NYU 1L Taking Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
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NYC2012
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby NYC2012 » Mon Dec 23, 2013 12:47 am

Magnacromion wrote:So if this is what you need to tell yourself to make yourself feel better about not getting the scholly you wanted, or to convince yourself that you can work your way to an A even if you're not born with an innate talent for legal analysis (you can't), fine. But why not let the people who actually would like their questions answered ask them?


LOL. Just lulz.

daryldixon
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby daryldixon » Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:01 am

Magnacromion wrote:Study schedule? What study schedule lol? Maybe I didn't take things as seriously as I should have. I read everything the night before. I don't think I ever read a day ahead, unless you count reading on Saturday for Monday. I highly recommend this strategy if you can make it work. Everything was fresh in my mind during lecture. The downside is that if you have one class on Mondays but two on Tuesdays, sometimes the reading load is a little imbalanced.

I probably should have read a few weeks ahead toward the end. I basically didn't do my reading assignments for the last week or two of class.

I didn't work through hypos throughout the year except the ones my CivPro TA gave us. I probably will next semester because they were helpful and I wish I'd done more of them. Heck, I outlined half-assedly starting in mid-November, but didn't really start in earnest until maybe a week before my first exam. Not the best way to do it, but I think my outlines turned out pretty well, actually. I took maybe one practice exam per class. Probably should have done more, but I still had an idea of what was coming.

I had plenty of free time during September and October, a little less during November, and none after Thanksgiving break. All in all, it wasn't too bad. But we'll have to see how I did on exams. If I had to guess, I'd say I got an A (top 10%), an A- (top 30%), and a B+ (median). I'd rather not get the B+, but I can live with that and I may actually try to apply myself more next semester.

One comment about my study style: as with any study style, it will not work for everybody. But this is especially true of mine because I tend to understand things very quickly, and I have something close to a photographic memory. So I don't really need to brief my cases because I remember them all anyway.

I would not recommend briefing cases because it wastes time which could be spent more productively. Generally you don't need to remember a bunch of minute details about the cases for the exam. On my outlines I just wrote the case citation, the rule(s), and (sometimes) a one-sentence squib to jog my memory about the facts. Next semester I might try writing the squibs as I read them, not waiting until the last week. Remember again that I have a near-photographic memory, so I don't need to put as much info about the cases as everyone else.

I did not do 0L prep other than reading part of Getting to Maybe, which I highly recommend. I do not under any circumstances recommend studying substantive law as a 0L, because you don't need to learn Torts, you need to learn Professor Smith's conception of Torts. Learning about the basic court structure, basic mechanics of litigation, and how to read a case might be helpful. I already knew because I had studied these things extensively during undergrad and I paralegaled for two years. If you don't have that kind of background, it might be worthwhile to read a few opinions from SCOTUS, the US Courts of Appeals, and one or two state high courts (New York Court of Appeals, Wisconsin Supreme Court, etc.; except don't read the California Supreme Court because those dudes are HIGH as s***). Also get your typing speed up for exams.

I was kind of a purist. I didn't use supplements. I referred to an E&E maybe once. Remember that I already knew how to read cases, and the case decisions usually count as pleasure reading for me. Others may need supplements more than I did, but don't rely on them too much—they don't give you the full picture, and you don't learn how to analyze a court opinion if you use the supplement as a crutch. Next semester I think I'm going to get some E&E's and use them to work through practice problems. But I'm still going to do most of my learning through reading the casebooks and vigorous class participation.

That's another thing: you need to participate in class. Not only does it make the class more lively if everyone participates, but it also forces you to wrestle with the material yourself.


You really shouldn't be giving anyone advice since you are a 1L that hasn't gotten any grades back yet! Your advice is useless at this point. For all you know you are dead last in your class. This is the most self-delusion I have ever encountered on TLS.

Magnacromion
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby Magnacromion » Mon Dec 23, 2013 12:44 pm

daryldixon wrote:You really shouldn't be giving anyone advice since you are a 1L that hasn't gotten any grades back yet! Your advice is useless at this point. For all you know you are dead last in your class. This is the most self-delusion I have ever encountered on TLS.

Didn't I make it abundantly clear that I am a 1L with no grades yet? I offered to answer questions, and people asked in full knowledge of this. What's it to you, huh? Why does it bother you if other people want to ask me questions? Why do you feel the need to insult me and try to make me feel bad?
deebanger wrote:or maybe he is just a pompous douche. OP, I do not want to say that you are a pompous douche, but I can totally see how one can think you are a douche based on what you wrote. Seriously, go ahead and read all what you have written. just read this para once again-"…If I hate my boss, I can tell him to go eat a d*** and I won't have to worry about going broke. You cannot overestimate the value of freedom"

How is this pompous? This is just accepting and preparing for reality. Most people in supervisory positions in BigLaw are absolutely horrible human beings who do not give a f*** about the well-being of their subordinates. Some people can tolerate this much better than I can; that's great. But for me, I absolutely have to have some sort of a trump card so that they don't have power over me. If they start abusing me, asking me to do jobs a high-school dropout could do, asking me to work all night for the umpteenth time this week, asking me to double-check work I already know is good to go, I need the freedom to tell them to go eat a d***. I fail to see what is so wrong about this. I can't deal with feeling trapped by the circumstances of life, which is precisely what I would be if I had $250k in debt and a BigLaw job.
daryldixon wrote:Are you going to come back and start a "Median-Pawned at NYU - Taking Questions" thread or should I just PM you my ridicule?

It could happen, and if you hadn't failed the reading comp section of the LSAT, you would have seen that I've recognized this as a distinct possibility. All I've said is that scholly recipients are at least somewhat less likely on a statistical basis to graduate below median. Not that every scholly recipient does well. Just that on average they do better than sticker-price applicants. I've heard this from 3Ls here, btw, and I've researched who from our school goes on to clerk for SCOTUS (not surprisingly, full scholly recipients) so I'm not just speculating. I don't know why it's so controversial to say that people with better qualifications who turned down higher-ranked schools to go somewhere have, statistically speaking, a better shot at good grades. Not that they all will ace their classes, just that they as a subset of law students will do better on a statistical basis. Why does this seem to be the single most controversial thing to say on TLS? The data reflect it, 3Ls acknowledge it, scambloggers know it and write about it, but honestly, you don't even need all that. It's just common sense. Simple deductive reasoning will get you there. To say that everyone coming into law school has exactly the same chance at making law review is simply ludicrous, and it ignores crucial differences among the entering students. Wishful thinking, perhaps? Sure, PM me your ridicule. Take your best shot.
daryldixon wrote:Do you have aspergers?

Sure, if that's what you want to believe, if it makes you feel better, go right ahead. But why stop at aspergers? (Not a valid psychiatric diagnosis anymore, btw, but it's whatever.) Why not say that I have bipolar, and schizophrenia, and while we're at it, I probably have syphilitic insanity, too! I should probably be locked up in a mental home, not getting a free legal education at NYU! Seriously dude, what did I ever do to you? Get a life, or a woman, or something.

Seriously, why can't we keep it civil, folks? This place is getting almost as bad as xoxoth. The only difference is that people aren't questioning my sexuality. I guess I've learned the two things TLSers hate most in the world: scholly recipients and NYU.

Magnacromion
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby Magnacromion » Mon Dec 23, 2013 12:49 pm

sinfiery wrote:what section are you? :shock: wouldn't want you ruining my curve..

Haha, I'm section 1. The best section that is and ever was. You? But as these kind folks rightly point out, I may well be at the bottom of my class, for all I know. I think it's unlikely, but it's possible.

I promise I'm really a nice guy. You can ask any of my friends here. I share notes, I cook midnight snacks for my friends, and I share beer. I walk my classmates home when they're too drunk to walk themselves. I caused the entire room to laugh, thus defusing the tension and relaxing everyone before our last exam of the semester. I don't know why everyone here thinks I'm such a jerk. People like me.

Btw, is "sinfiery" supposed to be Irish? If it is, I think I know who you are and I think we're friends.

Magnacromion
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby Magnacromion » Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:00 pm

daryldixon, I think (perhaps) I get your angle now. I've looked through your prior posts. You think that the LSAT and GPA are meaningless (despite overwhelming data to the contrary), but you think being a URM or a having worked as a janitor will make one a better law student. Lol…yes, a natural talent for logical reasoning won't help you in law school, but scrubbing toilets will. Brilliant! Why didn't I think of it?
I don't even need to rebut this. A SCOTUS justice already has, much more effectively than I ever could. Go read what Clarence Thomas has to say about Yale and affirmative action.

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NYC2012
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby NYC2012 » Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:42 pm

Edited
Last edited by NYC2012 on Mon Dec 23, 2013 11:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

thsmthcrmnl
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby thsmthcrmnl » Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:55 pm

Many Furman scholars are chosen for that scholarship based on their 1L grades.

Magnacromion
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby Magnacromion » Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:57 pm

NYC2012 wrote:
Magnacromion wrote: I caused the entire room to laugh. People like me.

Well done OP, this has been the most hilarious thread I've ever been a part of on TLS. Best of luck!

And for reasons unbeknownst to me, a bunch of random people from the internet whom I've never met and never harmed in any way absolutely hate my guts.

Happy holidays!

Magnacromion
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby Magnacromion » Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:01 pm

thsmthcrmnl wrote:Many Furman scholars are chosen for that scholarship based on their 1L grades.

That's definitely true, though I'm not sure what ratio of scholars are chosen as 0Ls versus rising 2Ls.

A better example might be the RTKs. They are chosen only as 0Ls, and they almost invariably do well.

Seriously, if anyone wishes to refute my argument, all you need do is show me a single Hamilton from Columbia who finished at the bottom of his/her class.

Oh, and to respond to something said much earlier, from what I've heard from the 2Ls and 3Ls, "median-p0wnd at NYU" is not a thing. If you finish at the bottom, you might be screwed, but, though median isn't rolling in offers, I've heard that they do just fine unless they have zero interview skills.

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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby thsmthcrmnl » Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:23 pm

More Furmans come after 1L than before. You're right, though, statistically. Your odds are better. But I think they're not quite as good as you think they are. You think you're in the top ten percent without having actually seen your grades.

You don't have to listen to me because I'm just a person on the Internet. But I'm going to throw out that I know people with 4.0s first semester that dropped by .5 next semester. I know a Pomeroy who couldn't get a callback in the city the person wanted to work. I have seen a person with single-digit rank get no-offered for rudeness.

Anyway, I just mean to say that things sometimes are unpredictable. Let us know how it goes.

Magnacromion
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby Magnacromion » Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:36 pm

thsmthcrmnl wrote:More Furmans come after 1L than before. You're right, though, statistically. Your odds are better. But I think they're not quite as good as you think they are. You think you're in the top ten percent without having actually seen your grades.

You don't have to listen to me because I'm just a person on the Internet. But I'm going to throw out that I know people with 4.0s first semester that dropped by .5 next semester. I know a Pomeroy who couldn't get a callback in the city the person wanted to work. I have seen a person with single-digit rank get no-offered for rudeness.

Anyway, I just mean to say that things sometimes are unpredictable. Let us know how it goes.

You're absolutely right. You're rational. You don't make categorical statements like the trolls. Your statements are supported by data.

I don't think I'm necessarily in the top ten percent. I'm just guessing I'm in the top fifty percent. Like I said, if I had to guess, I got an A, an A-, and a B+. That's not top ten percent. I don't think doing well is guaranteed for a scholly recipient, just better than average odds. Dunno why people get all up in arms when I say that.

And yeah, rudeness will screw you over royally. I promise I'm a really nice guy in person—you can see this in the posts in this thread before the trolls arrived. You can ask any of my sectionmates: they'll say I was a bit of a gunner the first few weeks, then I calmed down. And that maybe I'm a little goofy sometimes, but I always help my sectionmates out when they need it. For heaven's sakes, I spent almost an hour on the phone with a sectionmate who wasn't even in my study group when she called up like a day or two before the exam with a complicated question in Contracts. It was an hour I didn't have to spare, but she needed that hour more than I did. I swear I'm really not a d***.

deebanger
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby deebanger » Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:39 pm

"I promise I'm really a nice guy. You can ask any of my friends here. I share notes, I cook midnight snacks for my friends, and I share beer. I walk my classmates home when they're too drunk to walk themselves. I caused the entire room to laugh, thus defusing the tension and relaxing everyone before our last exam of the semester. I don't know why everyone here thinks I'm such a jerk. People like me" LOL

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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby thsmthcrmnl » Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:48 pm

Believe it or not, 3.67 (plus or minus a little bit for that extra credit in Civ. Pro.) is actually right around top ten percent, maybe slightly worse.

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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby Magnacromion » Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:15 pm

thsmthcrmnl wrote:Believe it or not, 3.67 (plus or minus a little bit for that extra credit in Civ. Pro.) is actually right around top ten percent, maybe slightly worse.

Really? I thought top ten percent was about 3.9 or so. Because I mean an A (4.0) in a class is about top 11% of that class, right? Shows how little I know, lol!

deebanger, ask thsmthcrmnl: I'm probably not a jerk, if for no other reason than that there really just aren't that many jerks who go to NYU Law. Even the gunners tend to have hearts of gold. People with bad personalities go elsewhere. They're frankly not quite welcome here. That's really why I wanted to take questions, more than anything else: I wanted to share with TLS how nice everyone here is. That, and I wanted to help out some people who are facing difficult decisions this application cycle. I remembered how much people from TLS helped me last year. This community was great. I wanted to give back to those who had given to me before. But instead I'm just getting assailed by trolls. I don't know what I did to deserve it. I've done nothing wrong.

Magnacromion
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby Magnacromion » Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:21 pm

Does it make you guys feel good to make someone else feel bad? Does it make you feel like big men to insult someone behind the veil of pseudonymity? Is your life that bleak? Are you too timid to troll someone in person?

Why don't you go and have yourselves a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. Go enjoy life and stop wasting your time on me. I highly doubt I'm worth it.

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NYC2012
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby NYC2012 » Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:48 pm

Magnacromion wrote:Does it make you guys feel good to make someone else feel bad? Does it make you feel like big men to insult someone behind the veil of pseudonymity? Is your life that bleak? Are you too timid to troll someone in person?

Why don't you go and have yourselves a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. Go enjoy life and stop wasting your time on me. I highly doubt I'm worth it.


I apologize for making you feel bad. BTW, I'm a girl (I just happen to love Dwight). No one is questioning your goodwill to come on here and answer questions, I think we all appreciate that law students do answer our questions, it's the whole point of this forum. But you can't go around talking the way you were talking and not expect to be ridiculed. No one likes people who come off as arrogant. Maybe you're a nice guy, I don't know that. The way you talk, you sound like you think you're God's greatest gift to this earth. Maybe you're just bragging online, but if you talk like that in an interview or in real life it's hard for people to relate to you. Personally, if I had received a full tuition scholarship, I wouldn't tell any of my classmates - it's just not appropriate. It's important to realize you're not any better than anyone else in your class, or anyone at Harvard, or anyone else who didn't get a scholarship. Neither am I. Everyone has their own path and their own purpose, we're all doing our own thing, and that's okay.

I really do wish you the best of luck though, it seems like you didn't mean to sound like a douche.

deebanger
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby deebanger » Mon Dec 23, 2013 3:53 pm

yup, OP I never called you a pompous douche, but all I said is I can see how you can come of as a pompous douche. But Good luck though!
Last edited by deebanger on Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

EdBurke
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby EdBurke » Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:29 pm

Hmm... this thread got seriously derailed.

I'm a 1L (Section 3) and agree with both of the above (sinfiery and magna) when it comes to the culture and what not. I am continually surprised by how often people are willing to share notes/outlines and help each other out. While people are certainly driven, we never had a person in our section get out of control in class, and I haven't had any kind of encounter where someone was trying to make me feel inferior. Also, there is a ton of time to go out in the first two months of the semester and everyone is very social. The fact bars stay open so late did throw me off a bit, but that is what catching up in November is for...

I used supplements for every class, but to each their own.

Taus11
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby Taus11 » Mon Dec 23, 2013 11:45 pm

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Last edited by Taus11 on Sat Jul 19, 2014 9:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Magnacromion
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby Magnacromion » Mon Dec 23, 2013 11:59 pm

NYC2012 wrote:I apologize for making you feel bad. BTW, I'm a girl (I just happen to love Dwight). No one is questioning your goodwill to come on here and answer questions, I think we all appreciate that law students do answer our questions, it's the whole point of this forum. But you can't go around talking the way you were talking and not expect to be ridiculed. No one likes people who come off as arrogant. Maybe you're a nice guy, I don't know that. The way you talk, you sound like you think you're God's greatest gift to this earth. Maybe you're just bragging online, but if you talk like that in an interview or in real life it's hard for people to relate to you. Personally, if I had received a full tuition scholarship, I wouldn't tell any of my classmates - it's just not appropriate. It's important to realize you're not any better than anyone else in your class, or anyone at Harvard, or anyone else who didn't get a scholarship. Neither am I. Everyone has their own path and their own purpose, we're all doing our own thing, and that's okay.

I really do wish you the best of luck though, it seems like you didn't mean to sound like a douche.

Hahaha, fair enough; never really watched the American version of The Office (ain't nobody got s*** on Ricky Gervais) but I've heard he's pretty hilarious.

Look, I'm not an aspie, but I do have one aspie trait, viz., I'm prone to saying things that I think sound perfectly normal but others take as arrogant. The way I see it, I do have a better memory than most of my section. And it does make studying a little easier for me. But at the end of the day, it's really just a cheap parlor trick, and it certainly doesn't make me better than anyone else. (I never said it did.) Yeah, you know, I am God's greatest gift to this earth. But so is half my class. One of my sectionmates can make anyone love him within five minutes of meeting him. He networks more than Cisco. It won't help him on exams, but I'd be an idiot if I didn't acknowledge that it'll help him when he's looking for jobs. He'll have a leg up on me, and you know what? That's OK. It's part of life. There are also two debate champions in my section. I will never beat them at oral argument. One of the girls I worked with on a group project is so well organized…without her supervision we couldn't have done half the job we did. I will never be as well organized as she is. And I know it's going to make her a better litigator in many ways than I'll ever be. We were born like this; I can't change this any more than I can wake up in the morning and be six inches taller. I have some pretty cool talents, but so does everyone else in my class. I kinda thought I didn't need to say that…thought you all would have guessed that, seeing as it's a T6 and all. Maybe I should have been clearer about that. My bad. I'm only arrogant if I think I'm better than everyone else. But I don't. I think we're all pretty f***ing awesome.

Nobody knows about my scholarship except for my close friends. Which is actually a pretty large group, since everyone here is so nice. And most of them have partial schollies, too, so I'm not exactly lording it over them.

I should have known better than to answer the question as I did. The poster asked an honest question, and I wanted to give him/her the most complete and accurate answer I could. I gave him/her all of my reasons for picking the scholly, whether or not they were legit (I happen to think that most, if not all of them were). But I really thought people would be more likely to ask about the atmosphere and culture of NYU. After all, I did say at the outset that I was a 1L. That's what I'm most qualified to answer, isn't it? That's what I really wanted to rave about. But the posters asked about different things.

If you really want to know my grades, I'm happy to PM you when they come out. And one of us can laugh at the other, as appropriate.

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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby Magnacromion » Tue Dec 24, 2013 12:04 am

EdBurke wrote:Hmm... this thread got seriously derailed.

I'm a 1L (Section 3) and agree with both of the above (sinfiery and magna) when it comes to the culture and what not. I am continually surprised by how often people are willing to share notes/outlines and help each other out. While people are certainly driven, we never had a person in our section get out of control in class, and I haven't had any kind of encounter where someone was trying to make me feel inferior. Also, there is a ton of time to go out in the first two months of the semester and everyone is very social. The fact bars stay open so late did throw me off a bit, but that is what catching up in November is for...

I used supplements for every class, but to each their own.

I was totally floored by how kind everyone has been. When I had strep, I joked about my "class mothers" worrying about me. (The girls I sat near in class were really worried about me and asked if I was OK.) Once or twice when I missed class, people asked about me, and I actually got notes unsolicited—even when I had only missed class because I had overslept. At one point this semester, one of my classmates got really sick for a week or so…I later emailed her like two months' worth of notes because I had forgotten when exactly she was sick. That's just what we expect of one another. And that's what you get when you come to NYU. We're competitive as hell, but we still love each other. We don't stab each other in the back—it's simply not tolerated. And that's not something you see at every law school.

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NYC2012
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby NYC2012 » Tue Dec 24, 2013 12:39 am

Lolz at "he networks more than Cisco." I think I get you now, and I might have even grown fond of you. Maybe I will see you around in the village :D

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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby Magnacromion » Tue Dec 24, 2013 12:41 am

NYC2012 wrote:Lolz at "he networks more than Cisco." I think I get you now, and I might have even grown fond of you. Maybe I will see you around in the village :D

Haha, well if you do, then I owe you a beer from Three Sheets or Triona's. You go to NYU, too?

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NYC2012
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby NYC2012 » Tue Dec 24, 2013 1:07 am

Magnacromion wrote:
NYC2012 wrote:Lolz at "he networks more than Cisco." I think I get you now, and I might have even grown fond of you. Maybe I will see you around in the village :D

Haha, well if you do, then I owe you a beer from Three Sheets or Triona's. You go to NYU, too?


I think I owe you a beer. Nope I'm just working as a paralegal in NYC until I go to law school!

UnderrateOverachieve
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Re: NYU 1L Taking Questions

Postby UnderrateOverachieve » Tue Dec 24, 2013 2:31 am

I think most people in this thread are reacting poorly to the fact you are self-confident and don't mind exuding it.

Most of the stuff people are berating you for was pompous behavior. It sounded more like you wanted to let people people know important things before taking your advice. Your memory, the fact you didn't use certain materials, etc, are all things that would warn someone asking questions that your advice might not be applicable to them.

Funny that people would freak out on you, but don't mind attacking people over and over telling them they are worthless and need to retake and feel smug about it.

I see this a lot in law school so far (2L). People are worried to share or say anything positive about themselves because others will talk about how "pompous" they are behind their backs.

I feel very confident in myself and was not at all threatened by anything you said OP. I did not even consider anything you said to be in poor taste until other people on this board felt the need to berate you for it.




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