UVA Law Students Taking Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
albanach
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby albanach » Wed Jan 15, 2014 12:10 am

Or, as jawsthegreat put it so eloquently:

jawsthegreat wrote:Friends don't let friends take PR w/ Cohen.

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t14splitter
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby t14splitter » Wed Jan 15, 2014 12:11 am

Can anyone give an overview (or point me to somewhere within this thread or in another one) of the OCI process and the success of students within it?

Specifically, what percentile would get students into what types of firms?
What cities are easier/harder to break into?
What cities do students get the most offers in?
Anything else you think is worth noting?

I have some ties to Boston, Chicago, D.C., and Charlotte. I would like to avoid NYC if at all possible.

Thanks in advance for your answers! I hope that all of your grades are turning out well.

sprezz
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby sprezz » Wed Jan 15, 2014 1:19 am

i imagine someone will say something along the lines of "people get jobs everywhere! at different grade points!" and they're not wrong

student success (esp. outside NYC/DC markets) is idiosyncratic; to the extent that you have ties to non-NYC/DC areas, you will maximize them by pimping them during the back half of the summer preceding OGI, not by waiting until OGI to snipe them. this means your first summer job will dictate where your networking will be most effective or at least easiest to navigate [see also this].

OGI is a separate prong of getyoassemployed; it's a different game than the tie-pimping one. your grades/ties/personality! will dictate what your appropriate OGI strategy is to max the odds you hit a BIGLAW job via OGI. way too many permutations to give generic overview. i think it's safe to say that if your grades are not omgstellar you will probably be throwing some bids to NYC unless your risk tolerance borders on irrational. this is basically true across the t14 board on the geographic preference part, even where it seems counterintuitive, like the chicago law schools or georgetown. i am a card carrying member of the unabashedly irrational geographic preference camp, so this is based on some years of reading boards like this for this sole purpose.

there are enough opportunities between boston/chicago/dc/charlotte at uva OGI to bid those four markets at the exclusion of any bids to NYC. but it's a very risky game (i say "very risky" instead of "dumb" only because i try to refrain from calling myself "dumb" outside of parentheticals). callbacks in those markets tend to be worse bets at conversion because of the smaller class sizes; etc etc other reasons this complicates things, check the legal employment forum.

tldr "it can work, hell personally i think uva's the best bet for non-NYC geographic preference flexibility in the t14, but just know up front OGI is less of a silver bullet for geographic preference than it is for just-cop-dat-$160k." worked out fine for me, anyway. hth

desertlaw
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby desertlaw » Wed Jan 15, 2014 1:21 am

t14splitter wrote:Can anyone give an overview (or point me to somewhere within this thread or in another one) of the OCI process and the success of students within it?

Specifically, what percentile would get students into what types of firms?
What cities are easier/harder to break into?
What cities do students get the most offers in?
Anything else you think is worth noting?

I have some ties to Boston, Chicago, D.C., and Charlotte. I would like to avoid NYC if at all possible.

Thanks in advance for your answers! I hope that all of your grades are turning out well.


Dude, there are so many threads out there. Use the search function; learning how to search for things is like 80% of a junior associate's job in biglaw. Go to the UVa OGI thread.

Cities that are hard to get into = those you have no ties to; those that everyone wants to go to (D.C.) relative to the amount of spots open.

Most offers? NYC and DC from UVa probably.

Anything else worth noting? Yes, there are probably hundreds of pages here on TLS, especially for UVa, that give OGI advice. You can find them, I have faith in you.

Best advice is to choose 1 or 2 markets for OGI and bid/interview on those.

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t14splitter
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby t14splitter » Wed Jan 15, 2014 2:50 am

sprezz wrote:i imagine someone will say something along the lines of "people get jobs everywhere! at different grade points!" and they're not wrong

student success (esp. outside NYC/DC markets) is idiosyncratic; to the extent that you have ties to non-NYC/DC areas, you will maximize them by pimping them during the back half of the summer preceding OGI, not by waiting until OGI to snipe them. this means your first summer job will dictate where your networking will be most effective or at least easiest to navigate [see also this].

OGI is a separate prong of getyoassemployed; it's a different game than the tie-pimping one. your grades/ties/personality! will dictate what your appropriate OGI strategy is to max the odds you hit a BIGLAW job via OGI. way too many permutations to give generic overview. i think it's safe to say that if your grades are not omgstellar you will probably be throwing some bids to NYC unless your risk tolerance borders on irrational. this is basically true across the t14 board on the geographic preference part, even where it seems counterintuitive, like the chicago law schools or georgetown. i am a card carrying member of the unabashedly irrational geographic preference camp, so this is based on some years of reading boards like this for this sole purpose.

there are enough opportunities between boston/chicago/dc/charlotte at uva OGI to bid those four markets at the exclusion of any bids to NYC. but it's a very risky game (i say "very risky" instead of "dumb" only because i try to refrain from calling myself "dumb" outside of parentheticals). callbacks in those markets tend to be worse bets at conversion because of the smaller class sizes; etc etc other reasons this complicates things, check the legal employment forum.

tldr "it can work, hell personally i think uva's the best bet for non-NYC geographic preference flexibility in the t14, but just know up front OGI is less of a silver bullet for geographic preference than it is for just-cop-dat-$160k." worked out fine for me, anyway. hth


desertlaw wrote:
t14splitter wrote:Can anyone give an overview (or point me to somewhere within this thread or in another one) of the OCI process and the success of students within it?

Specifically, what percentile would get students into what types of firms?
What cities are easier/harder to break into?
What cities do students get the most offers in?
Anything else you think is worth noting?

I have some ties to Boston, Chicago, D.C., and Charlotte. I would like to avoid NYC if at all possible.

Thanks in advance for your answers! I hope that all of your grades are turning out well.


Dude, there are so many threads out there. Use the search function; learning how to search for things is like 80% of a junior associate's job in biglaw. Go to the UVa OGI thread.

Cities that are hard to get into = those you have no ties to; those that everyone wants to go to (D.C.) relative to the amount of spots open.

Most offers? NYC and DC from UVa probably.

Anything else worth noting? Yes, there are probably hundreds of pages here on TLS, especially for UVa, that give OGI advice. You can find them, I have faith in you.

Best advice is to choose 1 or 2 markets for OGI and bid/interview on those.



Thanks for the advice!

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North
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby North » Wed Jan 15, 2014 1:39 pm

What are the chances of me getting a spot in Mitchell's Evidence if I'm at #24 on the waitlist?

:|

albanach
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby albanach » Wed Jan 15, 2014 1:51 pm

North wrote:What are the chances of me getting a spot in Mitchell's Evidence if I'm at #24 on the waitlist?

:|


Very, very slim. The class already has 125 in it. Given there are two other evidence classes next semester, it's hard to argue the need for you to be in his section. I wouldn't many to drop evidence since almost everyone takes it at some point, and there's no way a fifth of the class are going to drop in the first week.

If you had a really good reason for why you cannot take either of the other sections and why you can't take it next semester - say you're a 3L and both other sections conflict with year long clinic classes, then you should go ask him directly.

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North
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby North » Wed Jan 15, 2014 1:53 pm

albanach wrote:
North wrote:What are the chances of me getting a spot in Mitchell's Evidence if I'm at #24 on the waitlist?

:|


Very, very slim. The class already has 125 in it. Given there are two other evidence classes next semester, it's hard to argue the need for you to be in his section. I wouldn't many to drop evidence since almost everyone takes it at some point, and there's no way a fifth of the class are going to drop in the first week.

If you had a really good reason for why you cannot take either of the other sections and why you can't take it next semester - say you're a 3L and both other sections conflict with year long clinic classes, then you should go ask him directly.

I'm guessing a strong preference for sleeping in every day instead of taking Brown's Evidence at 8:30 won't cut it then.

:cry:

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thesealocust
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby thesealocust » Wed Jan 15, 2014 2:51 pm

albanach wrote:Or, as jawsthegreat put it so eloquently:

jawsthegreat wrote:Friends don't let friends take PR w/ Cohen.


When the nightmare about having to take a final exam for a course that you never attended goes to sleep, it dreams about Cohen exams.

olive16
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby olive16 » Wed Jan 15, 2014 7:28 pm

Are all grades due the 21st?

albanach
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby albanach » Wed Jan 15, 2014 7:41 pm

olive16 wrote:Are all grades due the 21st?


According to the January 3rd email from Student Records, yes. Bear in mind that it can take 2-3 days for grades to make it to SIS after they are submitted by your professor to the SRO.

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BammBamm
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby BammBamm » Wed Jan 15, 2014 8:14 pm

albanach wrote:
olive16 wrote:Are all grades due the 21st?


According to the January 3rd email from Student Records, yes. Bear in mind that it can take 2-3 days for grades to make it to SIS after they are submitted by your professor to the SRO.

What about the people in this thread last year who reported getting grades back in February? Was this Jan 21st(ish) deadline just not in place last year or was it just ignored by profs?
Last edited by BammBamm on Wed Jan 15, 2014 8:18 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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5ky
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby 5ky » Wed Jan 15, 2014 8:16 pm

BammBamm wrote:
albanach wrote:
olive16 wrote:Are all grades due the 21st?


According to the January 3rd email from Student Records, yes. Bear in mind that it can take 2-3 days for grades to make it to SIS after they are submitted by your professor to the SRO.

What about the people in this thread last year who reported getting grades back in February? Was this Jan 21st(ish) deadline just not in place last year or was it just ignored by profs?


Last year 1L grades were due 1/21 and all others were due 1/31 or 2/1.

Also, they say that it takes 2-3 days for grades to make it to SIS after submission, but in my experience 90%+ of grades are in by 7pm on deadline day.

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BammBamm
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby BammBamm » Wed Jan 15, 2014 8:25 pm

5ky wrote:
BammBamm wrote:
albanach wrote:
olive16 wrote:Are all grades due the 21st?


According to the January 3rd email from Student Records, yes. Bear in mind that it can take 2-3 days for grades to make it to SIS after they are submitted by your professor to the SRO.

What about the people in this thread last year who reported getting grades back in February? Was this Jan 21st(ish) deadline just not in place last year or was it just ignored by profs?


Last year 1L grades were due 1/21 and all others were due 1/31 or 2/1.

Also, they say that it takes 2-3 days for grades to make it to SIS after submission, but in my experience 90%+ of grades are in by 7pm on deadline day.

Thanks. They must have been 2Ls or 3Ls then.

olive16
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby olive16 » Thu Jan 16, 2014 12:10 pm

For 2Ls and 3Ls who know, is it possible to get higher than a B+ in a seminar?

sprezz
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby sprezz » Thu Jan 16, 2014 12:50 pm

sure.

but seriously, yes. someone on this board last year looked at the books before they were removed and reported that all classes with 5+ people in them had some semblance of a curve (so not all b+)

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5ky
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby 5ky » Thu Jan 16, 2014 2:55 pm

Yes, and with the new GPA rules now, it should be even easier. I took a seminar back in Spring of 2012, before the change, and the mean grade from the class was like a 3.47. Over half the people got above a B+

Woods
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby Woods » Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:50 pm

What's the difference between a 3.40 and 3.48 GPA for a 1L now?

albanach
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby albanach » Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:00 pm

Woods wrote:What's the difference between a 3.40 and 3.48 GPA for a 1L now?


3.40 is good. 3.48 isn't law review but should place you very nicely for OGI. Career services will provide a breakdown of bidding targets based on GPA that includes a section for 3.5+ obviously those are much less of a reach at 3.48.

Of course you need to repeat it next semester.

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Br3v
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby Br3v » Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:09 pm

Does how many credits you have make a difference for anything? As in, is a 2L with a 4.0 (48 credits) any different from a 4.0 (45 credits) for things like LR, OCI, or other things that matter school wise?

(P.S. I made up the credit amounts, but assume both students are on track to graduate with the correct number of credits)

daleearnhardt123
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby daleearnhardt123 » Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:14 pm

Br3v wrote:Does how many credits you have make a difference for anything? As in, is a 2L with a 4.0 (48 credits) any different from a 4.0 (45 credits) for things like LR, OCI, or other things that matter school wise?

(P.S. I made up the credit amounts, but assume both students are on track to graduate with the correct number of credits)


LR doesn't care how many credits you have. As such, I know some people in my 1L year who did particularly well in the fall, and then before add/drop ended in the spring, they adjusted their credit-load down to 13 (including LRW) to protect against grade drops.

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5ky
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby 5ky » Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:22 pm

Br3v wrote:Does how many credits you have make a difference for anything? As in, is a 2L with a 4.0 (48 credits) any different from a 4.0 (45 credits) for things like LR, OCI, or other things that matter school wise?

(P.S. I made up the credit amounts, but assume both students are on track to graduate with the correct number of credits)


No difference. Your goal should be to get through law school with the bare minimum of credits.

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UVAIce
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby UVAIce » Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:24 pm

The above advice is credited. I kick myself everyday for taking 14 credits last semester.

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Br3v
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby Br3v » Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:28 pm

Thank you for the advice guys

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danitt
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby danitt » Thu Jan 16, 2014 10:30 pm

Does J term count for GPA?




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