Best Paths To Take for Employments

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KingsCup
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Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby KingsCup » Sat Dec 22, 2012 2:17 am

As said in the title, what are the best paths (in terms of summer employments) to take?

For biglaw, is the best path to take just getting a summer associate position after 1L then working for the same thing after 2L?

For a job at the DA what is the ideal path to take? For public interest law?

Also curious about best paths for other positions in the law field. Now that acceptances are starting to come through, starting to think about what to work for after that.

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atcushman
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby atcushman » Sat Dec 22, 2012 2:53 am

best paths to employment do not involve law school...
best biglaw path hys and grades
best da ps path top 14 and grades
best paths to othe legal jobs top 14 and grades

now that the standard tls responses are out of the way...the best path to any job (other than school and grades) is networking. When you look at schools or select a school get in touch with some alumni in the field you are lookin at take them to coffee and just aproach it as hey im thinking about x law school and noticed you practice x type of law what was your experience like? this is an easy way to start your networking and get solid advice on all of your qs. Stay in contact with these alum but dont be anoying then when your done with finals in the fall get a hold of them again and say hey im starting to think about this summer and the best path I can take to get to where you are. Take them out to coffee again (lawyers love coffee) ask them the usuals and then drop the hey would you mind lookin at my resume (have your resume with you). Listen to what they have to say about it then ask if their firm/agency ever hires 1Ls and hopefully they take your resume and hear something back but more likely they will give you some solid feedback and advice on what to do 1L summer (you will likely end up with a volunteer job at a non profit or government gig) and tell you to apply with them 2L year. Keep in touch and get a 2L gig with them. Then profit.

Get in a good school-get good grades-build strong network and connections-get good grades-do WHATEVER you can 1L summer-get good grades-practice interview skills-get good grades-rock 2L OCI-get good grades-rock 2L SA

utlaw2007
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby utlaw2007 » Tue Jan 01, 2013 9:06 pm

atcushman wrote:best paths to employment do not involve law school...
best biglaw path hys and grades
best da ps path top 14 and grades
best paths to othe legal jobs top 14 and grades

now that the standard tls responses are out of the way...the best path to any job (other than school and grades) is networking. When you look at schools or select a school get in touch with some alumni in the field you are lookin at take them to coffee and just aproach it as hey im thinking about x law school and noticed you practice x type of law what was your experience like? this is an easy way to start your networking and get solid advice on all of your qs. Stay in contact with these alum but dont be anoying then when your done with finals in the fall get a hold of them again and say hey im starting to think about this summer and the best path I can take to get to where you are. Take them out to coffee again (lawyers love coffee) ask them the usuals and then drop the hey would you mind lookin at my resume (have your resume with you). Listen to what they have to say about it then ask if their firm/agency ever hires 1Ls and hopefully they take your resume and hear something back but more likely they will give you some solid feedback and advice on what to do 1L summer (you will likely end up with a volunteer job at a non profit or government gig) and tell you to apply with them 2L year. Keep in touch and get a 2L gig with them. Then profit.

Get in a good school-get good grades-build strong network and connections-get good grades-do WHATEVER you can 1L summer-get good grades-practice interview skills-get good grades-rock 2L OCI-get good grades-rock 2L SA


The best pathway to working for the DA is not T-14 plus grades. A DA's job does not care about prestige. They care somewhat about grades. Every employer does. But they care more about an interest to want to be there and that you have the skills to do the job. And the only way you can show that you want to be there and have the skills needed to be effective is by taking classes that highlight skills needed for a DA's office such as evidence and criminal procedure. It also helps to take some sort of trial advocacy class at whatever law school you attend or do some sort of mock trial, interscholastic preferably. Also, if your school has a criminal defense clinic, you should participate in that.

As for landing a job with any other legal employer not biglaw. The better the school's reputation and the better your grades, the more likely your chances are of getting hired. But saying that coming from any T14 with good grades will be better than attending the best school in a given region or a good school in a given region is just not at all accurate. For example, a Duke grad with good grades doesn't stand a chance against a UT Law grad with good grades in Texas. A UVA grad with good grades doesn't stand a chance against a USC grad with good grades in LA. Most of the T-14 schools are heavily regional, as well. Sure, you can go to another region of the country to work. You can do that coming out of UT or Vanderbilt which are not T-14 schools. But every school not named Harvard, Yale, or Stanford is going to be regional to some degree, meaning that those grads will not be sought after over UCLA, Vanderbilt, USC, or Texas grads in their respective regions. And if a graduate at a regional TT school like University of Houston has great grades, he/she will likely get the nod over a Duke or any lower T14 grad with just pretty good grades. Law school employment is VERY regional. Don't think for a minute that you can go to Michigan and have good grades and easily get a job over an SMU (TT) grad with great grades in Dallas, especially at a smaller firm. It just ain't gonna happen. The smaller the firm, the more important regional ties become.

All of the schools outside of the T6 to T18ish are pretty what and what with employers in neutral regions of the country. There are advantages that some schools have over others, obviously. But it's not as big as any T14 is automatically better than a T18 because it is a T14, as if every school in the T14 is interchangeable. It's not like an employer looks at applicants with equal grades and says that applicant A should get the job over applicant B because his school is ranked 5 spots higher in US News. Regional biases weigh heavily in the hiring process for firms of any size including biglaw. The only schools really immune to such bias are Harvard, Yale, and Stanford.
Last edited by utlaw2007 on Tue Jan 01, 2013 9:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

utlaw2007
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby utlaw2007 » Tue Jan 01, 2013 9:48 pm

I apologize if the above poster was just being sarcastic with his "standard TLS responses" response.

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Ramius
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby Ramius » Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:15 pm

utlaw2007 wrote:
atcushman wrote:best paths to employment do not involve law school...
best biglaw path hys and grades
best da ps path top 14 and grades
best paths to othe legal jobs top 14 and grades

now that the standard tls responses are out of the way...the best path to any job (other than school and grades) is networking. When you look at schools or select a school get in touch with some alumni in the field you are lookin at take them to coffee and just aproach it as hey im thinking about x law school and noticed you practice x type of law what was your experience like? this is an easy way to start your networking and get solid advice on all of your qs. Stay in contact with these alum but dont be anoying then when your done with finals in the fall get a hold of them again and say hey im starting to think about this summer and the best path I can take to get to where you are. Take them out to coffee again (lawyers love coffee) ask them the usuals and then drop the hey would you mind lookin at my resume (have your resume with you). Listen to what they have to say about it then ask if their firm/agency ever hires 1Ls and hopefully they take your resume and hear something back but more likely they will give you some solid feedback and advice on what to do 1L summer (you will likely end up with a volunteer job at a non profit or government gig) and tell you to apply with them 2L year. Keep in touch and get a 2L gig with them. Then profit.

Get in a good school-get good grades-build strong network and connections-get good grades-do WHATEVER you can 1L summer-get good grades-practice interview skills-get good grades-rock 2L OCI-get good grades-rock 2L SA


The best pathway to working for the DA is not T-14 plus grades. A DA's job does not care about prestige. They care somewhat about grades. Every employer does. But they care more about an interest to want to be there and that you have the skills to do the job. And the only way you can show that you want to be there and have the skills needed to be effective is by taking classes that highlight skills needed for a DA's office such as evidence and criminal procedure. It also helps to take some sort of trial advocacy class at whatever law school you attend or do some sort of mock trial, interscholastic preferably. Also, if your school has a criminal defense clinic, you should participate in that.

As for landing a job with any other legal employer not biglaw. The better the school's reputation and the better your grades, the more likely your chances are of getting hired. But saying that coming from any T14 with good grades will be better than attending the best school in a given region or a good school in a given region is just not at all accurate. For example, a Duke grad with good grades doesn't stand a chance against a UT Law grad with good grades in Texas. A UVA grad with good grades doesn't stand a chance against a USC grad with good grades in LA. Most of the T-14 schools are heavily regional, as well. Sure, you can go to another region of the country to work. You can do that coming out of UT or Vanderbilt which are not T-14 schools. But every school not named Harvard, Yale, or Stanford is going to be regional to some degree, meaning that those grads will not be sought after over UCLA, Vanderbilt, USC, or Texas grads in their respective regions. And if a graduate at a regional TT school like University of Houston has great grades, he/she will likely get the nod over a Duke or any lower T14 grad with just pretty good grades. Law school employment is VERY regional. Don't think for a minute that you can go to Michigan and have good grades and easily get a job over an SMU (TT) grad with great grades in Dallas, especially at a smaller firm. It just ain't gonna happen. The smaller the firm, the more important regional ties become.

All of the schools outside of the T6 to T18ish are pretty what and what with employers in neutral regions of the country. There are advantages that some schools have over others, obviously. But it's not as big as any T14 is automatically better than a T18 because it is a T14, as if every school in the T14 is interchangeable. It's not like an employer looks at applicants with equal grades and says that applicant A should get the job over applicant B because his school is ranked 5 spots higher in US News. Regional biases weigh heavily in the hiring process for firms of any size including biglaw. The only schools really immune to such bias are Harvard, Yale, and Stanford.


How does this "apples vs. oranges (read T14 vs. really strong regional)" apply to saturated markets like LA and DC? For instance, GULC seems to be largely disregarded in the DC market in favor of a vast majority of HYS applicants, which makes sense, but beyond that, does GULC perform well in DC on par with UVA and other T14? Similarly, isn't it reasonable to say that a non-HYS T14 would be competitive against a similar regional affiliation? Not to say they would be hired outright having gone to aforementioned T14, but would it not make the firm at least look closely at the periphery?

I'm honestly unclear about the greying lines between national v. regional in the reformed legal market, so please forgive me if this question seems ridiculous to those of you out there better informed on the legal market.

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atcushman
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby atcushman » Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:23 pm

utlaw2007 wrote:I apologize if the above poster was just being sarcastic with his "standard TLS responses" response.


It was which is why I then offered the networking advice, given the general nature of his question I felt was the best answer. I do not believe my answer is contrary to any advice you gave, most of which I agree with.
Last edited by atcushman on Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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dingbat
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby dingbat » Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:40 pm

matthewsean85 wrote:How does this "apples vs. oranges (read T14 vs. really strong regional)" apply to saturated markets like LA and DC? For instance, GULC seems to be largely disregarded in the DC market in favor of a vast majority of HYS applicants, which makes sense, but beyond that, does GULC perform well in DC on par with UVA and other T14? Similarly, isn't it reasonable to say that a non-HYS T14 would be competitive against a similar regional affiliation? Not to say they would be hired outright having gone to aforementioned T14, but would it not make the firm at least look closely at the periphery?

I'm honestly unclear about the greying lines between national v. regional in the reformed legal market, so please forgive me if this question seems ridiculous to those of you out there better informed on the legal market.

While everything UTLAW2007 said is true, it's also fairly generic. The answer to your question varies by market and by school. DC is very much HYS focused, while NYC is the market most open to out-of-region candidates. The Pacific North West is very insular and going to a local school is absolutely recommended if you want to break in there. But even this is generalized and certain schools hold more sway in some regions than others.

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Ramius
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby Ramius » Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:57 pm

dingbat wrote:
matthewsean85 wrote:How does this "apples vs. oranges (read T14 vs. really strong regional)" apply to saturated markets like LA and DC? For instance, GULC seems to be largely disregarded in the DC market in favor of a vast majority of HYS applicants, which makes sense, but beyond that, does GULC perform well in DC on par with UVA and other T14? Similarly, isn't it reasonable to say that a non-HYS T14 would be competitive against a similar regional affiliation? Not to say they would be hired outright having gone to aforementioned T14, but would it not make the firm at least look closely at the periphery?

I'm honestly unclear about the greying lines between national v. regional in the reformed legal market, so please forgive me if this question seems ridiculous to those of you out there better informed on the legal market.

While everything UTLAW2007 said is true, it's also fairly generic. The answer to your question varies by market and by school. DC is very much HYS focused, while NYC is the market most open to out-of-region candidates. The Pacific North West is very insular and going to a local school is absolutely recommended if you want to break in there. But even this is generalized and certain schools hold more sway in some regions than others.


This seems to be exactly what I suspected. While grades and relative prestige to the local market will carry a great deal of weight, it varies so disparately that no general rule can exist. Doesn't this lead most to think that, absent of other factors, most must take their relative prospects and decide based on their previously disregarded soft factors along with potential debt whether the cost-benefit analysis skews in their favor? For each person it's different, but it seems to me that when you talk about the top schools in law school, it comes down to debt-aversion (definitely justifiable) and chance of gainful employment. Lower T14 will be at a disadvantage to the rarified air of HYS, but beyond that, isn't this all a gamble?

I've struggled with this for months now, and I have the benefit of counting on a fairly substantial scholarship complements of the U.S. Gov't, so I can't imagine what others might feel on the issue. Regardless, it seems like one of the most catalyst decisions of a early-20's life for most.

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dingbat
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby dingbat » Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:06 pm

You need to consider 2 questions first:
1) where do you want to end up after law school?
2) do you care more about location or more about employment?
matthewsean85 wrote:This seems to be exactly what I suspected. While grades and relative prestige to the local market will carry a great deal of weight, it varies so disparately that no general rule can exist.
General rules can and do exist, but you have to realize that they're general rules, not specific
matthewsean85 wrote:Doesn't this lead most to think that, absent of other factors, most must take their relative prospects and decide based on their previously disregarded soft factors along with potential debt whether the cost-benefit analysis skews in their favor?
I see a lot of big words but I don't know what this means
matthewsean85 wrote:For each person it's different, but it seems to me that when you talk about the top schools in law school, it comes down to debt-aversion (definitely justifiable) and chance of gainful employment Lower T14 will be at a disadvantage to the rarified air of HYS, but beyond that, isn't this all a gamble?
Even at HYS it's possible to strike out. Cost vs likely outcomes should be part of the consideration, although very few have actually done any detailed analysis
matthewsean85 wrote:I've struggled with this for months now, and I have the benefit of counting on a fairly substantial scholarship complements of the U.S. Gov't, so I can't imagine what others might feel on the issue. Regardless, it seems like one of the most catalyst decisions of a early-20's life for most.
everyone is different. Some people say risk be damned, others try to avoid risk and go for the cheapest options. The majority is somewhere in between. Everyone's risk/reward point is different.

rad lulz
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby rad lulz » Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:10 pm

Just do Yale bro

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Ramius
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby Ramius » Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:33 pm

dingbat wrote:You need to consider 2 questions first:
1) where do you want to end up after law school?
2) do you care more about location or more about employment?
matthewsean85 wrote:This seems to be exactly what I suspected. While grades and relative prestige to the local market will carry a great deal of weight, it varies so disparately that no general rule can exist.
General rules can and do exist, but you have to realize that they're general rules, not specific
matthewsean85 wrote:Doesn't this lead most to think that, absent of other factors, most must take their relative prospects and decide based on their previously disregarded soft factors along with potential debt whether the cost-benefit analysis skews in their favor?
I see a lot of big words but I don't know what this means
matthewsean85 wrote:For each person it's different, but it seems to me that when you talk about the top schools in law school, it comes down to debt-aversion (definitely justifiable) and chance of gainful employment Lower T14 will be at a disadvantage to the rarified air of HYS, but beyond that, isn't this all a gamble?
Even at HYS it's possible to strike out. Cost vs likely outcomes should be part of the consideration, although very few have actually done any detailed analysis
matthewsean85 wrote:I've struggled with this for months now, and I have the benefit of counting on a fairly substantial scholarship complements of the U.S. Gov't, so I can't imagine what others might feel on the issue. Regardless, it seems like one of the most catalyst decisions of a early-20's life for most.
everyone is different. Some people say risk be damned, others try to avoid risk and go for the cheapest options. The majority is somewhere in between. Everyone's risk/reward point is different.


Absolutely agreed, and many of my statements were sweeping generalities, it's just difficult to differentiate between CW at TLS (which arguably has a fresher approach on the realities of legal hiring along with LST and a few select blogophiles) and what happens outside of the general CW. I guess my curiosity lies in those outliers, even though they can't be taken for anything outside of anecdotal evidence of legal hiring.

Rad Lulz, while I appreciate your ability to effectively kill pretty much any "What Are My Chances?" thread in a mere instant, and your sarcasm cuts with the sharp edge of Ice, I'm mostly hi-jacking this thread with the attempt to open discussions (that have arguably been had before, while not in the constantly evolving legal climate) about how the new legal market is seeing the concept of "regional" vs. "national" as was previously defined by the relics of the T14 world and the so-called national reach of these institutions.

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suralin
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby suralin » Wed Jan 02, 2013 12:13 am

utlaw2007 wrote:
atcushman wrote:best paths to employment do not involve law school...
best biglaw path hys and grades
best da ps path top 14 and grades
best paths to othe legal jobs top 14 and grades

now that the standard tls responses are out of the way...the best path to any job (other than school and grades) is networking. When you look at schools or select a school get in touch with some alumni in the field you are lookin at take them to coffee and just aproach it as hey im thinking about x law school and noticed you practice x type of law what was your experience like? this is an easy way to start your networking and get solid advice on all of your qs. Stay in contact with these alum but dont be anoying then when your done with finals in the fall get a hold of them again and say hey im starting to think about this summer and the best path I can take to get to where you are. Take them out to coffee again (lawyers love coffee) ask them the usuals and then drop the hey would you mind lookin at my resume (have your resume with you). Listen to what they have to say about it then ask if their firm/agency ever hires 1Ls and hopefully they take your resume and hear something back but more likely they will give you some solid feedback and advice on what to do 1L summer (you will likely end up with a volunteer job at a non profit or government gig) and tell you to apply with them 2L year. Keep in touch and get a 2L gig with them. Then profit.

Get in a good school-get good grades-build strong network and connections-get good grades-do WHATEVER you can 1L summer-get good grades-practice interview skills-get good grades-rock 2L OCI-get good grades-rock 2L SA


The best pathway to working for the DA is not T-14 plus grades. A DA's job does not care about prestige. They care somewhat about grades. Every employer does. But they care more about an interest to want to be there and that you have the skills to do the job. And the only way you can show that you want to be there and have the skills needed to be effective is by taking classes that highlight skills needed for a DA's office such as evidence and criminal procedure. It also helps to take some sort of trial advocacy class at whatever law school you attend or do some sort of mock trial, interscholastic preferably. Also, if your school has a criminal defense clinic, you should participate in that.

As for landing a job with any other legal employer not biglaw. The better the school's reputation and the better your grades, the more likely your chances are of getting hired. But saying that coming from any T14 with good grades will be better than attending the best school in a given region or a good school in a given region is just not at all accurate. For example, a Duke grad with good grades doesn't stand a chance against a UT Law grad with good grades in Texas. A UVA grad with good grades doesn't stand a chance against a USC grad with good grades in LA. Most of the T-14 schools are heavily regional, as well. Sure, you can go to another region of the country to work. You can do that coming out of UT or Vanderbilt which are not T-14 schools. But every school not named Harvard, Yale, or Stanford is going to be regional to some degree, meaning that those grads will not be sought after over UCLA, Vanderbilt, USC, or Texas grads in their respective regions. And if a graduate at a regional TT school like University of Houston has great grades, he/she will likely get the nod over a Duke or any lower T14 grad with just pretty good grades. Law school employment is VERY regional. Don't think for a minute that you can go to Michigan and have good grades and easily get a job over an SMU (TT) grad with great grades in Dallas, especially at a smaller firm. It just ain't gonna happen. The smaller the firm, the more important regional ties become.

All of the schools outside of the T6 to T18ish are pretty what and what with employers in neutral regions of the country. There are advantages that some schools have over others, obviously. But it's not as big as any T14 is automatically better than a T18 because it is a T14, as if every school in the T14 is interchangeable. It's not like an employer looks at applicants with equal grades and says that applicant A should get the job over applicant B because his school is ranked 5 spots higher in US News. Regional biases weigh heavily in the hiring process for firms of any size including biglaw. The only schools really immune to such bias are Harvard, Yale, and Stanford.


Generally accurate, but I would add in the obvious caveat that one can go to a T14 and yet still have ties to a small regional/insular market. In fact, that person will probably have an advantage over both somebody with better grades from a T14 without ties and somebody with even better grades at the regional TT. So if your hypothetical Michigan grad had grown up his/her whole life close to Dallas, family lives there, etc., s/he will likely have an edge over the SMU grad with better grades.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Wed Jan 02, 2013 12:46 am

matthewsean85 wrote:
dingbat wrote:You need to consider 2 questions first:
1) where do you want to end up after law school?
2) do you care more about location or more about employment?
matthewsean85 wrote:This seems to be exactly what I suspected. While grades and relative prestige to the local market will carry a great deal of weight, it varies so disparately that no general rule can exist.
General rules can and do exist, but you have to realize that they're general rules, not specific
matthewsean85 wrote:Doesn't this lead most to think that, absent of other factors, most must take their relative prospects and decide based on their previously disregarded soft factors along with potential debt whether the cost-benefit analysis skews in their favor?
I see a lot of big words but I don't know what this means
matthewsean85 wrote:For each person it's different, but it seems to me that when you talk about the top schools in law school, it comes down to debt-aversion (definitely justifiable) and chance of gainful employment Lower T14 will be at a disadvantage to the rarified air of HYS, but beyond that, isn't this all a gamble?
Even at HYS it's possible to strike out. Cost vs likely outcomes should be part of the consideration, although very few have actually done any detailed analysis
matthewsean85 wrote:I've struggled with this for months now, and I have the benefit of counting on a fairly substantial scholarship complements of the U.S. Gov't, so I can't imagine what others might feel on the issue. Regardless, it seems like one of the most catalyst decisions of a early-20's life for most.
everyone is different. Some people say risk be damned, others try to avoid risk and go for the cheapest options. The majority is somewhere in between. Everyone's risk/reward point is different.


Absolutely agreed, and many of my statements were sweeping generalities, it's just difficult to differentiate between CW at TLS (which arguably has a fresher approach on the realities of legal hiring along with LST and a few select blogophiles) and what happens outside of the general CW. I guess my curiosity lies in those outliers, even though they can't be taken for anything outside of anecdotal evidence of legal hiring.

Rad Lulz, while I appreciate your ability to effectively kill pretty much any "What Are My Chances?" thread in a mere instant, and your sarcasm cuts with the sharp edge of Ice, I'm mostly hi-jacking this thread with the attempt to open discussions (that have arguably been had before, while not in the constantly evolving legal climate) about how the new legal market is seeing the concept of "regional" vs. "national" as was previously defined by the relics of the T14 world and the so-called national reach of these institutions.


Some advice: work on your writing before law school.

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atcushman
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby atcushman » Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:01 am

There are benefits and drawbacks of going to either a t14 or a strong regional

Strong regional
Easier to network
Can get the moneys (if your choosing between a t14 and regional your prob getting some scholy from the regional)
In state tuition
Biglaw has hard cutoffs for hiring from specific schools (some will interview the top 33% from x school, top 40% from top 6 school, and maybe top 10-25% from the regional depending on the strength)
That being said if you fall outside the cutoff your networking and ties wont mean squat but if you are above the cutoff it becomes more about "fit" and the "culture of the firm" so your ties will help you stand out


T14
If you don't have an "in" and someone looks at an app from Berkeley and an applicant from lets say UW guess who gets the advantage? That being said PNW is very insular and it would not be hard to find an in at UW as long as your grades were solid

If you have ties to a region already (grew up there, family there, ug there) and you leave to go to a t14 no employer is going to hold this against you and you will have a leg up on people with the same ties who went to a lower school

This is key in this market-lets say you are totally committed to a market and choose the regional school as apposed to the t-14 national school...what happens if you strike out in the region? If your in a t-14 you just mass mail more regions if you are at the regional school uhh...odds are less that you will get any hits on mass mailers to firms in Chicago when you attended UW.

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suralin
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby suralin » Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:21 am

Richie Tenenbaum wrote:
matthewsean85 wrote:
dingbat wrote:You need to consider 2 questions first:
1) where do you want to end up after law school?
2) do you care more about location or more about employment?
matthewsean85 wrote:This seems to be exactly what I suspected. While grades and relative prestige to the local market will carry a great deal of weight, it varies so disparately that no general rule can exist.
General rules can and do exist, but you have to realize that they're general rules, not specific
matthewsean85 wrote:Doesn't this lead most to think that, absent of other factors, most must take their relative prospects and decide based on their previously disregarded soft factors along with potential debt whether the cost-benefit analysis skews in their favor?
I see a lot of big words but I don't know what this means
matthewsean85 wrote:For each person it's different, but it seems to me that when you talk about the top schools in law school, it comes down to debt-aversion (definitely justifiable) and chance of gainful employment Lower T14 will be at a disadvantage to the rarified air of HYS, but beyond that, isn't this all a gamble?
Even at HYS it's possible to strike out. Cost vs likely outcomes should be part of the consideration, although very few have actually done any detailed analysis
matthewsean85 wrote:I've struggled with this for months now, and I have the benefit of counting on a fairly substantial scholarship complements of the U.S. Gov't, so I can't imagine what others might feel on the issue. Regardless, it seems like one of the most catalyst decisions of a early-20's life for most.
everyone is different. Some people say risk be damned, others try to avoid risk and go for the cheapest options. The majority is somewhere in between. Everyone's risk/reward point is different.


Absolutely agreed, and many of my statements were sweeping generalities, it's just difficult to differentiate between CW at TLS (which arguably has a fresher approach on the realities of legal hiring along with LST and a few select blogophiles) and what happens outside of the general CW. I guess my curiosity lies in those outliers, even though they can't be taken for anything outside of anecdotal evidence of legal hiring.

Rad Lulz, while I appreciate your ability to effectively kill pretty much any "What Are My Chances?" thread in a mere instant, and your sarcasm cuts with the sharp edge of Ice, I'm mostly hi-jacking this thread with the attempt to open discussions (that have arguably been had before, while not in the constantly evolving legal climate) about how the new legal market is seeing the concept of "regional" vs. "national" as was previously defined by the relics of the T14 world and the so-called national reach of these institutions.


Some advice: work on your writing before law school.


I didn't want to directly say it, but agreed. Frankly, your writing is painful to read, and sounds more like you're trying to come off as impressive than anything else. Just my opinion of course.

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J-e-L-L-o
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby J-e-L-L-o » Wed Jan 02, 2013 5:19 am

Richie Tenenbaum wrote:
Some advice: work on your writing before law school.

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Ramius
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby Ramius » Wed Jan 02, 2013 6:59 am

J-e-L-L-o wrote:
Richie Tenenbaum wrote:
Some advice: work on your writing before law school.


Point taken. Not trying to sound like a douche and I apologize.

utlaw2007
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby utlaw2007 » Wed Jan 02, 2013 3:30 pm

Glad to see that this ended up being a spirited discussion.

rad lulz
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby rad lulz » Wed Jan 02, 2013 3:40 pm

Just do nepotism bro

utlaw2007
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby utlaw2007 » Wed Jan 02, 2013 3:44 pm

rad lulz wrote:Just do nepotism bro


Haha!

KingsCup
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby KingsCup » Thu Jan 03, 2013 12:57 am

How tough is it to be accepted to a JAG program either post law school or through their student program?

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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby rad lulz » Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:27 am

bgoodrick wrote:How tough is it to be accepted to a JAG program either post law school or through their student program?

in a word, very

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J-e-L-L-o
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby J-e-L-L-o » Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:19 am

I'm a veteran and I was browsing the military thread. I believe it was around 8% acceptance this year for JAG.

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Ramius
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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby Ramius » Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:01 am

J-e-L-L-o wrote:I'm a veteran and I was browsing the military thread. I believe it was around 8% acceptance this year for JAG.


In recent years it has been right around the 6-8% mark. Anyone know how that compares to other gov't job acceptance rates?

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Re: Best Paths To Take for Employments

Postby KingsCup » Tue Jan 08, 2013 8:21 pm

matthewsean85 wrote:
J-e-L-L-o wrote:I'm a veteran and I was browsing the military thread. I believe it was around 8% acceptance this year for JAG.


In recent years it has been right around the 6-8% mark. Anyone know how that compares to other gov't job acceptance rates?


+1

I'm looking at potentially going into some type of government work, ideally JAG but maybe DOJ or something along those lines.

Also, as a follow up to my previous question, is there anything that JAG recruiters look for especially? Any certain ways that I could stand out from the crowd besides having good grades?




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