Penn Students Taking Questions Forum

[PennBull]

magic outline

Well shit.

You did it differently?

I don't think any of mine were magic.

I did fine, though,

Yeah I mean no outline is gonna give you a good grade on its own; it's gonna be like using a wrench to screw in a nail otherwise.

But if you don't need a professor to verbally explain how exactly to sniff his farts, the magic outline copies what he says in class almost word for word.

[notgreat]

Hi all. How is Penn/career services support for those not wanting to go the Big Law route? Specifically, I'd really like to work in fed gov after law school, but I'm a bit afraid of what look like low placement percentages for government work coming out of Penn. (On the other hand, TolLRAP looks like it might be more flexible than the LRAPs at some other schools.)

Thanks for any input.

I wouldn't be too worried about the low placement numbers per se, because it really seems like there are only a few people here with a strong interest in fed gov work. It seemed like almost everyone was gunning for big law in our class. Although, that doesn't mean it won't be tough. I do know a couple of people with interest in fed gov work and my understanding is that it is a pretty tough nut to crack. I'll try to remember to ask someone I know about it and then report back. My experiences with career services have been good, but I was gunning for BL. Maybe someone else has something to add?

[middlebear]

I wouldn't be too worried about the low placement numbers per se, because it really seems like there are only a few people here with a strong interest in fed gov work. It seemed like almost everyone was gunning for big law in our class. Although, that doesn't mean it won't be tough. I do know a couple of people with interest in fed gov work and my understanding is that it is a pretty tough nut to crack. I'll try to remember to ask someone I know about it and then report back. My experiences with career services have been good, but I was gunning for BL. Maybe someone else has something to add?

Thanks very much for this and any other info you may uncover! Big Law self-selection I totally get, as long as there is still support for people who are selecting a different way.

[Lions1913]

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[PennBull]

Posted this a few other places but haven't gotten a decent answer: how much of a 2L SA salary is the average Penn student able to put towards loans, living expenses, etc.? In other words, how much of your salary can you actually use? Assume NYC or other major market.

It's gonna be around $30K pre-tax (assuming 10 weeks) so do with it as you will; keep in mind you'll be taxed at a much higher rate so you may want to bump up your exemptions so the federal government doesn't just get to sit on your money until your tax return

[Penn16]

Posted this a few other places but haven't gotten a decent answer: how much of a 2L SA salary is the average Penn student able to put towards loans, living expenses, etc.? In other words, how much of your salary can you actually use? Assume NYC or other major market.

For NYC, assuming a non-NY resident single filer with no dependents who maximizes his/her exemptions and has no other income for the year, the 30K before taxes (for a 10 week SA program) will be about $27-28K after taxes. Depending on how much you spend on housing (estimate $7,000 total to be reasonably conservative) and food, transportation, and entertainment (conservatively estimate another $3,000) over the summer, you could very reasonably expect to save around 17K to put towards reducing loans and/or covering living expenses for 3L year.

[B.B. Homemaker]

Posted this a few other places but haven't gotten a decent answer: how much of a 2L SA salary is the average Penn student able to put towards loans, living expenses, etc.? In other words, how much of your salary can you actually use? Assume NYC or other major market.

For NYC, assuming a non-NY resident single filer with no dependents who maximizes his/her exemptions and has no other income for the year, the 30K before taxes (for a 10 week SA program) will be about $27-28K after taxes. Depending on how much you spend on housing (estimate $7,000 total to be reasonably conservative) and food, transportation, and entertainment (conservatively estimate another $3,000) over the summer, you could very reasonably expect to save around 17K to put towards reducing loans and/or covering living expenses for 3L year.

Gonna quote this so I feel bad later for saving nowhere near this, blowing through my stipend, and maxing out my salary advance.

[Penn16]

Posted this a few other places but haven't gotten a decent answer: how much of a 2L SA salary is the average Penn student able to put towards loans, living expenses, etc.? In other words, how much of your salary can you actually use? Assume NYC or other major market.

For NYC, assuming a non-NY resident single filer with no dependents who maximizes his/her exemptions and has no other income for the year, the 30K before taxes (for a 10 week SA program) will be about $27-28K after taxes. Depending on how much you spend on housing (estimate $7,000 total to be reasonably conservative) and food, transportation, and entertainment (conservatively estimate another $3,000) over the summer, you could very reasonably expect to save around 17K to put towards reducing loans and/or covering living expenses for 3L year.

Woops, forgot to account for Social Security and Medicare, so that'd be another $2K in taxes roughly, which means you'd have about $25-26K after all taxes. The $15K in savings though still stands if you stick with the $10,000 estimate for housing, food, and entertainment for the summer. Of course if you take only one or a couple exemptions, you will have a lot more withheld (like an additional $1,000 per paycheck) so the immediate savings will be much less, but then you'll get a large tax refund.

[AlwaysPlayTheFox]

Can someone give some info on the 1L OCI process. I feel like so many people bidding on so few firms the chances of even getting an interview with your first choice is slim.

[PennBull]

Can someone give some info on the 1L OCI process. I feel like so many people bidding on so few firms the chances of even getting an interview with your first choice is slim.

You'll probably get your first choice, maybe your second and third. So don't put your favorite, put the one you have the best shot at.

Is Marriott on there this year? Do that one.

[grizzlybear]

Post removed.

[DCNTUA]

Any word on whether LRW will stay p/f?

No reason to think it will change.

[PennBull]

Any word on whether LRW will stay p/f?

No reason to think it will change.

I mean they've been talking about it ever since I was a 1L, so

[B.B. Homemaker]

I know I argued vigorously against grading it in that survey thing. LPS is probably the most important course you take as a 1L, and putting that on a mandatory curve just doesn't make sense given the goal of getting everyone to some baseline level of proficiency at legal writing. "Congrats! Your writing is vastly better and submission-worthy! Here's your B-!" Everyone just passing, with a handful of really good people getting honors and some failing (if necessary) is a much better system.

[PennBull]

1L year would have been so much fucking worse if I had to worry if my writing was of median quality

[AlwaysPlayTheFox]

Do we know the 1L curve median gpa or is it safe to say it is around a B+?

[ymmv]

Do we know the 1L curve median gpa or is it safe to say it is around a B+?

You can't know the exact median thanks to discretionary grades in different classes, but IIRC the chances are good that B+ puts you at or just above median.

[Masonsmith]

Would anyone care to share how merit scholarships work at Penn? I'm aware that there is some kind of nomination system, etc... Generally, is Penn generous with the non-financial aid money? I was just admitted last Friday.

[Lions1913]

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[Redynsje]

I was recently accepted to Penn, and while I know it is a wonderful school, I don't know as much about the school (or Philly) as I do about other schools on my list. I would love to get the perspective of Penn students. What do you like most about the school? Tell me about Philly. Why did you choose Penn? Thanks!

[PennBull]

I was recently accepted to Penn, and while I know it is a wonderful school, I don't know as much about the school (or Philly) as I do about other schools on my list. I would love to get the perspective of Penn students. What do you like most about the school? Tell me about Philly. Why did you choose Penn? Thanks!

You're going to get a myriad of answers depending on folks' backgrounds and reasons for going. Which is a good thing, but it'd be helpful if you also pointed out your reasons for going to law school/what you hope to get out of it, etc. What brings you to law school?

[Redynsje]

Sure thing. I am 7 years out of undergrad. I started a family first (coming into 1L with three small kids) and now I'm diving into my career. I am very committed to returning to MN after school and have a tentative plan of focusing on business or tax law.

[schmelling]

Post removed.

[ymmv]

I would love to get the rundown on what everyone thinks of the various housing options. I am considering just about everything right now, but I am leaning toward living in university city, walking distance to the law school for 1l year.

Lots of advice in this thread. West Philly's mostly fine near Penn and inexpensive in a lot of areas. Many people move to Center City, but it can be a little pricier on the whole. Graduate Hospital area is a pretty nice compromise and still close enough to school to walk.

[DiniMae]

Has anyone ITT done the legislative clinic? If so, would you mind sharing your experience?