Penn Students Taking Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
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Georgiana
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Georgiana » Sun Jun 20, 2010 3:07 pm

markymark wrote:Penn 2Ls (or shall I say, rising 3Ls), on average, how many OCI interviews does someone get?

10? 15? 20?

There are a lot of variables. If you are talking just about OCI interviews I would say its 15-30 depending on where you are bidding with the average being around 20. If you do regional interviews as well that's another 3-10 interviews. The year before the average was obviously higher.

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x47point6
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby x47point6 » Sun Jun 20, 2010 10:58 pm

What is a reasonable number of hours one could plan to work part-time during 1L year?

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Georgiana
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Georgiana » Mon Jun 21, 2010 7:28 am

x47point6 wrote:What is a reasonable number of hours one could plan to work part-time during 1L year?

None...

But if you must, I'd say 10-15 up until Nov. 15ish, then none.

Also depends on whether its the type of job where you don't really work and instead have time where you are paid to read/study.

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x47point6
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby x47point6 » Mon Jun 21, 2010 3:27 pm

Thanks for answering all these questions...

Is there somewhere within the law school where one can prepare home-brought food? A room with a microwave and a sink and stuff?

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kurla88
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby kurla88 » Mon Jun 21, 2010 6:48 pm

x47point6 wrote:Thanks for answering all these questions...

Is there somewhere within the law school where one can prepare home-brought food? A room with a microwave and a sink and stuff?


I believe there is at least a public microwave and fridge down in the basement somewhere. Never used it, but I know some people do. We had some cases of foodtheft from the fridge last year, just fyi. :P

Those older and wiser than myself, if you've got a moment, please review the following professors/classes:

    Corporations - Wachter vs. Fisch vs. Bratton vs. Booth

    Environmental Lawyering - Fox (How useful is this type of class really?)

    Corporate Lawyering - Basri

    Contract Drafting - Adams

    Copyright - Parchomovsky

    Tax - Sanchirico vs. Shuldiner

    International Environmental Law - Chang

    M&A - Holland

    Professional Responsibility - Perry

    Sec Rec - Fisch

    Trusts and Estates - Terrill

Are there particular classes you recommend taking Fall semester because they are a prerequisite for a lot of other courses? Alternatively, professors so good that it's worth delaying till Spring for? Also, I know there are a few classes highly recommended to take before you graduate, but what courses do you think are vital before being a SA at a firm your 2L summer?

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Georgiana
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Georgiana » Mon Jun 21, 2010 7:24 pm

kurla88 wrote:
x47point6 wrote:Thanks for answering all these questions...

Is there somewhere within the law school where one can prepare home-brought food? A room with a microwave and a sink and stuff?


I believe there is at least a public microwave and fridge down in the basement somewhere. Never used it, but I know some people do. We had some cases of foodtheft from the fridge last year, just fyi. :P


For 1Ls there is the fridge downstairs and there are two microwaves but no sink. There has been food theft but I think that'll happen with any "public" fridge.

For people on journals, most journals (or good journals haha) have a fridge and microwave in the office. I know JIL and Law Review have them, I don't believe JBL does but I'm not sure about the other two that have been annexed outside the law school.


Corporations - Wachter vs. Fisch vs. Bratton vs. Booth
Wachter is a character and people who take corps with him really learn their stuff. My boyfriend had Fisch for sec rec and loved her. I don't think it's beneficial to take the 3 credit corps class just because it's probably about the same amount of work for less credit. Bratton is new to the faculty but taught this past year. I didn't hear anything bad but didn't hear rave reviews either.

Environmental Lawyering - Fox (How useful is this type of class really?)
Its a love it or hate it class. Some people loved it and thought it was really helpful, others didn't really find it helpful. It's a lot of student presentations so that can be good or bad depending on what you're looking for.

Contract Drafting - Adams
I've been told it's not great but I think it depends on the person. After this summer I'm considering taking it because I really enjoy contract work and the nitpicky nature of it.

Copyright - Parchomovsky
Great professor and great class I've heard... I don't like copyrights so I don't plan to take it, but you should if you like the subject.

Tax - Sanchirico vs. Shuldiner
DO NOT TAKE SANCHIRICO. He is one of the worst prof's I've had so far and one of the few classes I would not take given the opportunity to redo life. I don't know much about Shuldiner but the same hate for the class was not present in the friends I spoke to about tax. Unless you want to know tax and plan on possibly going into it, dont take tax. Pretty much everyone regrets the decision. It's not teaching you anything skills based, its more tax code/theory.

International Environmental Law - Chang
I've heard the prof is not so great (he also teaches intl trade) but I am considering this class as well because the topic seems good. His intl trade exam is all MC so it will probably be the same for this class.

Professional Responsibility - Perry
Boyfriend says Perry isn't so good (in more harsh language). I haven't taken the class yet so can't comment.

Sec Rec - Fisch
Boyfriend loved her and the class but he's a corporate genius (unlike me). Take corps first and see if you like/love it and do well in it. Don't take it before corps. I may edit if he has other comments when he gets home.

Trusts and Estates - Terrill
I took TE because I loved the topic in prop... the class did not deliver BUT I took it with someone else. I know nothing about this prof.

Also, are there particular classes you recommend taking Fall semester because they are a prerequisite for a lot of other courses? Alternatively, professors so good that it's worth delaying till Spring for?
Take evidence before summer. Your firm (assuming that's what you want) will have a mock trail thing (I'm doing mine now) and it will be easier if you know evidence or at least are familiar with it. Also, if you get a change to take crim pro with Bibas you should do it. I am sad he isn't teaching it this fall because I wanted to take it. I also recommend appellate advocacy if you want to do litigation or clerkship applications. I didn't do it and don't regret it, but I plan on working before clerking and don't have my life set on litigation. I loved conflicts with Roosevelt but I'm sure it's not for everyone. I've heard great things about Remedies with Wax, not a soul has a bad thing to say about it as far as I know. Feel free to ask about others if you want to :)

sjj05
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby sjj05 » Tue Jun 22, 2010 9:26 am

Okay, housing questions.

What is the average commute time/most popular method of getting from your home to school? Walking, bus, biking, the EL? This thread seems to indicate most people live by Rittenhouse or slightly west of it and the Penn Law admin folks said that most students live in CC not UC, but that seems like a total haul. Thoughts?

Also, Penn's housing site says a 1BR average in CC is $1640, which seems crazy high. Is that for real?

Thanks!!!

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DelDad
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby DelDad » Tue Jun 22, 2010 10:23 am

JBL has a fridge (2, actually) and a microwave :)

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x47point6
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby x47point6 » Tue Jun 22, 2010 11:17 am

Any advice for getting the COA increased (to increase the Grad Plus limit)? I imagine that simply citing demographic data to show that a household of XX people requires XX% more money to subsist in Philadelphia probably won't hack it, but I'm dreading providing an itemized, documented breakdown of everything we've purchased in the last several months only to have it torn apart and thrown back at me. (If you've had experience with this process with Penn you can PM if you want.)

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flipadelphia
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby flipadelphia » Tue Jun 22, 2010 3:50 pm

fun fact: the fall 2010 course schedule is online, along with section designations. there's no way to know what section you are, but all three are fairly similar.

also unless my eyes are playing tricks on me i don't see friday classes for any of the sections.

https://courses.law.upenn.edu/

AdmitMePls
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby AdmitMePls » Tue Jun 22, 2010 5:10 pm

flipadelphia wrote:fun fact: the fall 2010 course schedule is online, along with section designations. there's no way to know what section you are, but all three are fairly similar.

also unless my eyes are playing tricks on me i don't see friday classes for any of the sections.

https://courses.law.upenn.edu/



does "R" refer to Thursday on this schedule? (sorry, never seen that before)

Fridays off would be amaaazing...

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kurla88
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby kurla88 » Tue Jun 22, 2010 6:26 pm

AdmitMePls wrote:
flipadelphia wrote:fun fact: the fall 2010 course schedule is online, along with section designations. there's no way to know what section you are, but all three are fairly similar.

also unless my eyes are playing tricks on me i don't see friday classes for any of the sections.

https://courses.law.upenn.edu/



does "R" refer to Thursday on this schedule? (sorry, never seen that before)

Fridays off would be amaaazing...


R is Thursday. Odd, I know.

I am jealous if the new 1Ls have no Fridays... good deal. Just keep in mind that this is not a finalized schedule though, and they do make changes till the last minute.

Kaneloa
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Kaneloa » Wed Jun 23, 2010 2:02 pm

You'all are making me miss the good old days.
I graduated from DSL 30 years ago this month.

xokel87
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby xokel87 » Wed Jun 23, 2010 2:44 pm

Wow no Friday ! Seems too good to be true.

jc1988
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby jc1988 » Wed Jun 23, 2010 5:31 pm

does anyone know when do international students get their I-20 forms in order to apply for student visa? It is almost july and i am getting a bit nervous on this because i still haven't received that.

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Georgiana
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Georgiana » Wed Jun 23, 2010 5:58 pm

DelDad wrote:JBL has a fridge (2, actually) and a microwave :)

I'm told they are microfridges... sans freezer :)

(ps JIL has a microwave too... and windows!)

I really don't know what's in the other offices

alex06
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby alex06 » Thu Jun 24, 2010 7:40 am

Hey! Anybody know what a reasonable student budget should look like per month? Outside of rent, with my student loans, it looks like I'll have around $700/month. Given the cost of living in a big city like Philly, will this be enough? I wouldn't want to miss out on dinners with my fellow 1Ls and the like because I hadn't asked for enough in loans in the beginning.

Thanks! Obviously, people's budgets vary a ton, but I'm pretty social and I LOVE good food, so those are probably big factors...:)

Edit: because I know that guidelines are provided on the admitted students website, but they only estimate 8,000 for housing, which seems low to me, so I question the other amounts listed.

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Georgiana
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Georgiana » Thu Jun 24, 2010 7:58 am

alex06 wrote:Hey! Anybody know what a reasonable student budget should look like per month? Outside of rent, with my student loans, it looks like I'll have around $700/month. Given the cost of living in a big city like Philly, will this be enough? I wouldn't want to miss out on dinners with my fellow 1Ls and the like because I hadn't asked for enough in loans in the beginning.

Thanks! Obviously, people's budgets vary a ton, but I'm pretty social and I LOVE good food, so those are probably big factors...:)

Edit: because I know that guidelines are provided on the admitted students website, but they only estimate 8,000 for housing, which seems low to me, so I question the other amounts listed.

I gave myself 1800/month and pretty much always had at least 150 left over.
1k for rent
100 for phone/internet
and then random things that come up like health/renters insurance
groceries was usually 300-400/month depending on how much i went out
So i generally had about 300 to spend in any given month and rarely used it (im also a girl which makes for differences in food spending)
But we make up for it by clothes shopping and spending 300+ sometime during the semester

alex06
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby alex06 » Thu Jun 24, 2010 12:08 pm

Georgiana-- super helpful! Sounds like I should be ok, if I make sure to be careful. I am a girl too...how's the discount shopping around Penn? Loehmann's? Filene's basement? Forever 21 or H and M? :) I have a weakness...

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kurla88
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby kurla88 » Thu Jun 24, 2010 12:16 pm

alex06 wrote:Georgiana-- super helpful! Sounds like I should be ok, if I make sure to be careful. I am a girl too...how's the discount shopping around Penn? Loehmann's? Filene's basement? Forever 21 or H and M? :) I have a weakness...


We definitely have a couple of H&Ms in Center City. Idk if I've seen the others. I've been kind of disappointed with the cheap shopping. :( They don't have Forever 21 or my favorite, Charlotte Russe.

alex06
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby alex06 » Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:58 pm

What?! No Forever 21?? I might have to request a refund on my deposit. j/k but almost not really...

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Georgiana
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Georgiana » Fri Jun 25, 2010 9:43 am

alex06 wrote:Georgiana-- super helpful! Sounds like I should be ok, if I make sure to be careful. I am a girl too...how's the discount shopping around Penn? Loehmann's? Filene's basement? Forever 21 or H and M? :) I have a weakness...

Banana, Gap, AT, AT Loft, Talbots (which actually has some good biz cas things that are really good quality even though you feel like you're in an old lady store), like 4 H&Ms, J Crew, Express, Macys (though a sucky one), Anthro, Juicy, BCBG, Zara, etc...

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kurla88
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby kurla88 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 10:52 am

So trying to figure out how to rank order my courses... I know Evidence fills up really fast. Does Wachter Corps? Probably all the clinics do... I was thinking of the Mediation one. Also Copyright. And now you know my entire proposed schedule. Thoughts?

Thanks in advance for any input.

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Georgiana
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Georgiana » Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:06 am

kurla88 wrote:So trying to figure out how to rank order my courses... I know Evidence fills up really fast. Does Wachter Corps? Probably all the clinics do... I was thinking of the Mediation one. Also Copyright. And now you know my entire proposed schedule. Thoughts?

Thanks in advance for any input.

Being a 2L is the worst time to sign up for classes... You're the bottom of the barrel. Evidence will fill up quickly. In the spring I ranked it 2nd and did not get in off the waitlist. The clinic will also fill up and since 3Ls will get preference it may not be worth it to waste your first "bid" on it. If I were you I would do Evidence > Corps > Copyright and then pick another easy class (copyright and corps may be interchangeable as far as the ranking goes... I really don't remember which was more popular). Doing corps + ev + clinic is a lot, esp if you're planning to do a journal.

PierceFromCT
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby PierceFromCT » Tue Jun 29, 2010 5:56 pm

Any suggestions for applying ED to UPenn? It's a reach with my 170 and GPA of 3.3 (though I have 3 years of great work experience and awesome letters of rec). Does anyone have any advice how to make me stick out in the admissions process?




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