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Bikeflip
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Bikeflip » Tue Jun 11, 2013 11:16 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
Bikeflip wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
Bikeflip wrote:The way I see it, if you're doing above 70% right now, I want you to give me your notes or be available for questions later on.


Yea, if you get 70% on gameday, that's probably a 145 on the MBE. Great place to be now.


It's probably higher, broseph.


Probably, but I wanted to do a worst case scenario. Almost 150 right?



Probably above 150. Looks like I was editing on you. I found a California raw to scaled converter, and I poasted it a few pages back. lemme go dig it up.

Bikeflip wrote:CA Jul 2011 raw to scale conversion: http://admissions.calbar.ca.gov/Portals ... 201107.pdf

Scaled scores change state to state and year to year, but it gives you an idea of what percentage correlates with what scale.


So for CA July 2011's bar, a 140 raw would get you a 154.4 scaled. Who knows? Because each state curves the MBE to their applicants, and because CA's supposed to be hard, maybe a 140 is even better or some people. Even if it's not, it's still probably on pace for the kick ass MBE and suck ass MEE plan.

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Reinhardt
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Reinhardt » Tue Jun 11, 2013 11:24 pm

http://www.lawprism.com/resources.php

For California people. Download the July 2011 spreadsheet and you can see what essay scores you need to get depending on your MBE.

For non-California people, you can just use it as a raw -> scaled converter.

Some of the data points are wrong through

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kalvano
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby kalvano » Tue Jun 11, 2013 11:31 pm

Explain to me why the actual MBE score is so important. For me, it's only 40% of a possible 1000 points for the total bar exam. I still have 40% essay, 10% Texas Evidence and Procedure, and 10% MPT. I get that a high MBE helps make up for deficiencies, but some of you treat it like all that's important is an MBE score.

I am mathematically challenged, so keep that in mind.

09042014
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby 09042014 » Tue Jun 11, 2013 11:46 pm

kalvano wrote:Explain to me why the actual MBE score is so important. For me, it's only 40% of a possible 1000 points for the total bar exam. I still have 40% essay, 10% Texas Evidence and Procedure, and 10% MPT. I get that a high MBE helps make up for deficiencies, but some of you treat it like all that's important is an MBE score.

I am mathematically challenged, so keep that in mind.


Well in my state it's 50-50, so MBE is considerably more important. In 50/50 states once you get above 150 on the MBE you can do really poorly on writing and still pass.

But even in yours, MBE is only 6 subjects and you can really nail them them if you are good at MC questions and standardized tests. It's more controllable.

Written is much more random, in grading and subjects tested. You can really do well on writting and shitty on MBE and still pass. I'm just not going to count on it.

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Bikeflip
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Bikeflip » Tue Jun 11, 2013 11:51 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
kalvano wrote:Explain to me why the actual MBE score is so important. For me, it's only 40% of a possible 1000 points for the total bar exam. I still have 40% essay, 10% Texas Evidence and Procedure, and 10% MPT. I get that a high MBE helps make up for deficiencies, but some of you treat it like all that's important is an MBE score.

I am mathematically challenged, so keep that in mind.


Well in my state it's 50-50, so MBE is considerably more important. In 50/50 states once you get above 150 on the MBE you can do really poorly on writing and still pass.

But even in yours, MBE is only 6 subjects and you can really nail them them if you are good at MC questions and standardized tests. It's more controllable.

Written is much more random, in grading and subjects tested. You can really do well on writting and shitty on MBE and still pass. I'm just not going to count on it.


This. 50-50 states, a solid MBE score helps a ton. In Colorado, MBE's 50%. MEE is 30% MPT is 20%. Assume a 140 and the 155ish score above. In order for me to pass Colorado, which requires a score of 276, I need to find 121 points somewhere else. I might be able to obtain a large majority of that remaining 121 from the MPT, though I'm not sure how it's scored.

Also, the MBE is more objective. You either get the right answer or you don't. The essays are probably more subjective. Bank on the objective portion.

Also, I'm not fully convinced that a high MBE score = auto pass, but it's objective component's make me believe it's more important.

Also, I'll have to go back and review the lectures, but I recall the lecturers strongly inferring that one or two MBE subjects will show up somehow on one or two of my essays. Birdthisle––for Agency, Corps and Partnership--strongly inferred that those subjects will somehow show up in one essay. So between the MBE and the elements of Biz Orgs, I may have 3 of my 6 MEE questions.

Granted, just because those elements mentioned above may show up on 50% of my questions, that does not mean that they account for the full 50%. One question may be 75% family law and 25% torts. Also, my explanation of what Themis told me may merely be a hackjob of an explanation.

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CaliBum
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby CaliBum » Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:16 am

I had a professor who writes questions for the CA exam. He mentioned that previous stats have shown that the better you do on your MBE, regardless, the more likely your chances are passing the bar all together. So at the very least, try to do the best you can on improving your MBE and it will help you retain the information you need to know for the MEE.

I think this is also why Directed Study has the essays spaced out, so that you continue to learn from doing the occasional MBE practice sets. Personally, I've noticed improvement by taking my time to understand why every answer choice is wrong in comparison to the correct answer. I even do it for the obvious questions as well. It's taken some time, but it's really paid off for Con law so far. =)

locusdelicti
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby locusdelicti » Wed Jun 12, 2013 10:57 am

I'm taking PA, which is 45% MBE, 11% performance test and 44 % essays, and then New Jersey, which is 50/50. I'm not sure how that all shakes down. Scaled test score math is beyond my intellect. Anyone have the energy/understanding to explain?

Citizen Genet
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Citizen Genet » Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:11 am

kalvano wrote:Explain to me why the actual MBE score is so important. For me, it's only 40% of a possible 1000 points for the total bar exam. I still have 40% essay, 10% Texas Evidence and Procedure, and 10% MPT. I get that a high MBE helps make up for deficiencies, but some of you treat it like all that's important is an MBE score.

I am mathematically challenged, so keep that in mind.


Yeah, even for Texas it's a big help. Assume you max out your MBE score in Texas. (Note: This doesn't require that you ace it or even get the highest score on it, just hit a certain minimum score that gives you the full 400 points from it.) That means you need 275 points from the other sections. Or, in other words, you need, on average, less than 50% of the points from each of the other sections. While you can't slack off, that's certainly doable - especially considering you're being judged on a scale against other people who are similarly new and time-pressured.

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jessuf
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby jessuf » Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:59 am

Themis, I see you lurking. Can I get a megapoaster discount?

antonious13
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby antonious13 » Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:25 pm

Bustang wrote:I scored a 70% on the property questions (34). I don't think I've felt happier in my entire life.


Would it be possible to share brains for certain subjects? I'll let you borrow my Con Law brain. I'm barely pushing 50% (if that) in property.

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BarbellDreams
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby BarbellDreams » Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:43 pm

I am flat out jealous of those that had Jeffries for a professor in real life. Just seems like he would be the most entertaining prof around.

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Themis Bar Review
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Themis Bar Review » Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:36 pm

Jessuf wrote:Themis, I see you lurking. Can I get a megapoaster discount?


We're not lurking, we are here to help - with everything other than discount requests. 8)

EJ
Themis Bar Review

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Bikeflip
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Bikeflip » Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:48 pm

Themis Bar Review wrote:
Jessuf wrote:Themis, I see you lurking. Can I get a megapoaster discount?


We're not lurking, we are here to help - with everything other than discount requests. 8)

EJ
Themis Bar Review



What about partial refund requests for being TLS members?

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Themis Bar Review
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Themis Bar Review » Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:49 pm

In regards to your percentage completion, a rough estimate is 12-15% completed each week. This is based on the structured study schedule, so if you got a late start or find yourself behind, please contact your state director to discuss various study strategies.

EJ
Themis Bar Review

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kalvano
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby kalvano » Wed Jun 12, 2013 2:02 pm

I guess I am learning stuff, despite my best efforts. My percentages correct are slowly increasing. 76% for Con Law today and 56% for Torts, which is way better than where I started.

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Bikeflip
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Bikeflip » Wed Jun 12, 2013 2:37 pm

kalvano wrote:I guess I am learning stuff, despite my best efforts. My percentages correct are slowly increasing. 76% for Con Law today and 56% for Torts, which is way better than where I started.


What are you doing to help increase your numbers?

I've condensed the handouts into 8 page outlines (when I print double sided, 4 pages/side, they're 1 page... mental trick on myself) and I review the outline.

mjj
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby mjj » Wed Jun 12, 2013 2:50 pm

Bikeflip wrote:
kalvano wrote:I guess I am learning stuff, despite my best efforts. My percentages correct are slowly increasing. 76% for Con Law today and 56% for Torts, which is way better than where I started.


What are you doing to help increase your numbers?

I've condensed the handouts into 8 page outlines (when I print double sided, 4 pages/side, they're 1 page... mental trick on myself) and I review the outline.


I'm making flashcards (with StudyBlue so I don't have to worry about physical cards and I can easily do them on my phone) and I do a few at random times. Waiting on line, downtime while cooking dinner, get boyfriend to read them to me while I'm driving, etc. I find it helps a lot.

Of course, my flashcards are insane. The front sides of them basically say, "talk about X" and the back side is a paragraph of info. But it helps.

ETA also the process of making them was really helpful.

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Bustang
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Bustang » Wed Jun 12, 2013 2:51 pm

antonious13 wrote:
Bustang wrote:I scored a 70% on the property questions (34). I don't think I've felt happier in my entire life.


Would it be possible to share brains for certain subjects? I'll let you borrow my Con Law brain. I'm barely pushing 50% (if that) in property.


I wish. I have to admit, I wasn't exactly full of confidence while completing that quiz. In fact, I took the entire 61 minutes to complete it. I'd say the quiz was mostly easements, recording and security priority. Those are pretty simple rules so I was able to give good educated guesses on most of them which probably helped me achieve the higher %. My problem with Conlaw/torts is I can convince myself that 2 or 3 of the answers are correct. With property, if you know the concept, the right answer seems much more "right."

locusdelicti
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby locusdelicti » Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:32 pm

Continued amusement at Geis's drunk mother in law fact patterns.

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andythecandyman
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby andythecandyman » Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:57 pm

Yo I'm bored at work and went on TLS. Used Themis last summer for MA/NY and passed both.

lmk if you have any ?s for someone who went through all this nonsense last year

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kalvano
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby kalvano » Wed Jun 12, 2013 4:17 pm

Bikeflip wrote:
kalvano wrote:I guess I am learning stuff, despite my best efforts. My percentages correct are slowly increasing. 76% for Con Law today and 56% for Torts, which is way better than where I started.


What are you doing to help increase your numbers?

I've condensed the handouts into 8 page outlines (when I print double sided, 4 pages/side, they're 1 page... mental trick on myself) and I review the outline.


Nothing, really. I just learn best by doing questions and repetition. There's only so much they can test, so it's all about the core concepts.

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Bustang
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Bustang » Wed Jun 12, 2013 6:09 pm

Another property question. I saw this in the handout and I'm trying to practice my RAP skills:

"O conveys Blackacre 'to A and her heirs, but if liquor is served on the premises, then to C and her heirs."

This violates RAP, correct? A could die and liquor could be served 100 years afterwards.

Would it NOT violate RAP if it said:

"To A and her heirs, but if liquor is served on the premises during A's lifetime, then to C and he heirs."

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Reinhardt
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Reinhardt » Wed Jun 12, 2013 6:12 pm

Seems fine with your modification

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Holly Golightly
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Holly Golightly » Wed Jun 12, 2013 6:29 pm

I apparently know nothing about family law. First essay on that today was scary.

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CaliBum
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby CaliBum » Wed Jun 12, 2013 8:57 pm

Ok, I'm starting to lag BIG TIME. For the past three days, I've become very tired or exhausted in the middle of studying. I didn't want to rely heavily on energy drinks, but it seems like there's no choice.




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