Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
User avatar
lowry99
Posts: 14
Joined: Fri May 25, 2012 12:29 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby lowry99 » Mon May 28, 2012 12:22 am

redacted
Last edited by lowry99 on Thu May 31, 2012 4:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
FlanAl
Posts: 1474
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:53 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby FlanAl » Mon May 28, 2012 1:12 am

I have no idea who anyone is on tls at cornell...
I'm going to second a lot of the things that Shan's been saying. Law school prestige is super weird in that all of the people I know who go to T2's like it but all the people at t14's think it sucks. Cornell specifically sucks for a few main reasons:

1. Graded legal writing SUCKS. I mean its only kind of graded legal writing, since almost everyone gets a B+ in it. BUT you could be in a section like mine where everyone was super eager to get that elusive A-, thus making the curve more of a drag and forcing normal people to work way harder to get their token B+.

2. In addition to graded legal writing we take 4 substantive classes. I think most schools do 3 and an ungraded legal writing, this is way better.

3. My understanding is that most top schools have close to a million journals and other than law review pretty much anyone can get on a journal. I really don't know how it works at Cornell, but with only three journals, I think there is a bit of a risk that some people who did the competition might not get on a journal (probably me...). I have heard that you can work on too , but I really don't know.

I have a hunch that these things that make Cornell suck more than other t14's are why our employment stats are usually pretty good. They know that we're a bunch of kids who moved to the icy tundra and will do all kinds of suck just to get whatever NLJ job in NYC. We're trained to do well in big law, haha.

SOCIALLY I really don't think it is as bad as Shan says. There are a lot of people that could probably be really great people outside of law school, but they get really caught up in the whole prestige mentality. Some of them know exactly why they are working so hard, but a lot of them learned that there was a vault list and they just want the top of the list in like all aspects of their life.

There are also a good amount of people who should have re-taken the lsat. There are definitely people who only went to cornell because it was the highest ranked school they go into and they "felt" like they deserved better.

But I really like the group of people that I hang out with regularly, I've had a lot of fun in Ithaca, it is really beautiful and Thai Cuisine is **Best Thai Food in New York State include New York City**!

SHANbangs
Posts: 206
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2009 8:36 am

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby SHANbangs » Mon May 28, 2012 11:35 am

graded legal writing did suck.

To be fair, I think there were a lot of really nice and down to earth people at law school, but I think the obnoxious/fake/prestige-obsessed people overshadowed them. I get the feeling that there were many small, isolated pockets of people who are really cool but mostly hung out with each other, with an almost tribalistic distrust of a perceived law school majority.

I do not want big law to pay off my debt (i actually don't have much in the way of student loans because I am mostly paying my parents back). I want big law because i think it'll give me very good training and exit opportunities for in-house, which is ultimately what I want.

Thai cuisine will never be good. If it weren't for FlanAl's abhorrent taste in food, we could have been friends. :lol:

User avatar
PennBull
Posts: 15435
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:59 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby PennBull » Mon May 28, 2012 11:49 am

SHANbangs wrote:the overrated wegmans


Now, I've never been to the Ithaca Wegmans (I try to stay as far away from Ithaca at all times), but this is the first time I've ever heard a Wegmans described as overrated. I'm guessing it was hyped up way too much being that there's nothing else in Ithaca, and that it may not be the best Wegmans ever.

SHANbangs
Posts: 206
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2009 8:36 am

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby SHANbangs » Mon May 28, 2012 12:18 pm

My experience: overpriced food that's available 24 hours. When I want to buy meat, I just go to wal-mart now. Somebody please tell me what is good about wegman's? Also, having grown up in upstate new york, I'm much more used to price chopper.

User avatar
PennBull
Posts: 15435
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:59 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby PennBull » Mon May 28, 2012 12:26 pm

SHANbangs wrote:My experience: overpriced food that's available 24 hours. When I want to buy meat, I just go to wal-mart now. Somebody please tell me what is good about wegman's? Also, having grown up in upstate new york, I'm much more used to price chopper.


Really? I also grew up in Upstate NY and I've never heard of Price Chopper. Only Wegmans for me.

Wegmans in my experience has not been overpriced compared to the competition, has a ridiculous variety and size, has VERY good Wegmans-brand products (I've never been to another store where I actually PREFERRED the store brand like I do Wegmans), and an exceptional deli/subshop/prepared foods/preseasoned-ready-to-cook items. Wegmans' meat should be a lot more diverse than you could even come close to finding at a Wal-Mart, so that surprises me.

Again, never been to Ithaca's Wegmans, but Wegmans has always completely blown away any other grocery store I've been to. I think it's a little ridiculous for people to obsess over it like a cult, but it's quality compared to others really can't be denied with the Wegmans I'm familiar with.

I still think somebody in the Wegmans cult overhyped a grocery store for you, and I get the feeling Ithaca's Wegmans not on par with most Wegmans (which wouldn't surprise me coming out of Ithaca).

User avatar
FlanAl
Posts: 1474
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:53 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby FlanAl » Mon May 28, 2012 12:36 pm

what is extremely sad is that i'm pretty sure wegmans has the best general tso's in town. i've ordered from like 3 different places and gone to multiple places in college town, they all suck.

The pocket thing is definitely true. If I knew who you were, I'm sure you'd be welcome in my pocket. (that sounds pretty weird...)

SHANbangs
Posts: 206
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2009 8:36 am

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby SHANbangs » Mon May 28, 2012 12:42 pm

All of the above is true about wegman's. It's just that I don't eat store-bought packaged foods very often. Also, i mostly care about meat price and meat fattiness (the fatter the better!), so for me, buying at wal-mart makes much more sense. But, for a more palette conscious perspective, I certainly see why Wegman's is superior (I'll admit it's definitely better than Topp's and Win Li/sorry excuse for an asian grocery).

The pocket thing sounds kind of sexual :twisted:

User avatar
lowry99
Posts: 14
Joined: Fri May 25, 2012 12:29 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby lowry99 » Mon May 28, 2012 4:06 pm

redacted
Last edited by lowry99 on Thu May 31, 2012 4:49 am, edited 1 time in total.

SHANbangs
Posts: 206
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2009 8:36 am

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby SHANbangs » Mon May 28, 2012 4:31 pm

lowry99 wrote:sorry to re-ask: What other schools did you decide between?

I am currently looking at Cornell or paying about $50k-60k less to go to a slightly lower ranked school. Do you think your experience might have been better if you went somewhere else, and would that be worth that much $$?

I haven't had the chance to go to an admitted students day at Cornell, the Vanderbilt one was very impressive...but most of what I've seen about Cornell is that it is harder than it needs to be and the return for that isn't amazing. Plus in terms of NY you are still standing in line behind Columbia and NYU.

Also: Alec Baldwin made a commercial for Wegmans just because his mother loves it so much...people don't normally do that for a chain of grocery stores (although Trader Joe's does inspire some devotion).


I would reiterate what other people on this thread have said: what is the other school? And what are your career and geographic goals? Without knowing these things, we can't really help you there. That being said, if you want NYC big law, I don't see any other school ranked below (and maybe even a few ranked above) better than cornell. In fact, even if you wanted DC big law, it's not like a school GULC is gonna give you much of an advantage when your overall opportunity is pretty low.

I wouldn't put much stock in admitted student days.

As for wegman's, sorry, I guess I'm used to paying 2.99/lb for a cut of rib eye or beef short ribs in Chinatown.

User avatar
FlanAl
Posts: 1474
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:53 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby FlanAl » Mon May 28, 2012 8:06 pm

i know you don't want to out yourself, but do you live in hughes? it seems like living in hughes would add a different dimension to everything that could either make it a lot better or a lot worse.

User avatar
Ikki
Posts: 405
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2011 3:37 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby Ikki » Mon May 28, 2012 9:34 pm

This SHANbangs person sounds pretty bitter. This might sound like cliched advice, but be it law school, med school, or whatever other graduate/professional degree you're pursuing, only you can make the best of it.

Yeah, there are some people that are overly snobbish and have an over-inflated sense of themselves, but I tried to stay away from them and didn't let that affect me in the least. If you wanted to have fun in Ithaca you certainly could. About half-way through the first semester I realized I didn't want to hang out (mostly) with other law school kids so I went out of my way to find people that I got along with and actually found them. most of them are MBAs, undergrads, and engineers.

Every single weekend of my second semester was a blast.

You want to go out and have dinner at a nice place? Sure, try something out in the commons.

You want to go out to a bar and have a beer chilling with your friends? That's what Chapter House's for.

Want to hit on drunken Cornell undergrad chicks? Go to Level B.

Want to easily take home a skanky IC chick? Go to Silky Jones or Moonie's.

If any of you 0Ls are considering Cornell and your decision is coming down to whatever school you think you will fit-in better at, rest assured that if you think you'll have a shitty time here at Ithaca, you probably will. But if you have a good attitude, are willing to give people a chance, and like mingling with different types of groups, I'm sure you can make it work in Ithaca, or for that matter, at any law school you end up at.


SHANbangs wrote:My experience: overpriced food that's available 24 hours. When I want to buy meat, I just go to wal-mart now. Somebody please tell me what is good about wegman's? Also, having grown up in upstate new york, I'm much more used to price chopper.


Although I second what Shan said here. Wegman's is way, way overrated and over-priced.

SHANbangs
Posts: 206
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2009 8:36 am

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby SHANbangs » Mon May 28, 2012 11:26 pm

Everything ikki has said is correct. I'm not saying you can't have fun at law school or that you can't enjoy cornell. I fully intend to take advantage of the greater cornell community as a 2L. The problem for me was that I was very fixated on studying. Maybe Ikki was someone who didn't care too much about grades/big law, or maybe he/she is someone who is bright and disciplined enough to be able to pull off good grades while having a lot of fun. I personally could not.

In light of this, I should add the following caveat. You can have Ikki's experience, and i'm sure you can do well, and all of that is entirely dependent on how well you know and have confidence in yourself. However, having said, that i think I speak for a slight majority or plurality of students who are middle of the pack in terms of intelligence/capability/confidence in themselves. Some students really "just get it" and excel with ease - others, like myself, cannot even compete without putting in twice the amount of work. My advice, and this entire thread, really only applies to people who consider themselves to be like me.

User avatar
PennBull
Posts: 15435
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:59 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby PennBull » Mon May 28, 2012 11:54 pm

Ikki wrote:
SHANbangs wrote:My experience: overpriced food that's available 24 hours. When I want to buy meat, I just go to wal-mart now. Somebody please tell me what is good about wegman's? Also, having grown up in upstate new york, I'm much more used to price chopper.


Although I second what Shan said here. Wegman's is way, way overrated and over-priced.


I have got to go to this Wegmans and see what they're doing wrong. I mean, there's a reason people love it so much.

/Wegmansdiscussion

User avatar
HereComesTreble
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:28 am

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby HereComesTreble » Tue May 29, 2012 1:23 am

..........................
Last edited by HereComesTreble on Wed Aug 01, 2012 6:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
msblaw89
Posts: 2669
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2011 6:10 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby msblaw89 » Tue May 29, 2012 8:52 am

I for one was really impressed by Wegmans...and it was actually MUCH cheaper than my local grocery store (Publix) for at least staple items I know the price of off the top of my head ( milk, yogurts, cereal, soda, chicken etc). It does have quite a selection too

User avatar
lowry99
Posts: 14
Joined: Fri May 25, 2012 12:29 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby lowry99 » Tue May 29, 2012 9:18 am

redacted
Last edited by lowry99 on Thu May 31, 2012 4:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
PennBull
Posts: 15435
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:59 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby PennBull » Tue May 29, 2012 9:21 am

lowry99 wrote:Sorry to re-re-ask but I did put my information about which schools up above.

I have one day to decide between: Cornell $129660 Vanderbilt $64200

I don't want to get into goals but I am not necessarily dead set on Big Law, though it may be necessary just to pay for these things. Hey let's go to law school so we can pay for having gone to law school!


Bump the thread you started on this topic, perhaps rename the title to indicate that you have one day to decide. I'm sure some advice will come out of the woodwork. I'll read your post now and throw my 2 cents in.

User avatar
KMaine
Posts: 862
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 1:57 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby KMaine » Tue May 29, 2012 9:57 am

I just graduated from Cornell. I agree with some of the OP's specific observations, but found the experience to be much more positive overall. Law School learning is not academic, per se, but I kind of like that. I enjoy the "game" aspect of it all, and found my classmates to be overall pleasant and interesting. I have a family, so the social aspect was not as prominent for me, but I think it helps to have some interests outside of law school. I think I stayed up until 1:00 one time during my LS career. No need to study more than 3 hours a day after class . . . even during 1L . . . maybe 4 hours tops during 1L (and I was not one of those people who naturally "gets it.") No real need to work on the weekends if you are organized. Wegmans is the best grocery store I have ever been to. Price Chopper is TTT.

User avatar
FlanAl
Posts: 1474
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:53 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby FlanAl » Tue May 29, 2012 9:58 am

I sort of made this decision last year. It depends on fit etc. but Cornell will get you into more doors than Vandy will. I really liked Vandy a lot when I visited, but if you aren't from the south/targeting the south, its name alone is not going to open the doors that Cornell's name will. Also if you aren't interested in big law, Cornell's lrap is better than Vandy's

User avatar
PennBull
Posts: 15435
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:59 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby PennBull » Tue May 29, 2012 10:01 am

FlanAl wrote:Also if you aren't interested in big law, Cornell's lrap is better than Vandy's


Ooo, very good point I neglected to mention in my response to the other thread. I can't speak to specifics, but if this is true, I'd say that's a big plus if you're not sure of your career path.

masked kavana
Posts: 423
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2011 11:24 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby masked kavana » Tue May 29, 2012 11:39 am

FlanAl wrote:I sort of made this decision last year. It depends on fit etc. but Cornell will get you into more doors than Vandy will. I really liked Vandy a lot when I visited, but if you aren't from the south/targeting the south, its name alone is not going to open the doors that Cornell's name will. Also if you aren't interested in big law, Cornell's lrap is better than Vandy's


Are there a lot of people interested in working PI/government at Cornell?

Also, would you be able to speak a bit about Cornell's LRAP?

loklamora
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2012 1:22 pm

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby loklamora » Tue May 29, 2012 4:26 pm

@ Trebel: Really enjoyed your post. As a 0L heading to Ithaca w/ minimal knowledge of the area your post was informative and uplifting.

I'm also interested in the LRAP at Cornell. Also, are many students at Cornell interested in PI/ Big Gov?

Thanks.

IsTheFatLadySinging
Posts: 179
Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:06 am

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby IsTheFatLadySinging » Tue May 29, 2012 8:25 pm

Hey OP: Is your Ferrari broken down too? Jesus.

SHANbangs
Posts: 206
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2009 8:36 am

Re: Bitter But Hopeful Cornell Rising 2L Taking Questions

Postby SHANbangs » Tue May 29, 2012 11:36 pm

IsTheFatLadySinging wrote:Hey OP: Is your Ferrari broken down too? Jesus.


What are you talking about?




Return to “Ask a Law Student / Graduate”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests