Cornell 1L taking questions

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kn6542
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby kn6542 » Tue Apr 20, 2010 1:03 am

fsohn wrote: With apologies to my friends going to BigLaw, welcome to the brave new world of over-educated, under-skilled folks not getting paid $160K to be useless tools for several years.

I'm not sure you need to apologize. There are ppl for whom being overpaid to be a useless tool for several years is about the best they can hope for in this life. Yay for them.

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violinst
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby violinst » Tue Apr 20, 2010 1:33 am

kn6542 wrote:
fsohn wrote: With apologies to my friends going to BigLaw, welcome to the brave new world of over-educated, under-skilled folks not getting paid $160K to be useless tools for several years.

I'm not sure you need to apologize. There are ppl for whom being overpaid to be a useless tool for several years is about the best they can hope for in life.



I actually don't mind to be a tool (a tool by nature is somehow useful), as long as I get paid an agreeable amount of money. I am a hired gun, and my personal value does not need to be defined by my profession.

But I do need to get hired first.

In the eyes of NY firms, what's the reputation of Cornell Law? Does Cornell's placement suffer because of its relative low rank among the T14? I find Cornell Law to be truly special, but I am also a hired gun who cares about getting hired.

Any optimistically realistic response?

Edit: deleted some sensitive info. Good read though.

ladiesandgerms
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby ladiesandgerms » Tue Apr 20, 2010 2:05 am

violinst wrote:In the eyes of NY firms, what's the reputation of Cornell Law? Does Cornell's placement suffer because of its relative low rank among the T14? I find Cornell Law to be truly special, but I am also a hired gun who cares about getting hired.

Any optimistically realistic response?

Edit: deleted some sensitive info. Good read though.


Sounds like you should ask any lawyers you may know in NYC. Chances are they'll have a better idea than most on this site. People here seem far more fixated on rankings than the people who will actually be giving us jobs.

As far as NLJ data goes, the whole biglaw status quo is changing in a big way. That's a given. I don't know why its stats dropped a little more than others. No matter how things shake out though, Cornell will still be regarded as one of the best schools in the country (and for NYC employment) not because of how many students it places in law firms with so many lawyers. It'll be because it's a great school with top-notch professors.

Maybe I'm not worrying enough about the data and rankings and all that, but they just don't seem as important as finding a school you're comfortable at, getting a little scholarship money, and studying your ass off 1L year. At some point it's got to be less about what other people think about the school and more about what you think.

fsohn
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby fsohn » Tue Apr 20, 2010 9:38 am

violinst wrote:
kn6542 wrote:
fsohn wrote: With apologies to my friends going to BigLaw, welcome to the brave new world of over-educated, under-skilled folks not getting paid $160K to be useless tools for several years.

I'm not sure you need to apologize. There are ppl for whom being overpaid to be a useless tool for several years is about the best they can hope for in life.



I actually don't mind to be a tool (a tool by nature is somehow useful), as long as I get paid an agreeable amount of money. I am a hired gun, and my personal value does not need to be defined by my profession.

But I do need to get hired first.

In the eyes of NY firms, what's the reputation of Cornell Law? Does Cornell's placement suffer because of its relative low rank among the T14? I find Cornell Law to be truly special, but I am also a hired gun who cares about getting hired.

Any optimistically realistic response?

Edit: deleted some sensitive info. Good read though.


Yes, Cornell suffers from being in the top two percent of law schools around the country. We are just f*cking awful.

If you are looking to make money, get as far the hell away from law school as you can. Any optimistic response at this point is absurd to the point of insanity. Do not come expecting to get rich. It won't happen. Stay away and help end the pollution of the profession of law with the business of law.

Slightly edited for grammar.

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kn6542
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby kn6542 » Tue Apr 20, 2010 1:04 pm

fsohn wrote:
violinst wrote:
kn6542 wrote:
fsohn wrote: With apologies to my friends going to BigLaw, welcome to the brave new world of over-educated, under-skilled folks not getting paid $160K to be useless tools for several years.

I'm not sure you need to apologize. There are ppl for whom being overpaid to be a useless tool for several years is about the best they can hope for in life.



I actually don't mind to be a tool (a tool by nature is somehow useful), as long as I get paid an agreeable amount of money. I am a hired gun, and my personal value does not need to be defined by my profession.

But I do need to get hired first.

In the eyes of NY firms, what's the reputation of Cornell Law? Does Cornell's placement suffer because of its relative low rank among the T14? I find Cornell Law to be truly special, but I am also a hired gun who cares about getting hired.

Any optimistically realistic response?

Edit: deleted some sensitive info. Good read though.


Yes, Cornell suffers from being in the top two percent of law schools around the country. We are just f*cking awful.

If you are looking to make money, get as far the hell away from law school as you can. Any optimistic response at this point is absurd to the point of insanity. Do not come expecting to get rich. It won't happen. Stay away and help end the pollution of the profession of law with the business of law.

Slightly edited for grammar.


Optimistically realistic responses? In other words, Violinist, you don't like what you're hearing and you want someone to say something else. I'm sure someone will pop on here with some numbers, bragging about whatever gross failure of character they are cultivating this week, and you will feel better soon.

If you want to know what Fsohn REALLY thinks, read his column.
http://cornellsun.com/section/opinion/c ... -economics

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violinst
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby violinst » Tue Apr 20, 2010 2:16 pm

kn6542 wrote:
fsohn wrote:
violinst wrote:
kn6542 wrote:I'm not sure you need to apologize. There are ppl for whom being overpaid to be a useless tool for several years is about the best they can hope for in life.



I actually don't mind to be a tool (a tool by nature is somehow useful), as long as I get paid an agreeable amount of money. I am a hired gun, and my personal value does not need to be defined by my profession.

But I do need to get hired first.

In the eyes of NY firms, what's the reputation of Cornell Law? Does Cornell's placement suffer because of its relative low rank among the T14? I find Cornell Law to be truly special, but I am also a hired gun who cares about getting hired.

Any optimistically realistic response?

Edit: deleted some sensitive info. Good read though.


Yes, Cornell suffers from being in the top two percent of law schools around the country. We are just f*cking awful.

If you are looking to make money, get as far the hell away from law school as you can. Any optimistic response at this point is absurd to the point of insanity. Do not come expecting to get rich. It won't happen. Stay away and help end the pollution of the profession of law with the business of law.

Slightly edited for grammar.


Optimistically realistic responses? In other words, Violinist, you don't like what you're hearing and you want someone to say something else. I'm sure someone will pop on here with some numbers, bragging about whatever gross failure of character they are cultivating this week, and you will feel better soon.

If you want to know what Fsohn REALLY thinks, read his column.
http://cornellsun.com/section/opinion/c ... -economics


I read it already (re:good read).

No, I don't want anyone to paint a rosy picture for me. But I do find Fsohn's responses to be on the negative side of the spectrum.

I will eat my own shit if I don't end up at the top 1/3 anywhere (It doesn't mean that I will end up at the 1/3, but just that I wouldn't complain if I don't). But I do care about Cornell's reputation in NYC, especially in comparison to the other T14s'. I don't want eat others' leftovers (jobs) after I have worked my ass off. Will someone with a top-1/3 rank from Cornell have the same opportunities in NYC as another person with the same rank coming from, let's say Michgian, does?
Last edited by violinst on Tue Apr 20, 2010 2:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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violinst
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby violinst » Tue Apr 20, 2010 2:23 pm

ladiesandgerms wrote:
violinst wrote:In the eyes of NY firms, what's the reputation of Cornell Law? Does Cornell's placement suffer because of its relative low rank among the T14? I find Cornell Law to be truly special, but I am also a hired gun who cares about getting hired.

Any optimistically realistic response?

Edit: deleted some sensitive info. Good read though.


Sounds like you should ask any lawyers you may know in NYC. Chances are they'll have a better idea than most on this site. People here seem far more fixated on rankings than the people who will actually be giving us jobs.

As far as NLJ data goes, the whole biglaw status quo is changing in a big way. That's a given. I don't know why its stats dropped a little more than others. No matter how things shake out though, Cornell will still be regarded as one of the best schools in the country (and for NYC employment) not because of how many students it places in law firms with so many lawyers. It'll be because it's a great school with top-notch professors.

Maybe I'm not worrying enough about the data and rankings and all that, but they just don't seem as important as finding a school you're comfortable at, getting a little scholarship money, and studying your ass off 1L year. At some point it's got to be less about what other people think about the school and more about what you think.


I don't know any lawyers in NYC.

Yes, I absolutely agree with you. It is how I perform that will make or break my career. But at the same time, I also want to maximize my chances through other means (networking, connections, and, also importantly, school reputation). I don't care about what other people think. But if they all think in a certain way, I will have to deal with it.

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violinst
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby violinst » Tue Apr 20, 2010 2:57 pm

fsohn wrote:
violinst wrote:
kn6542 wrote:
fsohn wrote: With apologies to my friends going to BigLaw, welcome to the brave new world of over-educated, under-skilled folks not getting paid $160K to be useless tools for several years.

I'm not sure you need to apologize. There are ppl for whom being overpaid to be a useless tool for several years is about the best they can hope for in life.



I actually don't mind to be a tool (a tool by nature is somehow useful), as long as I get paid an agreeable amount of money. I am a hired gun, and my personal value does not need to be defined by my profession.

But I do need to get hired first.

In the eyes of NY firms, what's the reputation of Cornell Law? Does Cornell's placement suffer because of its relative low rank among the T14? I find Cornell Law to be truly special, but I am also a hired gun who cares about getting hired.

Any optimistically realistic response?

Edit: deleted some sensitive info. Good read though.


Yes, Cornell suffers from being in the top two percent of law schools around the country. We are just f*cking awful.

If you are looking to make money, get as far the hell away from law school as you can. Any optimistic response at this point is absurd to the point of insanity. Do not come expecting to get rich. It won't happen. Stay away and help end the pollution of the profession of law with the business of law.

Slightly edited for grammar.


I was talking about Cornell's reputation within the T14s.
I don't expect anything before I get my grade.
It will happen for some (many, perhaps) of us.
The profession of law is a business. In my opinion, law itself is no different from business, as neither would exist in an Utopian world where everything is perfect and efficient. My past profession, however, would THRIVE in such a world. And that's why I quit.

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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby kn6542 » Tue Apr 20, 2010 9:02 pm

violinst wrote:No, I don't want anyone to paint a rosy picture for me. But I do find Fsohn's responses to be on the negative side of the spectrum.

I will eat my own shit if I don't end up at the top 1/3 anywhere (It doesn't mean that I will end up at the 1/3, but just that I wouldn't complain if I don't). But I do care about Cornell's reputation in NYC, especially in comparison to the other T14s'. I don't want eat others' leftovers (jobs) after I have worked my ass off. Will someone with a top-1/3 rank from Cornell have the same opportunities in NYC as another person with the same rank coming from, let's say Michgian, does?


No clue, but like I said, someone who came to cornell with biglaw ambitions will surely step in with some opinion or another. Good luck.

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violinst
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby violinst » Tue Apr 20, 2010 9:04 pm

kn6542 wrote:
violinst wrote:No, I don't want anyone to paint a rosy picture for me. But I do find Fsohn's responses to be on the negative side of the spectrum.

I will eat my own shit if I don't end up at the top 1/3 anywhere (It doesn't mean that I will end up at the 1/3, but just that I wouldn't complain if I don't). But I do care about Cornell's reputation in NYC, especially in comparison to the other T14s'. I don't want eat others' leftovers (jobs) after I have worked my ass off. Will someone with a top-1/3 rank from Cornell have the same opportunities in NYC as another person with the same rank coming from, let's say Michgian, does?


No clue, but like I said, someone who came to cornell with biglaw ambitions will surely step in with some opinion or another. Good luck.


Thanks. I will take my chances then.

woeisme
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby woeisme » Wed Apr 21, 2010 12:16 am

violinst wrote:
No, I don't want anyone to paint a rosy picture for me. But I do find Fsohn's responses to be on the negative side of the spectrum.

I will eat my own shit if I don't end up at the top 1/3 anywhere (It doesn't mean that I will end up at the 1/3, but just that I wouldn't complain if I don't). But I do care about Cornell's reputation in NYC, especially in comparison to the other T14s'. I don't want eat others' leftovers (jobs) after I have worked my ass off. Will someone with a top-1/3 rank from Cornell have the same opportunities in NYC as another person with the same rank coming from, let's say Michgian, does?


Yeah for sure. In the aggregate, for NYC Cornell is roughly equal to Michigan, if not slightly better. There was a thread a while back actually about Cornell and Michigan job prospects at big NYC firms. Cornell looked pretty good. We get lots of NYC firms at our OCIs.

jms116
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby jms116 » Tue Apr 27, 2010 2:09 pm

Hey,

I just got an apartment for next year on college ave across from collegetown bagels. Its about 2 blocks from the law school. How is this location as far as social life? Do people go out around there?

woeisme
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby woeisme » Tue Apr 27, 2010 2:24 pm

jms116 wrote:Hey,

I just got an apartment for next year on college ave across from collegetown bagels. Its about 2 blocks from the law school. How is this location as far as social life? Do people go out around there?


Definitely

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kn6542
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby kn6542 » Tue Apr 27, 2010 4:44 pm

jms116 wrote:Hey,

I just got an apartment for next year on college ave across from collegetown bagels. Its about 2 blocks from the law school. How is this location as far as social life? Do people go out around there?

Where else would they go?

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MusicNutMeggie
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby MusicNutMeggie » Wed Apr 28, 2010 12:49 pm

In going through the lists of student groups, I noticed that there doesn't seem to be an OUTLaws chapter at Cornell. Is this the case? There does seem to be Lambda Legal, but the site says that they're not currently meeting. It looks like the LGBT Resource Center (or whatever it's called) for the university it pretty active, but I'm especially curious about societies specific to the law school. Can anybody help me out here?

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MusicNutMeggie
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby MusicNutMeggie » Wed Apr 28, 2010 12:50 pm

Sorry to double-post, but speaking of societies on campus, I know there's a Jewish law student association of some kind-- what kind of stuff do they do? Mostly socializing? Or social justice? And can anybody speak to the quality of programming at Hillel? Is there a Chabad on campus?

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mbw
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby mbw » Wed Apr 28, 2010 1:31 pm

MusicNutMeggie wrote:In going through the lists of student groups, I noticed that there doesn't seem to be an OUTLaws chapter at Cornell. Is this the case? There does seem to be Lambda Legal, but the site says that they're not currently meeting. It looks like the LGBT Resource Center (or whatever it's called) for the university it pretty active, but I'm especially curious about societies specific to the law school. Can anybody help me out here?


There's a very active Lambda group at the law school, with both LGTBs and allies participating.

doublefistermilehigh
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby doublefistermilehigh » Wed Apr 28, 2010 6:09 pm

kn6542 wrote:
jms116 wrote:Hey,

I just got an apartment for next year on college ave across from collegetown bagels. Its about 2 blocks from the law school. How is this location as far as social life? Do people go out around there?

Where else would they go?


They would natch go to the Arbys, Subway, and Whole Foods for they're "unfeasible salads." People in today's day and age are looking for something a little bit more sophisticated than your average bagel joint. They demand variety and exciting, diverse selections. Hope this helps! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Love,
Doublefister

P.S. this kid needs to change his picture because it still makes him look like the complete fool ( :shock: )he is.

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dmcbride
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby dmcbride » Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:18 pm

This thread has been great, I have a couple questions I didn't see response to:

1. Are there any bars with a good beer selection?

2. Is there a good variety of places to go out or do law students tend to go to the same places over and over?

3. Does Ithaca get a lot of concerts/other events or would you have to go out of town to see a band/comedian/show?

4. What do law students do on a typical Friday, Saturday night?

5. Are there any points of interest in the region that are worth visiting on a day trip?

Thanks in advance!

woeisme
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby woeisme » Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:41 pm

dmcbride wrote:This thread has been great, I have a couple questions I didn't see response to:

1. Are there any bars with a good beer selection?


Yeah, there are a bunch of them. Chapterhouse is the one that most graduate students go to supposedly, though I've only gone a few times.

dmcbride wrote:2. Is there a good variety of places to go out or do law students tend to go to the same places over and over?


Eh... probably the latter. There's enough for variety for our purposes, though.

dmcbride wrote:3. Does Ithaca get a lot of concerts/other events or would you have to go out of town to see a band/comedian/show?


The former. Cornell pulls a lot of good entertainment. And so does Ithaca. Girl Talk was here last year. Maybe Ludacris? I know Flaming Lips were just here. Good stuff.

dmcbride wrote:4. What do law students do on a typical Friday, Saturday night?


Depends on the person. Some are into the bar scene. There are often house parties. Etc.

dmcbride wrote:5. Are there any points of interest in the region that are worth visiting on a day trip?


Probably, iono.

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kn6542
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby kn6542 » Wed Apr 28, 2010 9:57 pm

dmcbride wrote:
1. Are there any bars with a good beer selection?

Yeah, I agree with woe about Chapterhouse. They have a pretty large selection. Also, the Bandwagon Brewpub in the commons is relatively new. I don't know much about it, as I haven't been yet. Dunno if their beer is good. I'm an IPA person, but ppl keep talking about their Raspberry Jalapeno beer.

dmcbride wrote:2. Is there a good variety of places to go out or do law students tend to go to the same places over and over?

I think ppl tend to go to the same places. It's a small town. But you won't have a lot of time for going out anyway.

dmcbride wrote:3. Does Ithaca get a lot of concerts/other events or would you have to go out of town to see a band/comedian/show?


Yeah, some. It's not going to be like a big city, of course, but stuff comes through. Decemberists, Sufjan Stevens, Flaming Lips, etc came to Cornell proper, but there are other venues around town. Castaways is a common one. You might want to check out:
--LinkRemoved--
--LinkRemoved--
http://www.castawaysithaca.com/

dmcbride wrote:4. What do law students do on a typical Friday, Saturday night?


Really depends on the person. A lot of ppl like to go to clubs, it seems.

dmcbride wrote:5. Are there any points of interest in the region that are worth visiting on a day trip?


Depends on what you're interested in. There is good hiking and snowshoeing nearby.

fsohn
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby fsohn » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:58 am

dmcbride wrote:This thread has been great, I have a couple questions I didn't see response to:

1. Are there any bars with a good beer selection?

2. Is there a good variety of places to go out or do law students tend to go to the same places over and over?

3. Does Ithaca get a lot of concerts/other events or would you have to go out of town to see a band/comedian/show?

4. What do law students do on a typical Friday, Saturday night?

5. Are there any points of interest in the region that are worth visiting on a day trip?

Thanks in advance!



I'll add to what people have already said.

3) If you are into country at all, a lot of country acts come to the area on tour, so you can go see them. Willie Nelson came to Binghamton, Phil Vassar came to Ithaca, etc. Not that Willie Nelson and Phil Vassar should be mentioned together, but such is the state of affairs here.

5) The wine trail is fun if you get enough people together to do it. Seneca Falls is boring, but historically important. Lucille Ball's hometown isn't too far away. So, the general answer is no, there's not much.

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dmcbride
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby dmcbride » Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:42 am

Thanks for the replies!

One other question: Generally speaking how good is cell reception in Ithaca and specifically T-Mobile?

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MusicNutMeggie
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby MusicNutMeggie » Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:06 pm

mbw wrote:
MusicNutMeggie wrote:In going through the lists of student groups, I noticed that there doesn't seem to be an OUTLaws chapter at Cornell. Is this the case? There does seem to be Lambda Legal, but the site says that they're not currently meeting. It looks like the LGBT Resource Center (or whatever it's called) for the university it pretty active, but I'm especially curious about societies specific to the law school. Can anybody help me out here?


There's a very active Lambda group at the law school, with both LGTBs and allies participating.


Thanks!

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violinst
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Re: Cornell 1L taking questions

Postby violinst » Thu Apr 29, 2010 6:54 pm

How is the graded Lawyering class? Is it a (huge and unnecessary) burden or is it intellectually stimulating enough to offset the grading disadvantage?




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