UVA Law Students Taking Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
socraticmethodman
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby socraticmethodman » Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:43 pm

I apologize if this has been discussed already, but do we know the grades/class rank of the people making these shirts, rejection letter buildings, etc? Are they students above median, below median, etc?

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RVP11
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby RVP11 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:12 pm

quakeroats wrote:This makes three negative stories in as many weeks on ATL. What is going on at UVA?


Hint: the same guy keeps submitting "stories."

Also, the papier mache law school is just hilarious. How is that a negative story? There are people who did very, very well overall who still have a lot of rejection letters.
Last edited by RVP11 on Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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RVP11
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby RVP11 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:15 pm

socraticmethodman wrote:I apologize if this has been discussed already, but do we know the grades/class rank of the people making these shirts, rejection letter buildings, etc? Are they students above median, below median, etc?


Some are above, some are below. There are people with 3.0s and 3.1s who have the job of their dreams and people with 3.5s who don't have any legal job. No reason to be so hung up on this.

Brock2010
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby Brock2010 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:16 pm

Sooo....do you need a car to get around at uva law?

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quakeroats
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby quakeroats » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:26 pm

vamedic03 wrote:(3) So why do you keep posting in here?


I'm not sure. Perhaps it's compassion for students at my second-favorite public school.

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vamedic03
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby vamedic03 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:28 pm

Brock2010 wrote:Sooo....do you need a car to get around at uva law?


Maybe... It depends on where you live - I know plenty of people who live on Arlington who don't have cars. From there you can walk to the grocery store (across the street) and the law school (up the hill). Other places (i.e., not Arlington or Ivy Gardens), you really have to have a car.

A lot of it depends on what you are used to - if you already have a car, then I would highly recommend bringing it. If you don't already have one, then you can pretty easily manage without one (at least for 1L year).

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jcunni5
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby jcunni5 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:37 pm

Brock2010 wrote:Sooo....do you need a car to get around at uva law?


The thing about cville is that if you want a car it can definitely come in handy and it is easy to have one, but if you don't want to bring a car, you really don't have to. Cabs are cheap, there is some public transit, and most necessities (grocery stores, restaurants, bars) are a about a mile or less from me (ivy). I have a car but i will usually walk most places unless i'm splitting a cab to go the corner on the wk end or bar review or when i get groceries .

omg
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby omg » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:44 pm

The last two posters no doubt mean what they say, but there is a major difference of opinion about this among UVA students that shouldn't go unmentioned. I personally can't imagine getting around Charlottesville without a car, even if you live near the law school, and I know that lots of other people feel the same way (including people I know who started at Ivy without a car and found it way too difficult). All in all, it's definitely a personal choice, but if you feel at all uncomfortable about not bringing a car, I would recommend going with that gut feeling. (Also, both of the above posters do have cars, haha.)

Brock2010
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby Brock2010 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:47 pm

alright thanks for the advice. well...i don't have a car so i'd have to buy/lease one. i haven't gotten housing yet so i don't know where i'll be. should i look for housing assuming that i won't have a car next year? do kids ever share/split leases on cars?

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vamedic03
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby vamedic03 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:49 pm

omg wrote:The last two posters no doubt mean what they say, but there is a major difference of opinion about this among UVA students that shouldn't go unmentioned. I personally can't imagine getting around Charlottesville without a car, even if you live near the law school, and I know that lots of other people feel the same way (including people I know who started at Ivy without a car and found it way too difficult). All in all, it's definitely a personal choice, but if you feel at all uncomfortable about not bringing a car, I would recommend going with that gut feeling. (Also, both of the above posters do have cars, haha.)


I guess we need Cavalier to chime in as a non-car owner.

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arism87
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby arism87 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:57 pm

Brock2010 wrote:alright thanks for the advice. well...i don't have a car so i'd have to buy/lease one. i haven't gotten housing yet so i don't know where i'll be. should i look for housing assuming that i won't have a car next year? do kids ever share/split leases on cars?


I lived in Cville without a car for a year and with one for three- in your situation, I would probably find close housing and go without the car, but leave room in your budget in case you find yourself wanting one. I hated not having a car.

Brock2010
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby Brock2010 » Mon Apr 04, 2011 11:04 pm

arism87 wrote:
Brock2010 wrote:alright thanks for the advice. well...i don't have a car so i'd have to buy/lease one. i haven't gotten housing yet so i don't know where i'll be. should i look for housing assuming that i won't have a car next year? do kids ever share/split leases on cars?


I lived in Cville without a car for a year and with one for three- in your situation, I would probably find close housing and go without the car, but leave room in your budget in case you find yourself wanting one. I hated not having a car.


alright thanks. from what you told me before i would have some room in the student allowance for a car. i'll prob. finalize my housing and then figure out the car situation.

Watson
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby Watson » Tue Apr 05, 2011 12:10 am

Dude, your bars close at 2am. That made my 3-day bender this past weekend that much harder. Wtf gives?

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sundance95
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby sundance95 » Tue Apr 05, 2011 2:42 am

2Ls: Can any of you share some recommended second semester 1L courses for someone interested in lit and looking to maximize GPA?

plum
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby plum » Tue Apr 05, 2011 4:03 am

RVP11 wrote:people with 3.5s who don't have any legal job.


:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:
i think that makes a big difference. it's one thing if the protestors were all bottom of the barrell, but if top 1/3rd folks at a T10 are unemployed then rioting in the streets is TCR.

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Cavalier
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby Cavalier » Tue Apr 05, 2011 7:01 am

Brock2010 wrote:Sooo....do you need a car to get around at uva law?

Depends on whether you're OK with being constrained to a small area in Charlottesville. You almost certainly need to live on Arlington. If you do, you'll be close to the law school and the Barracks shopping center, which can take care of most of your needs. The Corner isn't that far away either--it's a 20 minute walk or a cheap cab ride. Personally, I don't really go anywhere else, so I'm fine without a car, but I'm sure some people can't handle the same set of stores and restaurants for three years.

sundance95 wrote:2Ls: Can any of you share some recommended second semester 1L courses for someone interested in lit and looking to maximize GPA?

It's way too early to be thinking about this. UVA posts the grade distributions of every class, so you can see for yourself which professors give a lot of high grades. A lot also depends on the professor's grading style; you won't know what grading styles are best for you until after fall semester.


plum wrote:
RVP11 wrote:people with 3.5s who don't have any legal job.

:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:
i think that makes a big difference. it's one thing if the protestors were all bottom of the barrell, but if top 1/3rd folks at a T10 are unemployed then rioting in the streets is TCR.

People think that grades are everything. They're not. While grades are the most important factor, location, interviewing ability, and work experience are all important too. In general, I think if someone in the top third is a decent interviewer and targets the right market (i.e. New York, and not DC), they don't have much to worry about.

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icouldbuyu
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby icouldbuyu » Tue Apr 05, 2011 7:27 am

plum wrote:
RVP11 wrote:people with 3.5s who don't have any legal job.

:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:
i think that makes a big difference. it's one thing if the protestors were all bottom of the barrell, but if top 1/3rd folks at a T10 are unemployed then rioting in the streets is TCR.

People think that grades are everything. They're not. While grades are the most important factor, location, interviewing ability, and work experience are all important too. In general, I think if someone in the top third is a decent interviewer and targets the right market (i.e. New York, and not DC), they don't have much to worry about.[/quote]

Would you say the same is true about UVA's peer schools?

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jcunni5
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby jcunni5 » Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:01 am

i dont want to derail the thread but is there anyone who knows whether it's a good idea or bad idea to bid on the same journals for the 2nd round or just go for the easiest journals

paulinaporizkova
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby paulinaporizkova » Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:15 am

Cavalier wrote:People think that grades are everything. They're not. While grades are the most important factor, location, interviewing ability, and work experience are all important too. In general, I think if someone in the top third is a decent interviewer and targets the right market (i.e. New York, and not DC), they don't have much to worry about.


so, median or below i should just abandon my dreams of NYC biglaw and go back to hometown market Minneapolis? (where I grew up/currently live)

(this is actually a q BTW)

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RVP11
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby RVP11 » Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:25 am

paulinaporizkova wrote:
Cavalier wrote:People think that grades are everything. They're not. While grades are the most important factor, location, interviewing ability, and work experience are all important too. In general, I think if someone in the top third is a decent interviewer and targets the right market (i.e. New York, and not DC), they don't have much to worry about.


so, median or below i should just abandon my dreams of NYC biglaw and go back to hometown market Minneapolis? (where I grew up/currently live)

(this is actually a q BTW)


Cavalier didn't imply that. NY is an easy (the easiest?) market. Generally, if you can't get a big firm there, you can't get one anywhere.

Median and below = don't bid DC, don't bid competitive non-DC firms, do bid on NY, do bid on markets you have have ties to (so, Minneapolis).

Basically you have to bid on one of NY, DC, or CA just to fill up your bid list. If your grades end up low then it should be NY.

paulinaporizkova
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby paulinaporizkova » Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:31 am

RVP11 wrote:
paulinaporizkova wrote:
Cavalier wrote:People think that grades are everything. They're not. While grades are the most important factor, location, interviewing ability, and work experience are all important too. In general, I think if someone in the top third is a decent interviewer and targets the right market (i.e. New York, and not DC), they don't have much to worry about.


so, median or below i should just abandon my dreams of NYC biglaw and go back to hometown market Minneapolis? (where I grew up/currently live)

(this is actually a q BTW)


Cavalier didn't imply that. NY is an easy (the easiest?) market. Generally, if you can't get a big firm there, you can't get one anywhere.

Median and below = don't bid DC, don't bid competitive non-DC firms, do bid on NY, do bid on markets you have have ties to (so, Minneapolis).

Basically you have to bid on one of NY, DC, or CA just to fill up your bid list. If your grades end up low then it should be NY.


i know he didn't imply that - i was really commenting on TLS's conventional advice that you can get a NYC firm job if you are at median or above but anything below that (barring exceptions for connections, great interviewing skills, etc.) and enjoy doc review. there seems to be no middle ground, so i'm currently in search of whether or not that's actually true

omg
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby omg » Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:48 am

To try to reply to a few different posts above...

Yes, I believe that Cavalier would say that the employment situation at UVA's peer schools is very similar (although he can definitely correct me if I'm wrong). If anything, I believe (and think other UVA students believe) that we at least have it the same--if not better--than peer schools. I have never seen any real data supporting the proposition or heard people complaining that we would be better off, career-wise, at Michigan, etc.

There are probably some people with 3.5s who didn't get jobs or, at least, the jobs they wanted. Except in very rare situations, though, there was probably some sort of negative situation attaching to that--i.e., they are a bad interviewer or made big mistakes in bidding.

The person who made the model and the shirt(s) is the same person from what I have heard. It is just one--admittedly unsatisfied--3L who is focusing all of this negative attention on our career services. I don't mean to deny that there are other similarly situated 3Ls, but I don't think that the fact that we have one particularly vocal unemployed 3L here says anything about UVA compared to peer schools.

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Kohinoor
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby Kohinoor » Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:14 am

omg wrote:The person who made the model and the shirt(s) is the same person from what I have heard. It is just one--admittedly unsatisfied--3L who is focusing all of this negative attention on our career services. I don't mean to deny that there are other similarly situated 3Ls, but I don't think that the fact that we have one particularly vocal unemployed 3L here says anything about UVA compared to peer schools.

You are incorrect sir.

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vanwinkle
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby vanwinkle » Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:17 am

I'm at HLS now, and even here I know 2Ls who struck out at OCI, and 3Ls who are still looking for jobs a month from graduation. The job market is harder now everywhere, and at every school. I think people should be aware of that, but I've been talking to people at a range of schools, and I really don't think it's worse at schools like UVA relative to their peers. It's just an effect of the job market and the way it's rapidly shifting and changing.

Of course, those rapid shifts can be things that places like career services can't easily keep up with... which adds to the frustration with the school. But my recommendation to anybody would be not to go to school planning to rely on career services to find a job. That goes for anywhere, not just UVA.

I don't mean to particularly defend or attack UVA career services. You can make your own judgments based on other posters whether they're as effective as they could be. But I'm just saying, it's not just their fault, and this is happening everywhere.

r6_philly
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Re: UVA 2L taking questions

Postby r6_philly » Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:21 am

vanwinkle wrote:I'm at HLS now, and even here I know 2Ls who struck out at OCI, and 3Ls who are still looking for jobs a month from graduation. The job market is harder now everywhere, and at every school. I think people should be aware of that, but I've been talking to people at a range of schools, and I really don't think it's worse at schools like UVA relative to their peers. It's just an effect of the job market and the way it's rapidly shifting and changing.


What are the reasons that make people still strike out at OCI and 3Ls with no jobs. I understand there are just not enough jobs to go around, but what separates the with-jobs and the jobless at Harvard? Still grades?




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