California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

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2807
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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby 2807 » Sun Feb 02, 2014 10:06 pm

a male human wrote:Is an issue statement inherently "wrong" just because the BLL does not mirror it? What if you started your rule statement with "A spouse has rights in half of CP and all of his SP. CP is ... and SP is ..." and made the issue "H has rights..." -- those statements mirror each other.

Or is it that the issue must be legally specific?


And to mirror AntiHuman (who is also my username antipode):
- What is different about PTs? PTs are pretty much a wild card. Your task may be like an essay with multi-element tests where you can use "whether"-type issue statements (the easiest kind of PT, e.g., Snyder v. Regents). Or you may be asked to write a persuasive brief with argumentative headings, not issue statements.
- What about those pesky cases that need to be analogized/distinguished? I tend to mash that part in at the end when I realize I haven't analogized/distinguished any cases. Should they be separated?


As far as the Issue/Rule mirroring:
1. I am sure you can do it without mirroring, but by keeping the concept of mirroring in your mind, it will force you to focus.
That is the benefit.

So, the issue statement will not "inherently" be wrong if the rule does not mirror it.

But, there is an increased chance that you will craft the issue as a correct legal issue if it links up grammatically with the rule that solves IT.
That's the benefit.

You will hopefully always be using the correct RULE, so your Issue better link up with that rule!
Mirroring-- is just a way to prove it.


For PTs:
Probably not a "whether" issue unless the task is analysis based.
You'll know if a IRAC and whether statements are needed.

However: Here are some PT tips:

1. There will always be an organizing principal. Find it.
It will be an element list of a law, or a list of your clients wants/needs, or who knows..
Just find it.

2. Make it look professional. I know, sounds silly. But it is true.
Form and delivery. Headings! bold, clear, solid form.

3. USE THAT FILE !
And by use, I mean: As much as possible, in BOLD.
So, law, cases, names of people interviewed, WHATEVER....
Just USE IT !

I would do what I had to do, and then just CRAM the info in there. IN BOLD so that the grader SEES it.
The analysis can be weak.. as little as "... In Walker v. Long Beach the court addressed the issue.
Thats it. Just cram it in there if you run out of time.

SHOW THE GRADER you saw the FULL FILE and considered everything.
Not all portions will have the same value or weight in the analysis, but you need to SHOW you saw them.

I had some seriously ridiculous uses, but at least I GOT THEM IN THERE !

So, basically:
1. Find that organizing element. Live by it.
2. Make it LOOK professional
3. CROW BAR in everything you can.

As far as analyzing: If analyzing is the task, the Whether statements will be useful as always.
When in doubt, IRAC and do what we have talked about.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby MURPH » Sun Feb 02, 2014 11:49 pm

get it to x wrote:Good luck to all taking the BarBri mid-term, if you haven't taken it already. Took it yesterday and bombed (94/200) after studying hard and am ready to give up and not sit. I've got the BLL relatively memorized, and didn't even think I was doing poorly when I was taking it.


I would get the BarMax app and do MBEs everyday from now until bar exam. Try knocking out 34 in one hour or so each morning. It will keep track of your mistakes and you can get a breakdown by question type to see your errors.
I am right there with you about wanting to quit. I've had this little battle with myself over and over. I wish I had never gone to law school. I wish I had dropped out after first semester grades. It has just been one miserable failure after another for me.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby zeth006 » Mon Feb 03, 2014 12:34 am

MURPH wrote:
get it to x wrote:Good luck to all taking the BarBri mid-term, if you haven't taken it already. Took it yesterday and bombed (94/200) after studying hard and am ready to give up and not sit. I've got the BLL relatively memorized, and didn't even think I was doing poorly when I was taking it.


I would get the BarMax app and do MBEs everyday from now until bar exam. Try knocking out 34 in one hour or so each morning. It will keep track of your mistakes and you can get a breakdown by question type to see your errors.
I am right there with you about wanting to quit. I've had this little battle with myself over and over. I wish I had never gone to law school. I wish I had dropped out after first semester grades. It has just been one miserable failure after another for me.


Yep...it's been an internal battle alright. I started studying strong for the retake early on, but at some point, I just burnt out mentally. I just can't seem to get butt to the library on time, starting to also wonder whether the whole ordeal was worth it.!!

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby km23 » Mon Feb 03, 2014 12:40 am

get it to x wrote:Good luck to all taking the BarBri mid-term, if you haven't taken it already. Took it yesterday and bombed (94/200) after studying hard and am ready to give up and not sit. I've got the BLL relatively memorized, and didn't even think I was doing poorly when I was taking it.


Hang in there and don't give up. I got a lower score than you on the barbri midterm (I can't remember the exact score but it was definitely in the mid-80s and I was in, like, the 9th percentile or something ridiculously low). I passed the exam even after my horrible midterm grade. My MBEs were NOT getting noticeably better until literally two days before the exam. Around the 3 week mark is when I started actually writing down the right answer (and why it was the right answer) for every single question I got wrong OR that I merely guessed on...rather than just "reviewing" the right answer. Whenever I guessed, I would star the question to know to go back to it even if I was correct. Further, I never used online questions. The real MBE exam is in a paper booklet. Get used to crossing out incorrect answers and putting arrows by your "gut answer," etc. Don't worry about making those pages look like a mess. Doing little things like crossing out choices work (at least for me).

Don't give up. Tell yourself that this is the LAST time you are taking the bar because you will pass. The last couple weeks are the most important: it's time to get the law down cold, practice essays, and review MBE answers like crazy. These last few weeks will make or break test takers. Remember -- quality over quantity.

Best of luck to you all.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby AntiHuman » Mon Feb 03, 2014 12:51 am

if im doing adaptibar, do i need to do barmax?

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby MURPH » Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:49 am

AntiHuman wrote:if im doing adaptibar, do i need to do barmax?

From what i see on Adaptabar's website, they look pretty similar. 100% real MBE questions, feedback on where you are making mistakes, etc. Don't bother doing both.

I agree with what km23 says. Don't just review wrong answers. Write down the relevant rule every time you get a wrong answer. Maybe write down what it was that mislead you with the distractor answers. Maybe write down the keyword or clue that you missed. But don't just look at your wrong answer and read the explanation and think 'OK I'll try not to do that again' Writing something on paper is a really important step.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby 2807 » Mon Feb 03, 2014 11:46 am

Study Tip:
When you "write out" your answer to the MBE Q's: USE IRAC
This is great practice.

Use MBE q's as tiny essay fact patterns.
IRAC your answer.
Likely 4 - 5 sentences total.
It will train you to: see, state, and solve the Legal Issue with the facts and the law.

You can find MBEs on topics and Issues that you are struggling with and really focus your Essay skills at the same time.

MBE + Essay training all at once.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby a male human » Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:18 pm

Concurred on the irac tip. I tend to use my gut understanding to answer/eliminate choices. But sometimes (often), the answer depends on knowing a specific rule. Articulating the rule helped me be clear about what my thought process was and lead to the right answer more confidently. If i didn't know the rule cold, i read the answer explanation and add or integrate new concepts into my outline. Pretty much every question. I end up doing fewer questions this way, but it's a conscious process, and i saw quantifiable improvement...at least in real property recently.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby CourtneyElizabeth » Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:38 pm

I feel the same way about not wanting to sit anymore. I'm gonna tackle the Kaplan MBE mid term tomorrow. Pour over the answers like crazyyyy and get to work on more MBE questions.
Anyone think theres any CA specific stuff I should focus on, too? Comm Prop I think I'm good with...They never test CA Civ Pro...so maybe CA Evidence and PR??

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby a male human » Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:53 pm

CA civ pro is like a time bomb; you never know when they will hit you with it. But there aren't too many differences. Off the top of my head: the nomenclature (cross-complaint, demurrer et al.), venue, res judicata, and anti-SLAPP.

I'd def focus on PR since that one always appears. But there are so many tiny differences :(

I'm starting CA evidence today (I skimmed this last time, and I don't think I should this time). Why are there so many distinctions?!

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby CourtneyElizabeth » Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:58 pm

a male human wrote:Why are there so many distinctions?!


Because God hates us.

Kidding.

Kind of.

I think I'm being lulled into a false sense of security by doing well on these multiple choice questions in my Kaplan book. I guess we'll see tomorrow when I tackle the 200-er.
Is anyone located in LA County that would want to meet up and study?!

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby a male human » Mon Feb 03, 2014 6:45 pm

Kaplan MBE is supposed to be harder, so that's good news. I think I added like 20 points to my Kaplan final MBE exam score. I forget which prep did you take last time?

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby CourtneyElizabeth » Mon Feb 03, 2014 8:35 pm

Kaplan. If you fail, they send you new books and let you do the whole shebang for free.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby a male human » Mon Feb 03, 2014 8:52 pm

Yeah, my new box of books is still sealed, lol.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby 2807 » Mon Feb 03, 2014 9:38 pm

Remember: When facing a multiple choice Q:

Pause, ask yourself: What are they testing me on here?

It will really help your brain to clarify the task and the law/facts.
Your brain can do wonders if you pause and let it.

Too many times you read the answers, and the facts
...and wander all over the place in a panic !
They get you with the SUCKER CHOICE at that point.
They know where your brain will betray you.
And they put an answer right there waiting for you.
SO Stay focused.
Pause for clarity.


I found this approach most-useful.
Hope you do too.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby a male human » Thu Feb 06, 2014 5:46 am

How are you guys studying and retaining the info? Just took a mock full MBE and got slammed the hardest on crim pro x_x Got a migraine afterward. Been getting white hair and pulling out my hair too...bad habit.

I really hope the last-week cramming really does help things click into place somehow.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby CourtneyElizabeth » Thu Feb 06, 2014 2:22 pm

Gonna make my own outlines from the giant ones Kaplan gives us. Whatever I can't seem to memorize I'm gonna make index cards for and just drill them in. Are you not studying now? I only ask because of the last minute cramming you're talking about.
ALSO...I didn't go to a "top law school" so I hope I'm not gonna be kicked out of the forum ;P

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby a male human » Thu Feb 06, 2014 2:51 pm

I'm also doing that. It helps retain some of it but not all. My "studying" consists of condensing material into my own outline and doing a couple of essays (issues and rules only) and doing a few MBEs. I just don't like the process of trying to rote memorize, so I never get started :(

I did some analytics on my mock MBE: Crim overall was highest even with crim pro by itself being 44%. Contracts and torts were the lowest, but not too surprising given I haven't "studied" those yet. So perhaps our method of studying works to some extent.

None of us are schools but rather students, so I think we'll be ok on top-law-schools.com.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby CourtneyElizabeth » Thu Feb 06, 2014 2:55 pm

I like issue spotting and writing out the rules. I'll probably do a few full length ones and have Kaplan grade them when I'm done reviewing.
I have yet to input my answers from the MBE midterm. I'm self grading and going over the answers, and when I'm done with that I'll report back as to how my scores were.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby CourtneyElizabeth » Thu Feb 06, 2014 6:37 pm

Okay, so mid term. I got 62% (124/200).
Con Law was my worst, which surprised me - 44%
Contracts = 55%
Evidence = 67%
Crim Law/Crim pro = 72%
Real Prop = 58%
Torts = 76%

I mean, it could have been worse. Looks like I really need to bone up on....everything. Mostly Con law though, I suppose.

I need a nap.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby lawdawg09 » Thu Feb 06, 2014 9:36 pm

Re Adaptibar:

I took Barbri for CA in July and I got 141 on the practice MBE. No clue what I got on the real MBE last July as CA does not release your MBE score.

I am taking another jx this feb and I am doing Adaptibar and Themis to save $$. I have a 72.4% on Adaptibar and I got a 142 on the Themis practice MBE (which seemed harder than the real MBE).

I have heard people say Adaptibar is too easy but from what I have seen, it seems right on course with the real deal.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby MURPH » Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:13 pm

My studying consists of doing 25 or more MBE questions from BarMax daily. (I did a lot more in late December and January when I was studying those topics).

After that I go over the outlines I got from Baressays.com .

Then I do the essays from the Cal Bar website. I do full one hour essays. Then I compare my answers to the model answers on the Cal Bar website or Baressays

To begin each essay I write "Issue # : Whether " Then on the next line I write "The law under.... is " (filling in either Common Law, California Probate Code or whatever. On the next line I write "Here, .... because, " Then on the last line "Therefore, "
I skip a line between each and a few lines after the last line. Then I copy and paste it 6 or 8 times. Doing this helps me stay focused on writing good IRAC. So the first line is my issue statement, the next is the rule of law, the next is the elements (Here there was a breaking because D opened a closed window" then repeat for each element. The last line is my conclusion.
I then make adjustments based on the call of the question. If it just says something simple like "Discuss" then I give a pure Issue spotting answer. If it gives a list of questions and sub questions, that serves as an outline for me - I rewrite the key words in bold.
Finally, when I have five minutes left, I highlight, underline, italics or put in caps anything I forgot to make stand out as I went along.

I compare my answers to the model and for any issue I missed, I just read the outline on that and write another IRAC paragraph in my style.

I pretty much decided to start using the copy and past after re-doing the July 2013 PT about the charity fraud. Pretty much the only way to get that done in time was to copy and paste like mad. It is clear from the baressays website. Copy and Paste is what people who got 65s did and what people who got below 60 did not do. Using this method also makes my issues simpler. I can stick to one issue at a time instead of conflating two or three minor issues at a time. It is just faster because I think less while I am writing. My mind is focusing on one small thing instead of running around grabbing every idea that pops into my brain as I write. Hopefully, the grader will look at it and count the issues, see that it is organized, spot the words I made bold or underlined and give me a quick 65 or better.

Each night I do 20 - 30 minutes on Mavis Beacon to improve my typing speed.

But the main thing is just endless essay writing. I try to do at least 6 essays on each area of the law. More if I am having trouble.

That probably makes it sound like I am super organized, which I am not. Two of my kids are sick. I goof off watching the first season of Heroes or some crap on Netflix too much. Last week I watched the first eight episodes of the Munsters with my sick kid. I acted like it was OK for me to goof off because he was home from school. Now I am two days behind the schedule I posted on the previous page.

For the record Courtney, I went to a top law school. They didn't teach shit and I really hate them for scamming students out of $150,000 so the profs can work 6 - 9 hours per week 32 weeks per year and spend the rest of their days frolicking on their hobbies. The whole school was run for the benefit of the professors. We were just there to pay the bills and stay out of their hair. Everything I know about the law is in spite of the school not because of it. Fuck UCLA.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby 2807 » Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:45 pm

Remember on PTs:

Plagiarize like crazy.
Copy over as much as possible of BLL and relevant portions of cases.
No need to paraphrase.
Transcribe! and Cite ! UNDERLINE Cites so they SEE IT.

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby 2807 » Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:46 pm

MURPH wrote:My studying consists of doing 25 or more MBE questions from BarMax daily. (I did a lot more in late December and January when I was studying those topics).

After that I go over the outlines I got from Baressays.com .

Then I do the essays from the Cal Bar website. I do full one hour essays. Then I compare my answers to the model answers on the Cal Bar website or Baressays

To begin each essay I write "Issue # : Whether " Then on the next line I write "The law under.... is " (filling in either Common Law, California Probate Code or whatever. On the next line I write "Here, .... because, " Then on the last line "Therefore, "
I skip a line between each and a few lines after the last line. Then I copy and paste it 6 or 8 times. Doing this helps me stay focused on writing good IRAC. So the first line is my issue statement, the next is the rule of law, the next is the elements (Here there was a breaking because D opened a closed window" then repeat for each element. The last line is my conclusion.
I then make adjustments based on the call of the question. If it just says something simple like "Discuss" then I give a pure Issue spotting answer. If it gives a list of questions and sub questions, that serves as an outline for me - I rewrite the key words in bold.
Finally, when I have five minutes left, I highlight, underline, italics or put in caps anything I forgot to make stand out as I went along.

I compare my answers to the model and for any issue I missed, I just read the outline on that and write another IRAC paragraph in my style.

I pretty much decided to start using the copy and past after re-doing the July 2013 PT about the charity fraud. Pretty much the only way to get that done in time was to copy and paste like mad. It is clear from the baressays website. Copy and Paste is what people who got 65s did and what people who got below 60 did not do. Using this method also makes my issues simpler. I can stick to one issue at a time instead of conflating two or three minor issues at a time. It is just faster because I think less while I am writing. My mind is focusing on one small thing instead of running around grabbing every idea that pops into my brain as I write. Hopefully, the grader will look at it and count the issues, see that it is organized, spot the words I made bold or underlined and give me a quick 65 or better.

Each night I do 20 - 30 minutes on Mavis Beacon to improve my typing speed.

But the main thing is just endless essay writing. I try to do at least 6 essays on each area of the law. More if I am having trouble.

That probably makes it sound like I am super organized, which I am not. Two of my kids are sick. I goof off watching the first season of Heroes or some crap on Netflix too much. Last week I watched the first eight episodes of the Munsters with my sick kid. I acted like it was OK for me to goof off because he was home from school. Now I am two days behind the schedule I posted on the previous page.

For the record Courtney, I went to a top law school. They didn't teach shit and I really hate them for scamming students out of $150,000 so the profs can work 6 - 9 hours per week 32 weeks per year and spend the rest of their days frolicking on their hobbies. The whole school was run for the benefit of the professors. We were just there to pay the bills and stay out of their hair. Everything I know about the law is in spite of the school not because of it. Fuck UCLA.



In a few months, MURPH is going to be an attorney.

Good job MURPH.

HOLD FAST.

You can do this

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Re: California Bar Exam (February 2014) thread

Postby MURPH » Fri Feb 07, 2014 12:04 am

thanks




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