Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
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brokendowncar
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby brokendowncar » Tue Dec 09, 2008 10:43 pm

rolandtrouble wrote:General questions:

I'm sure a lot of you sacrificed greatly to get into HLS, do you have any general advise for those headed down the same road?

How often do you frequent the "city" ?

Just for fun, Is Bartley's as good as I've heard? :D

Thanks for the time.

I can't say I really sacrificed anything significant to get into HLS. What exactly are you considering giving up?

I hit up the city a lot more when it was warmer (at least once a week). Now that it is cold, I tend to stay closer to the school (more like once a month).

Bartley's is good, definitely a good Harvard place to check out. I doubt you'll go much once you actually come to school here though.

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rolandtrouble
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby rolandtrouble » Tue Dec 09, 2008 11:32 pm

brokendowncar wrote:
rolandtrouble wrote:General questions:

I'm sure a lot of you sacrificed greatly to get into HLS, do you have any general advise for those headed down the same road?

How often do you frequent the "city" ?

Just for fun, Is Bartley's as good as I've heard? :D

Thanks for the time.

I can't say I really sacrificed anything significant to get into HLS. What exactly are you considering giving up?

Well in terms of sacrifice, I mean anything that disrupts the discipline required to have a total package when it comes to admissions. In my case I tend to socialize and party, then cram the night before. It results in decent grades but not the type of grades that will blow away the admissions staff. So I'm going to have to sacrifice a bit of my social life and maintain my sanity.

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brokendowncar
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby brokendowncar » Wed Dec 10, 2008 12:10 am

I didn't sacrifice an ouch of my social life in undergrad and you probably don't have to either. Just start studying earlier, during the days leading up until the exam. Slow and steady can win the race, at least in this case. It certainly takes some discipline to make yourself study in between classes, but it is worth it when your nights are free.

1004LSAT
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby 1004LSAT » Wed Dec 10, 2008 1:00 am

PinkTiki wrote:And something else I think you guys might find interesting which I just found out from a professor. Under the new grading system, professors are required to give out low passes.


Damn it :(

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Objection
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby Objection » Wed Dec 10, 2008 2:02 am

That sucks. So wtf was the point of the change?

Any more details?

Jay Obee
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby Jay Obee » Wed Dec 10, 2008 2:12 am

Other than the name recognition, ranking, and selectivity, why did you choose Harvard over schools like Columbia, Chicago, and NYU (if you applied and got in)?

1004LSAT
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby 1004LSAT » Wed Dec 10, 2008 2:35 am

Objection wrote:That sucks. So wtf was the point of the change?

Any more details?


Yeah, big time. I thought a big reason for the change was to eliminate curves and all the fierce competition that came with them...

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Objection
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby Objection » Wed Dec 10, 2008 6:45 am

Isn't requiring professors to give low pass essentially the same as a curve?

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brokendowncar
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby brokendowncar » Wed Dec 10, 2008 9:29 am

Objection wrote:Isn't requiring professors to give low pass essentially the same as a curve?

Yes - it is really exactly the same as before, just with smaller gradations. The HP=A+/A/A- P=B=/B/B- and LP=C+ and down. The teachers had to grade on the curve before which means they were supposed to give out a few C's. My teacher explained that as long as you aren't actively miss quoting what the law is, you're not going to fall into that bottom zone. Supposedly there is always someone who has zero understanding and those are the people with the LP's.

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JackieTreehorn
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby JackieTreehorn » Wed Dec 10, 2008 10:25 am

brokendowncar wrote:Objection wrote:
Isn't requiring professors to give low pass essentially the same as a curve?

Yes - it is really exactly the same as before, just with smaller gradations. The HP=A+/A/A- P=B=/B/B- and LP=C+ and down. The teachers had to grade on the curve before which means they were supposed to give out a few C's. My teacher explained that as long as you aren't actively miss quoting what the law is, you're not going to fall into that bottom zone. Supposedly there is always someone who has zero understanding and those are the people with the LP's.


Do you think this new system will result in lower stress/competition at all?

Esc
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby Esc » Wed Dec 10, 2008 1:56 pm

.
Last edited by Esc on Fri Nov 20, 2009 1:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

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brokendowncar
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby brokendowncar » Wed Dec 10, 2008 2:15 pm

The reason they removed the minor gradations is because every teacher claimed they couldn't really tell the difference in a B test or a B+ test. If they had been forced to regrade them, they admitted that they wouldn't be able to tell the difference. Supposedly, this will lead to less arbitrary grading.

There are admittedly problems with this grading system, but that is the nature of law school as a whole. Grades will never truly reflect individual students, but on the aggregate it is the best schools will really be able to do.

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brokendowncar
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby brokendowncar » Wed Dec 10, 2008 2:17 pm

JackieTreehorn wrote:
brokendowncar wrote:Objection wrote:
Isn't requiring professors to give low pass essentially the same as a curve?

Yes - it is really exactly the same as before, just with smaller gradations. The HP=A+/A/A- P=B=/B/B- and LP=C+ and down. The teachers had to grade on the curve before which means they were supposed to give out a few C's. My teacher explained that as long as you aren't actively miss quoting what the law is, you're not going to fall into that bottom zone. Supposedly there is always someone who has zero understanding and those are the people with the LP's.


Do you think this new system will result in lower stress/competition at all?

I would say it already has. Almost everyone I know has said, "I am just going to get P's and I am fine with that." When you don't have to worry about the little distinction in B/B+, it has helped people to chill out.

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JackieTreehorn
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby JackieTreehorn » Wed Dec 10, 2008 2:20 pm

Do you know if there's a minimum percentage of low passes per course?

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brokendowncar
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby brokendowncar » Wed Dec 10, 2008 2:21 pm

They won't say, but the teachers do say that it will be a relatively rare grade. The majority of people will get a pass.

Esc
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby Esc » Wed Dec 10, 2008 2:45 pm

.
Last edited by Esc on Sun Jan 10, 2010 1:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Jay Obee
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby Jay Obee » Wed Dec 10, 2008 3:26 pm

Jay Obee wrote:Other than the name recognition, ranking, and selectivity, why did you choose Harvard over schools like Columbia, Chicago, and NYU (if you applied and got in)?


Eh?

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brokendowncar
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby brokendowncar » Wed Dec 10, 2008 3:27 pm

Jay Obee wrote:
Jay Obee wrote:Other than the name recognition, ranking, and selectivity, why did you choose Harvard over schools like Columbia, Chicago, and NYU (if you applied and got in)?


Eh?

Job prospects, size, alumni network, the attitude at ASW, professors, etc...

sluggo
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby sluggo » Wed Dec 10, 2008 7:25 pm

Thanks for the thread. Are there any spots in Cambridge to avoid? I'm toying with the idea of buying a place there and wanted to know if the neighborhood had any significant good/bad spots.

Thanks.

littleboyblue
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby littleboyblue » Wed Dec 10, 2008 8:01 pm

Question about getting your 3L paid for if you commit to PI - is this need based only (for LRAP they look at how much income you have as well as your spouse's income and total assets) or does anyone qualify. Where can I find more info on this - I searched around on the HLS website but didn't see very many details. Thank you.

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brokendowncar
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby brokendowncar » Wed Dec 10, 2008 10:10 pm

littleboyblue wrote:Question about getting your 3L paid for if you commit to PI - is this need based only (for LRAP they look at how much income you have as well as your spouse's income and total assets) or does anyone qualify. Where can I find more info on this - I searched around on the HLS website but didn't see very many details. Thank you.

It is waived completely without regard to need. All you have to do is fulfill a few requirements while here and commit to five years of PI work.

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ndnlawdc
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby ndnlawdc » Wed Dec 10, 2008 10:49 pm

brokendowncar wrote:
littleboyblue wrote:Question about getting your 3L paid for if you commit to PI - is this need based only (for LRAP they look at how much income you have as well as your spouse's income and total assets) or does anyone qualify. Where can I find more info on this - I searched around on the HLS website but didn't see very many details. Thank you.

It is waived completely without regard to need. All you have to do is fulfill a few requirements while here and commit to five years of PI work.


Though if you're expecting a significant need-based package anyway, it might screw it up. That is, you're committing to five years of PI, but you may only be saving $12-15k if you expect a $30k Harvard grant.

I'm not sure what package to expect, so I'm not sure I'm going to do PSI (if I attend HLS) until I get my financial aid package. Though I did confirm (via email) that tribal governments are included in PSI, which was not explicitly mentioned on the website.

littleboyblue
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby littleboyblue » Wed Dec 10, 2008 11:15 pm

brokendowncar wrote:
littleboyblue wrote:Question about getting your 3L paid for if you commit to PI - is this need based only (for LRAP they look at how much income you have as well as your spouse's income and total assets) or does anyone qualify. Where can I find more info on this - I searched around on the HLS website but didn't see very many details. Thank you.

It is waived completely without regard to need. All you have to do is fulfill a few requirements while here and commit to five years of PI work.


Great. Thanks.

Jay Obee
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Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2008 2:29 am

Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby Jay Obee » Thu Dec 11, 2008 8:30 pm

brokendowncar wrote:
Jay Obee wrote:
Jay Obee wrote:Other than the name recognition, ranking, and selectivity, why did you choose Harvard over schools like Columbia, Chicago, and NYU (if you applied and got in)?


Eh?

Job prospects, size, alumni network, the attitude at ASW, professors, etc...


Can you elaborate? All the statistical data seems to put HYSCCN very similar in terms of job prospects and, as a result, I would think alumni network would be about the same. Harvard doesn't always come out at the top of the charts, either.

http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/20080414 ... trends.pdf and http://www.leiterrankings.com/jobs/2008job_biglaw.shtml, for example.

I would also think that professors would be good at all these schools (especially NYU, with Dworkin, et al).

The thing is, with these types of studies in hand, I can't help but think maybe Harvard is overrated once you take lay prestige out of the picture.

1004LSAT
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Re: Ask a Harvard 1L Questions

Postby 1004LSAT » Thu Dec 11, 2008 10:10 pm

I think all that that chart with the employment trends tells you is that more HLS students than CLS student decide to do something other than biglaw (especially judicial clerkships). I have little doubt that, if those students who chose to do clerkships or public interest decided to apply for biglaw jobs, they would probably be hired. I mean, CLS has a higher % of students who work in "other firms"--those are probably students who failed to get biglaw jobs. Very few HLS students end up working for "other firms"--probably because they are either assured a biglaw job, or they didn't want to do biglaw in the first place.

edit: Of course, I really have no idea. You'll get a great job regardless of where you go in the top 6.




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