Colorado 1L taking Questions!

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
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Pufer
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby Pufer » Thu Sep 02, 2010 1:17 am

mapes wrote:In regards to employment, how tough is it to secure a job/summer job with firms like HRO and Holland and Hart? Can it be done, and how do grades vs. networking and connections pan out in importance?


If you're a URM, you interview well, and you have very good grades, it's not impossible to get a legit biglaw job 1L summer. Odds are, you won't be back 2L summer.

In this economy, if you're top 10%, law review, moot court, interview well, look the part, etc., you can probably get an interview for a 2L position at a HRO or Holland & Hart. An interview isn't a job. If you're all of those elite things, your best 2L summer offer will still probably come from a medium-sized local firm or a moderately important judge.

Nobody gets offers for post-graduation employment these days from any type of big firm.

Yeah, maybe it'll go back to the good ol' days where interviewers were actually interviewing CU-types for jobs instead of to say they are still interviewing at thirty-five schools every year (for their three open summer associate positions), but nobody is left at the law school who remembers those good ol' days.

You network to get into medium-sized local firms and smaller (something that works as well today as ever). Big firms have branches in locations nearer to T14s, and are being schmoozed by unemployed Stanford-types with as nice a bunch of resumes as you have.

If you had any connections that matter, you'd already have a job lined up.

-Pufer

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20160810
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby 20160810 » Thu Sep 02, 2010 2:02 am

It takes top-10%+LR to get a screener with Holland and Hart? :shock:

Hoping for exaggeration there...

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Pufer
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby Pufer » Thu Sep 02, 2010 3:31 am

SBL wrote:It takes top-10%+LR to get a screener with Holland and Hart? :shock:

Hoping for exaggeration there...


Only interview like ten folks every year. 17 people in the top 10%, 30 people on LR. Not like any other big firms are coming, so everyone applies.

CU doesn't do OCI bidding. The same group of folks are interviewed for every firm job.

-Pufer

mapes
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby mapes » Thu Sep 02, 2010 2:58 pm

Wow, that is pretty harsh. The thing you said about connections seems a little strong though.

mapes
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby mapes » Thu Sep 02, 2010 3:00 pm

So are you saying if i want any real chance at working at a large firm in Denver, leaving the state for a top ten or so school would be the better option than going to CU on a fair scholarship?

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Pufer
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby Pufer » Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:00 pm

mapes wrote:So are you saying if i want any real chance at working at a large firm in Denver, leaving the state for a top ten or so school would be the better option than going to CU on a fair scholarship?


Yes. If you want any real chance at working at any large firm anywhere, going to a T14 is all but necessary in an economy like this one. Even in the greatest economy ever, you'll still have a far better chance at Denver (or any other) biglaw coming from a T14 school.

mapes wrote:The thing you said about connections seems a little strong though.


To be clear, I'm referring to biglaw connections. You don't schmooze or connect your way into biglaw coming from CU unless your father's name is on the building or something (a connection you'd already know is going to get you a job). Connections can absolutely matter if you just want some kind of legal job, but biglaw is not merely some kind of legal job if you're coming from CU.

-Pufer

mapes
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby mapes » Wed Oct 20, 2010 9:50 pm

ah i see what you mean then. makes sense.

ptblazer
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby ptblazer » Sun Oct 31, 2010 11:40 pm

Hey, first time posting on this site and I'm not sure this thread is still active, but I am strongly considering applying to Colorado for next year. I guess I would classify myself as a nontraditional perspective law student. My undergraduate degree is in chemistry and I am going to pursue a dual degree at Colorado, if I am accepted, with the school of environmental science. Maybe you know of people with a similar academic track and I'm just curious how they have viewed their experience (as best as you can know, of course). Also I'm curious if my LSAT score is strong enough to gain acceptance, or do you think I should retake the test? LSAT, 161. GPA, 3.69. I apreciate your input, and I'm sure there will be more questions to come.

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icarter
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby icarter » Mon Nov 01, 2010 12:01 am

ptblazer wrote:Hey, first time posting on this site and I'm not sure this thread is still active, but I am strongly considering applying to Colorado for next year. I guess I would classify myself as a nontraditional perspective law student. My undergraduate degree is in chemistry and I am going to pursue a dual degree at Colorado, if I am accepted, with the school of environmental science. Maybe you know of people with a similar academic track and I'm just curious how they have viewed their experience (as best as you can know, of course). Also I'm curious if my LSAT score is strong enough to gain acceptance, or do you think I should retake the test? LSAT, 161. GPA, 3.69. I apreciate your input, and I'm sure there will be more questions to come.


Hi ptblazer,

I have several friends who are doing the joint JD/MS in Environmental Sciences. Most of them are just starting the MS portion of the joint degree but seem to like it thus far from what I know. Each year the median LSAT seems to increase, and while you may get in with a 161, I would advocate for retaking it if you think you can do better. The median score last year was 164 and a 3.61 GPA, so you are very close to those, but a higher score will always help.

ptblazer
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby ptblazer » Mon Nov 01, 2010 2:01 am

icarter,

I appreciate your response. I'm going to put some serious thought into retaking the exam. While I'm sure that I can do better if I took it again, I'm would be concerned if there is a regression in my score. What are your thoughts, does Colorado put a lot of weight into the average or most recent score? I know LSAT and GPA are the primary factors they look at in admissions, but how heavily would they look a volunteer activities, under represented minorities, etc? Obviously they wouldn't include it as part of that application if they didn't to some degree, but I guess what I'm asking is does Colorado place a greater emphasis?

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Pufer
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby Pufer » Thu Nov 04, 2010 1:14 pm

ptblazer wrote:What are your thoughts, does Colorado put a lot of weight into the average or most recent score?


Virtually every school will put the most weight on your most recent score, and CU isn't an exception. Even if it's not a set policy to weigh later scores more, they still raise the question of whether your first, higher score was just a fluke.

ptblazer wrote:I know LSAT and GPA are the primary factors they look at in admissions, but how heavily would they look a volunteer activities, under represented minorities, etc?


Volunteer activities may help at the margins (i.e. if your numbers are the same as someone else's on the waitlist, but you have more volunteer activities, you might get off the WL before the other person), but aren't that big a deal unless you have a truly incredible amount of volunteering on your resume.

URM status will give you a massive boost at CU; likely even more than you'd get at comparably-ranked schools.

-Pufer

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chrisbru
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby chrisbru » Thu Dec 09, 2010 5:36 pm

How much time do you get in for ski/snowboading?

the lantern
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby the lantern » Fri Dec 10, 2010 10:57 pm

I'd imagine if you really wanted to, you could ski or snowboard multiple times a week. If you're just heading to Eldora (~30 mins away), you could easily go out there every day after class if you really wanted to. During the last month of the semester, you're probably not going to have a single spare minute so I'd just keep that in mind.

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chrisbru
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby chrisbru » Sun Dec 12, 2010 5:39 pm

the lantern wrote:I'd imagine if you really wanted to, you could ski or snowboard multiple times a week. If you're just heading to Eldora (~30 mins away), you could easily go out there every day after class if you really wanted to. During the last month of the semester, you're probably not going to have a single spare minute so I'd just keep that in mind.



That totally makes sense. Thanks for the input!

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coldshoulder
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby coldshoulder » Thu Mar 10, 2011 5:14 pm

Checking out CU, I've grown up most of my life in Park City, UT and attended UG at the University of Utah.
I'm really wondering if I would want to live for a significant amount of time in Colorado/Mt West. With my scores (3.6, 169), I might be able to get money, and could even start living in CO soon to get in-state tuition.
I'm interested in public interest mostly. I need to get the hell out of Utah (Mormon culture).

Pronkbaggins
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby Pronkbaggins » Wed Apr 20, 2011 2:55 pm

Hey everyone! Not sure if this thread is still active or if my question has already been answered, but I just wanted to know a little about 1L exams. I'm debating what to do for 0L prep, and I wanted to know if the exams were open or closed book and/or outline.

Thanks!

the lantern
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby the lantern » Thu Apr 21, 2011 2:23 am

(current 1L here)

@coldshoulder There are a good amount of people here from Utah, Mormon and non-Mormon. I am really good friends with a girl from a Mormon family who doesn't really do the whole Mormon thing anymore, and I bet there are more like her that you'd get along with great.

@Pronkbaggins As far as I know, every 1L exam is open book and open outline unless you are unlucky enough to get Nagel for Constitutional Law. Some professors allow the use of commercial supplements/outline, some don't (either way it doesn't really matter because if you're using either during the test you're destined for the median anyway). 1L exams are staggered so that you'll have at least two days in between each one (at least they were this year). 1L exams are also 3-4 hours depending on professor, with the vast majority of them being all essay issue spotting exams. My contracts prof (Schwartz) had a multiple choice section for part of the test, but I can't think of any others with a multiple choice test off the top of my head.

I did absolutely 0 prep before law school, and I am doing well (don't want to brag or sell myself short so I'll be general). I think the hardest thing about 1L year is that, in the beginning, it is difficult to figure out what you should be taking notes on and what you shouldn't. For this reason, I took really shitty notes for the first half of the semester and it took me a lot longer to review for finals. I'm not sure whether you can learn this skill before coming here, but I suppose it couldn't hurt to try. Nevertheless, I would recommend taking it easy this summer so that you are prepared to put in some long hours when legal writing papers are and when finals are coming up.


If anyone has any questions or anything, I'm always more than happy to answer, although my knowledge is somewhat limited being that I am a 1L and I am not from the Denver/Boulder area.

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boilerup89
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby boilerup89 » Tue Apr 26, 2011 1:27 pm

the lantern wrote:(current 1L here)

@coldshoulder There are a good amount of people here from Utah, Mormon and non-Mormon. I am really good friends with a girl from a Mormon family who doesn't really do the whole Mormon thing anymore, and I bet there are more like her that you'd get along with great.

@Pronkbaggins As far as I know, every 1L exam is open book and open outline unless you are unlucky enough to get Nagel for Constitutional Law. Some professors allow the use of commercial supplements/outline, some don't (either way it doesn't really matter because if you're using either during the test you're destined for the median anyway). 1L exams are staggered so that you'll have at least two days in between each one (at least they were this year). 1L exams are also 3-4 hours depending on professor, with the vast majority of them being all essay issue spotting exams. My contracts prof (Schwartz) had a multiple choice section for part of the test, but I can't think of any others with a multiple choice test off the top of my head.

I did absolutely 0 prep before law school, and I am doing well (don't want to brag or sell myself short so I'll be general). I think the hardest thing about 1L year is that, in the beginning, it is difficult to figure out what you should be taking notes on and what you shouldn't. For this reason, I took really shitty notes for the first half of the semester and it took me a lot longer to review for finals. I'm not sure whether you can learn this skill before coming here, but I suppose it couldn't hurt to try. Nevertheless, I would recommend taking it easy this summer so that you are prepared to put in some long hours when legal writing papers are and when finals are coming up.


If anyone has any questions or anything, I'm always more than happy to answer, although my knowledge is somewhat limited being that I am a 1L and I am not from the Denver/Boulder area.


Any recommendations on housing?

Also the CU 2014 page is way more active if you want to migrate over there 8)

the lantern
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby the lantern » Tue Apr 26, 2011 9:18 pm

I found my apartment at the last minute through a broker agency called Housing Helpers (http://www.housinghelpers.com). They are probably overpriced, but I found an apartment in a couple days through them. I'm currently looking for a new place and just trolling Craigslist like everyone else.

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coldshoulder
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby coldshoulder » Sat Jun 11, 2011 12:16 pm

Couple of questions:
1. From hearing from other people, any idea if 3.5/170 would warrant a scholly?
2. Approximate COL for a 1 bedroom or studio close to campus.
3. Bar scene
4. Employment prospects for environmental law in the mountain west.
5. Any experience with the dual jd/ms in environmental science and its help in securing an environmental law job.

the lantern
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby the lantern » Sat Jun 18, 2011 8:19 pm

coldshoulder wrote:Couple of questions:
1. From hearing from other people, any idea if 3.5/170 would warrant a scholly?
2. Approximate COL for a 1 bedroom or studio close to campus.
3. Bar scene
4. Employment prospects for environmental law in the mountain west.
5. Any experience with the dual jd/ms in environmental science and its help in securing an environmental law job.


1.anything is possible-- i had a sub 3.0 gpa and a LSAT worse than yours and I got a small scholarship
2. I'm paying $930 a month for a 1bedroom. Sure you can get a bit cheaper, probably not less than $700 a month unless you get really lucky or live in a shitty place.
3. bar scene is awesome. don't know what else to say. the bars are great, people in the town are cool, and other law students are cool.
4. i hear that it is good, but personally i'm not a environmental law person so all i know is from what i hear my friends talking about with each other.
5. don't know, but if you contact the admissions office they can put you in touch with a professor or student who will be able to answer specific questions

Tabemaju
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby Tabemaju » Sat Jul 16, 2011 12:57 pm

Thanks for keeping this thread going. I have a few questions:

1. Can anyone comment on the family aspects of CU and Boulder in general? I will be attending law school with my wife and 3-year-old daughter. Does the school offer any family services beyond childcare (for example, some colleges offer cheaper off-campus family housing rates and some family voucher programs)? How easy is it to get your child into their childcare program? Any further info about the school or area in regards to family/children would be appreciated.

2. I'll be applying this fall with a 3.9, 163 with some background in the legal field. I'm contemplating retaking for more money, but won't unless I can get consistent scores (my practice tests leading up to the test ranged from 162 to 176 with an average of 172. Of course, I hit the low end of my spread). Let's assume I do not retake (my fall semester, intern, and family will be sapping a lot of my fall study time). I have been told by a few people that I'll look at around a 30k scholarship. I know DU is likely to give me more money. Although my heart is set on Boulder, is it worth passing up more money at DU? I know that's a difficult one to answer considering I haven't applied, but some general feedback would be nice.

3. This may have been answered, but when is the absolute best time to apartment hunt? We'll be moving from out of state, but we're pretty open as far as when to move (I'm finished with undergrad this fall). We'll be likely trying to find a 3 bedroom house or apartment; is it even worth looking in Boulder, or should we be planning to commute?

That's all I can think of off the top of my head at the moment. Thanks again for anyone who is able to answer, and I'm sure I'll have more questions as we get closer to application time.

the lantern
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby the lantern » Tue Jul 26, 2011 9:53 am

Tabemaju wrote:Thanks for keeping this thread going. I have a few questions:

1. Can anyone comment on the family aspects of CU and Boulder in general? I will be attending law school with my wife and 3-year-old daughter. Does the school offer any family services beyond childcare (for example, some colleges offer cheaper off-campus family housing rates and some family voucher programs)? How easy is it to get your child into their childcare program? Any further info about the school or area in regards to family/children would be appreciated.

2. I'll be applying this fall with a 3.9, 163 with some background in the legal field. I'm contemplating retaking for more money, but won't unless I can get consistent scores (my practice tests leading up to the test ranged from 162 to 176 with an average of 172. Of course, I hit the low end of my spread). Let's assume I do not retake (my fall semester, intern, and family will be sapping a lot of my fall study time). I have been told by a few people that I'll look at around a 30k scholarship. I know DU is likely to give me more money. Although my heart is set on Boulder, is it worth passing up more money at DU? I know that's a difficult one to answer considering I haven't applied, but some general feedback would be nice.

3. This may have been answered, but when is the absolute best time to apartment hunt? We'll be moving from out of state, but we're pretty open as far as when to move (I'm finished with undergrad this fall). We'll be likely trying to find a 3 bedroom house or apartment; is it even worth looking in Boulder, or should we be planning to commute?

That's all I can think of off the top of my head at the moment. Thanks again for anyone who is able to answer, and I'm sure I'll have more questions as we get closer to application time.


1) No clue about anything regarding families children except that there are lots of students with wives/children. If you call the admissions office and ask to speak to a student in a similar situation, I'm sure they could find someone who would be happy to chat with you (or just answer any questions you have).

2) Could not give any advice here other than say that there are lots of successful attorneys from both CU and DU, and DU has a better location being right in Denver. Having said that, the economy is still shitty and there are a lot more students at DU.

3) Boulder is going to be a lot more expensive than the surrounding communities, but it shouldn't be that hard to find a place if you really want to live there. Check Craigslist and other online apartment/home rental listings. Also, if you want an easier way, use Housing Helpers, a broker agency. I haven't had any trouble finding apartments over the last two years. It seems there are always open places if you're willing to pay the extra price to live in Boulder.

MumofCad
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby MumofCad » Tue Jul 26, 2011 10:06 am

Do you agree with the previous posters regarding BigLaw prospects coming from CU ITE?

I'd love to get a government position - maybe State AG's background and trying to decide whether it makes sense to build contacts by going local or better to just attend HYS. HYS grads seem to be mixed, with most only experiencing the biglaw job hunt and not gov't feeling like there aren't alot of options in Colorado firms for them. Is it just hard-going all around? A few advised I'd be better off going to DU or CU and landing in the top 10% versus going to HYS not knowing where I might land, and being out of contention if I land in the bottom quarter of the class. Curious how it looks from your perspective.

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LeDique
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Re: Colorado 1L taking Questions!

Postby LeDique » Tue Jul 26, 2011 10:50 am

MumofCad wrote:Do you agree with the previous posters regarding BigLaw prospects coming from CU ITE?

I'd love to get a government position - maybe State AG's background and trying to decide whether it makes sense to build contacts by going local or better to just attend HYS. HYS grads seem to be mixed, with most only experiencing the biglaw job hunt and not gov't feeling like there aren't alot of options in Colorado firms for them. Is it just hard-going all around? A few advised I'd be better off going to DU or CU and landing in the top 10% versus going to HYS not knowing where I might land, and being out of contention if I land in the bottom quarter of the class. Curious how it looks from your perspective.


You don't know where you'll land at a CU either.




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