discarded ink pads and pens/pencils about 50 minutes before the second session ended.

florida2015

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby florida2015 » Fri Jul 27, 2018 1:38 pm

I just called the Bar about my proctor issue. If anyone had an issue with a proctor or an issue with the exam, mail a letter to the Director of Examinations, Brian Rains at 1891 Eider Court, Tallahassee, FL 32399-1750.

Margie on the phone told me that the Board is very upset with the way many issues were handled at the exam and they want to know about everything that happened so that they correct the issues going forward.

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby BlondeLawyer » Sat Jul 28, 2018 3:27 pm

Wow, discarding ink pads on a table occupied by a student? Proctor wearing heels? What in the world was going on in Tampa last week?!

At the February exam, I had proctors talking by my table and one woman REFUSED to turn her radio down during the essay portion (I'd say arguably the worst time for a distraction since it is the first session AND the essays are so time consuming). We also had a cougher. I understand test takers coughing, that's unavoidable, but having a coughing proctor is unacceptable.


Report EVERYTHING to the Bar.

not guilty

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby not guilty » Sun Jul 29, 2018 3:07 pm

cal_pushed wrote:What did you all put (generally) for your essays?

Fed Con Law i went: Standing, Organizational standing, Ripeness, Mootness. Then Parade Ordinance attacked as vague, overbr, improper license/ PR, and PDP Challenge. Then on the Park Ordinance established TAB's conduct as speech, and exercise of valid assembly/ association then brook out each section and challenged under Public Forum analysis (1st amendment). Challenge the "loud" and other similar words as vague as well.


On Family/Dependency, I made the mistake of thinking the husband/wife were still married and just broken up. I didn't realize they divorced until I re-read. I basically didn't give him too many rights. Some things at random: consent requirements, parental rights termination, effects of adoption, grandparents rights, dependency court, failure to report abuse, GAL, 3 main goals, and motion for reunification.

Did the lawyer have a duty to report the child abuse and/or the failed drug testing by mom?

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby SaiyanRose » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:33 pm

1. Contracts: What law applies? Common Law/Services, Offer, Acceptance, Consideration (exchange of professional services), each with rule statements, Counteroffer/additional terms ("I'll split the profits if you agree to exchange professional services") Modification (I argued the daughter was not part of the contract because no consideration was given for the modification and therefore the contract was not modified), Statute of Frauds (I argued it was enforceable), Breach of contract, Material vs Immaterial breach, listed and applied the factors and concluded that failure to give half the money was a material breach, some damages (expectation damages mostly), The winning of the jackpot was a condition precedent to the promise to pay and exchange of professional services, Waiver of condition after they won the first small prizes by not requesting the services of the other upon winning. PR issues: Lawyer can't engage in business with non-lawyers?? The threat the lawyer made to Cal was....unprofessional.

2. Dependency: What is Dependency? Defined Abuse, Abandonment and neglect. Duty to report: I didn't give the full rule, I only said that the uncle was legally obligated to report the abuse. The Lawyer could not report the abuse unless consent from the uncle/client in order to prevent violating the attorney-client privilege (yeah I wasn't too thrilled about those answers neither). Termination of Parental rights of the Mother/wife (Request by DCF Agent or Legal Guardian) Grounds for termination of Parental rights, Best interest of the child factors. The mother's violation of the Case plan by using drugs constitutes a material breach of the case plan and gives the DCF/Guardian the right to initiate proceedings to terminate parental rights of the wife. Adoption, who can adopt? the house of the uncle must be suitable, file for adoption petition only 60 days after judge signed the order terminating the parental rights and the hearing must be held either no less than 30 days or no more than 90 days. If the father refuses to give consent to the adoption I argued that there is enough evidence to show abandonment by the father and therefore, initiate proceedings to terminate the parental rights of the father/husband too. Grandparents rights to visitation do not end with termination of the parental rights of any of the parents unless the Best interest of the child weighs against the visitation.

3. this is a doozy, my weakest one: First amendment freedom of speech regulation. The government should encourage the free flow of ideas and not restrict it. The first amendment applies to the states through the 14th amendment. I argued Time, Place and Manner regulations (content neutral + intermediate scrutiny and open alternate ways of communication). Public forum: Historically open for speech ( streets, sidewalks, parks and the internet) so I argued the park was a public forum. Freedom of Association with a half-right rule no application. Tab is going to argue that the proper standard is strict scrutiny because they are trying to regulate speech but the argument fails. Equal Protection/Rational basis analysis for the $1,000,000 insurance certificate requirement placing the burden of proof on the challenger/TAB. And here's the worst part: I didn't read the call of the question good enough so I missed that it said "All Federal Claims" so I argued: Police Powers under the Florida Constitution, Right to access courts, Single Subject Rule, Vagueness and over-broad law.

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Eyo » Mon Jul 30, 2018 1:52 pm

1. Anyone else notice the woman wanted a TRUST done for her daughter? I added the elements of a trust, what kind of trust I thought would be best for her to receive and why, a long w a few other things. Looked like easy points. I figured they put it there for a reason.

Same as Divorce in 2. It was in the first sentence. I went over the quick elements of that, that we are a no fault and dead marriage state along w some other things like marital property split. then went into the defendancy stuff.

Good luck to all!!

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby FLBAR0718 » Mon Jul 30, 2018 2:15 pm

I completely missed the Trust and Divorce stuff. I also said they could try to argue that it was a goods contract because of the predominant purpose of the agreement.

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Omerta » Mon Jul 30, 2018 5:56 pm

SaiyanRose wrote:1. Contracts: What law applies? Common Law/Services, Offer, Acceptance, Consideration (exchange of professional services), each with rule statements, Counteroffer/additional terms ("I'll split the profits if you agree to exchange professional services") Modification (I argued the daughter was not part of the contract because no consideration was given for the modification and therefore the contract was not modified), Statute of Frauds (I argued it was enforceable), Breach of contract, Material vs Immaterial breach, listed and applied the factors and concluded that failure to give half the money was a material breach, some damages (expectation damages mostly), The winning of the jackpot was a condition precedent to the promise to pay and exchange of professional services, Waiver of condition after they won the first small prizes by not requesting the services of the other upon winning. PR issues: Lawyer can't engage in business with non-lawyers?? The threat the lawyer made to Cal was....unprofessional.

2. Dependency: What is Dependency? Defined Abuse, Abandonment and neglect. Duty to report: I didn't give the full rule, I only said that the uncle was legally obligated to report the abuse. The Lawyer could not report the abuse unless consent from the uncle/client in order to prevent violating the attorney-client privilege (yeah I wasn't too thrilled about those answers neither). Termination of Parental rights of the Mother/wife (Request by DCF Agent or Legal Guardian) Grounds for termination of Parental rights, Best interest of the child factors. The mother's violation of the Case plan by using drugs constitutes a material breach of the case plan and gives the DCF/Guardian the right to initiate proceedings to terminate parental rights of the wife. Adoption, who can adopt? the house of the uncle must be suitable, file for adoption petition only 60 days after judge signed the order terminating the parental rights and the hearing must be held either no less than 30 days or no more than 90 days. If the father refuses to give consent to the adoption I argued that there is enough evidence to show abandonment by the father and therefore, initiate proceedings to terminate the parental rights of the father/husband too. Grandparents rights to visitation do not end with termination of the parental rights of any of the parents unless the Best interest of the child weighs against the visitation.

3. this is a doozy, my weakest one: First amendment freedom of speech regulation. The government should encourage the free flow of ideas and not restrict it. The first amendment applies to the states through the 14th amendment. I argued Time, Place and Manner regulations (content neutral + intermediate scrutiny and open alternate ways of communication). Public forum: Historically open for speech ( streets, sidewalks, parks and the internet) so I argued the park was a public forum. Freedom of Association with a half-right rule no application. Tab is going to argue that the proper standard is strict scrutiny because they are trying to regulate speech but the argument fails. Equal Protection/Rational basis analysis for the $1,000,000 insurance certificate requirement placing the burden of proof on the challenger/TAB. And here's the worst part: I didn't read the call of the question good enough so I missed that it said "All Federal Claims" so I argued: Police Powers under the Florida Constitution, Right to access courts, Single Subject Rule, Vagueness and over-broad law.


I just finished a 4-hour hearing. My brain is cooked, so I'll throw in my .02 because I don't feel like entering my time. I won't repeat what SaiyanRose said but will add a couple things.

1. I think the daughter piece was enforceable because both parties agreed to a further split. There was also some other term that they added (maybe ability to terminate in writing). In addition to what you noted, I went into whether the contract was enforceable as to the daughter for two reasons: (1) she's a minor; and (2) the contract could be considered illegal (functionally allowing a minor to play the lotto). I went into the difference between a contract for an illegal purpose and a right to a monetary amount. Promissory estoppel, statute of frauds, material breach. For Cal's contract, unenforceable because of the condition precedent (actual collection of the funds), no cause of action against the lawyer for failure to pay, lawyer's best interest is not to assert breach of contract because it's better to say no contract at all.

Professionalism issues I had were: (1) can't engage in business with a non-lawyer absent consent in writing/failed to advise client in writing to seek advice from other attorney; (2) can't have an oral representation agreement (I think? That's what I said, at least); (3) can't agree to provide legal services in a transaction where the lawyer would be a counterparty; (4) lawyer properly refused to create the trust because the lawyer had an actual conflict with the client; (5) professionalism issues in the communication.

2. I didn't say a lot of that stuff, mainly because I didn't know it. I also said lawyer has no duty to report. It could be that I'm just totally messing this up from my 15 total minutes I spent looking at dependency law, but there was an issue relating to one of the kid's paternity. Although the DNA test said the father wasn't the actual parent, I vaguely recalled some rule about children born during a marriage being presumed as kids of husband/wife (might be determinative?), so a dispute over paternity would have that dimension, too. I also thought there was some issue about the uncle having some issue if he weren't married. Maybe I just made this rule up, but I thought that married couples need spouse's consent, and isn't it hard/impossible for an unmarried adult to adopt? I said best interest of the child a zillion times, mentioned consent as an important factor, and made up a rule about why the husband's parents and a right to receive notice of any termination proceeding based on my vague recollection from a practice essay answer.

As you can probably tell, family law isn't a strong subject.

3. I argued a huge amount of stuff that wasn't in the bar outlines. I spent a bunch of time in statutory interpretation and discussed how conduct might not fall within statute and the constitutional avoidance canon. Public forum, not commercial, strict scrutiny based on content discrimination. I argued substantive and procedural due process violations based on the $1mm insurance requirement because the condition was a pre-requisite to considering the group's application, as opposed to a condition placed on the grant of the application itself. Due process violation because nothing in the statute indicated that state could arbitrarily impose conditions to application consideration. I argued that the $1mm liability requirement had no explanation, no relationship to potential exposure (question specifically mentioned peaceful protesting, no damages). The language in the statute suggested that the commissioner "shall" extend park hours for civic engagement, and some question about whether the static demonstration constituted a "procession" or "parade" within the meaning of the statue. Also a question about whether the "purpose" requirement in another subsection was met, because the organization wasn't creating structures for the purpose of overnight camping. Threw in some additional stuff about vagrancy statutes being void for vagueness and that the statute amounted to criminalizing the existence of homeless people. I also noted that there were some federal constitutional issues related to the tickets given out, but the court couldn't act on those on Younger abstention grounds (ticketed people could raise constitutional objections to citation in ongoing state proceedings). I mentioned freedom of association but didn't really get into anything about it.



not guilty wrote:Thoughts on these MC concepts (relax mods, not exact questions):

1. routine practice (like stacking canned goods)?
Federal: admissible
Florida: admissible

2. refresh recollection must be written by witness?
Federal: not written/adopted by witness = excluded.
Florida: I think FL requires the witness to write it--can't be adopted.

3. appeal binding arbitration to circuit?
Federal: appeals of arbitration decisions go to district court.
Florida: couldn't remember, I said circuit based on experience with arbitration disputes in federal court.

4. voluntary dismiss of a class action with settlement?
Federal: anything dismissing a class claim after certification requires court approval
Florida: don't know if it's the same, I said it was.

5. answering interrogatories...come get the records?
Federal: yes, as long as burden is substantially similar.
Florida: same.

6. poll jury after discharge?
Federal: jury was discharged, can't poll.
Florida: don't know, said it was the same.

7. Judge calls own witness, parties cross-examine?
Federal: Ok.
Florida: not ok.

8. depo back to jury deliberations?
Federal: depos don't go back with jurors during trial.
Florida: same.


Weren't these Florida question, not MBE questions? I put my answers for both.

What I remember thinking about the MBE is that there were a couple CivPro questions that you'd have no way of knowing unless you practiced a lot in federal court and were also a rules nerd.

edit: edited to remove two general subjects referenced in case that fell afoul of the MBE rule.

not guilty

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby not guilty » Tue Jul 31, 2018 3:10 pm

Omerta wrote:
7. Judge calls own witness, parties cross-examine?
Federal: Ok.
Florida: not ok.





I'm not sure if this is correct. Which FL rule is it?

Molj1987

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Molj1987 » Tue Jul 31, 2018 4:44 pm

not guilty wrote:
Omerta wrote:
7. Judge calls own witness, parties cross-examine?
Federal: Ok.
Florida: not ok.





I'm not sure if this is correct. Which FL rule is it?


Yeah, that is wrong. It is allowed in FL as well.

Omerta

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Omerta » Tue Jul 31, 2018 10:15 pm

That's what I put, so I guess I got that one wrong. I wasn't sure during the exam and went with "not ok" because I could remember that Florida was more strict on judges commenting on evidence/witnesses. Oh well.

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby yennem » Wed Aug 01, 2018 10:14 am

one week down..... many more weeks of waiting remain...

Molj1987

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Molj1987 » Wed Aug 01, 2018 10:23 am

Omerta wrote:That's what I put, so I guess I got that one wrong. I wasn't sure during the exam and went with "not ok" because I could remember that Florida was more strict on judges commenting on evidence/witnesses. Oh well.


Yup, I had plenty of similar calls, too.

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SilvermanBarPrep

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby SilvermanBarPrep » Wed Aug 01, 2018 12:07 pm

I've spent a lot of time analyzing old Florida essay with a focus on the model answers and I can say with some confidence that there is little to worry about when you write about things that won't score you points provided you write enough that in addition to those things you also write about point-scoring issues. In other words, people sometimes are concerned that points will be deducted, but that's just not how it seems to work. Model answers throw a lot of darts at the board, and in doing so many darts miss but because they threw so many, they hit enough to get that high score that earns them a model answer.

It's great to write a lot on the Florida bar exam.

Sean (Silverman Bar Exam Tutoring)

yennem

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby yennem » Mon Aug 13, 2018 2:55 pm

Surprised by the silence....

micheleeb

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby micheleeb » Mon Aug 13, 2018 6:48 pm

Is anyone else still waiting for character and fitness clearance? I heard Florida is known for taking a long time.... but how long is "long"?



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