Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
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Ludo!
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby Ludo! » Sat May 26, 2012 1:37 pm

chitown2626 wrote:Again, thanks for the help. Can you provide any insight into a doing secondary journal v. doing moot court? Does one or the other look better on your resume? Is there any prestige difference between the 2 secondary journals (elder v. technology)?


From anecdotal experience I think grades were the most important thing, but law review was a boost if you were on the margins. Secondary journals and moot court were probably equal in that you needed to have one or the other (I think a majority of employers require one or the other) but neither was much of a boost. People with good grades on secondaries still got jobs, and at least a couple people with good grades got biglaw with only moot court on their resume.

I think if you miss LR but get a secondary journal you should take it though. It's a lot less work at our school and most of my friends on secondaries didn't hate their lives like law review people did. No prestige difference between the two. The elder law advisor is one of the best professors at the school and is very well respected in the field so even though Elder law sounds really obscure there's nothing wrong with being on it. I wouldn't turn down a secondary journal for moot court. If there is any prestige difference it would be in favor of journals since anyone can do moot court at our school (winning moot court might be more prestigious than being on a secondary though), but any difference in prestige didn't make any difference in hiring that I can tell. I know my friend with awesome grades who did moot court but not journal didn't get questioned on it in interviews or anything.

I would say the benefits of a secondary journal outweigh the burden of the workload, but if you don't get a journal it's not the end of the world.

uiucillini23
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby uiucillini23 » Sat May 26, 2012 10:56 pm

did any of you guys interview in different cities? suggestions for ppl like dreams-digital who want to work outside of Illinois?

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blurbz
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby blurbz » Sun May 27, 2012 3:39 am

Ludovico Technique wrote:
chitown2626 wrote:Again, thanks for the help. Can you provide any insight into a doing secondary journal v. doing moot court? Does one or the other look better on your resume? Is there any prestige difference between the 2 secondary journals (elder v. technology)?


From anecdotal experience I think grades were the most important thing, but law review was a boost if you were on the margins. Secondary journals and moot court were probably equal in that you needed to have one or the other (I think a majority of employers require one or the other) but neither was much of a boost. People with good grades on secondaries still got jobs, and at least a couple people with good grades got biglaw with only moot court on their resume.

I think if you miss LR but get a secondary journal you should take it though. It's a lot less work at our school and most of my friends on secondaries didn't hate their lives like law review people did. No prestige difference between the two. The elder law advisor is one of the best professors at the school and is very well respected in the field so even though Elder law sounds really obscure there's nothing wrong with being on it. I wouldn't turn down a secondary journal for moot court. If there is any prestige difference it would be in favor of journals since anyone can do moot court at our school (winning moot court might be more prestigious than being on a secondary though), but any difference in prestige didn't make any difference in hiring that I can tell. I know my friend with awesome grades who did moot court but not journal didn't get questioned on it in interviews or anything.

I would say the benefits of a secondary journal outweigh the burden of the workload, but if you don't get a journal it's not the end of the world.


Sorry for the delay: I'm traveling a bit right now and don't have access to the internet as readily as I normally do.

I agree with Ludo. Grades were the most important thing, but journal involvement is definitely helpful. I missed grading on to law review by one half letter grade and then was passed over by the secondary journals. There are a FEW firms that REQUIRE journal membership (An important aside: A lot of firms say that they require journal membership but, in practice, don't actually. Apply to EVERY FIRM coming to OCI, regardless of what they say their requirements are). Anyway, the few firms that actually require journal membership didn't interview me even though I was in the top 7 percent after 1L year. Moot court doesn't make up for that, but if you're not on a journal you really need to do moot court or employers will worry that you're just lazy.

That being said, I'm extremely happy, in hindsight, that I didn't get on a journal: I still got an offer from my top-choice firm for this summer and I didn't have to deal with the ridiculousness of being on a journal. Of course, I know I got lucky: Journal provides a noticeable boost so it should be a goal--but it's not the end of the world if you miss that boat.

uiucillini23 wrote:did any of you guys interview in different cities? suggestions for ppl like dreams-digital who want to work outside of Illinois?


I did. I interviewed in a number of different cities and ended up in my first-choice market, which is a large non-Illinois city. Without knowing the types of markets you're talking about, it's hard to give advice. Ludo touched on the main points earlier when talking about NY and CA markets: You have to be in the area to interview. Tell firms you'll be in town for a week and are interested in meeting with them. Spend the money to make it happen; it's definitely worth it. People we know who did that got jobs. Those who just wrote and hoped the firm would be interested enough to fly them out for an interview got nothing (Naturally, there are exceptions on both sides, but it's been my experience that this is a generally true statement).

If you're interviewing in a place like NYC, ties are not as important. If you're interviewing in a smaller market (Atlanta, Houston, St. Louis, Indianapolis, etc.) ties become extremely important. Make sure you have good, convincing reasons to be in the market and make sure that you know the market really well. I fielded questions in my interviews about specific neighborhoods in the market I was targeting in what was, I'm sure, an attempt to gauge how serious I was about moving there.

It's always good to skim the NYT, Wall Street Journal and etc. for basic corporate news, but if you're targeting smaller markets, you should also check out the local Business Journal. You'll probably need a subscription, but it's worth it to get a feel for the market and for the firms you're interviewing with. The business journals will obviously have a significant amount of news related to firm clients, but they also have legal/law firm sections covering the legal sector: these sections can be pure gold for interviews.

I did little things that might not be a big deal, too: If part of the reason that I was targeting a specific market was because I have family/friends in the area, I'd turn down the firm offered hotel (Oh, how painful it is to turn down such luxury...) and tell the recruiter "thank you, but I'm going to stay with my family." This may not have made a wit of difference, but I think it helped to reinforce that I wasn't just making up ties by inventing cousins and friends...

If you have specific markets you're targeting and want me to answer questions about them, just let me know. I'll probably either have interviewed there (particularly Midwestern markets) or in a similar-sized market/legal community.

It's important to again note that Illinois is not a national school. We place people outside of our home market, sure, but it takes a great deal of time, money and effort on the part of the student to make those connections. I think it was infinitely harder for me to land the job that I ended up taking than other opportunities that I had in our home market. We have really dedicated graduates who will help Illinois students get jobs, but most of those people are in Chicago. If your target market doesn't have Illinois grads (mine didn't!) be prepared to convince them why you're serious about sticking around and won't try to jump to Chicago in 3 years.

Sorry if this is too stream-of-consciousness: It's late, I'm traveling, and I'm exhausted! If you want me to clear anything up or elaborate on any point, just let me know and I'll be happy to do so.

uiucillini23
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby uiucillini23 » Sun May 27, 2012 10:44 am

blurbz wrote:
Ludovico Technique wrote:
chitown2626 wrote:Again, thanks for the help. Can you provide any insight into a doing secondary journal v. doing moot court? Does one or the other look better on your resume? Is there any prestige difference between the 2 secondary journals (elder v. technology)?


From anecdotal experience I think grades were the most important thing, but law review was a boost if you were on the margins. Secondary journals and moot court were probably equal in that you needed to have one or the other (I think a majority of employers require one or the other) but neither was much of a boost. People with good grades on secondaries still got jobs, and at least a couple people with good grades got biglaw with only moot court on their resume.

I think if you miss LR but get a secondary journal you should take it though. It's a lot less work at our school and most of my friends on secondaries didn't hate their lives like law review people did. No prestige difference between the two. The elder law advisor is one of the best professors at the school and is very well respected in the field so even though Elder law sounds really obscure there's nothing wrong with being on it. I wouldn't turn down a secondary journal for moot court. If there is any prestige difference it would be in favor of journals since anyone can do moot court at our school (winning moot court might be more prestigious than being on a secondary though), but any difference in prestige didn't make any difference in hiring that I can tell. I know my friend with awesome grades who did moot court but not journal didn't get questioned on it in interviews or anything.

I would say the benefits of a secondary journal outweigh the burden of the workload, but if you don't get a journal it's not the end of the world.


Sorry for the delay: I'm traveling a bit right now and don't have access to the internet as readily as I normally do.

I agree with Ludo. Grades were the most important thing, but journal involvement is definitely helpful. I missed grading on to law review by one half letter grade and then was passed over by the secondary journals.


wait you can grade on to law review????!!! I specifically asked my peer adviser about this and he said EVERYONE has to write-on!!! what on Earth is going on here!! I feel like those two guys really gave me a bunch of wrong info.

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DreamsInDigital
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby DreamsInDigital » Sun May 27, 2012 10:50 am

uiucillini23 wrote:
wait you can grade on to law review????!!! I specifically asked my peer adviser about this and he said EVERYONE has to write-on!!! what on Earth is going on here!! I feel like those two guys really gave me a bunch of wrong info.


Everyone has to complete the write on competition, but top 4 students in each section (which depending on the class size would be like, top 5 - top 10 percent) make it on as long as they make a good faith effort (which is defined as being in the top 75% of completed entries).

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Ludo!
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby Ludo! » Sun May 27, 2012 10:59 am

DreamsInDigital wrote:
uiucillini23 wrote:
wait you can grade on to law review????!!! I specifically asked my peer adviser about this and he said EVERYONE has to write-on!!! what on Earth is going on here!! I feel like those two guys really gave me a bunch of wrong info.


Everyone has to complete the write on competition, but top 4 students in each section (which depending on the class size would be like, top 5 - top 10 percent) make it on as long as they make a good faith effort (which is defined as being in the top 75% of completed entries).


This is correct. I graded on last year but still had to slave away at that godawful writing competition.

uiucillini23
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby uiucillini23 » Sun May 27, 2012 12:11 pm

Ludovico Technique wrote:
DreamsInDigital wrote:
uiucillini23 wrote:
wait you can grade on to law review????!!! I specifically asked my peer adviser about this and he said EVERYONE has to write-on!!! what on Earth is going on here!! I feel like those two guys really gave me a bunch of wrong info.


Everyone has to complete the write on competition, but top 4 students in each section (which depending on the class size would be like, top 5 - top 10 percent) make it on as long as they make a good faith effort (which is defined as being in the top 75% of completed entries).


This is correct. I graded on last year but still had to slave away at that godawful writing competition.


Can someone point me to where I could find that info in the student handbook or online? I wanted to call the school but I think they're closed. What is a good estimate for the GPA cutoff for the top 4 students? Thanks for all your help guys. Why weren't people talking about this site in school? I feel like this thing is loaded with info and sure beats listening to Stacy from career services.

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Ludo!
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby Ludo! » Sun May 27, 2012 12:31 pm

uiucillini23 wrote:
Ludovico Technique wrote:
DreamsInDigital wrote:
uiucillini23 wrote:
wait you can grade on to law review????!!! I specifically asked my peer adviser about this and he said EVERYONE has to write-on!!! what on Earth is going on here!! I feel like those two guys really gave me a bunch of wrong info.


Everyone has to complete the write on competition, but top 4 students in each section (which depending on the class size would be like, top 5 - top 10 percent) make it on as long as they make a good faith effort (which is defined as being in the top 75% of completed entries).


This is correct. I graded on last year but still had to slave away at that godawful writing competition.


Can someone point me to where I could find that info in the student handbook or online? I wanted to call the school but I think they're closed. What is a good estimate for the GPA cutoff for the top 4 students? Thanks for all your help guys. Why weren't people talking about this site in school? I feel like this thing is loaded with info and sure beats listening to Stacy from career services.


http://illinoislawreview.org/about/ under writing competition. It's probably in a handbook somewhere as well but that's easier.

Like blurbz said, last year top 7% wasn't good enough but top 5% was. I think our year that worked out to like needing at least 3.75ish to grade on. But you shouldn't really let that affect how hard you work on the competition. You wouldn't want to have the grades but then fall short of the good faith effort to get on.

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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby uiucillini23 » Sun May 27, 2012 12:55 pm

ugh it's by section ranking...geez i wouldn't be surprised if my section's top 4 all had 4.00s...some kid there probably cali'd everything again

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Ludo!
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby Ludo! » Sun May 27, 2012 1:00 pm

I'm glad people are finding this useful. I know last year I was completely in the dark when it came to how to go about the 2l job search and career services was not much help. They might be better now (at least they have a list of who's coming to OCI up already) but I would still take everything they say with a grain of salt. Last year most of their advice ranged from useless to actually harmful (i.e. telling men to wear black suits to interviews :shock: ) You are much better off talking to alums or current rising 3ls either on TLS or in real life.

At a lot of schools the career services office keeps information and statistics about how OCI went for previous classes and makes this info available to all of the students. Why Illinois does not do this is a fucking mystery to me. If you bug them enough they will send you a list of a few of the rising 3ls with biglaw jobs, but at least when I asked the list I got was woefully incomplete. It is very helpful when going into interviews when you are asked 'so why do you want to work here' if part of your answer can be I talked to So and So who summered here and they loved it. I know I looked stupid in at least one interview when the employer asked - so do you know Our Summers From This Year and I had to say no.

As far as I know career services has this information (I know they followed up with people about where they would be working for the summer, so unless those people refused to answer career services knows where everybody is working) but won't share it. Maybe it's a privacy concern, but they could at least ask rising 3ls if they would mind being contacted by rising 2ls and I imagine most people would be willing to help.

So if I were a rising 2l right now I would be bugging the shit out of career services to give me as much data as they have. What Illinois students have gotten jobs at what firms and what their GPAs looked like and if they were on journals or not, etc. Like I said, they know this stuff and other schools make this info readily available so it's kind of embarrassing that our office doesn't. (If any 2ls want to PM I can send you a list of as much of this info as I know, but it would be really beneficial for you to try to get career services to get their shit together).

If you haven't already, check out this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=161018

This was sealocusts OCI guide last year and it was invaluable to me and blurbz. A few things to keep in mind for Illinois specifically: We are 100% preselect with unlimited bids. This means you don't have to worry at all about bid strategy. Just bid as many firms as you want.

Do not ever trust the times given on symplicity. You will find out if you've been preselected earlier than the time they tell you, and you will be able to pick your interview slots earlier than they tell you. Last year they said we could start scheduling interviews at noon and it was really like 8:30am. Check that shit as obsessively as you checked for your LSAT score. It's important to be able to get the slots you want. You've got enough to stress out about, you don't want to have to worry about trading spots with people too.

Also, nobody should be relying solely on OCI. Everybody should do mass mailing as well. Even if your target market is Chicago there are still firms, esp smaller ones, that aren't coming to OCI but that doesn't mean they wouldn't hire an Illinois student. Again this is where having data from career services would be nice. Apply at every single firm you can find. Even if you are at the very very top of the class and make law review, nothing is a given.

uiucillini23
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby uiucillini23 » Sun May 27, 2012 3:46 pm

Ludovico Technique wrote:I'm glad people are finding this useful. I know last year I was completely in the dark when it came to how to go about the 2l job search and career services was not much help. They might be better now (at least they have a list of who's coming to OCI up already) but I would still take everything they say with a grain of salt. Last year most of their advice ranged from useless to actually harmful (i.e. telling men to wear black suits to interviews :shock: ) You are much better off talking to alums or current rising 3ls either on TLS or in real life.

At a lot of schools the career services office keeps information and statistics about how OCI went for previous classes and makes this info available to all of the students. Why Illinois does not do this is a fucking mystery to me. If you bug them enough they will send you a list of a few of the rising 3ls with biglaw jobs, but at least when I asked the list I got was woefully incomplete. It is very helpful when going into interviews when you are asked 'so why do you want to work here' if part of your answer can be I talked to So and So who summered here and they loved it. I know I looked stupid in at least one interview when the employer asked - so do you know Our Summers From This Year and I had to say no.

As far as I know career services has this information (I know they followed up with people about where they would be working for the summer, so unless those people refused to answer career services knows where everybody is working) but won't share it. Maybe it's a privacy concern, but they could at least ask rising 3ls if they would mind being contacted by rising 2ls and I imagine most people would be willing to help.

So if I were a rising 2l right now I would be bugging the shit out of career services to give me as much data as they have. What Illinois students have gotten jobs at what firms and what their GPAs looked like and if they were on journals or not, etc. Like I said, they know this stuff and other schools make this info readily available so it's kind of embarrassing that our office doesn't. (If any 2ls want to PM I can send you a list of as much of this info as I know, but it would be really beneficial for you to try to get career services to get their shit together).

If you haven't already, check out this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=161018

This was sealocusts OCI guide last year and it was invaluable to me and blurbz. A few things to keep in mind for Illinois specifically: We are 100% preselect with unlimited bids. This means you don't have to worry at all about bid strategy. Just bid as many firms as you want.

Do not ever trust the times given on symplicity. You will find out if you've been preselected earlier than the time they tell you, and you will be able to pick your interview slots earlier than they tell you. Last year they said we could start scheduling interviews at noon and it was really like 8:30am. Check that shit as obsessively as you checked for your LSAT score. It's important to be able to get the slots you want. You've got enough to stress out about, you don't want to have to worry about trading spots with people too.

Also, nobody should be relying solely on OCI. Everybody should do mass mailing as well. Even if your target market is Chicago there are still firms, esp smaller ones, that aren't coming to OCI but that doesn't mean they wouldn't hire an Illinois student. Again this is where having data from career services would be nice. Apply at every single firm you can find. Even if you are at the very very top of the class and make law review, nothing is a given.


I actually have a comprehensive list of where the Class of 2012 worked for their 2L summer. Can I post that here?

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Ludo!
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby Ludo! » Sun May 27, 2012 3:51 pm

Yes absolutely. That's exactly the kind of thing I wish they would've sent us last year!

uiucillini23
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby uiucillini23 » Sun May 27, 2012 4:08 pm

Ludovico Technique wrote:Yes absolutely. That's exactly the kind of thing I wish they would've sent us last year!


here's part of the list. I'll see what happens and I hope I don't get into trouble. If this helps people here, let me know and maybe I'll post the whole thing.

Salary Data
Average Starting Salary: $95,232 Median Starting Salary: $77,636


Class of 2012 2L Summer

2011 - Baker & McKenzie in Hong Kong Office
2011 - Schwarzwald, McNair & Fusco LLP (through Peggy Browning Fund), Cleveland OH
2011 - Seyfarth Shaw (labor & employment)
2011-Summer Clerk, Barnes & Thornburg (Chicago, IL)
Summer 2011 - Baker and Daniels - Indianapolis
Summer 2011 - Cabanellas Etchebarne Kelly & Dell'Oro Maini, Buenos Aires, Argentina
Summer 2011 - Chapman and Cutler - Chicago
Summer 2011 - Covington and Burling - Washington, DC
Summer 2011 - Deloitte Tax - Chicago
Summer 2011 - Deloitte Tax in Chicago
Summer 2011 - Drinker Biddle - Chicago
Summer 2011 - Dykema, Chicago Summer 2011 - Drinker Biddle, Chicago
Summer 2011 - Fish and Richardson - Boston
Summer 2011 - Fitzpatrick Cella - Costa Mesa, CA Summer 2011 - Knobbe Martins - Irvine, CA
Summer 2011 - Foley & Lardner - Chicago

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Ludo!
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby Ludo! » Sun May 27, 2012 4:25 pm

Great. That's exactly what career services should be sending out to everybody, along with information about the people that got those jobs.

uiucillini23
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby uiucillini23 » Sun May 27, 2012 5:07 pm

Ludovico Technique wrote:Great. That's exactly what career services should be sending out to everybody, along with information about the people that got those jobs.


I didn't get this from career services...

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Ludo!
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby Ludo! » Sun May 27, 2012 5:16 pm

uiucillini23 wrote:
Ludovico Technique wrote:Great. That's exactly what career services should be sending out to everybody, along with information about the people that got those jobs.


I didn't get this from career services...


Haha, well that's exactly the problem

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diegoforlan10
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby diegoforlan10 » Sun May 27, 2012 9:14 pm

Wait, can someone please explain this to a clueless "rising 1L"...people make 77k in a summer? I'm obviously misinterpreting that, but why is that the median salary?

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Ludo!
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby Ludo! » Sun May 27, 2012 9:21 pm

diegoforlan10 wrote:Wait, can someone please explain this to a clueless "rising 1L"...people make 77k in a summer? I'm obviously misinterpreting that, but why is that the median salary?


No, they are using the full years salary to compute that. Like this summer I am making 160k/year. I just only get that salary for 10 weeks.

Those numbers almost assuredly came from the school whose hope is to mislead you.

uiucillini23
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby uiucillini23 » Sun May 27, 2012 10:20 pm

Ludovico Technique wrote:
diegoforlan10 wrote:Wait, can someone please explain this to a clueless "rising 1L"...people make 77k in a summer? I'm obviously misinterpreting that, but why is that the median salary?


No, they are using the full years salary to compute that. Like this summer I am making 160k/year. I just only get that salary for 10 weeks.

Those numbers almost assuredly came from the school whose hope is to mislead you.


The 77K is not one summer's work. That is the median salary for ppl graduating (Class of 2011).

Do you know which law firms require law review?

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Chupavida
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby Chupavida » Sun May 27, 2012 10:26 pm

.
Last edited by Chupavida on Wed Jun 19, 2013 2:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Ludo!
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby Ludo! » Sun May 27, 2012 11:11 pm

uiucillini23 wrote:
Do you know which law firms require law review?


You can see the hiring criteria on symplicity if you click on the employer's name. Not sure which if any require it, most seem to just say preferred.

Chupavida wrote:Career services is actually in the process of rolling out a system (through symplicity) to provide students with some of the info being discussed. It's been something for which students (particularly one 2012 grad) have been lobbying for years. Now that the office is "under new management," they appear to be making a sincere effort to take action based on student suggestions and feedback.

None of this is to say that there aren't a litany of issues that cry out for reform, but in this, at least, they're making progress.


That is great to hear

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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby uiucillini23 » Sun May 27, 2012 11:35 pm

Ludovico Technique wrote:
uiucillini23 wrote:
Do you know which law firms require law review?


You can see the hiring criteria on symplicity if you click on the employer's name. Not sure which if any require it, most seem to just say preferred.

Chupavida wrote:Career services is actually in the process of rolling out a system (through symplicity) to provide students with some of the info being discussed. It's been something for which students (particularly one 2012 grad) have been lobbying for years. Now that the office is "under new management," they appear to be making a sincere effort to take action based on student suggestions and feedback.

None of this is to say that there aren't a litany of issues that cry out for reform, but in this, at least, they're making progress.


That is great to hear


so the "required" that you said just means "preferred"? Am I correct?

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Ludo!
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby Ludo! » Sun May 27, 2012 11:52 pm

You'd have to click through the individual employers to see but last year there were at least a couple where law review was "required". Not sure about this year. But even if it says that you should still apply. You get unlimited bids so you've got nothing to lose

E: I see now which of my posts probably confused you. When I said employers require either journal or moot court I meant as a practical matter. I don't know anyone who got a biglaw job without one or the other

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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby uiucillini23 » Mon May 28, 2012 1:13 am

Ludovico Technique wrote:You'd have to click through the individual employers to see but last year there were at least a couple where law review was "required". Not sure about this year. But even if it says that you should still apply. You get unlimited bids so you've got nothing to lose

E: I see now which of my posts probably confused you. When I said employers require either journal or moot court I meant as a practical matter. I don't know anyone who got a biglaw job without one or the other


wow really...why would they care about journal so much? it's not even a guarantee that the person's work would get published. i swear someone on this board said that he didn't have journal and still got a biglaw job. maybe he has a 4.00?

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blurbz
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Re: Illinois Law 1L Taking Questions

Postby blurbz » Mon May 28, 2012 1:43 am

uiucillini23 wrote:
Ludovico Technique wrote:You'd have to click through the individual employers to see but last year there were at least a couple where law review was "required". Not sure about this year. But even if it says that you should still apply. You get unlimited bids so you've got nothing to lose

E: I see now which of my posts probably confused you. When I said employers require either journal or moot court I meant as a practical matter. I don't know anyone who got a biglaw job without one or the other


wow really...why would they care about journal so much? it's not even a guarantee that the person's work would get published. i swear someone on this board said that he didn't have journal and still got a biglaw job. maybe he has a 4.00?


That would be me. No journal here, but got market-paying biglaw. Firms say a lot of things on symplicity: Apply even if you don't meet their qualifications. They might see something they like and ask you to interview. I had no journal and I had somewhere between 25 and 30 OCI interviews--I guarantee that a number of those firms said that journal work was ether required or preferred.




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