Columbia students taking questions Forum

[GoneSouth]

Those of you who chose CLS over HLS, do you have any regrets? If you could choose again, still CLS?

Didn't do this myself, but I know two people who picked CLS over HLS because they wanted to be in New York and neither of them regret it

[BrainsyK]

As a Canadian, how much of the tax return do I have to submit to Columbia? I asked my parents, and they gave me this one sheet of paper called a "Notice of Assessment" and said basically that's all they get after filing, but the requirement for Columbia seems to ask for all kinds of things...

[benwyatt]

As a Canadian, how much of the tax return do I have to submit to Columbia? I asked my parents, and they gave me this one sheet of paper called a "Notice of Assessment" and said basically that's all they get after filing, but the requirement for Columbia seems to ask for all kinds of things...

This seems like a question you'd be better off just asking financial aid.

[BrainsyK]

This seems like a question you'd be better off just asking financial aid.

They said "submit whatever form of tax returns you have." It just seems weird submitting 1 page with ~10 lines on it when they so specific about having so much information on the website.

[RSN]

Those of you who chose CLS over HLS, do you have any regrets? If you could choose again, still CLS?

No, and yes, in that order. If you have a Hamilton it's an absolute no-brainer. If you have a Butler it's a little closer of a question, but I'd still go to CLS.

[TAD]

They said "submit whatever form of tax returns you have." It just seems weird submitting 1 page with ~10 lines on it when they so specific about having so much information on the website.

I'm pretty sure that is all we have to submit. Canadian also, and I was digging through mine and my parents' tax returns and all we have is the notice of assessment - so that is all I am sending.

[BrainsyK]

I'm pretty sure that is all we have to submit. Canadian also, and I was digging through mine and my parents' tax returns and all we have is the notice of assessment - so that is all I am sending.

Thank you very much!

[FastRun]

Those of you who chose CLS over HLS, do you have any regrets? If you could choose again, still CLS?

I agree with the posters above. The only thing I'd add is that a good chunk of the HLS/CLS choice comes down to career objectives. If you want to do generic Biglaw, work for a state/local DA or public defender, work any number of moderately prestigious government or policy/nonprofit jobs, etc., then I think CLS is an easy choice if you have aid at the Butler level or above. For almost everyone, the marginally more difficult job market coming out of CLS versus HLS will be a considerably smaller burden than the opportunity cost of an additional $100k in debt. The only situation in which HLS might still make sense is if you are dead-set on academia and/or certain unicorn PI and government jobs, like the ACLU or the DoJ Honors Program. But really, if you want the best shot at those goals, go to Yale. And if you didn't get in to Yale (and honestly, even if you did), reflect carefully on what a quarter million dollars in debt will mean for your life plan, and how you will handle that financial constraint if it comes to pass that you don't get the unicorn job you want.

Edit to actually answer the question: I chose CLS with Hamilton over HLS/SLS with maybe 30% grant aid. I have no regrets, would make the same decision again for sure.

[wheathins]

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[GoneSouth]

To be fair, I'm sure if you asked Harvard students the same question you'd get the same answer.

[FastRun]

To be fair, I'm sure if you asked Harvard students the same question you'd get the same answer.

That's probably true in general. But, I suspect that you could find a good chunk of HYS grads who went to those schools at full price instead of CCN schools with significant aid, and who would at least seriously consider the CCN+aid option once they face the reality of their debt payments. It would be an interesting question to explore empirically.

[mmestik]

Is it possible to receive further aid after receiving a Butler? The half tuition is fantastic, but a little more aid would go a long way to helping me make a decision. Thanks!

[Hildegard15]

To be fair, I'm sure if you asked Harvard students the same question you'd get the same answer.

That's probably true in general. But, I suspect that you could find a good chunk of HYS grads who went to those schools at full price instead of CCN schools with significant aid, and who would at least seriously consider the CCN+aid option once they face the reality of their debt payments. It would be an interesting question to explore empirically.

I'm an HLS 1L who gave up a Butler and honestly I question whether I made the right choice about once a week. Especially since I loved my visit to CLS so much. Just so 0Ls know, the regret can go both ways.

[bluefox]

I am starting CLS this fall and am married with a daughter on the way (due in June). Looking at housing options, the Arbor seems like the best bet for someone in my situation, but TLS seems pretty down on it. Anyone know someone in a similar situation and what was best for them? Any advice is appreciated.

[wheathins]

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[wheathins]

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[GreenEggs]

I am starting CLS this fall and am married with a daughter on the way (due in June). Looking at housing options, the Arbor seems like the best bet for someone in my situation, but TLS seems pretty down on it. Anyone know someone in a similar situation and what was best for them? Any advice is appreciated.

Not in your family situation but will stress that the Arbor is a pretty shitty option. Especially if you have a family that commute is going to suck. Does your spouse have a job in NYC? Quite a few married people live where's most convenient for their spouse.

[Hildegard15]

What precipitates your once-a-week questioning? So many people would kill to be in your shoes!

The money is a big part of it. I turned down a substantial scholarship at CLS for a minuscule difference in hiring outcomes and probably no difference in educational quality. Plus the longer I spend in law school the more I realize the ways in which HLS is better for job outcomes will probably not end up applying to me (academia, impact litigation, etc).

Don't get me wrong, I love HLS. My classmates are wonderful, I get to be involved in a lot of cool activities, and the professors are incredibly accomplished. But would I have liked CLS any less? I doubt it. To be perfectly frank, the whole "If I turn down HLS I'll always wonder what my life would have been like" weighed heavily on my mind when I was deciding. I knew at the time that it was silly to think that way but I couldn't get it out of my head.

I'm not sure if I could go back that I would choose differently. But I just thought I'd let 0Ls know my take on it, so I hope this helps. Good luck the rest of this cycle!!

[jbagelboy]

What precipitates your once-a-week questioning? So many people would kill to be in your shoes!

The money is a big part of it. I turned down a substantial scholarship at CLS for a minuscule difference in hiring outcomes and probably no difference in educational quality. Plus the longer I spend in law school the more I realize the ways in which HLS is better for job outcomes will probably not end up applying to me (academia, impact litigation, etc).

Don't get me wrong, I love HLS. My classmates are wonderful, I get to be involved in a lot of cool activities, and the professors are incredibly accomplished. But would I have liked CLS any less? I doubt it. To be perfectly frank, the whole "If I turn down HLS I'll always wonder what my life would have been like" weighed heavily on my mind when I was deciding. I knew at the time that it was silly to think that way but I couldn't get it out of my head.

I'm not sure if I could go back that I would choose differently. But I just thought I'd let 0Ls know my take on it, so I hope this helps. Good luck the rest of this cycle!!

right; whether "so many people would kill to be in your shoes" as a general matter is irrelevant, because "so many people would kill to be in your shoes" as a CLS student or other top law school student as well--the same argument applies. This is a relative choice between good options

[RSN]

I am starting CLS this fall and am married with a daughter on the way (due in June). Looking at housing options, the Arbor seems like the best bet for someone in my situation, but TLS seems pretty down on it. Anyone know someone in a similar situation and what was best for them? Any advice is appreciated.

I know a guy living in an apartment at 420 W 116th (across the street from the law school) with his wife and a 1-year-old and they like it as far as I know.

[kingpin101]

What precipitates your once-a-week questioning? So many people would kill to be in your shoes!

The money is a big part of it. I turned down a substantial scholarship at CLS for a minuscule difference in hiring outcomes and probably no difference in educational quality. Plus the longer I spend in law school the more I realize the ways in which HLS is better for job outcomes will probably not end up applying to me (academia, impact litigation, etc).

Don't get me wrong, I love HLS. My classmates are wonderful, I get to be involved in a lot of cool activities, and the professors are incredibly accomplished. But would I have liked CLS any less? I doubt it. To be perfectly frank, the whole "If I turn down HLS I'll always wonder what my life would have been like" weighed heavily on my mind when I was deciding. I knew at the time that it was silly to think that way but I couldn't get it out of my head.

I'm not sure if I could go back that I would choose differently. But I just thought I'd let 0Ls know my take on it, so I hope this helps. Good luck the rest of this cycle!!

Just wondering did you get any grant aid from Harvard? Similarly, I turned down good money from Cornell to go to Columbia and wonder what my life would be like if I went there instead. Maybe I would have struck out, who knows?

[wheathins]

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[GoneSouth]

I am starting CLS this fall and am married with a daughter on the way (due in June). Looking at housing options, the Arbor seems like the best bet for someone in my situation, but TLS seems pretty down on it. Anyone know someone in a similar situation and what was best for them? Any advice is appreciated.

FWIW, I don't know a single person that lives in the Arbor. That commute seems rough, not impossible, but rough.

[bluefox]

I am starting CLS this fall and am married with a daughter on the way (due in June). Looking at housing options, the Arbor seems like the best bet for someone in my situation, but TLS seems pretty down on it. Anyone know someone in a similar situation and what was best for them? Any advice is appreciated.

Not in your family situation but will stress that the Arbor is a pretty shitty option. Especially if you have a family that commute is going to suck. Does your spouse have a job in NYC? Quite a few married people live where's most convenient for their spouse.

I know a guy living in an apartment at 420 W 116th (across the street from the law school) with his wife and a 1-year-old and they like it as far as I know.

FWIW, I don't know a single person that lives in the Arbor. That commute seems rough, not impossible, but rough.

Thanks for the feedback, we'll definitely check out 420 W 116th, though I'm wondering if the amenities will be as good as the Arbor. My wife is a Ph.D. candidate who is in the dissertation-writing phase, so she can live anywhere.

The commute from the Arbor is purported to be 25 minutes, which doesn't sound bad to me at all. Is there some other reason why the commute sucks so much?

[GreenEggs]

The commute from the Arbor is purported to be 25 minutes, which doesn't sound bad to me at all. Is there some other reason why the commute sucks so much?

"purported" but it can be longer. Also the shuttle schedule is awful. It doesn't come nearly as often as it says it does plus stops at 8 pm saturdays and doesn't run on sundays. Arbor isn't really near the subway so you're just kind of stranded up there. if you guys are home bodies who prefer to just live comfortably at home and not go down into manhattan much then Arbor does work. Otherwise, I feel there are way better options for you