California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

User avatar
fl0w
Posts: 1404
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:46 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby fl0w » Fri Feb 21, 2014 2:23 pm

I try to go to bed by 10p. I go to midnight if I have to.
But I wake up at 5.30a to get started by 6a.
This shit isn't gonna memorize itself.

I feel the same way about jx. If it were on there I would tear it up.

CourtneyElizabeth
Posts: 310
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 12:22 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby CourtneyElizabeth » Fri Feb 21, 2014 2:26 pm

I'm gonna slay as many MBEs as I can this afternoon. Review some outlines. Go over flash cards. I just don't think reading these essays is going to help. I think the Harley Davidson character had it right - half the battle is learning how to format correctly and make sure the graders see important words, even if the words underneath them aren't 100% correct. Because, as we now know they only look at them for about 30 seconds.
Check in at my hotel is at 3 so I'm thinking a nice hot tub visit/cocktail will be relaxing since they tell you not to study the night before.
That being said…back to the outlines.

vacations
Posts: 102
Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2009 4:51 pm

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby vacations » Fri Feb 21, 2014 2:32 pm

I totally crashed and burned last night..on the one day in the last week when I didn't down an energy drink.

Stay strong my fellow Bar-takers. Who's with me in believing that we have "plenty" of time left for reviewing? I really think 4 days is plenty. Granted, at this point if you haven't even once looked over an outline for a particular subject, you might be in a jam but right now is about fine-tuning as much as you can. At this point, not knowing a small nuance here and there will not kill you.

As to @CourtneyElizabeth...i share your thought. On some subjects, I feel that my time is best just going through essays. For others, it's just going through the outline. It's frustrating trying to find a balance.

AntiHuman
Posts: 177
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2010 5:48 pm

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby AntiHuman » Fri Feb 21, 2014 3:33 pm

I'll prolly do a full studying on Sunday to finish Trusts/Wills as my last subject, but Im trying to wake up at 6 AM on monday morning to get my sleeping schedule set and probably ONLY do 33 mbes the whole day and thats it.

So burnt out that today I woke up at 8 AM and said fuck it and slept till 11. Gotta start getting that 11PM-6AM schedule in.

DwightSchruteFarms
Posts: 284
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2010 1:19 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby DwightSchruteFarms » Fri Feb 21, 2014 3:38 pm

Jesus, some of you guys are going all out right now. At this point, I'm just revising the outlines and maybe outlining a few more essays and MBEs. But nothing too serious. If anything, worrying about non-MBE subjects is an absolute bust at this point. Each one is worth 7% of your overall grade. Spend time with the MBE subjects from here on out since you know they will account for 35% with MBEs and at least half the essays.

User avatar
fl0w
Posts: 1404
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:46 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby fl0w » Fri Feb 21, 2014 4:02 pm

DwightSchruteFarms wrote:Jesus, some of you guys are going all out right now. At this point, I'm just revising the outlines and maybe outlining a few more essays and MBEs. But nothing too serious. If anything, worrying about non-MBE subjects is an absolute bust at this point. Each one is worth 7% of your overall grade. Spend time with the MBE subjects from here on out since you know they will account for 35% with MBEs and at least half the essays.


I sorta get what you're saying, but imagine the scenario where Corps/Agency/Partnership, Wills/Trusts and CivPro all appear on the essays.
Not 7% anymore is it? And given predictions (which, granted, are like assholes; we all have them and they all stink)... this is an entirely possible scenario.

But maybe ya'll are just planning to get 180 on the MBE or something. That's fine too.

Personally, I'm just too fucking terrified to not study everything.

User avatar
MURPH
Posts: 854
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 12:20 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby MURPH » Fri Feb 21, 2014 4:40 pm

I made the mistake in the summer of not studying the MBE for the last 4 weeks because I thought I had those subjects down pat. I did well on the MBE but had I gotten two more questions right I would not be here now. (And to think, I might never have gotten to share this board with you wonderful people).

So I am dabbling in a bit of everything. I did 100 MBEs this morning. I'll do a PT in a little bit. Then before bed, I'll review some exams - writing out issue statements only.

Two more days. I'll go to a movie or read comic books on Monday and move into my hotel room. In the mean time I'll try to stay healthy.

DwightSchruteFarms
Posts: 284
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2010 1:19 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby DwightSchruteFarms » Fri Feb 21, 2014 5:11 pm

MURPH wrote: I did 100 MBEs this morning. I'll do a PT in a little bit.



You are a beast.

run26.2
Posts: 896
Joined: Thu Jul 01, 2010 1:35 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby run26.2 » Fri Feb 21, 2014 5:25 pm

CourtneyElizabeth wrote:I'm gonna slay as many MBEs as I can this afternoon. Review some outlines. Go over flash cards. I just don't think reading these essays is going to help. I think the Harley Davidson character had it right - half the battle is learning how to format correctly and make sure the graders see important words, even if the words underneath them aren't 100% correct. Because, as we now know they only look at them for about 30 seconds.
Check in at my hotel is at 3 so I'm thinking a nice hot tub visit/cocktail will be relaxing since they tell you not to study the night before.
That being said…back to the outlines.

I would bold and underline my headings, and put a space before and after each. It's much easier to see that way. I don't think bold on it's own necessarily stands out.

User avatar
a male human
Posts: 1677
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 2:42 pm

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby a male human » Fri Feb 21, 2014 5:42 pm

DwightSchruteFarms wrote:
MURPH wrote: I did 100 MBEs this morning. I'll do a PT in a little bit.



You are a beast.

User avatar
northwood
Posts: 4872
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 7:29 pm

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby northwood » Fri Feb 21, 2014 5:48 pm

Best of luck to you all! Be confident in your knowledge of the material , and ability to put it on paper.

For the retakers- Remember, you saw the format before, and know what to expect. You also know what tripped you up last time, and undoubtly took remedial measures/ received advice. Forget what happened the other time, and know that this is a fresh start. Be confident in your abilities- and your grasp of the material.

Best of luck to you all, and have your favorite alcoholic( or non) beverage at the ready for the moment after you leave the testing room on the last day.



YOU GOT THIS!!!!!1

vacations
Posts: 102
Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2009 4:51 pm

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby vacations » Fri Feb 21, 2014 7:05 pm

one of the hardest things about the last few days and the 3 days remaining ahead is knowing when you're done reviewing one subject and convincing your mind to move on to the next outline.

User avatar
a male human
Posts: 1677
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 2:42 pm

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby a male human » Fri Feb 21, 2014 7:18 pm

For retakers, you most certainly took remedial measures and received lots of advice. My advice to myself as a repeater is not to have confidence in my abilities but study my problem areas (spotting relevant issues, doing real MBEs). Obviously I'm not a talented one when it comes to law, so that's my only choice.

Last time, I believed in my abilities, walked out, and felt generally pretty good about it. Look what happened. I knew how to state the rules but not how to spot the right issues. Also, in hindsight, I should have gone with Barbri (will get into that after the bar).

This is not a fresh start. If you fail again, you have to take it again with your underclassmen and wait until November...again. Not only is that a giant blow to your ego, I, for one, do not want to graduate as a 5L. If I fail again, I will either give up or take it just once more. Pretty sure I'll get it by the 3rd time--I have all summer to do all the essays and PTs out there.

Speaking of PTs, I had a nightmare today where I set my watch wrong and thought I had 25 minutes left to write my PT. Then the proctor gave the last warning. With seconds ticking, the SofTest screen wouldn't even load in time! The proctor called time before I can type in my answer from my paper notes. For some reason, I was also sharing my computer with someone else who completed her PT (who incidentally passed the bar and whom I don't particularly like yet am jealous of I guess and continuing to "like" her gaudy status updates and pictures even though she never interacts with mine). I woke up in a dramatic fashion with a gasp and a tensed, trembling body.

User avatar
MURPH
Posts: 854
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 12:20 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby MURPH » Fri Feb 21, 2014 8:13 pm

vacations wrote:one of the hardest things about the last few days and the 3 days remaining ahead is knowing when you're done reviewing one subject and convincing your mind to move on to the next outline.


Issue spotting on the essays that test multiple subjects is a good way to force yourself to move on. I am looking for my worst nightmare - the dreaded Evidence/PR/CivPRo/Business Associations essay.

Actually, if I saw that on the real exam I'd be thrilled because I'd know that I will do well on the other 5 essays. But for prep work the multiple topic ones are helpful in the last few days.

CourtneyElizabeth
Posts: 310
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 12:22 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby CourtneyElizabeth » Fri Feb 21, 2014 10:29 pm

I'll see your Softtest nightmare and raise you one where Jeremy Clarkson from Top Gear was involved and I had to take the bar in an attic and I lost all my outlines the day before (not that that would matter, I guess) and missed a SOLID hour or so of Day 2. Woke up drenched in sweat wanting to hurl.

Also, I better pass this time because I've already planned SDCC 2014 and it's the same time as the bar exam.

User avatar
a male human
Posts: 1677
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 2:42 pm

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby a male human » Fri Feb 21, 2014 11:13 pm

I was going to go to a con if I passed in July...

Can someone explain the condition vs. promise analysis? Not sure how to differentiate the two and how to integrate into my answer. Things like time of essence, parol evidence go with that, right?

User avatar
fl0w
Posts: 1404
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:46 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby fl0w » Fri Feb 21, 2014 11:30 pm

a male human wrote:I was going to go to a con if I passed in July...

Can someone explain the condition vs. promise analysis? Not sure how to differentiate the two and how to integrate into my answer. Things like time of essence, parol evidence go with that, right?


condition precedent requires an event must occur before duty to perform arises in other party.

"promise" is vague. is the promise supported by consideration? valid contract? if not.. promissory estoppel? if not is it a gift? quasi-contract?
oh.. and is the promise illusory?

parole evidence requires that if the parties have expressed their agreement to be entirely integrated into the writing, then parole evidence excludes contemporaneous expression made with the writing. exceptions: modification, condition precedent, collateral agreement, formation defect, ambiguous terms, consideration defects.

time is of the essence has more to do with material or minor breach. even if the clause is in there... it's still arguable that breaching party should have time to cure.
Last edited by fl0w on Fri Feb 21, 2014 11:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
a male human
Posts: 1677
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 2:42 pm

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby a male human » Fri Feb 21, 2014 11:39 pm

fl0w wrote:
a male human wrote:I was going to go to a con if I passed in July...

Can someone explain the condition vs. promise analysis? Not sure how to differentiate the two and how to integrate into my answer. Things like time of essence, parol evidence go with that, right?


condition subsequent requires an event must occur before duty to perform arises in other party.

"promise" is vague. is the promise supported by consideration? valid contract? if not.. promissory estoppel? if not is it a gift? quasi-contract?
oh.. and is the promise illusory?

parole evidence requires that if the parties have expressed their agreement to be entirely integrated into the writing, then parole evidence excludes contemporaneous expression made with the writing. exceptions: modification, condition precedent, collateral agreement, formation defect, ambiguous terms, consideration defects.

There's also a "constructive condition" right? AFAIK, if performance is conditioned on another party's promised performance, that performance is considered a condition.

That gets me confused with "promises," and I still don't get the significance of a term being a condition or a promise.

For parol evidence (ambiguous terms), can a party use course of performance, trade usage, etc. to interpret non-UCC contracts?

User avatar
fl0w
Posts: 1404
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:46 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby fl0w » Fri Feb 21, 2014 11:49 pm

a male human wrote:
fl0w wrote:
a male human wrote:I was going to go to a con if I passed in July...

Can someone explain the condition vs. promise analysis? Not sure how to differentiate the two and how to integrate into my answer. Things like time of essence, parol evidence go with that, right?


condition precedent requires an event must occur before duty to perform arises in other party.

"promise" is vague. is the promise supported by consideration? valid contract? if not.. promissory estoppel? if not is it a gift? quasi-contract?
oh.. and is the promise illusory?

parole evidence requires that if the parties have expressed their agreement to be entirely integrated into the writing, then parole evidence excludes contemporaneous expression made with the writing. exceptions: modification, condition precedent, collateral agreement, formation defect, ambiguous terms, consideration defects.

There's also a "constructive condition" right? AFAIK, if performance is conditioned on another party's promised performance, that performance is considered a condition.

That gets me confused with "promises," and I still don't get the significance of a term being a condition or a promise.

For parol evidence (ambiguous terms), can a party use course of performance, trade usage, etc. to interpret non-UCC contracts?


If the term is ambiguous and the evidence helps resolve the ambiguity... sure. If the term is not ambiguous... nope. Just because the term is "at issue" doesn't necessarily mean it's ambiguous.

Constructive condition is something done in equity by the court. It is something that should be understood in the contract but for some reason one party didn't understand. Example.. you agree to pay me $100 and i agree to paint your house. But you pay me $100 in Chinese currency. The court might impose a constructive condition that you agreed to pay me in AMERICAN dollars. To be clear... my duty to perform does not arise until you satisfy the "condition precedent" of paying me in AMERICAN dollars. Make sense?

When I talk about conditions I don't use the word promise, so I don't get them mixed up. A "condition precedent" (maybe try always calling it a condition precedent to help distinguish) requires that the condition be satisfied before the other party is obligated to perform. The word promise isn't in there.

User avatar
MURPH
Posts: 854
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 12:20 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby MURPH » Sat Feb 22, 2014 10:16 am

Which PT taker are you? The following is my notes from an academic support lecture at my school that I attended before graduation. The prof discussed mistakes people make on the PT and how to correct those mistakes.


BAD WRITING

The shot gunner
no rule / no rhyme / no Reason
Throws Ideas at wall to see what sticks,
No working outline
Fix This: Breakdown working outline point by point


The Tangentializer
not reading task memo
not seeing sub-issues
Skipping over what they do not understand and instead jumping to the easiest issue
Fix This: Slow down and spend more time on library

The Objectifier
Through monotone style, turns everything objective
Not paying attention to objective versus persuasive
Not paying attention to lawyer vs layperson
FIx this: Focus on persuasive reasoning


The Monotone
Does not change format
Skimming over guideline memo
Walking away form easy points
Fix This: Review different guideline memos to take away the element of surprise and/or anxiety

The Brainiac
Goes outside the Law
Need to rein in knowledge
Fix this: Four corners of the documents is what matters
Even if you read case before, pay attention to how it is edited
Get out of comfort zone by taking several practice tests


The Storyteller
Turns the PT into a Legal Writing assignment
Turns a brief fact section into a soap opera
To fix write: “Case held X because y. Specifically fact Z was dispositive because...”
Focus on case summaries and mapping why a given case appears in a problem



The Legal Mind
People who ignore facts and focus only on Library
too much irrelevant facts
Not connecting relevant fact to relevant law
Fix this: Focus on linking element / factor to fact


The one trick Pony
Does well on one type.
Fix this: Do the other type

Other Diagnostic Steps
compare your working outline to the model answer
mark up test to model answer
Initially play with time constraints to determine baseline (90/90 or 105/75 min?)
Consider doing half the test at a time
Do 4 - 6 practice tests

My mistakes fall under The Storyteller model and occasionally The Shot Gunner. At this point I think it is too late to do a few practice tests. I might do one more but I can practice writing quick two sentence case summaries on the ones I've already done using the format: “Case held X because Y. Specifically fact Z was dispositive because...” I think it will also help me to stay in line if I spend an extra minute or two re-reading the assignment page. Last night I did the 2nd July 2013 essay (to DDA Milo Ward). For some reason I wrote about evidence code section 402, which the assignment clearly stated was already completed. But I started writing and just wrote everything that I thought of instead of skipping the stuff that was wasteful.

User avatar
fl0w
Posts: 1404
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:46 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby fl0w » Sat Feb 22, 2014 11:48 am

you can do that... but i don't think you necessarily want to in a PT. that's a lot of extra words that don't seem to generate points? the PT is about your case, not about the cases in the library. The rule is ___ (cite case). Here the rule is satisfied because___. It's still IRAC

vacations
Posts: 102
Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2009 4:51 pm

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby vacations » Sat Feb 22, 2014 12:20 pm

Any words of encouragement or last minute tips for those who fear the PTs?

I haven't practiced one in quite some time, obviously because I've been focusing on essays and MBEs.

User avatar
2807
Posts: 578
Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2009 10:23 pm

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby 2807 » Sat Feb 22, 2014 12:25 pm

fl0w wrote:you can do that... but i don't think you necessarily want to in a PT. that's a lot of extra words that don't seem to generate points? the PT is about your case, not about the cases in the library. The rule is ___ (cite case). Here the rule is satisfied because___. It's still IRAC


Actually, these PTs are likely NOT going to be trite and clean enough to fit in your example above.

You better be prepared to analogize the facts in the case/library v. the facts in your client case.

They are likely testing your ability to do that.

The points will be given to the students who see that the rule comes from a case that had different facts.

There may be some some easy similarities, but watch for the twist.
That is the point of these. And you better see it.
If you use a case as a rule-maker and do not include a sentence that says "however, in this case the P was riding a bike and not a motorcycle" then you are going to have a problem...

Which makes me agree with MURPH and his SIMPLE TEMPLATE TO ADDRESS CASES.

GO WITH MURPH


MURPHY'S LAW.
nice

If you think everything is lining up just fine and fitting right into a box/label--- you are likely doing it wrong,

It is supposed to be a grind that tests your ability to do this, AND present it professionally.

The second PT will be similar, but I bet it will have slightly less analogy-"brain"-work and more plain-ol'-"busy" work.

User avatar
fl0w
Posts: 1404
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:46 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby fl0w » Sat Feb 22, 2014 12:52 pm

2807 wrote:
fl0w wrote:you can do that... but i don't think you necessarily want to in a PT. that's a lot of extra words that don't seem to generate points? the PT is about your case, not about the cases in the library. The rule is ___ (cite case). Here the rule is satisfied because___. It's still IRAC


Actually, these PTs are likely NOT going to be trite and clean enough to fit in your example above.

You better be prepared to analogize the facts in the case/library v. the facts in your client case.

They are likely testing your ability to do that.

The points will be given to the students who see that the rule comes from a case that had different facts.

There may be some some easy similarities, but watch for the twist.
That is the point of these. And you better see it.
If you use a case as a rule-maker and do not include a sentence that says "however, in this case the P was riding a bike and not a motorcycle" then you are going to have a problem...

Which makes me agree with MURPH and his SIMPLE TEMPLATE TO ADDRESS CASES.

GO WITH MURPH


MURPHY'S LAW.
nice

If you think everything is lining up just fine and fitting right into a box/label--- you are likely doing it wrong,

It is supposed to be a grind that tests your ability to do this, AND present it professionally.

The second PT will be similar, but I bet it will have slightly less analogy-"brain"-work and more plain-ol'-"busy" work.


i respect your opinion, and you've given a lot of good advice, but also really don't agree what is stated above. Doing fact comparison is part of what crushed me on my first go because that's not where the points were given (i.e., they were not testing my ability to do that). The facts in the library don't matter. I know nobody believes me and that's fine. The application of the law in the library matters (you see factors, how are the factors applied).

Making it "trite and clean" for the grader is important. If they can't find what they are looking for in seconds, it may as well not be there.

The points will be given to students who see the rule from a case with different facts or similar facts. Just get the rule.

If you really don't believe me go back and read all sample answers to all PTs on the CalBar website and count the number of them that compare the facts in the library to the facts of file. I did. It was truly enlightening.

But again, I completely understand why nobody believes me because to someone that has gone through law school or is a practicing attorney, it makes no sense. But PTs aren't the real world.

And hey, if you've already got your system and you feel like it works for you, it's probably too late to change it anyway and I wouldn't recommend doing so. So best of luck.

CourtneyElizabeth
Posts: 310
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 12:22 am

Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby CourtneyElizabeth » Sat Feb 22, 2014 1:16 pm

I don't have a system or plan of attack for PTs. I think i'm going to watch the Kaplan videos on them and see what jogs my memory… I just know that I'll do what they ask me. That's the biggest thing IMHO. Answer the damn question to the best of your ability and use what they gave you - not EVERYTHING they gave you, mind you, because some cases are completely irrelevant for the case you're trying to make.

I. Hate. This. State's. Bar Exam. If I fail again I'm going to take it in RI or Passachusetts and just go from there.




Return to “Bar Exam Prep and Discussion Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 2 guests