What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

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Lincoln
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby Lincoln » Sun Jul 21, 2013 5:15 pm

Keep in mind that a lot of this is just personal. I regret all use of supplements.

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Cobretti
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby Cobretti » Sun Jul 21, 2013 7:11 pm

Lincoln wrote:Keep in mind that a lot of this is just personal. I regret all use of supplements.

Just curious, why? I've heard a bunch of arguments for them, but I've never heard someone argue against them.

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Lincoln
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby Lincoln » Sun Jul 21, 2013 8:48 pm

Cobretti wrote:
Lincoln wrote:Keep in mind that a lot of this is just personal. I regret all use of supplements.

Just curious, why? I've heard a bunch of arguments for them, but I've never heard someone argue against them.


I found that doing the reading carefully, attending class (and paying attention), and engaging with the material both in class (instead of playing solitaire) and when reading is a lot more helpful in terms of learning the material. I'm generally terrible at memorization of rules or mnemonics, but if I actually understand the underlying policy or can relate it to a fact pattern, it sinks in better. Most of my friends (and we're all top 1/3 and have V15 jobs or clerkships lined up) agree with me. It sometimes requires more work, but I prefer reading the cases. I served as a TA for both LRW and Civ Pro, and I think my approach was helpful in that role, too.

daleearnhardt123
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby daleearnhardt123 » Mon Jul 22, 2013 10:48 am

If your goal is to be median whilst putting forth the absolute minimum (albeit still a decent amount) amount of work, then supplements are certainly the way to go. Also, best not to read the actual cases if your goal is to be this mediocre.

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Bronck
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby Bronck » Mon Jul 22, 2013 1:57 pm

daleearnhardt123 wrote:If your goal is to be median whilst putting forth the absolute minimum (albeit still a decent amount) amount of work, then supplements are certainly the way to go. Also, best not to read the actual cases if your goal is to be this mediocre.


You can totally do better than median by doing this. It worked for me, it might not work for others. For example, Wikipedia and Chemerinsky (plus paying attention in class to see if your professor deviates from either) is all you need for Con Law.

I'd probably suggest reading cases first semester just because law school will be something completely new. But as long as you did well first semester, I don't see much reason to put forth unnecessary effort.

hiima3L
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby hiima3L » Mon Jul 22, 2013 3:03 pm

Lincoln wrote:Keep in mind that a lot of this is just personal. I regret all use of supplements.


I second this. But mostly because in retrospect they were totally unnecessary and a waste of money. I didn't use any 2L or 3L year and did the same or better with significantly less studying (but this is a correlation/causation issue).

1. I would have studied more and differently 1L. TL;DR I would have just focused on getting a good outline, memorizing everything, and practicing exams more. I wasted so much time reading and making my own outline and did not practice tests enough. I feel like I blew it 1L year, but you never know. I know plenty of people who studied more and did worse, and vice versa. It's a crapshoot in most cases.

2. I would have gone over my exams with professors after 1st semester.

3. I would have treated write-on MUCH more seriously. I did not fully appreciate how important getting on law review was until after graduating.

4. I would never have taken any bar classes with the exception of Evidence (but that's mostly because I liked it a lot and some 2L/3L jobs require it). The rest are completely and utterly unnecessary.

5. Related to (4), I would have done more practice-oriented classes. I also would have done more paper-based classes.

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AreJay711
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby AreJay711 » Mon Jul 22, 2013 3:06 pm

I wish I knew my place and didn't ask retarded questions instead of just letting the prof. get through the material. Whatever cool, insightful thoughts on the law you have don't mean shit. Again, your thoughts don't mean shit.

swimmer11
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby swimmer11 » Mon Jul 22, 2013 3:16 pm

You have absolutely no idea what this year is going to bring. Prepare for the worst.

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TheThriller
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby TheThriller » Mon Jul 22, 2013 6:28 pm

swimmer11 wrote:You have absolutely no idea what this year is going to bring. Prepare for the worst.


Aren't you just a ray of sunshine.

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AreJay711
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby AreJay711 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:33 am

TheThriller wrote:
swimmer11 wrote:You have absolutely no idea what this year is going to bring. Prepare for the worst.


Aren't you just a ray of sunshine.


The sun doesn't shine in hell.

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hephaestus
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby hephaestus » Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:41 am

AreJay711 wrote:I wish I knew my place and didn't ask retarded questions instead of just letting the prof. get through the material. Whatever cool, insightful thoughts on the law you have don't mean shit. Again, your thoughts don't mean shit.

Yeah. I kept class participation to a minimum. It was a great decision. No one cares what you think about the 14th amendment.

hiima3L
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby hiima3L » Wed Jul 24, 2013 4:26 pm

swimmer11 wrote:You have absolutely no idea what this year is going to bring. Prepare for the worst.


Related to this: I wish I fully understood (and actively sought out more info so I would have better understood) just how bad the legal market is. I knew 1L year was pretty determinative of the rest of your career, but I didn't fully understand the snowball effect it has.

If you aren't in a top school, you should really, truly consider dropping out after 1L if your grades are mediocre. And by mediocre I mean if you're not in at least the top 15-20%. If you're at a terrible school, you should be in the top 5%.

I thought TLS was overblown doom and gloom until 3L year. It's not. You need to go into this with a do-or-die, feast-or-famine mentality because that is precisely what it is for 99% of you.

RodneyRuxin
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby RodneyRuxin » Wed Jul 24, 2013 4:31 pm

swimmer11 wrote:You have absolutely no idea what this year is going to bring. Prepare for the worst.



This is both devastating for the nervous 0Ls ITT and so true. Love it.

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Lincoln
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby Lincoln » Wed Jul 24, 2013 4:42 pm

hiima3L wrote:
swimmer11 wrote:You have absolutely no idea what this year is going to bring. Prepare for the worst.


Related to this: I wish I fully understood (and actively sought out more info so I would have better understood) just how bad the legal market is. I knew 1L year was pretty determinative of the rest of your career, but I didn't fully understand the snowball effect it has.

If you aren't in a top school, you should really, truly consider dropping out after 1L if your grades are mediocre. And by mediocre I mean if you're not in at least the top 15-20%. If you're at a terrible school, you should be in the top 5%.

I thought TLS was overblown doom and gloom until 3L year. It's not. You need to go into this with a do-or-die, feast-or-famine mentality because that is precisely what it is for 99% of you.


This is hyperbolic. At schools where 50% get Big Law, being in, say, the top 30% is not grounds for dropping out.

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Cobretti
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby Cobretti » Wed Jul 24, 2013 5:12 pm

Lincoln wrote:
hiima3L wrote:
swimmer11 wrote:You have absolutely no idea what this year is going to bring. Prepare for the worst.


Related to this: I wish I fully understood (and actively sought out more info so I would have better understood) just how bad the legal market is. I knew 1L year was pretty determinative of the rest of your career, but I didn't fully understand the snowball effect it has.

If you aren't in a top school, you should really, truly consider dropping out after 1L if your grades are mediocre. And by mediocre I mean if you're not in at least the top 15-20%. If you're at a terrible school, you should be in the top 5%.

I thought TLS was overblown doom and gloom until 3L year. It's not. You need to go into this with a do-or-die, feast-or-famine mentality because that is precisely what it is for 99% of you.


This is hyperbolic. At schools where 50% get Big Law, being in, say, the top 30% is not grounds for dropping out.

I think he qualified that immediately before the part you bolded...

RodneyRuxin wrote:
swimmer11 wrote:You have absolutely no idea what this year is going to bring. Prepare for the worst.



This is both devastating for the nervous 0Ls ITT and so true. Love it.

If 1L winds up being even in my top 3 most stressful years of my life I'll bake both of you a cake.

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stillwater
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby stillwater » Wed Jul 24, 2013 5:18 pm

coming out of TLS retirement to lay down my one solid 1L conviction: Freer's TREATISE is the best 1L supp. ditch that piece of shit by Glannon (joinder sections are pretty good tho) and audio tapes are for tourists.

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AreJay711
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby AreJay711 » Wed Jul 24, 2013 5:20 pm

Cobretti wrote:
Lincoln wrote:
hiima3L wrote:
swimmer11 wrote:You have absolutely no idea what this year is going to bring. Prepare for the worst.


Related to this: I wish I fully understood (and actively sought out more info so I would have better understood) just how bad the legal market is. I knew 1L year was pretty determinative of the rest of your career, but I didn't fully understand the snowball effect it has.

If you aren't in a top school, you should really, truly consider dropping out after 1L if your grades are mediocre. And by mediocre I mean if you're not in at least the top 15-20%. If you're at a terrible school, you should be in the top 5%.

I thought TLS was overblown doom and gloom until 3L year. It's not. You need to go into this with a do-or-die, feast-or-famine mentality because that is precisely what it is for 99% of you.


This is hyperbolic. At schools where 50% get Big Law, being in, say, the top 30% is not grounds for dropping out.

I think he qualified that immediately before the part you bolded...

RodneyRuxin wrote:
swimmer11 wrote:You have absolutely no idea what this year is going to bring. Prepare for the worst.



This is both devastating for the nervous 0Ls ITT and so true. Love it.

If 1L winds up being even in my top 3 most stressful years of my life I'll bake both of you a cake.


Stressful? It wasn't for me. It was awful for many other reasons but not stress. No, your 1L grades are pretty much already set in stone: no matter how hard you study or prepare or work, nothing is going to change them much. Fortunately, I was inclined to good grades . . . but I won't say I earned them, because that would be a lie.

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sinfiery
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby sinfiery » Wed Jul 24, 2013 5:23 pm

Can you, like, go over a practice exam with your prof before the exam?

I feel like that would be the best value for time spent studying, ever.

andythefir
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby andythefir » Wed Jul 24, 2013 5:37 pm

If you have any substance abuse/medical/personal/psychiatric/anxiety/depression issues fix them before you leave for law school. Law school is all about amping up uncertainty and fear while making you doubt everything you've ever done.

If you have an issue that you were able to cope with in high school/undergrad so you think you can handle it in law school you're wrong. Law school drives people to abuse substances and doubt every single decision they make. If you're already on that road it can consume you.

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Lincoln
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby Lincoln » Wed Jul 24, 2013 5:43 pm

Cobretti wrote:
Lincoln wrote:
hiima3L wrote:
swimmer11 wrote:You have absolutely no idea what this year is going to bring. Prepare for the worst.


Related to this: I wish I fully understood (and actively sought out more info so I would have better understood) just how bad the legal market is. I knew 1L year was pretty determinative of the rest of your career, but I didn't fully understand the snowball effect it has.

If you aren't in a top school, you should really, truly consider dropping out after 1L if your grades are mediocre. And by mediocre I mean if you're not in at least the top 15-20%. If you're at a terrible school, you should be in the top 5%.

I thought TLS was overblown doom and gloom until 3L year. It's not. You need to go into this with a do-or-die, feast-or-famine mentality because that is precisely what it is for 99% of you.


This is hyperbolic. At schools where 50% get Big Law, being in, say, the top 30% is not grounds for dropping out.

I think he qualified that immediately before the part you bolded...


Fair enough. I guess it depends on what you mean by "top."

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Devlin
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby Devlin » Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:37 am

I wish I knew to go out more at the beginning of fall semester. Enjoy the first month or so of school. Take that time to get to know your classmates and have fun with them. You will never have that down time again.

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unlicensedpotato
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby unlicensedpotato » Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:42 am

andythefir wrote:If you have any substance abuse/medical/personal/psychiatric/anxiety/depression issues fix them before you leave for law school. Law school is all about amping up uncertainty and fear while making you doubt everything you've ever done.

If you have an issue that you were able to cope with in high school/undergrad so you think you can handle it in law school you're wrong. Law school drives people to abuse substances and doubt every single decision they make. If you're already on that road it can consume you.


O.K. this is hyperbole. Uncertainty? Maybe. I would not describe it as about fear and doubting everything you've ever done. Let's be honest here. It's grad school.
Last edited by unlicensedpotato on Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Danger Zone
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby Danger Zone » Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:43 am

Lincoln wrote:Fair enough. I guess it depends on what you mean by "top."

If half the class is getting big law, that sounds pretty "top" to me, considering there's only about six schools in any given year that boast 50% big law employment.

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hookem7
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby hookem7 » Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:55 am

I wish I didn't stress about being called on so much. It literally does not matter for your grades.

For the supplements, I think it's pretty professor specific. If you have an oddball prof, getting into their mindset is key (at least it was for me). But for most classes, I would agree that supplements will probably teach you more than those expensive textbooks will.

RodneyRuxin
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Re: What do you wish you knew/did when starting 1l

Postby RodneyRuxin » Thu Jul 25, 2013 11:09 am

Cobretti wrote:If 1L winds up being even in my top 3 most stressful years of my life I'll bake both of you a cake.




I miss being a starry-eyed 0L. Fuck the real world.




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