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locusdelicti
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby locusdelicti » Mon Jul 29, 2013 11:25 am

Catleesi wrote:
locusdelicti wrote:
kalvano wrote:
Doesn't the MBE transfer?


No. I don't think any jurisdiction lets you do that anymore.

To waive in to a state that has reciprocity with your state (you make a motion and get admitted instead of having to take the bar), you have to have practiced 5 out of the last 7 years continuously in one state. I practiced for 4 years when I moved the first time. I didn't practice at all in Texas. So here I am.


You can transfer it with at least some UBE states. I know of someone who failed Colorado last year by almost nothing and considered transferring to a different UBE state with a lower overall score. She could have transferred her whole score to Arizona for $350.

So you can't transfer for free, but at least some places will still let you move your score. There's a very short time frame, though-- I think she had to do it before the next exam.


The only thing I can do is take the MBE in Pennsylvania and transfer the score to New Jersey if I'm taking both exams concurrently. I know nothing about UBE states - I've never lived in one.

locusdelicti
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby locusdelicti » Mon Jul 29, 2013 11:28 am

And now I know why - the UBE only became a thing in 2011. When I took my two previous exams, no jurisdiction used the UBE.

locusdelicti
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby locusdelicti » Mon Jul 29, 2013 11:40 am

New Jersey's sample student answers are GOD AWFUL. If this is all you need to pass, I think I'm ok.

Citizen Genet
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Citizen Genet » Mon Jul 29, 2013 12:00 pm

locusdelicti wrote:New Jersey's sample student answers are GOD AWFUL. If this is all you need to pass, I think I'm ok.


I think everyone needs to remember this. I am sure it is true across jurisdictions.

Things to remember to keep stress down over the next days:

-Minimum competence for you and everyone else
-No one, not a single person, has mastered every single subject
-This isn't a law school exam where a curve screws you over. This a state licensure exam where a curve saves you because no one is bright enough to do well on every section and it is MINIMUM COMPTENECE.
-A good part of what they are testing is just your ability to logistically reason and communicate. That means you are going to get points for saying things in a coherent manner even if they're wrong. Don't expect to pass on that alone, but if you wrote absolutely anything down related to the subject, you're going to get some points.

And if you're in Texas, remember that MBE, MPT, and Procedure are 600 points on the exam. If you don't know Secured Transactions, that's totally fine! That's about 35 points maximum that you are going to lose out on. In fact, you can have no clue what the UCC is, what commercial paper is, or what a sale is, then you'll still only miss out on a max of 70 points. And that's if you knew nothing, wrote down absolutely nothing and they don't scale points so that it's worth even less. Just take a deep breath and go kill that consumer law question by reciting the DTPA elements and mentioning warranties.

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Reinhardt
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Reinhardt » Mon Jul 29, 2013 12:10 pm

I've been freaking out about the essays for a good two weeks or so. It's helped me to remember that the model answers are people who either mastered one subject and didn't necessarily destroy the others, or passed the bar by an unnecessarily wide margin. The average July bar taker in California gets about a 128 raw on the MBE, meaning they miss about 1/3 of the questions. There's no way they know everything. That extends to the essays as well. They don't know everything. Somehow they still pass.

So at least:
IRAC
Write more than one page even on WTF questions
Spot the issues and make up rules for them as needed
Use headings to tell your grader to give you points for spotting the issues
Apply (made up) law to facts
Follow the directions
Answer all the questions asked
"Finish your answer" - meaning don't cut it off mid sentence or without giving at least minimal coverage to each point

antonious13
Posts: 77
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby antonious13 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 12:19 pm

Reinhardt wrote:I've been freaking out about the essays for a good two weeks or so. It's helped me to remember that the model answers are people who either mastered one subject and didn't necessarily destroy the others, or passed the bar by an unnecessarily wide margin. The average July bar taker in California gets about a 128 raw on the MBE, meaning they miss about 1/3 of the questions. There's no way they know everything. That extends to the essays as well. They don't know everything. Somehow they still pass.

So at least:
IRAC
Write more than one page even on WTF questions
Spot the issues and make up rules for them as needed
Use headings to tell your grader to give you points for spotting the issues
Apply (made up) law to facts
Follow the directions
Answer all the questions asked
"Finish your answer" - meaning don't cut it off mid sentence or without giving at least minimal coverage to each point


From what I've been hearing from people who subscribed to baressays, the people who got 60 and above on essays didn't really hit everything, they just analyzed the shit out of what they did hit. They said even the higher graded ones were jumbled a bit in their structure or were missing a few of the elements on each rule statement. The ones below 60 only made conclussory statements and didn't hit all the right issues. I think one went off on a tangent about contract formation in a wills answer. So, long story short, when in doubt, make shit up, and analyze the shit out of it.

wh3931110
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby wh3931110 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 1:21 pm

kalvano wrote:
locusdelicti wrote:
Charles Barkley wrote:
locusdelicti wrote:
It depends on where you are. I plan on leaving the site in Philly. I left the site when I took the Michigan bar and I made it back in time. When I took the TX bar in Austin, I had lunch at Starbucks and made it back in plenty of time. If you know where you are and don't go to a sit down restaurant, you have plenty of time to go get lunch.


You have taken some bars in your day.


Yeah. I'm from Michigan and I practiced there, but I've moved twice in the last 3 years (my husband changing jobs), so I haven't been able to get reciprocity. Here I am, taking PA and NJ.

Three bar exams in, and they still suck balls.


Doesn't the MBE transfer?


IL explicitly states they allow people to transfer their MBE scores... says you need a 140 or above and they will take it. Think it has to be within a couple of years though. Would seem like BS to me if states do not accept MBE scores if the MBE is a regular component of the exam in that state, but I guess anything for more fees/money.

locusdelicti
Posts: 225
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby locusdelicti » Mon Jul 29, 2013 1:28 pm

wh3931110 wrote:
kalvano wrote:
locusdelicti wrote:
Charles Barkley wrote:
You have taken some bars in your day.


Yeah. I'm from Michigan and I practiced there, but I've moved twice in the last 3 years (my husband changing jobs), so I haven't been able to get reciprocity. Here I am, taking PA and NJ.

Three bar exams in, and they still suck balls.


Doesn't the MBE transfer?


IL explicitly states they allow people to transfer their MBE scores... says you need a 140 or above and they will take it. Think it has to be within a couple of years though. Would seem like BS to me if states do not accept MBE scores if the MBE is a regular component of the exam in that state, but I guess anything for more fees/money.


Within 13 months. So it must be a recently taken exam. Illinois doesn't matter to me, anyway, because I moved to Texas, which doesn't allow inbound score transfers, then to PA, which also doesn't allow inbound score transfers.

Plus, when I moved to Texas, it had been nearly 4 years since I had taken the Michigan bar.

09042014
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby 09042014 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 2:05 pm

criminal convictions only come in against a defendant if they are testifying right?

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Reinhardt
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Reinhardt » Mon Jul 29, 2013 2:07 pm

Desert Fox wrote:criminal convictions only come in against a defendant if they are testifying right?


I think you can also use the hearsay exception "any fact necessary to support a prior criminal conviction" if I remember correctly. Might be more.... I suck at evidence

dsclaw
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby dsclaw » Mon Jul 29, 2013 2:20 pm

Desert Fox wrote:criminal convictions only come in against a defendant if they are testifying right?


Criminal convictions can only be used for impeachment purposes and therefore yes only come in if a party testifies. Remember to apply reverse 403 if it is the criminal defendant.

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BarbellDreams
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby BarbellDreams » Mon Jul 29, 2013 2:53 pm

Desert Fox wrote:criminal convictions only come in against a defendant if they are testifying right?


Yes.

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Whatisthis
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Whatisthis » Mon Jul 29, 2013 2:56 pm

never mind.

astro1819
Posts: 302
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby astro1819 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 3:12 pm

Desert Fox wrote:criminal convictions only come in against a defendant if they are testifying right?


One small exception -- evidence of prior sexual assault crimes are admissible as character evidence (or for any matter) in sexual assault cases (413/414/415)

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BarbellDreams
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby BarbellDreams » Mon Jul 29, 2013 3:22 pm

I'm done dudes. Good luck to everyone, I will see you on the other side.

TheBeard
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby TheBeard » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:22 pm

Nice hanging with ya'll. Based on our convos in this thread, I have a strong feeling we'll all be fine. Relax, watch some tv, get to bed early, and be ready to kick some ass tomorrow.

GOOD LUCK, and MINIMUM COMPETENCY!

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Themis Bar Review
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Themis Bar Review » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:00 pm

Hi everyone,

I wanted to say thank you for prepping for your Summer 2013 bar exam with Themis Bar Review. It has been an experience reading through your posts and I want you to know that your comments/suggestions/concerns have been noted. Also, your course access will remain available up until the last day of your jurisdiction's bar exam. To everyone that is taking their bar exam tomorrow, good luck! Trust in the hard work and preparation that you have put in thus far and try to relax tonight. Again, thank you for choosing Themis Bar Review and we wish you the best of luck in all of your future endeavors!

EJ
Themis Bar Review

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Bikeflip
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Bikeflip » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:12 pm

[Ladies and g]entlemen, it's been a privilege flying with you.

See you all on the ground.

Themis Bar Review wrote:Hi everyone,

I wanted to say thank you for prepping for your Summer 2013 bar exam with Themis Bar Review. It has been an experience reading through your posts and I want you to know that your comments/suggestions/concerns have been noted. Also, your course access will remain available up until the last day of your jurisdiction's bar exam. To everyone that is taking their bar exam tomorrow, good luck! Trust in the hard work and preparation that you have put in thus far and try to relax tonight. Again, thank you for choosing Themis Bar Review and we wish you the best of luck in all of your future endeavors!

EJ
Themis Bar Review



Thanks Themis People. Any way we can give you all feedback of what we liked and didn't like about Themis?
Last edited by Bikeflip on Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

yeff
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby yeff » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:14 pm

Catch you guys on the other side. Minimum competency indeed

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CaliBum
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby CaliBum » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:23 pm

Good luck tomorrow, team!

JD_done
Posts: 40
Joined: Thu May 30, 2013 9:04 am

Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby JD_done » Mon Jul 29, 2013 6:00 pm

You're all going to do great! I'm rooting for you (and me). I'm grateful for all I've learned from this community.

mrpickles
Posts: 53
Joined: Sun Jul 28, 2013 1:20 pm

Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby mrpickles » Mon Jul 29, 2013 8:26 pm

antonious13 wrote:
Reinhardt wrote:I've been freaking out about the essays for a good two weeks or so. It's helped me to remember that the model answers are people who either mastered one subject and didn't necessarily destroy the others, or passed the bar by an unnecessarily wide margin. The average July bar taker in California gets about a 128 raw on the MBE, meaning they miss about 1/3 of the questions. There's no way they know everything. That extends to the essays as well. They don't know everything. Somehow they still pass.

So at least:
IRAC
Write more than one page even on WTF questions
Spot the issues and make up rules for them as needed
Use headings to tell your grader to give you points for spotting the issues
Apply (made up) law to facts
Follow the directions
Answer all the questions asked
"Finish your answer" - meaning don't cut it off mid sentence or without giving at least minimal coverage to each point


From what I've been hearing from people who subscribed to baressays, the people who got 60 and above on essays didn't really hit everything, they just analyzed the shit out of what they did hit. They said even the higher graded ones were jumbled a bit in their structure or were missing a few of the elements on each rule statement. The ones below 60 only made conclussory statements and didn't hit all the right issues. I think one went off on a tangent about contract formation in a wills answer. So, long story short, when in doubt, make shit up, and analyze the shit out of it.


Seconded. In a moment of panic and desperation, I got a baressays.com membership about 1.5 weeks ago.
Today, I pulled up a 65 passing on July 2011 I think. Some major things the guy missed: 1) didnt bring up delegation of power (the first sentence was Congress giving power to an Exec Agency. Duh.). 2) didn't bring up standing (these are Constitutional challenges, c'mon now!). 3) there was a threat to withhold 10% of federal highway and the guy concluded this was comandeering and compulsion (umm those South Dakota 21 year old drink law cases say differently about 10% of highway funds).

He started off his heading/essay with: "Procedural Due Process" - didn't even bring up the fact it was valid under Commerce Clause first, before even moving on.

In short: I've looked at a lot of baressays.com lately - I was always comparing to model answers. On some things, like Crim Law, the 65's weren't THAT far off from the models, they still resembled. On things like Prop, Contracts, Con - there was just a WILD variance. I read a 65 contract where the guy wrote the entire essay on Agency and undisclosed principal, authority to bind. The call of the question was asking about specific performance of something not related to the principal in it, nor was agency used at all to trigger anything. PASSED.

That said, I am freaking out because of Civ Pro. if CA Civ Pro is on there, I am screwed. If Fed Civ Pro, I am just going to write about JX even if that's not it.

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Reinhardt
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Reinhardt » Mon Jul 29, 2013 8:38 pm

CA Civ Pro, limited, unlimited, small claims....courts of general jurisdiction....that's about all I know.

Kretzy
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Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Kretzy » Mon Jul 29, 2013 8:44 pm

Reinhardt wrote:CA Civ Pro, limited, unlimited, small claims....courts of general jurisdiction....that's about all I know.


County matters for Venue! Long arm statute!

[I've added the only 2 other things I know. Pretty please no CA Civ Pro.]

Good luck, everyone!

Citizen Genet
Posts: 516
Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:03 am

Re: THEMIS BAR REVIEW Hangout.

Postby Citizen Genet » Mon Jul 29, 2013 11:39 pm

Good night everybody. Good luck in the days to come!




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