NYU 3L Taking Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
dixiecupdrinking
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:43 pm

freestallion wrote:I recently saw a document that Michigan had on their website listing all the summer internship positions taken by each one of their students in 1L and 2L years. Here's the link: http://www.law.umich.edu/careers/classs ... stats.aspx.

I would like to find a similar listing/information from NYU (primarily for 2L summer statistics/data) but can't seem to find anything on the website. Anyone have this type of info? Thanks!

Sorry, I don't think that anything like an itemized list of every summer employer is published. PILC releases a list of people working in public interest in each city. OCS obviously maintains info on summer associate jobs but hasn't released it in such specific detail.

freestallion
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby freestallion » Mon Dec 05, 2011 11:10 am

dixiecupdrinking wrote:
freestallion wrote:I recently saw a document that Michigan had on their website listing all the summer internship positions taken by each one of their students in 1L and 2L years. Here's the link: http://www.law.umich.edu/careers/classs ... stats.aspx.

I would like to find a similar listing/information from NYU (primarily for 2L summer statistics/data) but can't seem to find anything on the website. Anyone have this type of info? Thanks!

Sorry, I don't think that anything like an itemized list of every summer employer is published. PILC releases a list of people working in public interest in each city. OCS obviously maintains info on summer associate jobs but hasn't released it in such specific detail.

Thank you! I'd be interested in seeing the PILC list of public interest students, if possible. Do you know if I may be able to access it somehow?

Do you know if NYU releases similar lists for post-grad employment? Just trying to get a better sense of what type of public interest opportunities students pursue. Thanks!

dixiecupdrinking
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:16 am

The summer info isn't really accessible (it's piecemeal and contains personal identifying info for individual students), but here is info on postgrad employment: http://www.law.nyu.edu/publicinterestla ... /index.htm

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smokeylarue
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby smokeylarue » Tue Dec 13, 2011 2:01 am

This is more of a social aspect class. How close to each other is your class? I know NYU has a fairly big class. And i've heard its difficult to make friends in undergrad at least because theres no centralized campus and people live everywhere in the city? Can you or someone who knows give us your viewpoint on all things social about NYU? Thanks!

kaiser
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby kaiser » Tue Dec 13, 2011 2:14 am

I think it is really easy to make friends here because so many of the students live in the 2 main law school dorms. So people take all classes together, and then many have the chance to meet and socialize outside of class in the dorms right on campus.

snehpets
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby snehpets » Tue Dec 13, 2011 8:28 pm

kaiser wrote:I think it is really easy to make friends here because so many of the students live in the 2 main law school dorms. So people take all classes together, and then many have the chance to meet and socialize outside of class in the dorms right on campus.


Would you say this is true of people who live off-campus as well, perhaps to a lesser degree? I wouldn't have the option to live on campus and don't want to feel like I'm at a commuter school...

nutella123
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby nutella123 » Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:34 pm

snehpets wrote:
kaiser wrote:I think it is really easy to make friends here because so many of the students live in the 2 main law school dorms. So people take all classes together, and then many have the chance to meet and socialize outside of class in the dorms right on campus.


Would you say this is true of people who live off-campus as well, perhaps to a lesser degree? I wouldn't have the option to live on campus and don't want to feel like I'm at a commuter school...



I'm also interested in this. Thanks! And good luck with exams!

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arism87
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby arism87 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:41 pm

nutella123 wrote:
snehpets wrote:
kaiser wrote:I think it is really easy to make friends here because so many of the students live in the 2 main law school dorms. So people take all classes together, and then many have the chance to meet and socialize outside of class in the dorms right on campus.


Would you say this is true of people who live off-campus as well, perhaps to a lesser degree? I wouldn't have the option to live on campus and don't want to feel like I'm at a commuter school...



I'm also interested in this. Thanks! And good luck with exams!


I live off campus and was a little concerned about this going into it, but it hasn't been a problem at all. Your section gets so close- or at least groups of people within your section- that it's easy. If you can't live in dorms, it's at least easier to live close to school if possible because most social things do tend to happen in this area. I know if I lived farther away I might not be as involved, but it would be due to pure laziness, not because of the lack of option. Overall I've been really impressed by the sense of community within the school!

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zanda
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby zanda » Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:08 pm

Embarrassed 3L here. Anyone know where to check grades? They changed Albert.

kaiser
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby kaiser » Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:12 pm

When you go into Albert, go to student center (the only thing you can click really). Once in there, there is a bar on the left with a few options if you click. Pick "transcript unofficial". From there, you just choose the record you want to see, and it will show you your unofficial transcript. Curious how long it takes for grades to come up. I'm a transfer so idk. Do they post them all at once on the same day? Release them as they come in?

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zanda
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby zanda » Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:15 pm

They post them as they come in. Also, thanks!

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zanda
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby zanda » Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:53 pm

Anyone else having trouble getting to the bookstore website? I want to get my booklist so I can order books over break.

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Stanford4Me
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby Stanford4Me » Tue Feb 28, 2012 11:24 am

Don't know if anyone still has questions, but I'm a 2L as well and am willing to answer to your heart's content.

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Doorkeeper
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Re: NYU 2L Taking Questions

Postby Doorkeeper » Tue Feb 28, 2012 12:41 pm

This may be a long shot, but I have a few questions for any NYU students who have taken classes in Legal Theory and Legal History, as it's designated in the course descriptions page (especially law and phil classes). I have some Qs about specific faculty members before going to one of the ASWs, so feel free to PM me if you'd prefer.

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Detrox
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Re: NYU 3L Taking Questions

Postby Detrox » Fri May 18, 2012 7:13 pm

Necro bumping this thread now that I'm a rising 3L mainly to help the rising 2Ls if they have any questions about 2L year: EIW, Journal stuff, class selection etc. etc.

Of course 0L's are welcome to ask any questions they may have, but they may be better served by the NYU 1L thread.

yehklwlm
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Re: NYU 3L Taking Questions

Postby yehklwlm » Fri May 25, 2012 8:54 pm

Thanks Detrox! (And other rising 3Ls et. al. who may have advice.)

1. Advice on class selection and bidding? How do we know which classes were oversubscribed last year/how to allocate our bid points on ABRA?

2. Relatedly, is there a good list somewhere of must-take NYU profs/classes? (Not all of which anyone would actually take, but which are worth looking at.)

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Detrox
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Re: NYU 3L Taking Questions

Postby Detrox » Fri May 25, 2012 9:40 pm

yehklwlm wrote:Thanks Detrox! (And other rising 3Ls et. al. who may have advice.)

1. Advice on class selection and bidding? How do we know which classes were oversubscribed last year/how to allocate our bid points on ABRA?

2. Relatedly, is there a good list somewhere of must-take NYU profs/classes? (Not all of which anyone would actually take, but which are worth looking at.)


1. Select classes based on profs, then based on interest, not the other way around. http://www.law.nyu.edu/recordsandregist ... /index.htm has alot of information for prof ratings and classes and stuff. There was a link last year that showed what classes cleared at what bid levels, but I don't have the energy to find it now (it wasn't easy to find but if you spend a bit of time googling/digging on nyu law website I'm sure you can find it.) I STRONGLY recommend taking a seminar with a paper requirement fall semester 2L. If you have any interest in publishing a note a seminar is pretty much a de facto requirement (a slight exagguration but not really). Additionally, getting your mandatory A-Paper out of the way early is nice even if you're not seeking to publish. You can PM me or reply again if you have more specific class selection advice since it depends on what you want to do (i.e. Corporate interested people should obviously start picking some transactional classes, tax people should take tax/accounting etc.)

2. I can give you the list of profs I know are very highly recommended/liked out of personal experience and reputation, and others can feel free to add, but I don't know of an official list. Pretty much any class with a good professor is better than an interesting class with a bad one. Off the top of my head the raved about professors who teach upper level courses are: Friedman, Levinson, Yoshino, Adler (Amy), Murphy. Profs who are liked but not necessarily raved about: McKenzie, Rascoff, Schaffer. PM me if you want professors that I've heard are NOT good (probably the most important list). Faculty/Class reviews give a pretty good idea about all of this, and obviously my list is somewhat subjective as there are a few professors that are very polarizing (some love, some hate), and I'm sure some people would move names around on my list as well.

Hope some of that helped. Obviously wasn't super thorough but I've only taken so many classes.

IFoughtTheLaw
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Re: NYU 3L Taking Questions

Postby IFoughtTheLaw » Fri May 25, 2012 11:56 pm

Any advice on ranking journals?

Ideally, I'd love to do the IP journal, followed by Law & Business. I'll probably at least take a shot at the prestige and put law review as #1. Business considers only those who rank them as 1 or 2, so I'm debating ranking them as 2 and IP as 3 (the reverse of my preference) so I get a shot at both rather than just IP.

I'm also considering Annual Survey (prestige) and Moot Court (sounds fun, and my min park brief is probably better than my note). My bluebooking is excellent, but my note and personal statement will probably be not so great.

Thanks for any advice!

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Detrox
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Re: NYU 3L Taking Questions

Postby Detrox » Sat May 26, 2012 12:19 am

IFoughtTheLaw wrote:Any advice on ranking journals?

Ideally, I'd love to do the IP journal, followed by Law & Business. I'll probably at least take a shot at the prestige and put law review as #1. Business considers only those who rank them as 1 or 2, so I'm debating ranking them as 2 and IP as 3 (the reverse of my preference) so I get a shot at both rather than just IP.

I'm also considering Annual Survey (prestige) and Moot Court (sounds fun, and my min park brief is probably better than my note). My bluebooking is excellent, but my note and personal statement will probably be not so great.

Thanks for any advice!


If you put any real effort into your personal statement and actually complete the writing competition, you really should not be getting below your #4 journal choice. Obviously put law review first, this isnt about prestige its simply about the fact that law review will noticably help you if you have any interest in academia, clerkships, and even some jobs in general. As for the other journals, I am limited by the fact that I am not on those, but putting business 2nd and IP 3rd sounds like it suits your interests well but if you really want IP and have the background for it I wouldn't hesitate to put it 2nd as you'll likely get it.

I regret not being on Moot Court, but if you are really interested in it, you should recognize it is a significant commitment as you have to do the Marden Competition if you are not in the Casebook division. Keep in mind as well that different journals have different time commitments in terms of office hours and years of participation expected, you'll be glad you did when you realize you have to do journal work every week...even after you have a job.

Final note, Annual Survey doesn't really have prestige (but don't tell them that). For prestige (aka increased career prospects) I would say Law Review >>>>>>Moot Court > Annual Survey >= every other journal. That being said, lack of prestige doesn't mean annual survey is not valuable, especially if their annual event is to someone cool/well known/connected, but thats kind of a crapshoot.

Final final note. If you have any interest in publishing, this should weigh heavily in your decision. Some journals are strict about only publishing articles strictly within their topic area, thus your journal may limit your available topics.

Sorry if all of this sounds rather pessimistic. Some people enjoy being on journals, but most view it as a resume line and the work you are made to do certainly reflects the latter. That being said, you'll learn some decent skills and if you go for editorial board you can have a resume line+.

chasgoose
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Re: NYU 3L Taking Questions

Postby chasgoose » Sun May 27, 2012 2:45 am

Detrox wrote:
IFoughtTheLaw wrote:Any advice on ranking journals?

Ideally, I'd love to do the IP journal, followed by Law & Business. I'll probably at least take a shot at the prestige and put law review as #1. Business considers only those who rank them as 1 or 2, so I'm debating ranking them as 2 and IP as 3 (the reverse of my preference) so I get a shot at both rather than just IP.

I'm also considering Annual Survey (prestige) and Moot Court (sounds fun, and my min park brief is probably better than my note). My bluebooking is excellent, but my note and personal statement will probably be not so great.

Thanks for any advice!


If you put any real effort into your personal statement and actually complete the writing competition, you really should not be getting below your #4 journal choice. Obviously put law review first, this isnt about prestige its simply about the fact that law review will noticably help you if you have any interest in academia, clerkships, and even some jobs in general. As for the other journals, I am limited by the fact that I am not on those, but putting business 2nd and IP 3rd sounds like it suits your interests well but if you really want IP and have the background for it I wouldn't hesitate to put it 2nd as you'll likely get it.

I regret not being on Moot Court, but if you are really interested in it, you should recognize it is a significant commitment as you have to do the Marden Competition if you are not in the Casebook division. Keep in mind as well that different journals have different time commitments in terms of office hours and years of participation expected, you'll be glad you did when you realize you have to do journal work every week...even after you have a job.

Final note, Annual Survey doesn't really have prestige (but don't tell them that). For prestige (aka increased career prospects) I would say Law Review >>>>>>Moot Court > Annual Survey >= every other journal. That being said, lack of prestige doesn't mean annual survey is not valuable, especially if their annual event is to someone cool/well known/connected, but thats kind of a crapshoot.

Final final note. If you have any interest in publishing, this should weigh heavily in your decision. Some journals are strict about only publishing articles strictly within their topic area, thus your journal may limit your available topics.

Sorry if all of this sounds rather pessimistic. Some people enjoy being on journals, but most view it as a resume line and the work you are made to do certainly reflects the latter. That being said, you'll learn some decent skills and if you go for editorial board you can have a resume line+.


Sorry to be that person, but what are the secondary journals with the least work? If I had my druthers I wouldn't do writing comp at all, but seeing as unless you have crazy high grades you should be on at least A journal, which one would be the least annoying? Considering Annual Survey, IP, Law and Business, and Legislation and Public Policy...

nyuwithbadgrades
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Re: NYU 3L Taking Questions

Postby nyuwithbadgrades » Sun May 27, 2012 3:50 am

rising 2L here - thanks for taking the time to answer our questions!

1. my bluebooking is absolutely horrible, and presumably my 10 bluebooking questions will be filled with errors. i will try to make up for this by putting an honest effort into the comment and writing a targeted personal statement, plus not ranking LR or annual survey at all and instead only ranking 3 secondary journals 1-2-3. is there a chance I will not get a single journal due to my horrendous bluebooking? i'm trying to avoid the scenario where i do all this work and then end up not getting a single journal...

2. as my ID indicates, i have bad grades. do you have any anecdotal evidence of those with sub 3.2s getting biglaw offers? if so, any tips?

3. any general tips on selecting courses if my ultimate goal is to take the courses that require the least amount of effort to get a mediocre grade?

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Detrox
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Re: NYU 3L Taking Questions

Postby Detrox » Sun May 27, 2012 3:22 pm

First, as to the journals with the least work, avoid Law Review obviously. As to the others, I think the info session at the end of 1L year provided basic details as to the office hours expectations and things like that so you should have some of the info available. Journal of Law and Liberty is pretty well known to require very little work and provide the greatest flexibility. I do not know first hand about the others, I believe Legislation and Public Policy has some decently strict hours and Environmental Law Journal is pretty relaxed, but beyond that I do not think there's huge variation.

nyuwithbadgrades wrote:rising 2L here - thanks for taking the time to answer our questions!

1. my bluebooking is absolutely horrible, and presumably my 10 bluebooking questions will be filled with errors. i will try to make up for this by putting an honest effort into the comment and writing a targeted personal statement, plus not ranking LR or annual survey at all and instead only ranking 3 secondary journals 1-2-3. is there a chance I will not get a single journal due to my horrendous bluebooking? i'm trying to avoid the scenario where i do all this work and then end up not getting a single journal...

2. as my ID indicates, i have bad grades. do you have any anecdotal evidence of those with sub 3.2s getting biglaw offers? if so, any tips?

3. any general tips on selecting courses if my ultimate goal is to take the courses that require the least amount of effort to get a mediocre grade?


1. There is very very little chance you will not end up with a journal. Again, if you complete all the parts of the application, and express an interest in your personal statement to the journals you rank highly (2 or 3rd) you really shouldn't be worried. Bluebooking is important, but they know that 1Ls need to learn it and don't already just know it; overall, bluebooking is a rather minor component of most journals recruiting analysis. I think most journals put a great deal of weight on the personal statement, resume, and where you rank them in your selections. Grades matter a little, but not much beyond LR.

2. I do know of a couple people with sub-3.3 grades (I don't know the specific #'s) who got big law jobs. It took them a bit, and you'll have to do searching beyond EIW via mass mailing and networking, but it definitely can be done. Use the Office of Career Services, they are very useful (in my opinion) and they will give you far better tips than I can. Just be prepared to be doing a bit more legwork than your colleagues with better grades and don't get too down if you don't land something at EIW since that is just the start of the job hunt, not the end. Finally, practice interviewing until you are very confident. Some people are naturally good at it, others aren't, and unfortunately with low grades you will need to be someone who is very personable/memorable; again, OCS will help you a great deal with this if you ask for practice interviews/further help.

3. This question is phrased a bit odd. Least amount of effort to get a "mediocre" grade? I'd have to say Seminars/Colloquiuims. As they are not bound to the grading curve, they are simultaneously more generous with people who do the bare minimum and more strict on giving out As to people who do well but not outstanding, so they may be good courses if you're just seeking a B+. Be forewarned that some seminars/colloquiums require a fair amount of reading/written submissions, but they don't generally have finals. As to other more standard courses that are easy to do well in, that's tougher, the grade distributions given by professors/classes are listed on nyu law's site somewhere, so you can look that up. What I can say is to avoid Federal Courts, and avoid classes with very highly rated professors (Friedman, Yoshino) as the gunners self-select into those classes.

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banjo
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Re: NYU 3L Taking Questions

Postby banjo » Thu May 31, 2012 9:24 pm

Thanks for the taking questions, 3Ls. Since you guys have been through OCI, I'll ask about something more serious than the best pizza around (Artichoke, for sure). What's happening right now to NYU students who strike out at OCI? I know I may end up having to ask my family for financial help, but If I lower my standards a bit, hustle, and cast a very wide net (smaller firms and PI in NJ, CT, the boroughs, upstate NY, or Long Island where I have ties), could I still expect full-time employment as a lawyer with modest room for career growth? Or do such jobs not really exist? If it matters, I think I'm more or less average personality-wise. Reassurance is nice, but brutal honesty would be best. Thanks again.

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Detrox
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Re: NYU 3L Taking Questions

Postby Detrox » Thu May 31, 2012 10:48 pm

banjo wrote:Thanks for the taking questions, 3Ls. Since you guys have been through OCI, I'll ask about something more serious than the best pizza around (Artichoke, for sure). What's happening right now to NYU students who strike out at OCI? I know I may end up having to ask my family for financial help, but If I lower my standards a bit, hustle, and cast a very wide net (smaller firms and PI in NJ, CT, the boroughs, upstate NY, or Long Island where I have ties), could I still expect full-time employment as a lawyer with modest room for career growth? Or do such jobs not really exist? If it matters, I think I'm more or less average personality-wise. Reassurance is nice, but brutal honesty would be best. Thanks again.


Both people (yes that few) I know who struck out at OCI managed to land something within 2 months afterwards. One is abroad, the other is at biglaw in a secondary market. Casting a big net, ties, talking with OCS, and just generally hustling/staying in the loop seems to make the difference. That being said, I'm sure there are people who fared worse than my friends who struck out, I just don't know of them.

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Stanford4Me
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Re: NYU 3L Taking Questions

Postby Stanford4Me » Fri Jun 01, 2012 1:18 am

Of all the people who struck out at OCI, I only know one who I'm not 100% sure ever found employment, but that's because is literally a mess. No exaggeration.

My friends who struck out at OCI cast a wider net during their supplemental job search and looked in markets/jobs they originally wouldn't have considered. Sure, they're not working at their dream job, but they're getting paid well and are working summer jobs that will lead to full time employment.




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