UVA Law Students Taking Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
albanach
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby albanach » Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:01 pm

WhiteyCakes wrote:
thesealocust wrote:
Br3v wrote:Also, can 2L's and 3L's get Va residency?


For tuition? 99.9% no. If you were close to getting it as a 1L year, married, etc. it might not be impossible, but it's very much non-standard.


This doesn't seem right. According to http://www.top-law-schools.com/law-scho ... dency.html , you need to reside in VA for 12 months prior to the first day of classes for that year, have a VA driver's license, pay VA income taxes. That means you need to move down by July of your 1L year, get a license, and file your income taxes in VA that year. Not impossible for 2L/3L


That's not quite correct. You need to be domiciled in Virginia and have relinquished any prior domicile. That's quite different to living here for a year.

VA Code states explicitly: "Domiciliary status shall not ordinarily be conferred by the performance of acts which are auxiliary to fulfilling educational objectives or are required or routinely performed by temporary residents of the Commonwealth. Mere physical presence or residence primarily for educational purposes shall not confer domiciliary status. A matriculating student who has entered an institution and is classified as an out-of-state student shall be required to rebut by clear and convincing evidence the presumption that he is in the Commonwealth for the purpose of attending school and not as a bona fide domiciliary. "

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WhiteyCakes
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby WhiteyCakes » Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:05 pm

albanach wrote:
WhiteyCakes wrote:
thesealocust wrote:
Br3v wrote:Also, can 2L's and 3L's get Va residency?


For tuition? 99.9% no. If you were close to getting it as a 1L year, married, etc. it might not be impossible, but it's very much non-standard.


This doesn't seem right. According to http://www.top-law-schools.com/law-scho ... dency.html , you need to reside in VA for 12 months prior to the first day of classes for that year, have a VA driver's license, pay VA income taxes. That means you need to move down by July of your 1L year, get a license, and file your income taxes in VA that year. Not impossible for 2L/3L


That's not quite correct. You need to be domiciled in Virginia and have relinquished any prior domicile. That's quite different to living here for a year.

VA Code states explicitly: "Domiciliary status shall not ordinarily be conferred by the performance of acts which are auxiliary to fulfilling educational objectives or are required or routinely performed by temporary residents of the Commonwealth. Mere physical presence or residence primarily for educational purposes shall not confer domiciliary status. A matriculating student who has entered an institution and is classified as an out-of-state student shall be required to rebut by clear and convincing evidence the presumption that he is in the Commonwealth for the purpose of attending school and not as a bona fide domiciliary. "


Would filing taxes in VA and having a VA license help?

albanach
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby albanach » Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:14 pm

WhiteyCakes wrote:
Would filing taxes in VA and having a VA license help?


I'd think it unlikely. If you bought a house it might help. It would help a lot more if you were married and your spouse had a permanent job in the state or if you have a post-graduation job offer from an in-state employer.

Here's the code section http://leg1.state.va.us/000/cod/23-7.4.HTM

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Br3v
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby Br3v » Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:16 pm

albanach wrote:
WhiteyCakes wrote:
Would filing taxes in VA and having a VA license help?


I'd think it unlikely. If you bought a house it might help. It would help a lot more if you were married and your spouse had a permanent job in the state or if you have a post-graduation job offer from an in-state employer.

Here's the code section http://leg1.state.va.us/000/cod/23-7.4.HTM


What do you mean by "help"? Is each person on a case by case basis and individually reviewed by someone?

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5ky
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby 5ky » Fri Nov 30, 2012 11:14 pm

Br3v wrote:
albanach wrote:
WhiteyCakes wrote:
Would filing taxes in VA and having a VA license help?


I'd think it unlikely. If you bought a house it might help. It would help a lot more if you were married and your spouse had a permanent job in the state or if you have a post-graduation job offer from an in-state employer.

Here's the code section http://leg1.state.va.us/000/cod/23-7.4.HTM


What do you mean by "help"? Is each person on a case by case basis and individually reviewed by someone?


Anyone can fill out an application for in-state tuition if they want, so sure, that would be reviewed.

But just about every UVA student who has responded telling you that it is not going to happen -- if it were as easy as paying taxes and getting a VA driver's license, nobody would pay the extra 10k for 2L and 3L combined.

You can read the code albanach posted, and also look here:
Section 05. Residence for educational purposes.

A. Mere physical presence or residence primarily for educational purposes will not confer domiciliary status. For example, a student who moves to Virginia for the primary purposes of becoming a full-time student is not a Virginia domiciliary, even if the student has been in Virginia for the required one-year period.


Again, the problem is that (1) living in VA for educational purposes won't meet the requirement of living in Virginia for one year (you need to live in VA one year PRIOR to starting at school), and (2) it would be difficult to meet the intent to stay aspect.

As albanach says, might be possible if you have a permanent job offer letter in VA to show them, but you wouldn't have that until after your second year. It might be a little easier if you're married and your spouse has a job in Virginia, as others have pointed out. But that's really irrelevant to your owning a VA driver's license, etc.

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BruceWayne
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby BruceWayne » Sun Dec 02, 2012 2:54 pm

thesealocust wrote:
Hoocheez wrote:
albanach wrote:
ChampagnePapi wrote:Are there any numbers for how OCI went last year? % of participants who got offers? Seems like CLS and Chi have leaked these but they are hard to get for any other T14


BruceWayne gave the official report on top-law-schools.com, perhaps you missed it?

Unfortunately no one received offers this year or last. Unless you're offered a full scholarship to HYS, law school will be harmful to your future prospects. Don't go.



At face value, this is absolute bs. Fear-mongering at its best. Sad to see such idiocy finding its way into our top law school's classrooms.


albanach was being facetious and trying to make a joke at BruceWayne's expense. BruceWayne has a reputation, deserved or otherwise, for taking a dim view on the legal hiring market relative to TLS conventional wisdom.


I mean the only "view" I take on it is the view given by the GPA hiring chart that the school gives to students. The thing is a lot of people like to turn a blind eye to the real data because it doesn't coincide with what they want to believe. I can,to a point, empathize with that. But sticking your head in the sand doesn't change the facts. I also personally believe that in the past law schools did a disservice by inflating job prospects. And to me, current students acting like things are better than they are when they are asked is no different from that.

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Rahviveh
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby Rahviveh » Sun Dec 02, 2012 3:16 pm

BruceWayne wrote:
I mean the only "view" I take on it is the view given by the GPA hiring chart that the school gives to students. The thing is a lot of people like to turn a blinid eye to the real data because it doesn't coincide with what they want to believe. I can,to a point, empathize with that. But sticking your head in the sand doesn't change the facts. I also personally believe that in the past law schools did a disservice by inflating job prospects. And to me, current students acting like things are better than they are when they are asked is no different from that.


So are the oci results for last year available to students? Would be nice to know how it went

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chem
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby chem » Sun Dec 02, 2012 3:23 pm

ChampagnePapi wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:
I mean the only "view" I take on it is the view given by the GPA hiring chart that the school gives to students. The thing is a lot of people like to turn a blinid eye to the real data because it doesn't coincide with what they want to believe. I can,to a point, empathize with that. But sticking your head in the sand doesn't change the facts. I also personally believe that in the past law schools did a disservice by inflating job prospects. And to me, current students acting like things are better than they are when they are asked is no different from that.


So are the oci results for last year available to students? Would be nice to know how it went


They are. Just ask Steve Hopson.

005618502
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby 005618502 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 3:58 pm

chem wrote:
ChampagnePapi wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:
I mean the only "view" I take on it is the view given by the GPA hiring chart that the school gives to students. The thing is a lot of people like to turn a blinid eye to the real data because it doesn't coincide with what they want to believe. I can,to a point, empathize with that. But sticking your head in the sand doesn't change the facts. I also personally believe that in the past law schools did a disservice by inflating job prospects. And to me, current students acting like things are better than they are when they are asked is no different from that.


So are the oci results for last year available to students? Would be nice to know how it went


They are. Just ask Steve Hopson.


He told me we have 3L(s) who got market paying offers in NYC and DC with a 3.0 he didnt give names or how many exactly, but that is definitely good to know all is not lost if you dont do well.

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YCrevolution
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby YCrevolution » Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:08 pm

..

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BruceWayne
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby BruceWayne » Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:50 pm

AssumptionRequired wrote:
chem wrote:
ChampagnePapi wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:
I mean the only "view" I take on it is the view given by the GPA hiring chart that the school gives to students. The thing is a lot of people like to turn a blinid eye to the real data because it doesn't coincide with what they want to believe. I can,to a point, empathize with that. But sticking your head in the sand doesn't change the facts. I also personally believe that in the past law schools did a disservice by inflating job prospects. And to me, current students acting like things are better than they are when they are asked is no different from that.


So are the oci results for last year available to students? Would be nice to know how it went


They are. Just ask Steve Hopson.


He told me we have 3L(s) who got market paying offers in NYC and DC with a 3.0 he didnt give names or how many exactly, but that is definitely good to know all is not lost if you dont do well.


Congrats to those people. But that old saying about the exception to the rule is an understatement when it comes to landing biglaw with a 3.0. Most of the people below a 3.3 don't land biglaw--let alone those with a 3.0.

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dailygrind
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby dailygrind » Sun Dec 02, 2012 9:05 pm

Way to set the tone on the eve of finals, man.

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BruceWayne
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby BruceWayne » Mon Dec 03, 2012 5:49 pm

dailygrind wrote:Way to set the tone on the eve of finals, man.


Hell if anything it's exactly what they need to hear in case they're considering slacking or are wondering if they should put in that extra bit of effort.

paulinaporizkova
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby paulinaporizkova » Mon Dec 03, 2012 6:00 pm

BruceWayne wrote:
dailygrind wrote:Way to set the tone on the eve of finals, man.


Hell if anything it's exactly what they need to hear in case they're considering slacking or are wondering if they should put in that extra bit of effort.


Image

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BruceWayne
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby BruceWayne » Mon Dec 03, 2012 11:28 pm

paulinaporizkova wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:
dailygrind wrote:Way to set the tone on the eve of finals, man.


Hell if anything it's exactly what they need to hear in case they're considering slacking or are wondering if they should put in that extra bit of effort.


Image


This blind eye attitude that people with 3.3+ GPAs have really hurts a lot of people. I remember when I had PA's like you who really gave A LOT of kids the wrong impression who are on their way to school funded "fellowships" as we speak. Our whole fake "laid" back persona is one of the worst things about the school. It's definitely an attribute that other top 14s don't have that I wish we didn't either. "No one gets below a 3.3 bro unless they didn't show up for exams! Don't worry about it" "Hey wanna go max bench 135 at North grounds before the softball tournament?!" lol

Image

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Rahviveh
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby Rahviveh » Tue Dec 04, 2012 1:01 pm

BruceWayne wrote:
paulinaporizkova wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:
dailygrind wrote:Way to set the tone on the eve of finals, man.


Hell if anything it's exactly what they need to hear in case they're considering slacking or are wondering if they should put in that extra bit of effort.


Image


This blind eye attitude that people with 3.3+ GPAs have really hurts a lot of people. I remember when I had PA's like you who really gave A LOT of kids the wrong impression who are on their way to school funded "fellowships" as we speak. Our whole fake "laid" back persona is one of the worst things about the school. It's definitely an attribute that other top 14s don't have that I wish we didn't either. "No one gets below a 3.3 bro unless they didn't show up for exams! Don't worry about it" "Hey wanna go max bench 135 at North grounds before the softball tournament?!" lol

Image


I got this vibe at ASW too (more than any other school) and it was kind of a turnoff tbh. Not saying that ASW is reflective of the school as a whole, just an observation.

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pjo
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby pjo » Tue Dec 04, 2012 4:30 pm

Lol at max benching 135.


Also, I really don't think the whole "laid-back" thing is limited to UVA. It depends what you're talking about though. There's more bros at UVA than at other schools (which IMO can be annoying in it's own right), and we have some things that I guess you could consider part of a "laid-back culture" like the Thursday Keg and Feb Club, but what Bruce Wayne is talking about is, I think, more indicative of being a 3L (or probably 2L even) with a job, no matter what school you're at. It's just REALLY hard to try as hard as you do as a 1L once you have a job lined up. I was talking to my 3L friend at Penn the other day, and he was harassing me because I have class on Mondays and Fridays and he set up his schedule so he doesn't. He has a job, so he hardly goes to class. He knows in a year he'll be busting his ass, so he's just taking it easy. 1Ls shouldn't look at what 3Ls (or even 2Ls) are doing and think they can or should do the same. You have to pay your dues as a 1L, just like those 2Ls and 3Ls did. I don't think the 3Ls/2Ls "laid-back nature" should be taken as "don't worry, everyone gets a B+" so much as "I'm not worried, because my grades don't matter because I have a job". That's how I viewed it as a 1L at least.

paulinaporizkova
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby paulinaporizkova » Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:18 pm

On that note, anyone know if Morley actually fails people in his classes? Looks like I'm headed in that direction.

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plenipotentiary
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby plenipotentiary » Tue Dec 04, 2012 10:32 pm

paulinaporizkova wrote:On that note, anyone know if Morley actually fails people in his classes? Looks like I'm headed in that direction.


Same, and I have two classes with him.

egt2103
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby egt2103 » Thu Dec 06, 2012 1:30 pm

Does anyone have a clue how to structure/organize an Abraham torts exam?

Are we just going for the style he uses in his book? socially organizing policy weighing for and against w/e random question at hand?

Help?

paulinaporizkova
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby paulinaporizkova » Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:48 pm

egt2103 wrote:Does anyone have a clue how to structure/organize an Abraham torts exam?

Are we just going for the style he uses in his book? socially organizing policy weighing for and against w/e random question at hand?

Help?


Congrats on your forthcoming Abraham B+

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NoodleyOne
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby NoodleyOne » Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:43 am

So how much is the rent at the apartment complexes/houses near the law school?

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defdef
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby defdef » Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:15 am

NoodleyOne wrote:So how much is the rent at the apartment complexes/houses near the law school?


+1 and is copeley hill actually a nice area, specifically for families?

edit: found earlier info in this thread about copeley hill, for interested parties viewtopic.php?f=4&t=86231&p=4919525&hilit=copeley+hill#p4919525

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WhiteyCakes
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby WhiteyCakes » Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:29 am

defdef wrote:
NoodleyOne wrote:So how much is the rent at the apartment complexes/houses near the law school?


+1 and is copeley hill actually a nice area, specifically for families?

edit: found earlier info in this thread about copeley hill, for interested parties viewtopic.php?f=4&t=86231&p=4919525&hilit=copeley+hill#p4919525


As someone with kids, this is an awesome post! Thank you!

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jawsthegreat
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Re: UVA Law Students Taking Questions

Postby jawsthegreat » Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:02 pm

BruceWayne wrote:
paulinaporizkova wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:
dailygrind wrote:Way to set the tone on the eve of finals, man.


Hell if anything it's exactly what they need to hear in case they're considering slacking or are wondering if they should put in that extra bit of effort.


Image


This blind eye attitude that people with 3.3+ GPAs have really hurts a lot of people. I remember when I had PA's like you who really gave A LOT of kids the wrong impression who are on their way to school funded "fellowships" as we speak. Our whole fake "laid" back persona is one of the worst things about the school. It's definitely an attribute that other top 14s don't have that I wish we didn't either. "No one gets below a 3.3 bro unless they didn't show up for exams! Don't worry about it" "Hey wanna go max bench 135 at North grounds before the softball tournament?!" lol

Image


Everyone in law school is an adult. If you didn't try as hard as you could because "your PA told it'd be okay" you have nobody to blame but yourself.




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