Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
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radio1nowhere
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby radio1nowhere » Mon Feb 22, 2016 10:11 pm

lunixer wrote:Hi. I'm a 0L and just got accepted at Harvard. Getting cold feet. A few questions if you don't mind answering:


Disclaimer: Just a 1L.

1) Are you happy you chose to attend Harvard, given the other offers you had for various schools, your then-current job/job offers, etc?

I chose H over cheaper options because I thought that it would benefit me most in terms of flexibility and connections over the arc of my whole career. Therefore, I don't think I will be able to answer this question for another decade or two. However, I can at least say that I've never had occasion to question my decision thus far; I'd make the same one if I could go back.

2) I consider myself to be a pretty smart guy, but not a genius. I have a pretty meh undergrad GPA (~3.7 very good state school, difficult major), and got in mostly on the basis of my LSAT, my sounds-impressive work experience, and my grad degree. But given that I'm not THAT smart (and certainly not as smart as people who get a 173+ LSAT on their first try) will my classmates totally outclass me? I am very dedicated to work and have a whole lot of stick-to-it-iveness.

I don't think high first-try LSAT scores are strong indications of brilliancy. I had a 3.9x uGPA and 178 first-try LSAT, and I got very mediocre grades my first semester at H. My point is not that the people here are geniuses, but that undergrad grades and test scores aren't really that good at measuring ability (I would posit that law school grades aren't either, but that's another discussion). Anyone who is accepted to H has the ability to succeed. Further, when I think about the most successful students I've met here, many of them strike me as being the hardest workers, not necessarily the most brilliant. I wouldn't second-guess your ability to do well.

3) Are the stories about Harvard being a cutthroat institution true? I know that they have tried to soften their image, but should I still expect students to be stealing books from the library or stuff like that? Will I be laughed out of the room if I'm cold-called and don't know the answer?

Not in any way. Maybe this used to be true back in the Paper Chase days, but not so now. No one likes gunners (admittedly there are a few), and everyone screws up cold calls sometimes. Your sectionmates will loan you notes, encourage you on your bad days, etc., because it doesn't feel like you're competing with your classmates. We're all in it together, and there are good jobs available for anyone who puts in the work.

4) My impression is that the higher-ranked the school the "easier" it is, at least relative to law school in general. If I am choosing between, for example, Harvard and NYU, knowing that this is not by any means an exclusive or even important criteria for my decision, which school should I expect to be easier?

I dunno how any H student would be able to answer this one unless they transferred from another school.

5) As you apply for jobs, do you find that the Harvard name is valuable? Compared to, say, Columbia/NYU/etc? How valuable?

Haven't applied for SA spots yet, but it definitely was/is a big deal to 1L summer employers. I was a little worried since my grades were mediocre, but it ended up not being a problem at all; I got some great offers and I attribute this to H (especially given my weak, straight-outta-undergrad resume). Again, however, I'm not qualified to say how valuable Columbia or NYU would be comparatively.

6) I'm visiting the campus on ASW April 1-2. Any advice on what I should check out while I'm there? Secret things that my sway my decision one way or another?

I recommend checking out student groups if you can; the semester can get pretty hectic pretty quickly, so it's great to have an idea beforehand what orgs you might be interested in joining. There are a lot, and the sooner you can get involved, the easier it will be to get a leadership position later.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Goldie » Mon Feb 22, 2016 10:31 pm

I'm a transfer student. I started at a mid-30s state school, so I have some perspective both from Harvard and from another school (not your Columbia/NYU schools, but still might be helpful.

1) Are you happy you chose to attend Harvard, given the other offers you had for various schools, your then-current job/job offers, etc?
I struggled over whether to transfer, and it took me a few months after transferring to decide whether it was the right move. I had to give up scholarships, a law review offer, and some of the momentum and relationships I'd built up in 1L and start over. But yes, I'm absolutely happy that I transferred.

2) I consider myself to be a pretty smart guy, but not a genius. I have a pretty meh undergrad GPA (~3.7 very good state school, difficult major), and got in mostly on the basis of my LSAT, my sounds-impressive work experience, and my grad degree. But given that I'm not THAT smart (and certainly not as smart as people who get a 173+ LSAT on their first try) will my classmates totally outclass me? I am very dedicated to work and have a whole lot of stick-to-it-iveness.
Based on my undergrad institution and LSAT, I'm totally outclassed here. Harvard wouldn't have given my application a second look as an 0L. But here I am, and I'm somewhere around top 10% here based on the numbers floating around TLS. Your mileage may vary, but I don't convince yourself that you won't do well here. That work ethic and stick-to-it-iveness can take you a long way.

3) Are the stories about Harvard being a cutthroat institution true? I know that they have tried to soften their image, but should I still expect students to be stealing books from the library or stuff like that? Will I be laughed out of the room if I'm cold-called and don't know the answer?
I think that the most cutthroat schools are the lowest ranked schools. Unlike some schools, Harvard students don't have to be the best in order to get good jobs. Even at my good 1L school, you had to be top 10-15% to be competitive for the jobs that median students here can land fairly easily. And at even lower ranked schools, you individually have to rank much higher than that. But no, in my experience, Harvard students are fine. There's a range of personalities at every law school but most students here are great.

4) My impression is that the higher-ranked the school the "easier" it is, at least relative to law school in general. If I am choosing between, for example, Harvard and NYU, knowing that this is not by any means an exclusive or even important criteria for my decision, which school should I expect to be easier?
That's hard to say. I don't think the material is that different between law schools, the only difference is the average quality of the students you're up against. But like some others have mentioned, even if it's not actually easier here, you definitely don't have to do as well here to have plenty of options.

5) As you apply for jobs, do you find that the Harvard name is valuable? Compared to, say, Columbia/NYU/etc? How valuable?
The Harvard name is great. Some places that I interviewed with in the market my 1L school was in weren't thrilled that I transferred away, but Harvard has a brand that is hard to match.

6) I'm visiting the campus on ASW April 1-2. Any advice on what I should check out while I'm there? Secret things that my sway my decision one way or another?
On a super practical note, it might be helpful to walk down Mass Ave to Harvard Square or up Mass Ave to Porter Square. Either way, you'll be able to see what kind of eating options/dry cleaners/etc are close to campus. One of the bigger adjustments for me has been how far I have to walk to get to some of the day-to-day necessities.

Hope this helps! Good luck!

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby heythatslife » Mon Feb 22, 2016 11:30 pm

Indifference wrote:Related to above, is it a bad idea to skip EIP?
Really not interested in a firm gig, but also don't wanna be unemployed haha.

I know people who didn't do EIP. It's not uncommon among PI/government gunners. If you think you might like to try a firm gig, by all means do EIP and you'll most probably get something, but don't feel like you have to.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby tonysoprano » Tue Feb 23, 2016 1:01 am

What do people w/ leases w/ 9/1 start dates do for EIP?

Hotel? Beanbag room in Langdell? Random Gropius lounge?

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby heythatslife » Tue Feb 23, 2016 1:15 am

tonysoprano wrote:What do people w/ leases w/ 9/1 start dates do for EIP?

Hotel? Beanbag room in Langdell? Random Gropius lounge?

I did AirBnB for 3 weeks. Actually worked out to be cheaper per day than the rent I currently pay. A lot of Cambridge residents, being students, are away for August so you can find a ton of relatively cheap stays around that time. You're gonna need to unwind/prepare after each day of interviews and sleep well so I would recommend securing some form of private space during EIP.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Mr. Elshal » Tue Feb 23, 2016 1:21 am

heythatslife wrote:
tonysoprano wrote:What do people w/ leases w/ 9/1 start dates do for EIP?

Hotel? Beanbag room in Langdell? Random Gropius lounge?

I did AirBnB for 3 weeks. Actually worked out to be cheaper per day than the rent I currently pay. A lot of Cambridge residents, being students, are away for August so you can find a ton of relatively cheap stays around that time. You're gonna need to unwind/prepare after each day of interviews and sleep well so I would recommend securing some form of private space during EIP.


This is a good way to do it. You probably don't want to be living in the law school during that time (although you probably could), and a hotel nearby will be prohibitively expensive. Airbnb or a short sublet is ideal.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby wwwcol » Tue Feb 23, 2016 2:12 am

lunixer wrote:Hi. I'm a 0L and just got accepted at Harvard. Getting cold feet. A few questions if you don't mind answering:

1) Are you happy you chose to attend Harvard, given the other offers you had for various schools, your then-current job/job offers, etc?

2) I consider myself to be a pretty smart guy, but not a genius. I have a pretty meh undergrad GPA (~3.7 very good state school, difficult major), and got in mostly on the basis of my LSAT, my sounds-impressive work experience, and my grad degree. But given that I'm not THAT smart (and certainly not as smart as people who get a 173+ LSAT on their first try) will my classmates totally outclass me? I am very dedicated to work and have a whole lot of stick-to-it-iveness.

3) Are the stories about Harvard being a cutthroat institution true? I know that they have tried to soften their image, but should I still expect students to be stealing books from the library or stuff like that? Will I be laughed out of the room if I'm cold-called and don't know the answer?

4) My impression is that the higher-ranked the school the "easier" it is, at least relative to law school in general. If I am choosing between, for example, Harvard and NYU, knowing that this is not by any means an exclusive or even important criteria for my decision, which school should I expect to be easier?

5) As you apply for jobs, do you find that the Harvard name is valuable? Compared to, say, Columbia/NYU/etc? How valuable?

6) I'm visiting the campus on ASW April 1-2. Any advice on what I should check out while I'm there? Secret things that my sway my decision one way or another?

Thanks very much for your help and input.


This thread (and Harvard Law generally) can be an echo chamber sometimes, so here's a slightly different perspective. I don't regret my decision to come here, but I figure I will have about 270k in debt before I get my first paycheck. It's depressing as fuck to know I will have a negative net wealth until at least 5 or 6 years after graduation.

And my tuition is cheap compare to what you'll pay. For the class of 2019, it looks like tuition will be 58, 62, 65, plus COL and interest. That's probably 325k in debt at graduation. If I was facing that number, I would probably take a full ride to another T10 (ideally one with a cheap COL). Maybe if I wanted a unicorn job I'd come here, but for most things I think another school would do just find. So without knowing anythjng about your finances, my advice is to think carefully about your ideal career trajectory.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby lunixer » Tue Feb 23, 2016 8:31 am

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Last edited by lunixer on Mon Mar 14, 2016 11:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby despina » Tue Feb 23, 2016 8:43 am

heythatslife wrote:
Indifference wrote:Related to above, is it a bad idea to skip EIP?
Really not interested in a firm gig, but also don't wanna be unemployed haha.

I know people who didn't do EIP. It's not uncommon among PI/government gunners. If you think you might like to try a firm gig, by all means do EIP and you'll most probably get something, but don't feel like you have to.


If you don't want a firm gig, don't do EIP. Everyone gets a job, and HLS students are in a better position to get public interest jobs than anyone.

The public interest job search is MUCH more challenging and you won't have your situation locked down until likely mid-way or later through 3L (while your firm friends are basically set 2L fall when they accept an offer for 2L summer that will likely be their post-3L job).

But there's no reason to go to a firm just for job security -- that's how people wind up in firms hating their lives and wondering "what if" they had tried to do what they actually wanted to do.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby despina » Tue Feb 23, 2016 8:49 am

1) Are you happy you chose to attend Harvard, given the other offers you had for various schools, your then-current job/job offers, etc?

Graduated last year. Yes, absolutely, though the comment above about loans is definitely spot-on. If you're just going for a biglaw job, I wouldn't take HLS over financial aid at another top school. If you're going for public interest, HLS is probably the way to go as long as you understand LIPP and what it covers (it's better than almost all peer schools, though in some respects YLS / SLS might be better).

2) I consider myself to be a pretty smart guy, but not a genius. I have a pretty meh undergrad GPA (~3.7 very good state school, difficult major), and got in mostly on the basis of my LSAT, my sounds-impressive work experience, and my grad degree. But given that I'm not THAT smart (and certainly not as smart as people who get a 173+ LSAT on their first try) will my classmates totally outclass me? I am very dedicated to work and have a whole lot of stick-to-it-iveness.

Read up on impostor syndrome. A lot of people experience it, especially 1L. You got in for a reason and you can do this!

3) Are the stories about Harvard being a cutthroat institution true? I know that they have tried to soften their image, but should I still expect students to be stealing books from the library or stuff like that? Will I be laughed out of the room if I'm cold-called and don't know the answer?


Agree with the answers above - definitely no book stealing / laughing out of the room. Everybody messes up a cold call once in a while and nobody remembers it but you. The first person in my 1L section to answer "pass" to an obscure cold-call question got high-fives and cheers after class.

4) My impression is that the higher-ranked the school the "easier" it is, at least relative to law school in general. If I am choosing between, for example, Harvard and NYU, knowing that this is not by any means an exclusive or even important criteria for my decision, which school should I expect to be easier?

I'm not sure if "easier" is the right question and obviously I can't compare since I only went to one school, but I get the sense that the lower down you go, the more important class rank is for job prospects, so the more competitive students tend to be with each other.

5) As you apply for jobs, do you find that the Harvard name is valuable? Compared to, say, Columbia/NYU/etc? How valuable?

Very valuable. It instantly gets me in the door in talking to people when I have no connections, plus I usually have connections because our alumni network is huge and touches pretty much every field / country.

6) I'm visiting the campus on ASW April 1-2. Any advice on what I should check out while I'm there? Secret things that my sway my decision one way or another?

Ice cream machine below Hauser.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby foxes » Tue Feb 23, 2016 8:58 am

foxes wrote:can anyone tell me what the typical summer intern period is for 1Ls? do people usually leave after law review write on, or maybe right after exams, or do they wait a few weeks? and how many days before eip should i be back in cambridge? ty in advance


reposting for a new pg, sorry to spam you guys :oops: just want a rough idea so i can get back to my summer job re dates

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby tomwatts » Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:00 am

foxes wrote:can anyone tell me what the typical summer intern period is for 1Ls? do people usually leave after law review write on, or maybe right after exams, or do they wait a few weeks? and how many days before eip should i be back in cambridge? ty in advance

8-12 weeks. (12 is on the long side.)

People usually leave Cambridge when they're done, so after exams if they're not doing the law review write-on or after the law review write-on if they are doing that. Personally, I'd give myself a few days to recover and feel like a human being again, especially if you're doing the law review write-on, because it's like a month of exams, but some people just want to get out.

You don't have to be back in Cambridge until whenever your first EIP interview is, but there is an event the Friday before (usually) that you're semi-supposed to go to. You might want to get back the week before EIP, or you might not.
Indifference wrote:Related to above, is it a bad idea to skip EIP?
Really not interested in a firm gig, but also don't wanna be unemployed haha.

It is not a bad idea to skip EIP if you don't want to go to a firm. You should skip EIP if you don't want biglaw. If you're at all interested in biglaw, you should go to EIP, but if you're not, you should not waste your time getting caught up in the fuss.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby foxes » Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:35 am

i know there have been a lot of responses, but i thought i'd address a few of your q's that i have specific experience with in case it helps :) disclaimer: 1L

lunixer wrote:Hi. I'm a 0L and just got accepted at Harvard. Getting cold feet. A few questions if you don't mind answering:

1) Are you happy you chose to attend Harvard, given the other offers you had for various schools, your then-current job/job offers, etc?
yes. i initially did not want to go to H at all. i had a full ride at another top school and was 100% set on going there. i ended up at H b/c of circumstances beyond my control, but in retrospect, it was a good decision for me. the connections, community, network etc. are difficult to quantify but they've been the best part of my experience here and i don't think many other schools could replicate them. however, the debt does suck (a lot), as mentioned above, and depending on your other offers, i'd definitely take that into account. would i go to H over a good scholarship at CLS/NYU/etc.? probably not. most people i've talked to about this (including me) find it hard to wrap their head around this much debt until they've actually incurred it.

2) I consider myself to be a pretty smart guy, but not a genius. I have a pretty meh undergrad GPA (~3.7 very good state school, difficult major), and got in mostly on the basis of my LSAT, my sounds-impressive work experience, and my grad degree. But given that I'm not THAT smart (and certainly not as smart as people who get a 173+ LSAT on their first try) will my classmates totally outclass me? I am very dedicated to work and have a whole lot of stick-to-it-iveness.
i wouldn't worry about this AT ALL. i felt similarly coming in (went to a shitty state school, same gpa as you, admitted based on my LSAT). even worse, i'm not a particularly dedicated student haha. however, you'll soon find out that everyone is totally lost for the first few weeks of 1L, regardless of their background, and everyone is basically on the same footing. don't feel that you're automatically at a disadvantage b/c you don't have a fancy degree or w/e. ime the people who do the best arent necessarily those with the fanciest degrees or work experience.

3) Are the stories about Harvard being a cutthroat institution true? I know that they have tried to soften their image, but should I still expect students to be stealing books from the library or stuff like that? Will I be laughed out of the room if I'm cold-called and don't know the answer?
this was one of my biggest worries coming in b/c i'd never gone to a school that was even remotely prestigious before. however, i have not even once experienced this tbh. it might be because of my section or the activities i'm involved with, but literally everyone i know is extremely helpful and willing to lend notes, make a connection for you, etc. i have reached out to so many people and they've basically all been willing to help me out. i've bombed cold calls (everyone has) and no one's ever said a thing to me. no one will ever remember your bad cold calls except you. honestly, i also think it helps a lot that people aren't very worried about whether or not they'll get a job after graduation. it makes people less self-conscious about helping others. it also helps a lot with just your general state of panic/mental health throughout the year, esp. when you get to that inevitable period where you're sure you're doing everything wrong and you're going to fail miserably.

5) As you apply for jobs, do you find that the Harvard name is valuable? Compared to, say, Columbia/NYU/etc? How valuable?
can only speak as a 1L, and can't really compare to other schools, but for me it's been immensely valuable. i've gotten a lot of offers for the summer that i can't believe i got based on my grades and resume, and landed what amounts to a dream job for me pretty early on. most of the people i know are in similar situations. i'm also interested in a pretty niche, credentials-conscious field, so i kind of get the feeling that i wouldn't have been as successful if i'd gone to a lower-ranked school. also, if you have any interest in working internationally, the brand name really really helps.

6) I'm visiting the campus on ASW April 1-2. Any advice on what I should check out while I'm there? Secret things that my sway my decision one way or another?
i think someone else mentioned it as well, but i'd check out cambridge. some things just aren't as convenient as they'd be in a bigger city, and good restaurants, places to go out, etc. can be a bit sparse. you may or may not like it. if you're interested in public interest work, i'd ask the admissions office to put you in touch with students who are in similar fields so you can scope out what options people have. that was a huge thing for me this year and i wish i'd had a better idea of the lay of the land earlier in the semester.

all in all, law school anywhere can be really shitty at times. but i think going to H has alleviated a lot of that inherent shittiness for me. the breadth of activities you can get involved with, the connections, people's general helpfulness, etc. have made up for a lot of crappier parts of law school (in my experience). hope that helps a little :)

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby foxes » Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:35 am

tomwatts wrote:
foxes wrote:can anyone tell me what the typical summer intern period is for 1Ls? do people usually leave after law review write on, or maybe right after exams, or do they wait a few weeks? and how many days before eip should i be back in cambridge? ty in advance

8-12 weeks. (12 is on the long side.)

People usually leave Cambridge when they're done, so after exams if they're not doing the law review write-on or after the law review write-on if they are doing that. Personally, I'd give myself a few days to recover and feel like a human being again, especially if you're doing the law review write-on, because it's like a month of exams, but some people just want to get out.

You don't have to be back in Cambridge until whenever your first EIP interview is, but there is an event the Friday before (usually) that you're semi-supposed to go to. You might want to get back the week before EIP, or you might not.

thanks!

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby tomwatts » Tue Feb 23, 2016 12:37 pm

lunixer wrote:Hi. I'm a 0L and just got accepted at Harvard. Getting cold feet. A few questions if you don't mind answering:

1) Are you happy you chose to attend Harvard, given the other offers you had for various schools, your then-current job/job offers, etc?

2) I consider myself to be a pretty smart guy, but not a genius. I have a pretty meh undergrad GPA (~3.7 very good state school, difficult major), and got in mostly on the basis of my LSAT, my sounds-impressive work experience, and my grad degree. But given that I'm not THAT smart (and certainly not as smart as people who get a 173+ LSAT on their first try) will my classmates totally outclass me? I am very dedicated to work and have a whole lot of stick-to-it-iveness.

3) Are the stories about Harvard being a cutthroat institution true? I know that they have tried to soften their image, but should I still expect students to be stealing books from the library or stuff like that? Will I be laughed out of the room if I'm cold-called and don't know the answer?

4) My impression is that the higher-ranked the school the "easier" it is, at least relative to law school in general. If I am choosing between, for example, Harvard and NYU, knowing that this is not by any means an exclusive or even important criteria for my decision, which school should I expect to be easier?

5) As you apply for jobs, do you find that the Harvard name is valuable? Compared to, say, Columbia/NYU/etc? How valuable?

6) I'm visiting the campus on ASW April 1-2. Any advice on what I should check out while I'm there? Secret things that my sway my decision one way or another?

Thanks very much for your help and input.

Mostly I second the previous comments, but just a couple of things to add.

1. One thing that sort of surprised me is that you can get a sense of the feel of a school, and of its culture, pretty quickly. Harvard felt right. Some other schools didn't. I'm glad I went to Harvard.

3. The scary stories about Harvard Law School come from the 1980's. There was a time, starting around the late '70s and continuing until some point in the '90s or so, when HLS was a really unpleasant place to be. Those days are long gone.

5. The alumni network has a breadth and depth that I don't think any other school can really match, because HLS is a huge school with such a high level of prestige. Other schools with a comparable level of prestige (e.g., YLS) are a good deal smaller, so they don't have alums in every niche area of law (and some areas of non-law) in quite the same way that HLS does. If you think you're probably just going to do corporate M&A, then it doesn't really matter, but if you think that you might like to do something unusual, then the HLS network can almost certainly get you on the phone with someone who's already doing whatever it is that you dream up during law school.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Pneumonia » Tue Feb 23, 2016 1:28 pm

foxes wrote:can anyone tell me what the typical summer intern period is for 1Ls? do people usually leave after law review write on, or maybe right after exams, or do they wait a few weeks? and how many days before eip should i be back in cambridge? ty in advance


From the end of exams to the beginning of EIP, 1L summer is 12 weeks long. The HLR write on takes place immediately following exams, so if you do that your summer shrinks to 11 weeks. Obviously, most people don't get HLR; but if you do, then you have to be back 1 week before EIP for training. So, if you get lucky and do make HLR, your summer shrinks to 10 weeks.

Whether or not you do HLR, I strongly advise that you take at least 1 or 2 weeks for yourself. If you can only take 1, I think your best bet would be to take a week off between the end of the Spring semester and the beginning of your job.

I did not do the HLR write on, so I had 12 weeks. I used all of those weeks for working, and that was a mistake. To be clear, using all 12 weeks means that you leave Cambridge on a Friday, and begin work on a Monday. If you've just had an exam that Friday (or Thursday), the combination of traveling, moving your stuff out, moving in somewhere else, and beginning work all within a few days is brutal. Similarly, coming back, I finished work on a Friday and began EIP three days later. Also not the best choice.

Ideally, I think you should take 1 week off between exams and starting your job and 1 week off between ending your job and beginning EIP. Beginning work immediately after exams is just too grueling (I think). You won't be fresh, and you won't do as good of a job as you would if you'd taken the time to recuperate.

I think the decision to take time off is most difficult if you're working in the private sector, for two reasons. First, taking time two weeks off means missing out on about $6,000. However, if you have any need based aid, that amount will be a wash. Moreover, you'll still have made 24k in the 8 weeks that you do work. $6,000 is a lot of money, but in the long term It really just isn't worth risking an offer over (or risking a callback at EIP). A second reason for working 12 weeks as a 1L might be that you have two firm offers and each requires a 6 week minimum. If that is the case, try asking the firms to do 5 weeks each. Explaining your summer schedule will go along way, as will letting each firm know that you're only doing 5 at both.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby lunixer » Tue Feb 23, 2016 6:13 pm

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Last edited by lunixer on Mon Mar 14, 2016 11:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Single-Malt-Liquor
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Single-Malt-Liquor » Wed Feb 24, 2016 3:47 pm

Interrupting the HLS Lovefest for a PSA.

If you take one of the elevators in WCC down one floor, you will be judged. Especially if it is at 1PM when there's a rush.

That is all.


My contribution to the love fest. One of the best moments at HLS is when you realize that you're just average here. You can just turn it off and go into cruise control. If you're here, for most classes, medium effort throughout the semester and then full steam before/during finals is good enough.*

*Disclaimer: some classes will wreck you with this strategy, consult hlsdope.com to check reading load, difficulty, and availability of outlines first. Void where prohibited.

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Mack.Hambleton
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Mack.Hambleton » Wed Feb 24, 2016 4:34 pm

Single-Malt-Liquor wrote:Interrupting the HLS Lovefest for a PSA.

If you take one of the elevators in WCC down one floor, you will be judged. Especially if it is at 1PM when there's a rush.

That is all.


My contribution to the love fest. One of the best moments at HLS is when you realize that you're just average here. You can just turn it off and go into cruise control. If you're here, for most classes, medium effort throughout the semester and then full steam before/during finals is good enough.*

*Disclaimer: some classes will wreck you with this strategy, consult hlsdope.com to check reading load, difficulty, and availability of outlines first. Void where prohibited.


What if u have a sore ankle

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Mr. Elshal
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Mr. Elshal » Wed Feb 24, 2016 5:21 pm

Mack.Hambleton wrote:
Single-Malt-Liquor wrote:Interrupting the HLS Lovefest for a PSA.

If you take one of the elevators in WCC down one floor, you will be judged. Especially if it is at 1PM when there's a rush.

That is all.


My contribution to the love fest. One of the best moments at HLS is when you realize that you're just average here. You can just turn it off and go into cruise control. If you're here, for most classes, medium effort throughout the semester and then full steam before/during finals is good enough.*

*Disclaimer: some classes will wreck you with this strategy, consult hlsdope.com to check reading load, difficulty, and availability of outlines first. Void where prohibited.


What if u have a sore ankle


It's expected that you will be a good citizen and make your sore ankle well known by, for example, listing slightly to one side or continuously grimacing in pain in such a way that everyone else will understand your pain. Otherwise, you are fully liable for the embarrassment caused when somebody gives you a dirty look and later finds out that your ankle was sore.

ETA: For simple questions like this, you really should just consult the student handbook. It covers such useful topics as sore ankle elevator usage and determining whether coming to HLS was a good decision, as well as such crucial strategy tips as whether a particular class might require more than middling effort.

throwaway_
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby throwaway_ » Wed Feb 24, 2016 5:35 pm

Pneumonia wrote:
foxes wrote:can anyone tell me what the typical summer intern period is for 1Ls? do people usually leave after law review write on, or maybe right after exams, or do they wait a few weeks? and how many days before eip should i be back in cambridge? ty in advance


From the end of exams to the beginning of EIP, 1L summer is 12 weeks long. The HLR write on takes place immediately following exams, so if you do that your summer shrinks to 11 weeks. Obviously, most people don't get HLR; but if you do, then you have to be back 1 week before EIP for training. So, if you get lucky and do make HLR, your summer shrinks to 10 weeks.

Whether or not you do HLR, I strongly advise that you take at least 1 or 2 weeks for yourself. If you can only take 1, I think your best bet would be to take a week off between the end of the Spring semester and the beginning of your job.

I did not do the HLR write on, so I had 12 weeks. I used all of those weeks for working, and that was a mistake. To be clear, using all 12 weeks means that you leave Cambridge on a Friday, and begin work on a Monday. If you've just had an exam that Friday (or Thursday), the combination of traveling, moving your stuff out, moving in somewhere else, and beginning work all within a few days is brutal. Similarly, coming back, I finished work on a Friday and began EIP three days later. Also not the best choice.

Ideally, I think you should take 1 week off between exams and starting your job and 1 week off between ending your job and beginning EIP. Beginning work immediately after exams is just too grueling (I think). You won't be fresh, and you won't do as good of a job as you would if you'd taken the time to recuperate.

I think the decision to take time off is most difficult if you're working in the private sector, for two reasons. First, taking time two weeks off means missing out on about $6,000. However, if you have any need based aid, that amount will be a wash. Moreover, you'll still have made 24k in the 8 weeks that you do work. $6,000 is a lot of money, but in the long term It really just isn't worth risking an offer over (or risking a callback at EIP). A second reason for working 12 weeks as a 1L might be that you have two firm offers and each requires a 6 week minimum. If that is the case, try asking the firms to do 5 weeks each. Explaining your summer schedule will go along way, as will letting each firm know that you're only doing 5 at both.


As an alternative take, I had a 1L SA that required me to do 10 weeks, which I squeezed between write-on and EIP. My thought is that 1L jobs ... tend not to be brutal at all, and I didn't really have an issue with handing in my packet on Saturday and packing up that night, then driving to New York on Sunday to start work on Monday. (Unless your 1L job is Cravath, maybe.)

At the other end, I thought that having a week to myself before EIP wasn't necessary at all. Stakes at EIP are high of course, but it's a process that really doesn't require that much preparation, and I don't think you need more than a night of good rest, as opposed to a couple of full days off.

Remember also that EIP drags on to travelling from city to city, which is physically but not intellectually tiring, and afterwards you become a 2L! Lots of time for yourself during 2L.

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foxes
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby foxes » Wed Feb 24, 2016 5:59 pm

throwaway_ wrote:
Pneumonia wrote:

thanks guys!

@throwaway, is there really not that much prep for eip? i suppose there's firm research and stuff like that but i guess that can be done over the summer? i'm a little concerned b/c ill be out of the country for the summer so i have to plan ahead

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TripTrip
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby TripTrip » Wed Feb 24, 2016 6:13 pm

foxes wrote:
throwaway_ wrote:
Pneumonia wrote:

thanks guys!

@throwaway, is there really not that much prep for eip? i suppose there's firm research and stuff like that but i guess that can be done over the summer? i'm a little concerned b/c ill be out of the country for the summer so i have to plan ahead

Depends on whether you mean prepping your bid list or prepping for the interviews themselves.

Neither need to take very long, but they can if you make them.

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Pneumonia
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Pneumonia » Wed Feb 24, 2016 7:53 pm

throwaway_ wrote: As an alternative take, I had a 1L SA that required me to do 10 weeks, which I squeezed between write-on and EIP. My thought is that 1L jobs ... tend not to be brutal at all, and I didn't really have an issue with handing in my packet on Saturday and packing up that night, then driving to New York on Sunday to start work on Monday. (Unless your 1L job is Cravath, maybe.)

At the other end, I thought that having a week to myself before EIP wasn't necessary at all. Stakes at EIP are high of course, but it's a process that really doesn't require that much preparation, and I don't think you need more than a night of good rest, as opposed to a couple of full days off.

Remember also that EIP drags on to travelling from city to city, which is physically but not intellectually tiring, and afterwards you become a 2L! Lots of time for yourself during 2L.

This goes to show that, even in the firm world, there are a variety of experiences. For myself, I had to drive to quite a bit further than New York, and my SA was pretty hectic from the start.

foxes wrote:is there really not that much prep for eip? i suppose there's firm research and stuff like that but i guess that can be done over the summer? i'm a little concerned b/c ill be out of the country for the summer so i have to plan ahead

As TripTrip said, there is the bid list and then there is preparing for the actual interviews. Bid list requires some thought if you're bidding the same firms in multiple markets (not a lot of thought, but some). As far as preparing for the screeners, you don't really need to do anything at all beyond have a basic grasp of what the firm does—and does not—do. Wachtell / DC / Boutiques might be an exception in some cases. But, for the majority of firms that visit, you don't need to know their PPP or whether their PE group had a middling year or whatever. That information might be helpful when you're deciding between offers, but it's not necessary for the interviews themselves.

Indifference
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Indifference » Wed Feb 24, 2016 10:20 pm

Are LRW brief grades done for our individual part of the brief? I assume that isn't the case, right?




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