Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

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lhanvt13
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Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby lhanvt13 » Sun May 05, 2013 8:33 pm

So, just wondering if anybody followed the general outline of any TLS guide (such as Arrow's, Talon's, etc) or a combination of them and if they wanted to share their success/failure stories as well. Just curious as to how it all worked out since a lot of the guides have been out for a little while now. :wink: :?:

shock259
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby shock259 » Mon May 06, 2013 12:19 pm

I read them all before starting. I made my own "plan" of sorts based on a bunch of them (picking and choosing). It worked very well and I ended up in the top of the class. But I studied my ass off and didn't have much of a life. Was it necessary? Probably not. The study specifics are a lot less important than learning to take an exam. But it was definitely worth it.

The guides have a lot of good info. But as with all things, take it with a grain of salt. Take the good stuff and leave the rest. And figure out what works for you.

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beepboopbeep
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby beepboopbeep » Mon May 06, 2013 12:26 pm

shock259 wrote:The study specifics are a lot less important than learning to take an exam.


This is something I keep hearing, but it's never in the guides (at least, any of the few I've looked at). Are there any good resources about this, aside from Getting To Maybe?

Seems to me that if one were determined to gun hard during 0L summer (I personally plan on drinking and reading trashy scifi for most of it, but I at least want to know what I should feel guilty about not doing), getting a head start on figuring out exams would be the most productive way to do that. Agree/disagree?

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Bronck
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby Bronck » Mon May 06, 2013 12:32 pm

beepboopbeep wrote:
shock259 wrote:The study specifics are a lot less important than learning to take an exam.


This is something I keep hearing, but it's never in the guides (at least, any of the few I've looked at). Are there any good resources about this, aside from Getting To Maybe?

Seems to me that if one were determined to gun hard during 0L summer (I personally plan on drinking and reading trashy scifi for most of it, but I at least want to know what I should feel guilty about not doing), getting a head start on figuring out exams would be the most productive way to do that. Agree/disagree?


GTM isn't even that useful. I just picked it up while doing PTs.

Argue both ways, take note of the topics the prof likes, read MAs, etc

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Mon May 06, 2013 12:34 pm

beepboopbeep wrote:
shock259 wrote:The study specifics are a lot less important than learning to take an exam.


This is something I keep hearing, but it's never in the guides (at least, any of the few I've looked at). Are there any good resources about this, aside from Getting To Maybe?

Seems to me that if one were determined to gun hard during 0L summer (I personally plan on drinking and reading trashy scifi for most of it, but I at least want to know what I should feel guilty about not doing), getting a head start on figuring out exams would be the most productive way to do that. Agree/disagree?

I agree, but given the nature of law school exams, it's kind of hard to learn how to take an exam before you know anything about the content. Getting to Maybe is the best generic discussion of exams I know of, or maybe LEEWS. But I think both of those are more helpful about halfway into the semester than during 0L summer. And I agree that neither are the only ways to learn exams (looking at your own profs' exams are the most helpful, and you can't do that till you're in school anyway).

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lhanvt13
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby lhanvt13 » Mon May 06, 2013 12:53 pm

shock259 wrote:I read them all before starting. I made my own "plan" of sorts based on a bunch of them (picking and choosing). It worked very well and I ended up in the top of the class. But I studied my ass off and didn't have much of a life. Was it necessary? Probably not. The study specifics are a lot less important than learning to take an exam. But it was definitely worth it.

The guides have a lot of good info. But as with all things, take it with a grain of salt. Take the good stuff and leave the rest. And figure out what works for you.

Thanks shock. Mind sharing how you did the "picking and choosing" in more detail? Like, what did you choose to do / choose not to do. Thanks in advance buddy :)

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cinephile
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby cinephile » Mon May 06, 2013 1:04 pm

Success guides aren't helpful because people have different strengths and weaknesses. It'd be better for you to reflect on your own academic and professional career thus far and figure out where you need to focus your efforts. For example, I burn out quickly - so the smart choice for me was to avoid reading cases and just find case briefs online. Others with more patience might get more out of the cases from reading them, so I wouldn't necessarily recommend you do things as I did.

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lhanvt13
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby lhanvt13 » Mon May 06, 2013 2:58 pm

cinephile wrote:Success guides aren't helpful because people have different strengths and weaknesses. It'd be better for you to reflect on your own academic and professional career thus far and figure out where you need to focus your efforts. For example, I burn out quickly - so the smart choice for me was to avoid reading cases and just find case briefs online. Others with more patience might get more out of the cases from reading them, so I wouldn't necessarily recommend you do things as I did.

Thanks for the info. I understand and I'm just curious as to how they worked out for people who followed them. Also, I'm hoping this thread could be good information for others who are looking into those guides as well. :)

M458
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby M458 » Mon May 06, 2013 6:02 pm

A guide on what guide to use?! Mind blown!

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lhanvt13
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby lhanvt13 » Mon May 06, 2013 6:27 pm

M458 wrote:A guide on what guide to use?! Mind blown!

Hah, more like an experience sharing thread

shock259
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby shock259 » Mon May 06, 2013 7:39 pm

Few things:

1) For how to take an exam, I'd recommend LEEWS. It was painstakingly boring, but it sorta drills things into you. You can get the audio CDs for pretty cheap. That, plus Getting to Maybe is enough for 0L prep. When you start getting near the end of the semester and start doing practice tests, FIND MODEL ANSWERS. Ideally from your professors, but that usually isn't possible. Just find any professor's model exam answers. They may discuss things you didn't discuss or not discuss all the right things, but they will be useful for showing you how a good exam is written/organized. It's getting harder and harder to find model answers these days but Golden Gate University law school still has them on their website. Google it.

2) As to how you know what to pick and choose, I think it's partly knowing yourself and partly stuff you'll pick up on the fly. Some people love supplements. Others don't need them or find them useless. You won't really know until you dive in, but if you feel like you're wasting time by doing something, don't be afraid to go against the grain (or TLS advice threads).

I read in one thread about a guy that read all of his assigned readings on the weekends, then read supplements during the week. That's basically what I did. I also read ahead, so that about a month before finals, I was done with reading for the semester. This gave me lots of time to outline and do tons of practice exams. I also followed the LEEWS approach for taking notes in class (two columns, one side is my notes, on the other side is class notes). This really helped things from becoming unwieldy. When it came to exam time, I didn't follow any of the specific LEEWs strategies. I started writing right away and just wrote for the entire exam. It worked for me.

So that's sort of picking and choosing stuff that I think worked. Your mileage may vary. But just try stuff, and don't be afraid to do things a different way.

3) Take it all with a grain of salt. People are going to be doing all kinds of weird things. Don't pay attention to them. And don't get distracted by the people who talk in class.

That's about all I got for now.

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lhanvt13
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby lhanvt13 » Mon May 06, 2013 7:53 pm

shock259 wrote:Few things:

1) For how to take an exam, I'd recommend LEEWS. It was painstakingly boring, but it sorta drills things into you. You can get the audio CDs for pretty cheap. That, plus Getting to Maybe is enough for 0L prep. When you start getting near the end of the semester and start doing practice tests, FIND MODEL ANSWERS. Ideally from your professors, but that usually isn't possible. Just find any professor's model exam answers. They may discuss things you didn't discuss or not discuss all the right things, but they will be useful for showing you how a good exam is written/organized. It's getting harder and harder to find model answers these days but Golden Gate University law school still has them on their website. Google it.

2) As to how you know what to pick and choose, I think it's partly knowing yourself and partly stuff you'll pick up on the fly. Some people love supplements. Others don't need them or find them useless. You won't really know until you dive in, but if you feel like you're wasting time by doing something, don't be afraid to go against the grain (or TLS advice threads).

I read in one thread about a guy that read all of his assigned readings on the weekends, then read supplements during the week. That's basically what I did. I also read ahead, so that about a month before finals, I was done with reading for the semester. This gave me lots of time to outline and do tons of practice exams. I also followed the LEEWS approach for taking notes in class (two columns, one side is my notes, on the other side is class notes). This really helped things from becoming unwieldy. When it came to exam time, I didn't follow any of the specific LEEWs strategies. I started writing right away and just wrote for the entire exam. It worked for me.

So that's sort of picking and choosing stuff that I think worked. Your mileage may vary. But just try stuff, and don't be afraid to do things a different way.

3) Take it all with a grain of salt. People are going to be doing all kinds of weird things. Don't pay attention to them. And don't get distracted by the people who talk in class.

That's about all I got for now.

Awesome! yeah, I figured I would try new things here and there but since I won't have a "real job" over the summer, I'll probably just try my hand at LEEWs and reading a few fun things here and there, among them GTM.

Thanks for the great insight!

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patrickd139
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby patrickd139 » Mon May 06, 2013 8:04 pm

I got lucky once on an exam by studying the right material the night before that the professor randomly chose to test.

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lhanvt13
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby lhanvt13 » Mon May 06, 2013 8:17 pm

patrickd139 wrote:I got lucky once on an exam by studying the right material the night before that the professor randomly chose to test.

Sounds like a plan: get lucky. I'll be reporting back with results :P

seriously though, that's awesome! mind if I ask what it was specifically?

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patrickd139
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby patrickd139 » Mon May 06, 2013 11:42 pm

lhanvt13 wrote:
patrickd139 wrote:I got lucky once on an exam by studying the right material the night before that the professor randomly chose to test.

Sounds like a plan: get lucky. I'll be reporting back with results :P

seriously though, that's awesome! mind if I ask what it was specifically?

Agency, Partnerships and LLCs.

You'd be surprised at how much of its luck though.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Mon May 06, 2013 11:47 pm

Yup. I missed two days of my advanced torts class the whole semester, and then one of the three questions on the exam was a policy question based entirely on discussion on one of the days I missed. (I mean, I'm sure there were other things I missed, and I'd gotten notes for the class, but for me, it's not the same as being there for the discussion, not for a policy question.)

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lhanvt13
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby lhanvt13 » Mon May 06, 2013 11:59 pm

A. Mouse & patrickd:
wow that's pretty harsh...

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JusticeHarlan
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby JusticeHarlan » Tue May 07, 2013 3:07 pm

beepboopbeep wrote:
shock259 wrote:The study specifics are a lot less important than learning to take an exam.


This is something I keep hearing, but it's never in the guides (at least, any of the few I've looked at). Are there any good resources about this, aside from Getting To Maybe?

Seems to me that if one were determined to gun hard during 0L summer (I personally plan on drinking and reading trashy scifi for most of it, but I at least want to know what I should feel guilty about not doing), getting a head start on figuring out exams would be the most productive way to do that. Agree/disagree?

I've always been a big fan of "Scribe's" guide on "How to learn how to do well on a law school exam."

Randomnumbers
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby Randomnumbers » Tue May 07, 2013 3:16 pm

JusticeHarlan wrote:I've always been a big fan of "Scribe's" guide on "How to learn how to do well on a law school exam."


I read every guide on TLS before my 1L year. Of all of them, I think this one is the only one that really should be mandatory reading. I'd still recommend reading them all, as everyone learns differently. But that's the key - you know how you study. That is how you got into a good law school to begin with. The amount you actually need to learn ('the law') is quite small - it is all about proper application of that law to fact, which is a skill. Grades seem arbitrary because there is no link between grades and hours put in - because everyone puts in enough hours to learn the law.

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lhanvt13
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Re: Mind sharing experiences on the "success guides"?

Postby lhanvt13 » Tue May 07, 2013 5:53 pm

JusticeHarlan wrote:I've always been a big fan of "Scribe's" guide on "How to learn how to do well on a law school exam."

Yup. I've read that before and the guide was awesome!




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