Law Firm Marketing

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Lawdork
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Re: Law Firm Marketing

Postby Lawdork » Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:29 pm

AVBucks4239 wrote:
utlaw2007 wrote:
Lawdork wrote:Sorry didn't mean to test your patience. utlaw, do you think the PPC high volume strategy would work well for DUI cases? I think I remember you saying that DUI can be very lucrative if you can drive the volume and you work efficiently with a flat fee. Idk I may be putting too much faith in PPC but I feel like as soon someone needs an atty for something like DUi and they don't know any attys personally or through friends, they're gonna google for them. PPC would be just one way to drive business, other ways would be through traditional networking. I just think the high volume route is more feasible that the big contingency cases which I think clients will press more for attys with extensive experience.

And are you more of the rule or the exception when it comes to bagging big contingent cases for someone with not a whole lot of experience (since you stated straight out of law school). I would think with criminal, family, pi cases, the clients would be less sophisticated and wouldn't do research on your experience. However, some one or a business with a lot on the line will either go with a solo who has been around or with a bigger firm.


Apology accepted. And my apologies for getting testy.

PPC is a great way to go if you want volume. It's probably required nowadays. You have to use some form of online advertising if you want volume. I'm mainly saying that you may have to supplement PPC advertising with some other form of advertising. I don't know much about volume practices because I have not tried to get volume.

PPC for DWI/DUI sounds really good, actually. And PPC for any criminal matter sounds good. PPC for Guardianship cases also sounds pretty good. But once you get into much lower paying areas, like divorces for clients who have little money or bankruptcies or occupational licenses, then PPC may not yeild the volume you need to make a decent amount of money. But I'm speculating, though. I have no experience with PPC. It's just that none of the experienced lawyers I know used it. Perhaps, they didn't understand it. But I hear that it's a great tool for obtaining volume. But you also have to consider the competition of what you are doing and whether you can still get volume. Because DWI's can net you a decent amount of upfront money, volume doesn't have to be crazy. Volume is just needed if you want to be rich or almost rich.


Don't have close to the experience of UTlaw, but just to add to this:

I answer the cold calls at my firm, which has been around since the 1870s and has a lot of reputable attorneys. I ask every single cold call where they heard from us or how they found us, and I'd say less than 10% are from online searches. It's almost always, "Oh, you guys represent my friend's business," or "I heard you guys had the best corporate practice in town," or "I know Partner A from years ago."

Maybe that's just my market, but it almost always seems to me that people get referrals first and then go online only to find your contact information/website.

If your firm has been around that long, it makes sense that 90% of clients come from referrals. How many partners does your firm have? Bc if it's a big firm that's pulling 1 mil + in revenue, then the revenue from PPC is very substantial. Especially when scaled down to a solo shop.

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Danger Zone
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Re: Law Firm Marketing

Postby Danger Zone » Mon Oct 12, 2015 2:33 pm

I searched this thread for diminishing returns and couldn't find it, so here's an economics lesson for you starry: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminishing_returns

Eta: Oh whoops this thread is old

Lawdork
Posts: 181
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Re: Law Firm Marketing

Postby Lawdork » Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:02 pm

Danger Zone wrote:I searched this thread for diminishing returns and couldn't find it, so here's an economics lesson for you starry: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminishing_returns

Eta: Oh whoops this thread is old


I'm confused, are you implying that more money spent on advertising leads to diminishing returns? Because advertising investment is very different than investment designed to increase production. I would bargain that the law of diminishing returns would hardly apply to Pay Per Click (because you only pay when someone clicks). Assuming a constant conversion rate, the amount spent is directly proportional to the amount of clients gained.

Or maybe there's something i'm missing

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Danger Zone
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Re: Law Firm Marketing

Postby Danger Zone » Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:47 pm

Lawdork wrote:
Danger Zone wrote:I searched this thread for diminishing returns and couldn't find it, so here's an economics lesson for you starry: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminishing_returns

Eta: Oh whoops this thread is old


I'm confused, are you implying that more money spent on advertising leads to diminishing returns? Because advertising investment is very different than investment designed to increase production. I would bargain that the law of diminishing returns would hardly apply to Pay Per Click (because you only pay when someone clicks). Assuming a constant conversion rate, the amount spent is directly proportional to the amount of clients gained.

Or maybe there's something i'm missing

The OP implied that for every $1 he spent on advertising, he'd get X amount in revenue in return. This is wrong because each dollar spent will yield less and less in revenue. There is not a direct correlation between the two variables because of the law of diminishing returns.

Lawdork
Posts: 181
Joined: Sun Aug 02, 2015 5:07 pm

Re: Law Firm Marketing

Postby Lawdork » Wed Oct 21, 2015 1:30 pm

Utlaw... Someone just posted an attorney TV ad in the lounge for Bryan Wilson (also a UT law grad). It's very outlandish and he looks silly in it (he does wheelies on a mini dirt bike, screams about being a law hawk, etc.). He was targeting DUI folks. But i'm wondering if the more outlandish commercials are actually the best kind of advertising because it gets people talking and gets your name out there. Though i'm sure that he has ruined his chances of ever representing a sophisticated client, he might get impressive DUI volume. What is your take on outlandish TV ads?

Lawdork
Posts: 181
Joined: Sun Aug 02, 2015 5:07 pm

Re: Law Firm Marketing

Postby Lawdork » Thu Oct 22, 2015 10:41 am

Danger Zone wrote:
Lawdork wrote:
Danger Zone wrote:I searched this thread for diminishing returns and couldn't find it, so here's an economics lesson for you starry: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminishing_returns

Eta: Oh whoops this thread is old


I'm confused, are you implying that more money spent on advertising leads to diminishing returns? Because advertising investment is very different than investment designed to increase production. I would bargain that the law of diminishing returns would hardly apply to Pay Per Click (because you only pay when someone clicks). Assuming a constant conversion rate, the amount spent is directly proportional to the amount of clients gained.

Or maybe there's something i'm missing

The OP implied that for every $1 he spent on advertising, he'd get X amount in revenue in return. This is wrong because each dollar spent will yield less and less in revenue. There is not a direct correlation between the two variables because of the law of diminishing returns.


Yea but i'm pretty sure the ceiling is MUCH higher than the 20k per year mentioned (ceiling being when diminishing returns starts to drastically take effect). Want proof? Just look at the PI stars in your city who spend a million plus per year on ads. So I don't think your point is very applicable here. Maybe if he was talking outrageous numbers, you'd have a point. Seems like you were just trying to be snarky to OP.

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Danger Zone
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Re: Law Firm Marketing

Postby Danger Zone » Thu Oct 22, 2015 1:49 pm

I used X because the actual number is irrelevant. He's using bad math. I'm not explaining it again.




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