Really Bad Grades 1st Semester Forum

[Shelled]

The "not going to stress" part may have been poorly worded by the OP or misinterpreted by the hive (which is kind of what I think happened) but if the OP means what it sounds like then the OP should definitely cut his/her losses now

I think it comes down to the strength of the OP's THIRST for JUSTICE and how much the OP just NEEDS to be a lawyer, and the OP's debt level. If the OP is like the other 97% of law students who are just kind of doing the law school thing cuz "Meh, whatever, what else do you want me to do, get a job?" then the OP should drop out. Or, if the OP is going like 100K in debt (decently likely if not on a full ride) for some middling to bad-ish school (decently likely when the school has scholly stips) then the OP should drop out (unless maybe that THIRST is simply UNQUENCHABLE I guess).

If that was me, knowing what I know now (which is impossible of course because how could 0L me know what 3L me knows?) then I would drop out.

this is shitty advice. do not listen to this advice. it has nothing to do with your grades. it is just unabashedly shitty advice. thirst for justice has nothing to do with hiring. "meh" is THE worst attitude anyone has towards legal hiring. the thirst is real regardless of T14 or not,

Yes, this is TERRIBLE ADVICE. OP, don't even bother reading this advice.

[Shelled]

What, if anything, makes you qualified to opine on the quality of Zuck's advice?

When someone gives that poor of advice someone should interfere whether qualified or not.

With all due respect, I read your advice thread, and its full of suggestions that are awful. For instance working as a paralegal with a jd.

Ladies and Gentlemen:
Clearly scored a 176 on his LSAT; therefore, all questions seeking advice should be directed at him. He knows everything (well, except for the handful of LSAT questions he missed) and career advice appears to be his speciality.

[PeanutsNJam]

oops

[BigZuck]

I'm going to insist that you dum dums back up why you think the drop out advice is bad instead of just saying stuff like "This is terrible advice." I mean that's fine but why, specifically, is that a terrible idea?

[PeanutsNJam]

Context:

Highest employment score of a T2 school: Somewhere around 65% (http://www.lstscorereports.com/schools/pennstate/2014/)

OP's class rank: Bottom 20%

[A. Nony Mouse]

The "not going to stress" part may have been poorly worded by the OP or misinterpreted by the hive (which is kind of what I think happened) but if the OP means what it sounds like then the OP should definitely cut his/her losses now

I think it comes down to the strength of the OP's THIRST for JUSTICE and how much the OP just NEEDS to be a lawyer, and the OP's debt level. If the OP is like the other 97% of law students who are just kind of doing the law school thing cuz "Meh, whatever, what else do you want me to do, get a job?" then the OP should drop out. Or, if the OP is going like 100K in debt (decently likely if not on a full ride) for some middling to bad-ish school (decently likely when the school has scholly stips) then the OP should drop out (unless maybe that THIRST is simply UNQUENCHABLE I guess).

If that was me, knowing what I know now (which is impossible of course because how could 0L me know what 3L me knows?) then I would drop out.

this is shitty advice. do not listen to this advice. it has nothing to do with your grades. it is just unabashedly shitty advice. thirst for justice has nothing to do with hiring. "meh" is THE worst attitude anyone has towards legal hiring. the thirst is real regardless of T14 or not,

I don't get why this is crappy advice either. Zuck is basically saying the OP should drop out, but he's allowing for the possibility that the OP went to law school because he passionately wants to be a lawyer, which might change the equation.

There are whole realms of legal hiring (especially from a T2) that don't have anything to do with grades and are entirely about connections and experience. Most people on this site aren't looking at those kinds of jobs, but they're out there. Someone with a burning passion to be a PD or work in a small personal injury firm or the like isn't going to get hired (in most cases) based on their grades, and not even despite their grades, because the employer won't even look at them.

That said, no one hands you such jobs, and they require a lot more hustle than the standard good grades -> OCI -> biglaw model. And the OP doesn't remotely sound like someone who fits this mold and has said he doesn't have to be a lawyer and that law school was a mistake. So dropping out seems like a good move.

Or, OP, you could continue and see how things go next semester, since it sounds like that won't make a huge difference to your debt and may put you in a somewhat better position. But you should probably start stressing about what went wrong last semester. Talk to your profs about your exams and what you need to do to improve. If you're that far down in the class presumably there are some basic changes you can make to perform better.

And what are you planning to do for a job this summer? You need to start looking for something that isn't grades-conscious where you can make some connections who will help you out.

Or if you don't want to/think you can do these things, cut your losses and drop out.

[A. Nony Mouse]

Also, sock puppeting isn't allowed here, f.glenn/Shelled.

[TheSpanishMain]

Am I unemployable even if I hit 2.8? I would work any job a JD could get me if I could just get an A range grade in one of my classes next semester and keep my scholarship. I'm not being completely honest. I don't have my Torts grade yet, but that's a modest prediction. Who knows, maybe I got a B+ or better in Torts and I'm on the borderline. I've only taken out $15k in loans for the year.

I think going to law school was a mistake and I don't "have" to be a lawyer.

Did you really go to an Ivy League undergrad, or was that you not being completely honest again? I mean, I know law school grading can seem random, but I'm having a hard time imagining someone smart enough to get into an Ivy undergrad unable to be in the top 80% at a tier two law school.

Also, sock puppeting isn't allowed here, f.glenn/Shelled.

The perfect crime.

[Shelled]

Also, sock puppeting isn't allowed here, f.glenn/Shelled.

What is sock puppeting?

[Smoking Gunner]

Also, sock puppeting isn't allowed here, f.glenn/Shelled.

What is sock puppeting?

Mods can see the IPs of all users. You should quit before this gets embarrassing.

[Shelled]

Also, sock puppeting isn't allowed here, f.glenn/Shelled.

What is sock puppeting?

Mods can see the IPs of all users. You should quit before this gets embarrassing.

Thanks for the tip, detective.

[TheSpanishMain]

Also, sock puppeting isn't allowed here, f.glenn/Shelled.

What is sock puppeting?

Mods can see the IPs of all users. You should quit before this gets embarrassing.

Thanks for the tip, detective.

Basically, pick an identity and stick with it. You can't be both f.glenn and Shelled. You can't just create another username to give the appearance that more people agree with you. That is a POOR trick that makes you look RIDICULOUS.

[Troubled1L]

I just hope I get hired somewhere. If I land a job during the semester, do I drop out immediately?

[twenty]

If nothing else, "I dropped out of law school to take this job" sounds a lot better than "I dropped out of law school because I had bad grades, and then I got a job shortly thereafter."

But yeah, gun for a non-law job right now.

That is a POOR trick that makes you look RIDICULOUS.

[cheaptilts]

I just hope I get hired somewhere. If I land a job during the semester, do I drop out immediately?

Yeah. I would start today...if you can find a job within the next month, you'll be able to recoup some of the money spent on books/tuition/living expenses. Broaden your search to include all cities you'd enjoy (or be willing to live in). Good luck, OP!

[thisiswater]

OP please find someone to talk to. I'm sure your school has a counseling center and they could be helpful here. I am not saying dropping out isn't the right choice, but you're making a big decision very quickly and probably while you're upset or disappointed. If you will be at 15k for the year, and you still want to be an attorney riding this out and giving yourself some time won't kill you.

[Troubled1L]

I'm hoping that I killed the Torts exam, but I can see it being anywhere from a C+ to an A-.

If I can save my scholarship by averaging B's next semester, should I stick it out? I went to law school to get a stable job, but if I'm not employable, I'll try hard to get something so I can drop out.

[thisiswater]

I don't think anyone can answer those questions for you, and definitely not without a lot more info.
If you stuck out 3 years, and you kept your scholarship where would your debt be?

You keep saying you just want a job but what does that mean to you? I mean, there are law jobs out there, but you might have locked yourself out of biglaw and the easy-ish path of OCI to summer to full time. How hard are you willing to work to find that first job? Are you flexible on location? Can you financially work for 45k?

[BigZuck]

Yeah no given the OP's posts ITT I'm confident that drop out is the right call

It's not worth going into debt at a middling school and job searching with a poor GPA unless you really, really want to be a lawyer and are ready, willing, and able to put in the legwork to get that job. It doesn't sound like that is the OP. At all. Not wasting another semester of time and money is the best course of action IMO.

Happy to debate this with any and all alts

[totesTheGoat]

I'm hoping that I killed the Torts exam, but I can see it being anywhere from a C+ to an A-.

If I can save my scholarship by averaging B's next semester, should I stick it out? I went to law school to get a stable job, but if I'm not employable, I'll try hard to get something so I can drop out.

I'm going to go against the "drop out immediately" tide and say that you should stick it out one more semester. My fall 1L grades are the worst I've gotten in law school so far, and they drastically improved in the spring.

Here are things you should think about doing:
- Meet with your profs, especially contracts, and figure out what went wrong.
- Meet with your spring profs and talk with them about how to write a law school exam.
- Figure out whether your problem is issue spotting or writing style. If it's issue spotting, you need to be in at office hours as much as possible. If it's writing style, you need to start prepping for finals a month before everybody else, running practice exams and taking them into office hours to get help from the profs.

In 1L you can improve your grades through sheer effort. That's not as true in 2L and 3L (once everybody has figured out law school exams).

If you're not willing to put in that level of effort, then drop out. Your job prospects won't justify the additional debt that you'll take on.

[jrass]

The grades may not be that terrible depending on the curve, but the more you kept up the readings and work that you did, the harder it will be to improve those grades. If I was in your position, I wouldn't just do the same things I did last time but work harder. I'd go for a complete overhaul. Obviously what you did didn't work for you, and you'll either have to figure out something else or drop out.

[Clearly]

How much money do you expect to earn as a lawyer, and in what scenario public interest, government, small firm, big firm etc)

[Troubled1L]

How much money do you expect to earn as a lawyer, and in what scenario public interest, government, small firm, big firm etc)

From reading this forum, I was thinking a small firm or doc review might be all I'm qualified for.

I just got called back by Hertz about a temporary recruiting coordinator position that pays $12 an hour. Would it be a horrible idea to follow through with this job?

[TheSpanishMain]

How much money do you expect to earn as a lawyer, and in what scenario public interest, government, small firm, big firm etc)

From reading this forum, I was thinking a small firm or doc review might be all I'm qualified for.

I just got called back by Hertz about a temporary recruiting coordinator position that pays $12 an hour. Would it be a horrible idea to follow through with this job?

Do you seriously have an Ivy undergrad degree? What is happening?

[Troubled1L]

My degree is in history. I didn't know that it paid $12 an hour until after I got contacted back. I wouldn't apply for something that paid $12 an hour. From the online listing it sounded like it would be something that was salaried. I can't work for $12 an hour but ill take it if it can lead to a fulltime position that is salaried.