Question regarding seriousness of job offer

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future liT1g4tor
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Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby future liT1g4tor » Thu Jan 12, 2017 5:49 pm

Hello all, I didn't really know what title to put, and also I know this section is not for 0Ls but unless it can be placed better in a different section I will post it here.

I live in a large west coast city of 1million+ and I am an UG with a 4.0 GPA, Dean's list, honors, etc. I started school at 21 at my CC, got a 4.0 and transferred out, I am currently 23 and 1 year away from graduation. I am T14 or Bust (Plus Vandy) but have plan B which is I can go to my UG's law school which is fairly cheap and I can probably get a full ride. Although I will most likely go to a t14.

Today I went to court to attend to my wife's case to meet with an attorney I retained, I brought my father-in-lawfather-in-law along. After entering the court building i stopped to look at all the cases and asked this older man for directions to the courtroom I had to go to.

After answering, my father-in-law is like "Hey what's up, man!". After a confused stare, the man realized who my father-in-law was and apparently they were very close in high school and still kept up to date, just not recently. So I speak to him and he says I can intern at the DA's office. He is really high up the food chain and oversees approx. 150 attorneys, perhaps just under the DA. (He couldve been DA but didn't want to run due to smear campaign)

I told him I want to be a litigator, and he says no you don't, wait until you get your first murder trial, matter of fact after you finish law school with all honesty come see me and you'll be an ADA. I want to go BigLaw and I obviously would much rather do so than be a DA. Even without BigLaw I don't think I would want to be a DA, although I would try it out and honestly I think it's a good idea to do for a year or so prior to transitioning to criminal defense on top of doing litigation, if I were to go solo.

My question is how serious can I take such statement? If he guaranteed me a position at the DA's office, is it just like that? Additionally, why do I read on these forums that it's fairly hard to get into a DA's office but he said he'lll hire me just like that without even knowing me, except stating that he likes my appearance/persona.

Is it simply just based on connections ? Obviously I knew it is like everything else, but mainly, is it that easy to just get in and should I take his offer serious ? (I wouldn't say offer more like a statement since it's a offer 4 years from now, lol, but he assured me he'll be there for at least 10 years to come). Thank you.

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lymenheimer
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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby lymenheimer » Thu Jan 12, 2017 5:52 pm

Idk. Maybe read this?
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=170603

Better start acting in reliance or else he will be able to withdraw the offer at any time. (#notlegaladvice)

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Thu Jan 12, 2017 5:55 pm

This is exactly what the Ask a Law Student/Graduate forum is for, so I've moved it.

And no, I don't think he's guaranteed you a position. Keep in touch with him and if you want to work in that office it's a great connection to have (and yes connections are very important) but you don't have a job offer until you have an actual job offer.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby kellyfrost » Thu Jan 12, 2017 5:59 pm

future liT1g4tor wrote:Hello all, I didn't really know what title to put, and also I know this section is not for 0Ls but unless it can be placed better in a different section I will post it here.

I live in a large west coast city of 1million+ and I am an UG with a 4.0 GPA, Dean's list, honors, etc. I started school at 21 at my CC, got a 4.0 and transferred out, I am currently 23 and 1 year away from graduation. I am T14 or Bust (Plus Vandy) but have plan B which is I can go to my UG's law school which is fairly cheap and I can probably get a full ride. Although I will most likely go to a t14.

Today I went to court to attend to my wife's case to meet with an attorney I retained, I brought my father-in-lawfather-in-law along. After entering the court building i stopped to look at all the cases and asked this older man for directions to the courtroom I had to go to.

After answering, my father-in-law is like "Hey what's up, man!". After a confused stare, the man realized who my father-in-law was and apparently they were very close in high school and still kept up to date, just not recently. So I speak to him and he says I can intern at the DA's office. He is really high up the food chain and oversees approx. 150 attorneys, perhaps just under the DA. (He couldve been DA but didn't want to run due to smear campaign)

I told him I want to be a litigator, and he says no you don't, wait until you get your first murder trial, matter of fact after you finish law school with all honesty come see me and you'll be an ADA. I want to go BigLaw and I obviously would much rather do so than be a DA. Even without BigLaw I don't think I would want to be a DA, although I would try it out and honestly I think it's a good idea to do for a year or so prior to transitioning to criminal defense on top of doing litigation, if I were to go solo.

My question is how serious can I take such statement? If he guaranteed me a position at the DA's office, is it just like that? Additionally, why do I read on these forums that it's fairly hard to get into a DA's office but he said he'lll hire me just like that without even knowing me, except stating that he likes my appearance/persona.

Is it simply just based on connections ? Obviously I knew it is like everything else, but mainly, is it that easy to just get in and should I take his offer serious ? (I wouldn't say offer more like a statement since it's a offer 4 years from now, lol, but he assured me he'll be there for at least 10 years to come). Thank you.


This was a strange post...

The things that caught me as strange are underlined above.

While you may have an offer, what is the consideration?

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mjb447
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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby mjb447 » Thu Jan 12, 2017 6:04 pm

Agreeing with the consensus - keep in touch during law school and reach out again when you're closer to graduating if you're interested in a position there, but this isn't close to a guarantee of a job offer.

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future liT1g4tor
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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby future liT1g4tor » Thu Jan 12, 2017 6:56 pm

kellyfrost wrote:This was a strange post...

The things that caught me as strange are underlined above.

While you may have an offer, what is the consideration?


What exactly is strange about it? Tell me in a little bit more detail and I will clarify it.

1. I was meeting with an attorney to discuss a case relating to a matter regarding my wife.
2. My attorney said the more that show up to court the merrier, as far as bringing my father-in-law is concerned.
3. Those are exactly the words he said. Randomly and quite loud, "What's up man" was said in an older person's tone, of course, not "Whaddup Mayne".

4. He put the current District Attorney in office, prior to being the DA, he was in private practice and had a firm that still is online with his name listed as closed. He was going to run because he knew he could beat the opposition, although he knew they would smear his campaign with regard to some family issues not directly involving him, and he didn't want them to go through it, so he had an acquaintance run in his place. Although he isn't the sole reason why such and such is DA.

5. After graduating LS, if I choose to do so, he'll make me a DA to show that when I go on onto litigation, (if I still want to, which i'm sure I will) there is nothing like "doing a murder trial to see what the law is about".

6. I know a couple of lawyers that have very successful (250k+/yr) solos that started out as a prosecutor 1-4 years in. They get the best pleas, and even get immunity to people in certain cases when testifying. I assume getting someone immunity to testify for your client couldn't be done as easy without having personal friends in your phone at the DA's office?

7. This one is pretty self-explanatory, I mean he just out of nowhere says I am free to work at the DA's office when I get out of Law School, it could've been courtesy, due to knowing my father-in-law, but he was serious about it and said he can make me a DA "just like that".
8. I'm Swagga-Right Shawty, what do you expect? :D :D

9. It's not a job offer, since I can't accept it and get the job. That's where the confusion comes along. He is asserting to me that through him I can work at the DA's office, he offered me an internship, and I am just wondering if he really has the power to make me a DA "just like that".

Also, if someone can guess which one, this DA office has their own TV show, just recently, they currently finished filming season 2 and are waiting to see if they will air it, due to many lawyers objecting saying it violates the rights of defendants, etc.

In addition to all this, would the internship be beneficial to me getting accepted into that one extra T14 school? As far as establishing that I know what I am in for, even though I don't necessarily want to be a DA, it shows I at least have a picture of what criminal law and somewhat of a trial attorney is about.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby mjb447 » Thu Jan 12, 2017 7:24 pm

future liT1g4tor wrote:
kellyfrost wrote:This was a strange post...

The things that caught me as strange are underlined above.

While you may have an offer, what is the consideration?


What exactly is strange about it? Tell me in a little bit more detail and I will clarify it.

1. I was meeting with an attorney to discuss a case relating to a matter regarding my wife.
2. My attorney said the more that show up to court the merrier, as far as bringing my father-in-law is concerned.
3. Those are exactly the words he said. Randomly and quite loud, "What's up man" was said in an older person's tone, of course, not "Whaddup Mayne".

4. He put the current District Attorney in office, prior to being the DA, he was in private practice and had a firm that still is online with his name listed as closed. He was going to run because he knew he could beat the opposition, although he knew they would smear his campaign with regard to some family issues not directly involving him, and he didn't want them to go through it, so he had an acquaintance run in his place. Although he isn't the sole reason why such and such is DA.

5. After graduating LS, if I choose to do so, he'll make me a DA to show that when I go on onto litigation, (if I still want to, which i'm sure I will) there is nothing like "doing a murder trial to see what the law is about".

6. I know a couple of lawyers that have very successful (250k+/yr) solos that started out as a prosecutor 1-4 years in. They get the best pleas, and even get immunity to people in certain cases when testifying. I assume getting someone immunity to testify for your client couldn't be done as easy without having personal friends in your phone at the DA's office?

7. This one is pretty self-explanatory, I mean he just out of nowhere says I am free to work at the DA's office when I get out of Law School, it could've been courtesy, due to knowing my father-in-law, but he was serious about it and said he can make me a DA "just like that".
8. I'm Swagga-Right Shawty, what do you expect? :D :D

9. It's not a job offer, since I can't accept it and get the job. That's where the confusion comes along. He is asserting to me that through him I can work at the DA's office, he offered me an internship, and I am just wondering if he really has the power to make me a DA "just like that".

Also, if someone can guess which one, this DA office has their own TV show, just recently, they currently finished filming season 2 and are waiting to see if they will air it, due to many lawyers objecting saying it violates the rights of defendants, etc.

In addition to all this, would the internship be beneficial to me getting accepted into that one extra T14 school? As far as establishing that I know what I am in for, even though I don't necessarily want to be a DA, it shows I at least have a picture of what criminal law and somewhat of a trial attorney is about.

This is a weird "clarification," if that's even what it is. And I don't think an internship will move the needle much for law school admissions.

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future liT1g4tor
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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby future liT1g4tor » Thu Jan 12, 2017 7:30 pm

That wasn't me clarifying.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby cavalier1138 » Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:06 pm

future liT1g4tor wrote:That wasn't me clarifying.


It sure looked like clarification...

What, exactly, do you want from this thread? This was not a valid job offer, but it's a good start. Stay in contact and see if it turns into anything (assuming you still want to be an ADA after law school).

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby future liT1g4tor » Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:11 pm

cavalier1138 wrote:
It sure looked like clarification...

What, exactly, do you want from this thread? This was not a valid job offer, but it's a good start. Stay in contact and see if it turns into anything (assuming you still want to be an ADA after law school).


I do not want to be an ADA necessarily, unless I don't go T14 and don't get into BigLaw & start my own practice since I have an entrepreneurial background I think I can succeed that way. If that is the case, sure I would do it for a year or so and see what it is like and gain some connections. Mainly from this thread I was just wondering about the seriousness of the whole ordeal. Opposed to me saying I am an undergrad and I am an attorney, would he of said the same thing? Who knows, depending on the situation I was in. I just found it quite strange because I see people on here saying its pretty hard to get into the DA's office and they are applying all over, and without me mentioning anything, he says I can make you an ADA just like that.

So mainly I was just wondering the seriousness of it, it wasn't in a joking manner. I get that it isn't a serious matter either since I am in UG and it is not a offer, just something to say. Although I did follow it up with how about an internship and he said of course, come by my office.

Basically, yeah, it's like what you guys have said. The most I can do is follow up with it and it is a good connection to have and it is what it is. Maybe if I intern I can get some info on hiring and contribute to the TLS community. :D

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:50 pm

People say all kinds of things for all kinds of reasons. He probably wanted to make a good impression on your dad and look like an important guy. And maybe he does have enough pull to get you hired - different offices operate differently. Him saying he can make you an ADA doesn't make it an easy job to get, for all the people out there who aren't you and don't have your connection with him.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby kellyfrost » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:09 am

This thread is strange. It took an even stranger turn when OP started clarifying.

Let's not forget, he isn't even enrolled in law school. First he must be admitted, then graduate, then pass the bar. After doing all of those, maybe he could be hired at the DA office.
Those are significant hurdles at this point in the story.

What an odd god damn story to tell though, Jesus.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby mjb447 » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:45 am

kellyfrost wrote:This thread is strange. It took an even stranger turn when OP started clarifying.

Let's not forget, he isn't even enrolled in law school. First he must be admitted, then graduate, then pass the bar. After doing all of those, maybe he could be hired at the DA office.
Those are significant hurdles at this point in the story.

What an odd god damn story to tell though, Jesus.

The additional details were not intended to clarify anything; OP has been very clear about that. (And, in fairness, they didn't.)

/snark

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby Thomas Hagan, ESQ. » Fri Jan 13, 2017 2:14 am

Are you asking how serious somebody, when that person made you an offer?? Not sure how anyone here would know that...

Why not just shoot him a friendly follow-up email, showing that you're actually considering his offer? You'll definitely be able to gauge his seriousness/show him that you're interested.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby future liT1g4tor » Fri Jan 13, 2017 5:33 am

kellyfrost wrote:This thread is strange. It took an even stranger turn when OP started clarifying.

Let's not forget, he isn't even enrolled in law school. First he must be admitted, then graduate, then pass the bar. After doing all of those, maybe he could be hired at the DA office.
Those are significant hurdles at this point in the story.

What an odd god damn story to tell though, Jesus.


Okay, as if getting admitted & graduating law school is hard? And passing the bar? I have done some things in life that were hard to overcome. Getting a good GPA and mastering a standardized test is not two of them. I'm not saying I will be 4.0/180, but you were implying as if I was going to be an astronaut or a CEO of a pharmaceutical company that I solely raised the capital through my own hedge fund to buy my way in & climb up the food chain, that would be somewhat hard, not as hard as the astronaut thing, though.

As for the bar, who would go to Law School & not pass the bar, even if it took me years to do it (which it wouldn't) I would still try to do it. & I have been honest during my UG and will continue to do so during LS & no criminal record/ethical issues. Also after it all, no I most likely wouldn't be at the DA's office. I only asked one thing, no significant hurdles.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby future liT1g4tor » Fri Jan 13, 2017 5:39 am

mjb447 wrote:
kellyfrost wrote:This thread is strange. It took an even stranger turn when OP started clarifying.

Let's not forget, he isn't even enrolled in law school. First he must be admitted, then graduate, then pass the bar. After doing all of those, maybe he could be hired at the DA office.
Those are significant hurdles at this point in the story.

What an odd god damn story to tell though, Jesus.

The additional details were not intended to clarify anything; OP has been very clear about that. (And, in fairness, they didn't.)

/snark


The irony of trying to be sarcastic to someone that was displaying sarcasm that you didn't even notice. Did you really think I would seriously make a bulletin board about what kellyfrost outlined :D

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future liT1g4tor
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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby future liT1g4tor » Fri Jan 13, 2017 5:46 am

This is why I seldom post on TLS, due to the fact that I am always explaining myself, which is quite the opposite of your average TLSer. There are many great people on here, but most give the impression of your average law school graduate and they are making the profession look weak. The law is your master. This country was founded by lawyers, for lawyers, and you have a law degree and you can't make a decent living for yourself? Hiding behind anonymous accounts, not revealing anything about your personal lives as if you are so important & someone will out you and it will matter, you can say I haven't been in a law firm environment and those things can affect you, but with all honestly if it doesn't effect my work life, I would box one of these other lawyers if they pull any bs with me at my 180k+ job that is not work related. Do you think someone that is on their way to become a partner at a top firm will care about that unless they have a strategic reason for doing so? I get many people on TLS do, but not necessarily.

This profession has many educated people, great UG, great law school, not great lawyers/entrepreneurs & that is what is wrong with it. You can't bash someone that really wants to be a lawyer, I started school at 21 only because I wanted to be a lawyer! You have people that graduated from HARVARD LAW that cannot find a job, do you really think there is something wrong with the system or the people that the system is comprised of on a large scale? Of course there are TTT law schools, but there are TTT applicants that are going to law schools all over. Btw, this was not directed at anybody in this thread.
Last edited by future liT1g4tor on Wed Aug 09, 2017 2:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby ToGetIntoTheBoysHole » Fri Jan 13, 2017 6:38 am

^this makes sense

Btw OPs avatar is perfect #iamverysmart

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby rpupkin » Fri Jan 13, 2017 6:54 am

OP, you should reconsider your choice of career. You're a poor writer and you struggle to express yourself. I suggest working for at least a couple of years before attending law school.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby kellyfrost » Fri Jan 13, 2017 8:07 am

future liT1g4tor wrote:
kellyfrost wrote:This thread is strange. It took an even stranger turn when OP started clarifying.

Let's not forget, he isn't even enrolled in law school. First he must be admitted, then graduate, then pass the bar. After doing all of those, maybe he could be hired at the DA office.
Those are significant hurdles at this point in the story.

What an odd god damn story to tell though, Jesus.


Okay, as if getting admitted & graduating law school is hard? And passing the bar? I have done some things in life that were hard to overcome. Getting a good GPA and mastering a standardized test is not two of them. I'm not saying I will be 4.0/180, but you were implying as if I was going to be an astronaut or a CEO of a pharmaceutical company that I solely raised the capital through my own hedge fund to buy my way in & climb up the food chain, that would be somewhat hard, not as hard as the astronaut thing, though.

As for the bar, who would go to Law School & not pass the bar, even if it took me years to do it (which it wouldn't) I would still try to do it. & I have been honest during my UG and will continue to do so during LS & no criminal record/ethical issues. Also after it all, no I most likely wouldn't be at the DA's office. I only asked one thing, no significant hurdles.


Yep, this confirms that you most likely will be editor of a T6 Law Review and top 5% of your class. As for the bar exam, you should strongly consider taking the exam in Arizona, Texas, or Ohio as these states recognize the examinee who scores the highest score during each administration. You wouldn't want to put your score to waste by simply being a "Pass" like many of the rest of us. Not to mention, if this DA employee wasn't genuine in his offer or was maybe "on the fence" then this would persuade him.

I hope you stay active on the forum and we can follow you throughout your law school and beginning career. I am really curious how this strange story pans out. I had a hard time sleeping last night because I kept thinking about this and wondering:
Was this rock star DA employee, who knows his father-in-law, serious? How serious should he take this offer? Is or was it a job offer?
Last edited by kellyfrost on Fri Jan 13, 2017 8:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby kellyfrost » Fri Jan 13, 2017 8:11 am

future liT1g4tor wrote:This is why I seldom post on TLS, due to the fact that I am always explaining myself, which is quite the opposite of your average TLSer. There are many great people on here, but most give the impression of your average law school graduate and they are making the profession look weak. The law is your master. This country was founded by lawyers, for lawyers, and you have a law degree and you can't make a decent living for yourself? Hiding behind anonymous accounts, not revealing anything about your personal lives as if you are so important & someone will out you and it will matter, you can say I haven't been in a law firm environment and those things can affect you, but with all honestly if it doesn't effect my work life, I would box one of these other lawyers if they pull any bs with me at my 180k+ job that is not work related. Do you think someone that is on there way to become a partner at a top firm will care about that unless they have a strategic reason for doing so? I get many people on TLS do, but not necessarily.

This profession has many educated people, great UG, great law school, not great lawyers/entrepreneurs & that is what is wrong with it. You can't bash someone that really wants to be a lawyer, I started school at 21 only because I wanted to be a lawyer! You have people that graduated from HARVARD LAW that cannot find a job, do you really think there is something wrong with the system or the people that the system is comprised of on a large scale? Of course there are TTT law schools, but there are TTT applicants that are going to law schools all over. Btw, this was not directed at anybody in this thread.



This post alone demonstrates why you should postpone your applications to law schools.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby ToGetIntoTheBoysHole » Fri Jan 13, 2017 8:52 am

kellyfrost wrote:This post alone demonstrates why you should postpone your applications to law schools.


Lol I read that post and was like preach brotha! Although, I do get the sense that english might not be OPs first language. If that is indeed the case, no hate on him, just hope he keeps working on it

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby cavalier1138 » Fri Jan 13, 2017 9:01 am

ToGetIntoTheBoysHole wrote:Lol I read that post and was like preach brotha! Although, I do get the sense that english might not be OPs first language. If that is indeed the case, no hate on him, just hope he keeps working on it


English is his first language. Non-native speakers don't make the "should of" mistake or overuse commas. Those are classic mistakes for native speakers who never quite got the hang of written communication.

OP: I was going to give you the benefit of the doubt until your little screed against the "system". You aren't as smart as you think you are, and it's better that you figure that out now instead of after you can't get a job out of the local TTT law school.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby blueapple » Fri Jan 13, 2017 9:05 am

Take an internship with his office either before law school or during 1L summer, see if you like it. If you do, keep in touch with the guy throughout law school. Even if you think you'll go into biglaw, keep in touch with the guy because most people think they'll go into biglaw and it doesn't work out. Like everyone said this wasn't a real offer, but it does seem like an offer to be a mentor to you. You just need to keep in touch with him.

Also lots of people fail the bar and never pass it. You're being rude and sound entitled.

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Re: Question regarding seriousness of job offer

Postby ToGetIntoTheBoysHole » Fri Jan 13, 2017 9:08 am

cavalier1138 wrote: Non-native speakers don't make the "should of" mistake or overuse commas. Those are classic mistakes for native speakers who never quite got the hang of written communication.


Interesting... Something I'll have to keep an eye out for in the future




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