Penn Students Taking Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
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absolutazn87
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby absolutazn87 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:45 pm

tipler4213 wrote:
Its not a matter of getting used to it--I just already have a relatively new macbook. I use Microsoft suite at work and actually have my Mac synced to use outlook, word, etc.

And dropbox is like the most useful thing ever! (obligatory dropbox referral link :D ) http://db.tt/QJ8uZ4B

r6_philly
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby r6_philly » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:48 pm

Veyron wrote:
In theory, yes. In practice, many IT departments find Macs not to be secure enough to use. Whether this is true or not is irrelevant to you as a lowly associate.


As a 15-year IT professional, I can tell you the most insecure part of any corporate network is the users. You are grossly over representing what you know about IT.

tipler4213
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby tipler4213 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:50 pm

r6_philly wrote:
Veyron wrote:
In theory, yes. In practice, many IT departments find Macs not to be secure enough to use. Whether this is true or not is irrelevant to you as a lowly associate.


As a 15-year IT professional, I can tell you the most insecure part of any corporate network is the users. You are grossly over representing what you know about IT.


Cheers. Everyone I work with is former CIA, NSA, etc. We allow Mac or PC. In fact, I just sent a highly sensitive client e-mail. From my Mac.

jeremysen
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby jeremysen » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:51 pm

r6_philly wrote:
Veyron wrote:For sure, but any energy you have left over SHOULD be saved for law school. Thats the work that it took me to crack median. If you are more prolific than I am, why not gun for top 10% instead of spending the extra effort working? The ROI is definitely higher.


It will be after I spend the energy I have allotted for other things. Maybe I should stop spending time with my kids, or go to the doctors, or visiting family, or ... ?

Other people spend time on other priorities, and no one is trying to work a full-time job or anything. 2-3 hours per day should be able to be spared, especially if you are doing something you have been doing for a long time.


to each his own...but for the avg nearly all first year law students, having a part-time job is a terrible idea

edited for accuracy
Last edited by jeremysen on Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

TLSNYC
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby TLSNYC » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:51 pm

Veyron wrote:
So what were you saying about Lexis taking up all the processing power?


No idea, it just takes forever on my computer when I'm doing research and I have a really fast computer. Also, it makes everything else run slow. Maybe its that it takes up a ton of bandwith, not processing power but I sure runs faster on my new computer than on my old one.

1) Maybe you're working too much - try taking more breaks (I did better 2nd semester of 1L year when I committed to getting 7+ hrs of sleep/night)


Almost certainly true, but still, use the extra time for sleep, not work.


Life should hopefully be a bit easier for us incoming 1Ls if they follow through with their decision to go from 4 doctrinal classes to 3, right?

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Veyron
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Veyron » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:54 pm

r6_philly wrote:
Veyron wrote:
In theory, yes. In practice, many IT departments find Macs not to be secure enough to use. Whether this is true or not is irrelevant to you as a lowly associate.


As a 15-year IT professional, I can tell you the most insecure part of any corporate network is the users. You are grossly over representing what you know about IT.


Dude, I'm not saying that this is CORRECT, I'm saying that it is BELIEVED by many FIRMS (at least according to our Lexis and Westlaw reps). You will soon find that firms adhere to many outdated concepts (like the billable hour) Mr. IT PROFESSIONAL.

Life should hopefully be a bit easier for us incoming 1Ls if they follow through with their decision to go from 4 doctrinal classes to 3, right?


Yes, but thats looking less likely from what I hear.

TLSNYC
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby TLSNYC » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:58 pm

Veyron wrote:
r6_philly wrote:
Veyron wrote:
In theory, yes. In practice, many IT departments find Macs not to be secure enough to use. Whether this is true or not is irrelevant to you as a lowly associate.


As a 15-year IT professional, I can tell you the most insecure part of any corporate network is the users. You are grossly over representing what you know about IT.


Dude, I'm not saying that this is CORRECT, I'm saying that it is BELIEVED by many FIRMS (at least according to our Lexis and Westlaw reps). You will soon find that firms adhere to many outdated concepts (like the billable hour) Mr. IT PROFESSIONAL.

Life should hopefully be a bit easier for us incoming 1Ls if they follow through with their decision to go from 4 doctrinal classes to 3, right?


Yes, but thats looking less likely from what I hear.


haha, damnit. Bayrex misled me :( that's like my only reservation about going to Penn. 3 + LRW sounds so much manageable.

run26.2
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby run26.2 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:58 pm

r6_philly wrote:
Veyron wrote:
In theory, yes. In practice, many IT departments find Macs not to be secure enough to use. Whether this is true or not is irrelevant to you as a lowly associate.


As a 15-year IT professional, I can tell you the most insecure part of any corporate network is the users. You are grossly over representing what you know about IT.

Agreed that the user is the major source of insecurity. Fewer attacks that are OS targeted are aimed at Macs than PCs--this seems to be a residual effect of the smaller install base. But phising schemes affect users of both platforms. MS is moving in the direction of making things more secure, but the # of services it enables by default (which Macs do as well) means it is still not totally secure.

Actually many IT folks really like the Macs, perhaps because of the unix core. Geeky types like the customizability of such an operating system.

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absolutazn87
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby absolutazn87 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:58 pm

TLSNYC wrote:
Veyron wrote:
r6_philly wrote:
Veyron wrote:
In theory, yes. In practice, many IT departments find Macs not to be secure enough to use. Whether this is true or not is irrelevant to you as a lowly associate.


As a 15-year IT professional, I can tell you the most insecure part of any corporate network is the users. You are grossly over representing what you know about IT.


Dude, I'm not saying that this is CORRECT, I'm saying that it is BELIEVED by many FIRMS (at least according to our Lexis and Westlaw reps). You will soon find that firms adhere to many outdated concepts (like the billable hour) Mr. IT PROFESSIONAL.

Life should hopefully be a bit easier for us incoming 1Ls if they follow through with their decision to go from 4 doctrinal classes to 3, right?


Yes, but thats looking less likely from what I hear.


haha, damnit. Bayrex misled me :( that's like my only reservation about going to Penn. 3 + LRW sounds so much manageable.

Yeah but I thought if they changed it to 3, they'd make legal writing graded. and we wouldn't get 2 electives in the spring. so...pros and cons to each :|

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Veyron
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Veyron » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:07 pm

My schedule is/was NEVER anything like this... EVER. EVER. (this may change once I'm working biglaw obv... but even over the summer I had more free time than this!)

That said I was *only* top third after 1L... I don't think I'd trade that schedule for being top 10% (especially knowing what I know now re: my job outcome). Maybe I'd do it to be #1... but you never know if you're #1 bc thats how Penn works :)


There is a good chance that you are just significantly more intelligent than I am :).

Unfortunately, it is impossible to know how smart you will be compared to your classmates prior to fall exams, so my philosophy is, why take chances.

pereira6
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby pereira6 » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:18 pm

Veyron wrote:
My schedule is/was NEVER anything like this... EVER. EVER. (this may change once I'm working biglaw obv... but even over the summer I had more free time than this!)

That said I was *only* top third after 1L... I don't think I'd trade that schedule for being top 10% (especially knowing what I know now re: my job outcome). Maybe I'd do it to be #1... but you never know if you're #1 bc thats how Penn works :)


There is a good chance that you are just significantly more intelligent than I am :).

Unfortunately, it is impossible to know how smart you will be compared to your classmates prior to fall exams, so my philosophy is, why take chances.


I'm glad we're back to being happy classmates in this thread again haha

r6_philly
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby r6_philly » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:19 pm

jeremysen wrote:to each his own...but for the avg nearly all first year law students, having a part-time job is a terrible idea


Not disagreeing with this at all. But for the couple to few outliers everyone who's actually been working for a while, it isn't really that terrible. For example, I watch TV, eat dinner, and put in hours at the same time. It isn't that hard to put in 15 hours that way.

r6_philly
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby r6_philly » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:20 pm

Veyron wrote:Unfortunately, it is impossible to know how smart you will be compared to your classmates prior to fall exams, so my philosophy is, why take chances.


You seem to indicate the amount of hours you put in beyond 70 per week has any tangible affect on your grades, and everyone else say no.

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Georgiana
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Georgiana » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:28 pm

r6_philly wrote:
Veyron wrote:Unfortunately, it is impossible to know how smart you will be compared to your classmates prior to fall exams, so my philosophy is, why take chances.


You seem to indicate the amount of hours you put in beyond 70 per week has any tangible affect on your grades, and everyone else say no.

In all honesty, its about how much you feel you need to put in in order to not regret it later and think "gosh if only I'd worked 10 more hours per week." If you're willing to work hard as hell and you won't regret that time spent when you look back on it, then do it. Personally, after a certain amount, I just don't see the gains happening. The classes I really like/understand I do better in because I'm just naturally better at them. The classes I'm meh on I generally B+ it and I'm satisfied with that. I also do better on take homes and I study WAY less than other people for them.

For comparison, the schedule of a recent summa grad:
M-Th: Wake up 7:30am, gym, shower, etc, class 9am-Afternoon sometime, study until about 10 or 11
F: Sleep in until 10ish, class or two, study until 7pm, video games!
Weekend: Sleep in until 10ish, 8ish (max) hours studying/day

Things got a little more intense the last month or so before finals, and much less intense during 3L.

FiveSermon
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby FiveSermon » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:35 pm

Georgiana wrote:
r6_philly wrote:
Veyron wrote:Unfortunately, it is impossible to know how smart you will be compared to your classmates prior to fall exams, so my philosophy is, why take chances.


You seem to indicate the amount of hours you put in beyond 70 per week has any tangible affect on your grades, and everyone else say no.

In all honesty, its about how much you feel you need to put in in order to not regret it later and think "gosh if only I'd worked 10 more hours per week." If you're willing to work hard as hell and you won't regret that time spent when you look back on it, then do it. Personally, after a certain amount, I just don't see the gains happening. The classes I really like/understand I do better in because I'm just naturally better at them. The classes I'm meh on I generally B+ it and I'm satisfied with that. I also do better on take homes and I study WAY less than other people for them.

For comparison, the schedule of a recent summa grad:
M-Th: Wake up 7:30am, gym, shower, etc, class 9am-Afternoon sometime, study until about 10 or 11
F: Sleep in until 10ish, class or two, study until 7pm, video games!
Weekend: Sleep in until 10ish, 8ish (max) hours studying/day

Things got a little more intense the last month or so before finals, and much less intense during 3L.


Is it just me? Or does that schedule sound intense.

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Georgiana
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Georgiana » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:38 pm

FiveSermon wrote:
Georgiana wrote:
r6_philly wrote:
Veyron wrote:Unfortunately, it is impossible to know how smart you will be compared to your classmates prior to fall exams, so my philosophy is, why take chances.


You seem to indicate the amount of hours you put in beyond 70 per week has any tangible affect on your grades, and everyone else say no.

In all honesty, its about how much you feel you need to put in in order to not regret it later and think "gosh if only I'd worked 10 more hours per week." If you're willing to work hard as hell and you won't regret that time spent when you look back on it, then do it. Personally, after a certain amount, I just don't see the gains happening. The classes I really like/understand I do better in because I'm just naturally better at them. The classes I'm meh on I generally B+ it and I'm satisfied with that. I also do better on take homes and I study WAY less than other people for them.

For comparison, the schedule of a recent summa grad:
M-Th: Wake up 7:30am, gym, shower, etc, class 9am-Afternoon sometime, study until about 10 or 11
F: Sleep in until 10ish, class or two, study until 7pm, video games!
Weekend: Sleep in until 10ish, 8ish (max) hours studying/day

Things got a little more intense the last month or so before finals, and much less intense during 3L.


Is it just me? Or does that schedule sound intense.

He was/is an intense person when it comes to work... he also didn't have a life/friends during 1L. It paid off for him. If I thought I was summa qualified maybe I would have put in that much work... but I don't :)

r6_philly
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby r6_philly » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:53 pm

Georgiana wrote:
For comparison, the schedule of a recent summa grad:
M-Th: Wake up 7:30am, gym, shower, etc, class 9am-Afternoon sometime, study until about 10 or 11
F: Sleep in until 10ish, class or two, study until 7pm, video games!
Weekend: Sleep in until 10ish, 8ish (max) hours studying/day



So that's about 70 hours. I think most of us who want to work will find time out of our personal schedule to work. I am certainly not stupid enough to take time away from school work to work.

I don't really want to argue with people about what I can and cannot do, it is rather pointless. Also, I do agree generally students should focus on school mainly.

It also should be noted that the amount you can earn matters too. 10/hr or 50/hr may make a bit of difference.

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Veyron
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Veyron » Fri Apr 22, 2011 11:37 pm

He was/is an intense person when it comes to work... he also didn't have a life/friends during 1L. It paid off for him. If I thought I was summa qualified maybe I would have put in that much work... but I don't :)


Yah, I was in no way suggesting you can't have a job or do whatever as a 2L and 3L. No fucking way am I doing this next year.

70 hours a week also seems like a reasonable time for someone who is a fairly quick worker to spend on school as a 1L. Its just, if you use the extra time to work, the vast, vast majority of non-supermen are going to get burned out. Now, I ain't saying this poster ain't superman, but I didn't see no 180 in that there TLS box.

r6_philly
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby r6_philly » Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:23 am

Veyron wrote:
He was/is an intense person when it comes to work... he also didn't have a life/friends during 1L. It paid off for him. If I thought I was summa qualified maybe I would have put in that much work... but I don't :)


Yah, I was in no way suggesting you can't have a job or do whatever as a 2L and 3L. No fucking way am I doing this next year.

70 hours a week also seems like a reasonable time for someone who is a fairly quick worker to spend on school as a 1L. Its just, if you use the extra time to work, the vast, vast majority of non-supermen are going to get burned out. Now, I ain't saying this poster ain't superman, but I didn't see no 180 in that there TLS box.


I see you don't really know what it's like to have an infant, work 40 hours between 2 jobs, drive 2 hours to school everyday and another hour to work, and take 24 credits at the same time, then try to fit in enough LSAT study to get a 170. I am just glad for you that you didn't have to.

FiveSermon
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby FiveSermon » Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:31 am

r6_philly wrote:
Veyron wrote:
He was/is an intense person when it comes to work... he also didn't have a life/friends during 1L. It paid off for him. If I thought I was summa qualified maybe I would have put in that much work... but I don't :)


Yah, I was in no way suggesting you can't have a job or do whatever as a 2L and 3L. No fucking way am I doing this next year.

70 hours a week also seems like a reasonable time for someone who is a fairly quick worker to spend on school as a 1L. Its just, if you use the extra time to work, the vast, vast majority of non-supermen are going to get burned out. Now, I ain't saying this poster ain't superman, but I didn't see no 180 in that there TLS box.


I see you don't really know what it's like to have an infant, work 40 hours between 2 jobs, drive 2 hours to school everyday and another hour to work, and take 24 credits at the same time, then try to fit in enough LSAT study to get a 170. I am just glad for you that you didn't have to.


You say this as if it should be typical of a law student.

r6_philly
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby r6_philly » Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:34 am

FiveSermon wrote:
You say this as if it should be typical of a law student.


I did not, I said multiple times that I don't think it would be a good idea for a typical student.

Veyron's last reply was a little personal so I am just replying to that.

r6_philly
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby r6_philly » Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:37 am

FiveSermon wrote:
You say this as if it should be typical of a law student.


BTW are you coming to Penn?

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Veyron
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Veyron » Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:40 am

FiveSermon wrote:
r6_philly wrote:
Veyron wrote:
He was/is an intense person when it comes to work... he also didn't have a life/friends during 1L. It paid off for him. If I thought I was summa qualified maybe I would have put in that much work... but I don't :)


Yah, I was in no way suggesting you can't have a job or do whatever as a 2L and 3L. No fucking way am I doing this next year.

70 hours a week also seems like a reasonable time for someone who is a fairly quick worker to spend on school as a 1L. Its just, if you use the extra time to work, the vast, vast majority of non-supermen are going to get burned out. Now, I ain't saying this poster ain't superman, but I didn't see no 180 in that there TLS box.


I see you don't really know what it's like to have an infant, work 40 hours between 2 jobs, drive 2 hours to school everyday and another hour to work, and take 24 credits at the same time, then try to fit in enough LSAT study to get a 170. I am just glad for you that you didn't have to.


You say this as if it should be typical of a law student.


High LSAT
High GPA check
Great resume check
Raised small infant. . . no

DING.

Love to see that law school. On second thought, I have no desire to transfer to Northwestern.

r6_philly
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby r6_philly » Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:42 am

Veyron wrote:High LSAT
High GPA check
Great resume check
Raised small infant. . . no

DING.



What's your point? You don't have any of those?

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Veyron
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Re: Penn Students Taking Questions

Postby Veyron » Sat Apr 23, 2011 1:45 am

r6_philly wrote:
Veyron wrote:High LSAT
High GPA check
Great resume check
Raised small infant. . . no

DING.



What's your point? You don't have any of those?


You're having a bad reading comprehension day. Now you're insisting that jokes must have points. Infant must be tiring you out :wink: .




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