Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Pass302
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Pass302 » Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:02 pm

lavarman84 wrote:
hockeyman969 wrote:
lavarman84 wrote:
hockeyman969 wrote:
Young Marino wrote:
Pass302 wrote:Anyone taking Barbri struggling with the FL Civ/Crim Pro Questions? I am taking Kaplan and am comfortable with those questions, but the Barbri ones seem to be very nuanced. Just trying to figure out if I really don't know anything. :shock:

I bombed set 6 today. Barbri has gotten more nuanced as the course has gone along and crim is one of my stronger subjects. The target score was 10/18 on that last set btw which is 55% so they know they are making it hard on purpose. So stupid.



They make it exceptionally hard and the Florida essay graders are tough as hell too!!!

The same type of essay I would nail at 5/6 Or even a 6/6 for the MEE is getting tagged with a 52. I talked to my rep and made a comment about that and she laughed a little too hard!!!!!


Fuck the essays. I'm going to ride the multiple choice to a passing grade.


Be careful with that strategy, all I'm saying....it is only 175 mbe that count as opposed to 190 before.


It doesn't change the weight of the MBE in relation to the essays.



Well this makes me feel a bit better, since everyone seems to be struggling.

hockeyman969
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby hockeyman969 » Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:15 pm

lavarman84 wrote:
hockeyman969 wrote:
lavarman84 wrote:
hockeyman969 wrote:
Young Marino wrote:
Pass302 wrote:Anyone taking Barbri struggling with the FL Civ/Crim Pro Questions? I am taking Kaplan and am comfortable with those questions, but the Barbri ones seem to be very nuanced. Just trying to figure out if I really don't know anything. :shock:

I bombed set 6 today. Barbri has gotten more nuanced as the course has gone along and crim is one of my stronger subjects. The target score was 10/18 on that last set btw which is 55% so they know they are making it hard on purpose. So stupid.



They make it exceptionally hard and the Florida essay graders are tough as hell too!!!

The same type of essay I would nail at 5/6 Or even a 6/6 for the MEE is getting tagged with a 52. I talked to my rep and made a comment about that and she laughed a little too hard!!!!!


Fuck the essays. I'm going to ride the multiple choice to a passing grade.


Be careful with that strategy, all I'm saying....it is only 175 mbe that count as opposed to 190 before.


It doesn't change the weight of the MBE in relation to the essays.


Big different when 95 percent of the questions are graded than when only 87 percent of the questions count.

You have a wider field of questions to get correct, under the new regiment there is a smaller panel of questions and by correlation a smaller error rate. When you reduce your allowable margin of error by 8% it's a significant change.

Then again I'm just a math nerd.

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Derek Vinyard
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Derek Vinyard » Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:09 pm

From what I read, the pass rate for the last Feburary exam was at 57% and the pass rate for out of staters was the lowest of all test takers. This doesn't really come as a surprise to me, but it sure is unfortunate for those who haven't studied any Florida law while in law school. My school in the midwest made us learn their state law, even if we knew that we would not be taking the bar there. I do like that passing half of the exam and not the other half would make a re-take easier, however.

My essay and FL mcq scores are about the same at this point. Its the lack of explanations and random testing that really makes the FL exam difficult.

RC76
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby RC76 » Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:08 pm

I went to an out of state law school too....but it was a little more than 10 years ago. I only practiced criminal, so I had forgotten most of this completely. No reciprocity sure does suck. So for those of you that get your passing score in a couple of months, and think to yourself that you will never have to do that again.....you better not leave Florida!

Derek Vinyard wrote:From what I read, the pass rate for the last Feburary exam was at 57% and the pass rate for out of staters was the lowest of all test takers. This doesn't really come as a surprise to me, but it sure is unfortunate for those who haven't studied any Florida law while in law school. My school in the midwest made us learn their state law, even if we knew that we would not be taking the bar there. I do like that passing half of the exam and not the other half would make a re-take easier, however.

My essay and FL mcq scores are about the same at this point. Its the lack of explanations and random testing that really makes the FL exam difficult.

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Young Marino
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Young Marino » Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:29 pm

RC76 wrote:I went to an out of state law school too....but it was a little more than 10 years ago. I only practiced criminal, so I had forgotten most of this completely. No reciprocity sure does suck. So for those of you that get your passing score in a couple of months, and think to yourself that you will never have to do that again.....you better not leave Florida!

Derek Vinyard wrote:From what I read, the pass rate for the last Feburary exam was at 57% and the pass rate for out of staters was the lowest of all test takers. This doesn't really come as a surprise to me, but it sure is unfortunate for those who haven't studied any Florida law while in law school. My school in the midwest made us learn their state law, even if we knew that we would not be taking the bar there. I do like that passing half of the exam and not the other half would make a re-take easier, however.

My essay and FL mcq scores are about the same at this point. Its the lack of explanations and random testing that really makes the FL exam difficult.

Or you can get sworn into the D.C. bar in 5 years without taking another exam and then 2 years after that get reciprocity bases on your D.C. standing and get into most jurisdictions in the northeast.

Pass302
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Pass302 » Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:41 pm

Y'all taking Barbri, I am missing the answers to the Florida Civ. Pro. MC questions that are in the book. It's like a set of 100. I just need the answers to #89-96

I see the top of the document says "Practice Multiple Choice Questions" and the answers start on page 39.

Thanks!

redsox550
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby redsox550 » Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:03 pm

did anyone take the Themis FL practice test essays? can someone explain to me why the first essay doesnt have any commercial paper relevance?

redsox550
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby redsox550 » Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:20 pm

Can someone check my math and numbers:

50% mbe
50% FL

FL section made up of 50% MC 50% essays - FL MC = 25% of test and FL essays = 25% of test

3 essays make up essay portion
25%/3 = 8.33 = each essay is worth 8.333% of test

now the tricky part:
- each essay scored out of 100 points. a Great score is 50, a not bottom 10% score but bad score is lets say 30 points.
- thus if you screw up one essay, but not super horrendously u are only sacrificing at most 20 points on one essay. One essay is 8.333%. 20 points is 1/5 of one essay score. 1/5th of 8.3333% is 1.666%.

Thus the difference between a great essay and a pretty bad one is just 1.666% of the test.

Whered I go wrong?

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Young Marino
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Young Marino » Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:24 pm

redsox550 wrote:Can someone check my math and numbers:

50% mbe
50% FL

FL section made up of 50% MC 50% essays - FL MC = 25% of test and FL essays = 25% of test

3 essays make up essay portion
25%/3 = 8.33 = each essay is worth 8.333% of test

now the tricky part:
- each essay scored out of 100 points. a Great score is 50, a not bottom 10% score but bad score is lets say 30 points.
- thus if you screw up one essay, but not super horrendously u are only sacrificing at most 20 points on one essay. One essay is 8.333%. 20 points is 1/5 of one essay score. 1/5th of 8.3333% is 1.666%.

Thus the difference between a great essay and a pretty bad one is just 1.666% of the test.

Whered I go wrong?

I think you are putting way too much thought into this bro. Just focus on getting through the essays lol.

redsox550
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby redsox550 » Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:37 pm

Young Marino wrote:
redsox550 wrote:Can someone check my math and numbers:

50% mbe
50% FL

FL section made up of 50% MC 50% essays - FL MC = 25% of test and FL essays = 25% of test

3 essays make up essay portion
25%/3 = 8.33 = each essay is worth 8.333% of test

now the tricky part:
- each essay scored out of 100 points. a Great score is 50, a not bottom 10% score but bad score is lets say 30 points.
- thus if you screw up one essay, but not super horrendously u are only sacrificing at most 20 points on one essay. One essay is 8.333%. 20 points is 1/5 of one essay score. 1/5th of 8.3333% is 1.666%.

Thus the difference between a great essay and a pretty bad one is just 1.666% of the test.

Whered I go wrong?

I think you are putting way too much thought into this bro. Just focus on getting through the essays lol.


most def true.

but really if the 1.6% number hods up true, each mbe question is most definately worth a quarter of point, so 8 mbe questions will be worth more than the difference of a shit and good essay... crazy if true

not guilty
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby not guilty » Wed Jul 19, 2017 10:33 am

redsox550 wrote:Can someone check my math and numbers:

50% mbe
50% FL

FL section made up of 50% MC 50% essays - FL MC = 25% of test and FL essays = 25% of test

3 essays make up essay portion
25%/3 = 8.33 = each essay is worth 8.333% of test

now the tricky part:
- each essay scored out of 100 points. a Great score is 50, a not bottom 10% score but bad score is lets say 30 points.
- thus if you screw up one essay, but not super horrendously u are only sacrificing at most 20 points on one essay. One essay is 8.333%. 20 points is 1/5 of one essay score. 1/5th of 8.3333% is 1.666%.

Thus the difference between a great essay and a pretty bad one is just 1.666% of the test.

Whered I go wrong?


from a few pages back:

I wrote a long thing about the explanation of scoring earlier in this thread... but simply put -- don't get obsessed with the "down-scaling" as it becomes frustrating when you see raw v. scaled (as MBE normally is a better Scaled than Raw)... here's the easiest way to explain this...

Each Essay = 30 FL MPQs
Your Essay Score = % (not a hard number for scoring)
Convert the % to a # out of 30

For Example:
FL Essay 1 -- 50 actually means 15/30
Fl Essay 2 -- 60 actually means 18/30
FL Essay 3 -- 80 actually means 24/30
FL Essays = 67/90

FL Civ Pro -- 17/30
FL Business -- 15/30
FL Evidence -- 18/30
FL MPQ = 50/90

FL Day is Essentially 6 Sections of 30 Points...then there is a 42-45 point increase.

FL Essays (67) + FL MPQ (50) = 117/180... Scaling Actually Brings it to a Range of 159-162 (You need 136 in FL)

Then of course MBE is a 136 Scaled Required (or if you happen to get 159-162 in FL, you'd need like 113-117 on MBE for an Average of 136..

Hope this helps!

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby not guilty » Wed Jul 19, 2017 10:39 am

Derek Vinyard wrote:From what I read, the pass rate for the last Feburary exam was at 57% and the pass rate for out of staters was the lowest of all test takers. This doesn't really come as a surprise to me, but it sure is unfortunate for those who haven't studied any Florida law while in law school. My school in the midwest made us learn their state law, even if we knew that we would not be taking the bar there. I do like that passing half of the exam and not the other half would make a re-take easier, however.

My essay and FL mcq scores are about the same at this point. Its the lack of explanations and random testing that really makes the FL exam difficult.

It wasn't 57%, especially for just Part A alone.

Every single Part A "pass or fail" is posted online after the exam. I was told a lawyer in Orlando took the time to look at the data after July '16 and only 40% that took Part A passed part A.

Bar releases misleading stats. Maybe they passed the exam as a whole because Part B brought them up. Or maybe they didn't get factored in because they were re-takers.

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Derek Vinyard
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Derek Vinyard » Wed Jul 19, 2017 2:49 pm

not guilty wrote:
Derek Vinyard wrote:From what I read, the pass rate for the last Feburary exam was at 57% and the pass rate for out of staters was the lowest of all test takers. This doesn't really come as a surprise to me, but it sure is unfortunate for those who haven't studied any Florida law while in law school. My school in the midwest made us learn their state law, even if we knew that we would not be taking the bar there. I do like that passing half of the exam and not the other half would make a re-take easier, however.

My essay and FL mcq scores are about the same at this point. Its the lack of explanations and random testing that really makes the FL exam difficult.

It wasn't 57%, especially for just Part A alone.

Every single Part A "pass or fail" is posted online after the exam. I was told a lawyer in Orlando took the time to look at the data after July '16 and only 40% that took Part A passed part A.

Bar releases misleading stats. Maybe they passed the exam as a whole because Part B brought them up. Or maybe they didn't get factored in because they were re-takers.


So in other words, the pass rate was even worse than 57%! Im done with the statistics at this point, I guess.

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robin600
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby robin600 » Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:12 pm

Soooo I'm feeling a bit more confident about the multiple choice questions 61% on practice test two. I'm hoping that's enough to pass w/ a 65-70% right MBE score.

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Pass302 » Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:14 pm

robin600 wrote:Soooo I'm feeling a bit more confident about the multiple choice questions 61% on practice test two. I'm hoping that's enough to pass w/ a 65-70% right MBE score.


am I the only one hoping for Wills over BE?

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby RC76 » Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:15 pm

The pass rate of the entire exam for first time takers in February was indeed 57%. Its just the Florida Part A, seems to be a difficult pass and that quite a few people only pass overall because the MBE brings up their average.

Now, summer exams tend to have a much higher passing rate than winter exams. Not sure why. I originally thought it was because the winter exam was full of second time takers, but the pass rates are for first time takers only.

I am sure missing Texas, where pass rates were over 80% when I took it.

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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby RC76 » Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:21 pm

I will be shocked and disappointed if we dont get will at all. At least in the past 5 years, wills has never been skipped 2 exams in a row. I've studied all of the subjects evenly, but I just seem to get wills. I am nailing down wills questions at a subject best 90%. I would love to pad my score for my other shortcomings.

Pass302 wrote:
robin600 wrote:Soooo I'm feeling a bit more confident about the multiple choice questions 61% on practice test two. I'm hoping that's enough to pass w/ a 65-70% right MBE score.


am I the only one hoping for Wills over BE?

Pass302
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Pass302 » Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:27 pm

RC76 wrote:I will be shocked and disappointed if we dont get will at all. At least in the past 5 years, wills has never been skipped 2 exams in a row. I've studied all of the subjects evenly, but I just seem to get wills. I am nailing down wills questions at a subject best 90%. I would love to pad my score for my other shortcomings.

Pass302 wrote:
robin600 wrote:Soooo I'm feeling a bit more confident about the multiple choice questions 61% on practice test two. I'm hoping that's enough to pass w/ a 65-70% right MBE score.


am I the only one hoping for Wills over BE?


I enjoyed will in law school, so for me it makes sense and is straight forward. So I can do Mortgages and Wills and I can push past this thing.

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Young Marino
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Young Marino » Wed Jul 19, 2017 6:18 pm

I feel better about Will as well over BE. But getting better at BE also. Also been hovering in the low 60s percentages all week in both fl mc and mbe practice question timed sets. Hoping that will be enough to pass. Took an NCBE pracrice mbe test today and got a 61% not sure how to feel about it. I guess that would be enough to pass but I was really hoping for the extra 4 right answers. The fact that I am complaining over 4 questions probably means I'm over thinking this.

Roberrrrto
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby Roberrrrto » Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:39 pm

not guilty wrote:
redsox550 wrote:Can someone check my math and numbers:

50% mbe
50% FL

FL section made up of 50% MC 50% essays - FL MC = 25% of test and FL essays = 25% of test

3 essays make up essay portion
25%/3 = 8.33 = each essay is worth 8.333% of test

now the tricky part:
- each essay scored out of 100 points. a Great score is 50, a not bottom 10% score but bad score is lets say 30 points.
- thus if you screw up one essay, but not super horrendously u are only sacrificing at most 20 points on one essay. One essay is 8.333%. 20 points is 1/5 of one essay score. 1/5th of 8.3333% is 1.666%.

Thus the difference between a great essay and a pretty bad one is just 1.666% of the test.

Whered I go wrong?


from a few pages back:

I wrote a long thing about the explanation of scoring earlier in this thread... but simply put -- don't get obsessed with the "down-scaling" as it becomes frustrating when you see raw v. scaled (as MBE normally is a better Scaled than Raw)... here's the easiest way to explain this...

Each Essay = 30 FL MPQs
Your Essay Score = % (not a hard number for scoring)
Convert the % to a # out of 30

For Example:
FL Essay 1 -- 50 actually means 15/30
Fl Essay 2 -- 60 actually means 18/30
FL Essay 3 -- 80 actually means 24/30
FL Essays = 67/90

FL Civ Pro -- 17/30
FL Business -- 15/30
FL Evidence -- 18/30
FL MPQ = 50/90

FL Day is Essentially 6 Sections of 30 Points...then there is a 42-45 point increase.

FL Essays (67) + FL MPQ (50) = 117/180... Scaling Actually Brings it to a Range of 159-162 (You need 136 in FL)

Then of course MBE is a 136 Scaled Required (or if you happen to get 159-162 in FL, you'd need like 113-117 on MBE for an Average of 136..

Hope this helps!


Where'd you get the 42-45 point increase from?

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lavarman84
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Re: Florida Bar Exam - Official Thread

Postby lavarman84 » Thu Jul 20, 2017 3:17 am

Young Marino wrote:I feel better about Will as well over BE. But getting better at BE also. Also been hovering in the low 60s percentages all week in both fl mc and mbe practice question timed sets. Hoping that will be enough to pass. Took an NCBE pracrice mbe test today and got a 61% not sure how to feel about it. I guess that would be enough to pass but I was really hoping for the extra 4 right answers. The fact that I am complaining over 4 questions probably means I'm over thinking this.


Yea, I've flipped my preference. Give me Wills over BE. :lol:




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