Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

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whosinthehousejc
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Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby whosinthehousejc » Sat Dec 13, 2014 9:16 am

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Last edited by whosinthehousejc on Sat Mar 07, 2015 7:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Ron Don Volante
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby Ron Don Volante » Sat Dec 13, 2014 10:55 am

UT 1L here

The impression I get is that if you want to spend your career in TX, UT is preferable to or at least equivalent to the non-HYS T13. But if your goal is/requires prefstigious work in NYC or DC, I would definitely advise you to go T6. Huge oil & gas law community at UT though, if that makes any difference. There are some older UT people on this forum that could speak to that.

I would repost this/ask mod to move it to a different forum, the LS FAQ forum gets like no traffic.

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whosinthehousejc
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby whosinthehousejc » Sat Dec 13, 2014 11:04 am

Ron Don Volante wrote:UT 1L here

The impression I get is that if you want to spend your career in TX, UT is preferable to or at least equivalent to the non-HYS T13. But if your goal is/requires prefstigious work in NYC or DC, I would definitely advise you to go T6. Huge oil & gas law community at UT though, if that makes any difference. There are some older UT people on this forum that could speak to that.

I would repost this/ask mod to move it to a different forum, the LS FAQ forum gets like no traffic.


Thanks man, which forum you think is appropriate? They don't let us lowly 0Ls post in the "ask a pro" forum.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Sat Dec 13, 2014 11:18 am

Choosing a school or ask a law student/grad? No one but pros can post in the pros forum (but they're really all about admissions/LSAT prep and I'm not sure they could really help you anyway).

Phil Brooks
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby Phil Brooks » Sat Dec 13, 2014 11:27 am

Hi OP,

I worked in international arbitration before law school, during both summers, and will do so after graduation. There are a couple of huge firms that do it in Texas: King & Spalding and Andrews Kurth. I would look to see if they recruit at UT; would be shocked if they didn't. The hiring partner at Andrews Kurth is very nice and willing to take 1Ls.

If you are fluent in Spanish and have this energy expertise, I would also try to get a job as a paralegal with them for one year before law school.

International arbitration is one of those "sexy"-sounding niche fields that everyone discovers during their 1L Public International Law class and suddenly falls in love with, only to realize that there simply are very few jobs in the field. You have obvious advantages over most because you know about the field, have language skills, and industry expertise. You need to leverage these into concrete connections *before* starting law school.

Congratulations on the fantastic LSAT score. Good luck.

sflyr2016
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby sflyr2016 » Sat Dec 13, 2014 11:31 am

I have zero knowledge about the Texas market. But I think that If you can get a significant scholarship to attend UT or HYS (especially if you qualify for need-based aid), then either option would be equally good. I assume that no other t13, besides HYS, is going to help you land a good Texas law job more than UT would. As for me, I am from Miami and wanted Miami biglaw (should have retaken but didnt) and went to UF. After first year I had the option to transfer to a t10, but after doing research, I realized that aside from HYS, and maybe Columbia, no other school was going to help me land Miami biglaw over UF. I assume the same is probably true of UT in Texas, but UT is a significantly better school overall so I am sure your career options will not be limited only to the state of Texas. In any event, you have great numbers and work experience and I am sure you will have really good options!

What parts of Latin America did you go to, btw?

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whosinthehousejc
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby whosinthehousejc » Sat Dec 13, 2014 12:47 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:Choosing a school or ask a law student/grad? No one but pros can post in the pros forum (but they're really all about admissions/LSAT prep and I'm not sure they could really help you anyway).


Ask a Law Student/Grad makes sense to me, any chance you can move it? Thanks Nony

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whosinthehousejc
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby whosinthehousejc » Sat Dec 13, 2014 12:52 pm

Phil Brooks wrote:Hi OP,

I worked in international arbitration before law school, during both summers, and will do so after graduation. There are a couple of huge firms that do it in Texas: King & Spalding and Andrews Kurth. I would look to see if they recruit at UT; would be shocked if they didn't. The hiring partner at Andrews Kurth is very nice and willing to take 1Ls.

If you are fluent in Spanish and have this energy expertise, I would also try to get a job as a paralegal with them for one year before law school.

International arbitration is one of those "sexy"-sounding niche fields that everyone discovers during their 1L Public International Law class and suddenly falls in love with, only to realize that there simply are very few jobs in the field. You have obvious advantages over most because you know about the field, have language skills, and industry expertise. You need to leverage these into concrete connections *before* starting law school.

Congratulations on the fantastic LSAT score. Good luck.


Phil and joeant, really invaluable advice, thanks a lot guys.
Last edited by whosinthehousejc on Sat Mar 07, 2015 7:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Elston Gunn
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby Elston Gunn » Sat Dec 13, 2014 1:12 pm

This sounds possible but really, really tough. It's like being intent on going to NYC for regulatory work or DC for corporate. Like, it exists but not to the extent you can reasonably expect to get it. (Same for DOJ FCPA work, I imagine, especially from Texas.) If you do this, make sure you're comfortable ending up a regular litigator.

The other thing I'd add is that firm FCPA work seems REALLY shitty to me. Huge amount of travel, huge amount of doc review.

sflyr2016
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby sflyr2016 » Sat Dec 13, 2014 1:15 pm

That's awesome. I am Nicaraguan so I was wondering whether it was primarily South or Central America. By the way, I know your family is in Texas, but given your work experience, keep an eye out for Miami also. There's a ton of arbitration there, and a ton of focus on Brazil, Columbia, and Mexico. In fact, every big practice in Miami has a strong focus on international arbitration. Although it's typically an insular market and requires strong ties to the area, given your background, I am sure you will have options there too for arbitration/Latin american corporate work. And I do not think you need DOJ experience to do it. Best of luck!

Cogburn87
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby Cogburn87 » Sat Dec 13, 2014 1:29 pm

Elston Gunn wrote:The other thing I'd add is that firm FCPA work seems REALLY shitty to me. Huge amount of travel, huge amount of doc review.

I can confirm that FCPA work is pretty much awful. OP, don't dedicate your life to litigating the FCPA. Unless of course you have a passion for doc review and preparing witness kits of low-level employees various third-world shitholes, in which case have fun.

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Rahviveh
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby Rahviveh » Sat Dec 13, 2014 11:55 pm

Elston Gunn wrote:The other thing I'd add is that firm FCPA work seems REALLY shitty to me. Huge amount of travel, huge amount of doc review.


isnt international arb fairly similar in that regard? the way it was described to me, didnt sound so great either.

BigZuck
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby BigZuck » Sun Dec 14, 2014 2:41 am

I dunno what an FCPA is

At OCI I interviewed with a partner from the King and Spalding Houston office who did international arbitration, so I guess it's something that exists? I agree that it doesn't make sense in so far as it's probably such a small field that you would have to be right place, right time to make an in. But go for it I guess? I'd just figure some other options if that doesn't work out.

If the job really is unicorn-y (I honestly have no idea) then I think the higher ranking school, the better. UT is a good school, but I don't know of anyone on a prestigious PI/government path (there probably are some people though I'm guessing). Most people I know are either going to the usual players to do the usual stuff (Baker Botts, V&E, etc.) or NYC big law or planning to be a public defender, things like that. With strong Texas ties and just wanting any old TX big law I'd suggest maybe going to a T14 over UT but probably depends on how much each school would cost you so it's hard to say in a vacuum what your best move is.

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jbagelboy
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby jbagelboy » Sun Dec 14, 2014 1:10 pm

BigZuck wrote:I dunno what an FCPA is

At OCI I interviewed with a partner from the King and Spalding Houston office who did international arbitration, so I guess it's something that exists? I agree that it doesn't make sense in so far as it's probably such a small field that you would have to be right place, right time to make an in. But go for it I guess? I'd just figure some other options if that doesn't work out.

If the job really is unicorn-y (I honestly have no idea) then I think the higher ranking school, the better. UT is a good school, but I don't know of anyone on a prestigious PI/government path (there probably are some people though I'm guessing). Most people I know are either going to the usual players to do the usual stuff (Baker Botts, V&E, etc.) or NYC big law or planning to be a public defender, things like that. With strong Texas ties and just wanting any old TX big law I'd suggest maybe going to a T14 over UT but probably depends on how much each school would cost you so it's hard to say in a vacuum what your best move is.


Foreign corrupt practices act. Along with securities it's been the bread and butter of a lot of top flight NY litigation departments for the past decade. A lot of former DOJ prosecutors went back into private practice at Debevoise, Davis Polk, Cravath ect and brought that expertise/work with them. It's a lot less glamorous than it sounds.

OP: international arbitration is basically just a less formal version of normal law that is gradually becoming more formal (and as a result, less cost-effective). Few if any firms can staff a junior associate on int'l arbitration matters full time. It's good that you're open to FCPA work but you'll get a lot of doc review this way and see very little actual court/trial activity.

You might be best served starting your career in New York, but going to UT would certainly make the texas market more available down the line. The biggest downside of that choice is the risk of screwing up a 1L exam or two, landing at median or below and striking out. That's kind of a personal call.
I don't know as much about the Texas market but there is a guy on here who chose Texas full ride + stipend over all the T14 including Harvard and was very pleased with his choice (1L SA in his chosen field ect). So its certainly not unheard of with your numbers.

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Desert Fox
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Re: Am I naïve, or does this career path make sense?

Postby Desert Fox » Sun Dec 14, 2014 1:36 pm

I think your assumption about needing t6 for doj is wrong.

Also, FCPA is the worst.




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