Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
tomwatts
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby tomwatts » Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:13 pm

LaCumparsita wrote:Which dorm is the best? North seems ideal since it's newer than the others (right?) and you can have your own bathroom, but are the smaller rooms in North really small? Are the rooms in Gropius and Hastings really old? What is the social scene like in each of the dorms? Thanks!

The only unqualified disadvantage of North is the price (it's significantly more expensive than Gropius and somewhat more than Hastings).

North is, I'm told, less social than Gropius or Hastings. You do get your own bathroom, and there's not much in the way of common study area (except in the bottom floor), so you have very little reason to interact with others in your building, whereas in Gropius, just about everything is communal.

The rooms in North are relatively big and nice. They look exactly like converted economy hotel rooms, because they are. It's a couple of blocks off campus, whereas Hastings and Gropius are literally seconds from class. There are more LL.M.s and S.J.D.s (mostly foreign students doing Masters or doctoral degrees here); Gropius at least is dominated by 1Ls, with a handful of 2Ls/3Ls and LL.M.s/S.J.D.s.

There are various other comments about the dorms on pages 15-17 of this topic.

sarahh
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby sarahh » Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:54 pm

jbs017 wrote:Can someone comment on TF-ing undergrad classes? How common is it? Is it a pretty easy job to get? What classes do people most frequently TF? Etc....

I have seen a few postings in the administrative updates. I don't know anyone who does it. Not sure if it is common. Starting as a 2L, you can be a BSA (basically a TF for LRW class) and get paid for that.

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dean159
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby dean159 » Mon Feb 20, 2012 12:32 pm

I'm almost certainly going to be attending Harvard in the fall and lately I've been considering possibly applying for the joint degree with the KSG in my 1L year. I'm interested as to how most students view the joint degree as I've read in a few places that an MPP doesn't really open any more doors that you couldn't already access with a JD, especially from somewhere like Harvard. I'd also be interested to know whether any of you are aware as to how the joint degree would affect chances at OCI etc.

splbagel
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby splbagel » Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:21 pm

dean159 wrote:I'm almost certainly going to be attending Harvard in the fall and lately I've been considering possibly applying for the joint degree with the KSG in my 1L year. I'm interested as to how most students view the joint degree as I've read in a few places that an MPP doesn't really open any more doors that you couldn't already access with a JD, especially from somewhere like Harvard. I'd also be interested to know whether any of you are aware as to how the joint degree would affect chances at OCI etc.


I'm considering a dual JD/MPP as well. In the process of researching this, I've spoken with a number of professors and professionals. It seems like if you want to be a private sector attorney, there's probably no point in doing the MPP. But it might be advantageous in the public/non-profit sector and academia, especially for positions involving policy analysis and or legislative advocacy.

concurrent fork
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby concurrent fork » Tue Feb 21, 2012 8:34 pm

dean159 wrote:I'd also be interested to know whether any of you are aware as to how the joint degree would affect chances at OCI etc.

If you are interested in going to a firm, I don't see how a dual JD/MPP will be of any value. I expect that it could actually hurt you at OCI, since it suggests you may not be interested in going to a firm after graduation (granted, this is speculation as I don't know any JD/MPP candidates who participated in OCI).

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acrossthelake
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby acrossthelake » Tue Feb 21, 2012 8:49 pm

sarahh wrote:
jbs017 wrote:Can someone comment on TF-ing undergrad classes? How common is it? Is it a pretty easy job to get? What classes do people most frequently TF? Etc....

I have seen a few postings in the administrative updates. I don't know anyone who does it. Not sure if it is common. Starting as a 2L, you can be a BSA (basically a TF for LRW class) and get paid for that.


Yeah, this. I don't know anyone who TF's outside of being a BSA either personally or through other people. I imagine it happens, but it's not common since it can be quite the time commitment, and time during law school is scarce. It's definitely something I think that's worth signing up for if you really want the experience, less so the money.

tomwatts
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby tomwatts » Tue Feb 21, 2012 9:09 pm

dean159 wrote:I'm almost certainly going to be attending Harvard in the fall and lately I've been considering possibly applying for the joint degree with the KSG in my 1L year. I'm interested as to how most students view the joint degree as I've read in a few places that an MPP doesn't really open any more doors that you couldn't already access with a JD, especially from somewhere like Harvard. I'd also be interested to know whether any of you are aware as to how the joint degree would affect chances at OCI etc.

The direct "why on earth would you do that if you were going to work at a firm?" answer has already been given, but I'd add that if you want to do public interest (especially government), it may confer some benefit. Notably, you get three summers, so you have to chance to get more work experience. You have four years of classes and extracurriculars to develop expertise in some subject area, which can help.

More specific things could be said by someone more knowledgeable than I.

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dean159
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby dean159 » Tue Feb 21, 2012 9:40 pm

tomwatts wrote:
dean159 wrote:I'm almost certainly going to be attending Harvard in the fall and lately I've been considering possibly applying for the joint degree with the KSG in my 1L year. I'm interested as to how most students view the joint degree as I've read in a few places that an MPP doesn't really open any more doors that you couldn't already access with a JD, especially from somewhere like Harvard. I'd also be interested to know whether any of you are aware as to how the joint degree would affect chances at OCI etc.

The direct "why on earth would you do that if you were going to work at a firm?" answer has already been given, but I'd add that if you want to do public interest (especially government), it may confer some benefit. Notably, you get three summers, so you have to chance to get more work experience. You have four years of classes and extracurriculars to develop expertise in some subject area, which can help.

More specific things could be said by someone more knowledgeable than I.


I probably should have been a bit clearer with my initial question and I'm sorry for any confusion. I definitely get that there's no point getting an MPP for work in a firm and I am interested in possibly doing work for a national or international governmental organization. My question about OCI was more a general question about how doing an extra year would work in regards to applying for summer positions in my second summer, not just firms. I assume you'd do a similar type of internship to a 1L internship in that summer and then apply for the SA positions (or their public service equivalent) in the summer after your 3rd year.

The reason for some of my concerns about the usefulness of the MPP comes from what I've read in articles like this http://drezner.foreignpolicy.com/posts/ ... ing_a_list which seem to suggest that the KSG is perceived as not particularly rigorous relative to a JD. If that's the case and I would have a similar chance of getting some of these public service positions with just the JD, then it wouldn't be worth spending the extra time and accruing all the extra debt just for a few extra letters after my name.

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XxMVPxX
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby XxMVPxX » Wed Feb 22, 2012 12:19 am

dean159 wrote:I'm almost certainly going to be attending Harvard in the fall and lately I've been considering possibly applying for the joint degree with the KSG in my 1L year. I'm interested as to how most students view the joint degree as I've read in a few places that an MPP doesn't really open any more doors that you couldn't already access with a JD, especially from somewhere like Harvard. I'd also be interested to know whether any of you are aware as to how the joint degree would affect chances at OCI etc.


Assuming you already got in, I'm just wondering, how are you perceived by your friends and family now that you are going to Harvard law school? I feel like if I were to get in there I'd feel like a local celebrity of sorts, do you mention it a lot to people you meet or use it when arguing with friends once in a while? I feel like it would quadruple the size of my ego.

EDIT - anyone who has been admitted, is a current student, or an alum can feel free to answer as well.

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englawyer
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby englawyer » Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:11 am

XxMVPxX wrote:
dean159 wrote:I'm almost certainly going to be attending Harvard in the fall and lately I've been considering possibly applying for the joint degree with the KSG in my 1L year. I'm interested as to how most students view the joint degree as I've read in a few places that an MPP doesn't really open any more doors that you couldn't already access with a JD, especially from somewhere like Harvard. I'd also be interested to know whether any of you are aware as to how the joint degree would affect chances at OCI etc.


Assuming you already got in, I'm just wondering, how are you perceived by your friends and family now that you are going to Harvard law school? I feel like if I were to get in there I'd feel like a local celebrity of sorts, do you mention it a lot to people you meet or use it when arguing with friends once in a while? I feel like it would quadruple the size of my ego.

EDIT - anyone who has been admitted, is a current student, or an alum can feel free to answer as well.


no. there is some kind of "success" vibe/image you get but you will not mention it a lot and would certainly never cite your Harvard status to win an argument. you would quickly lose those friends for being a douche

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acrossthelake
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby acrossthelake » Wed Feb 22, 2012 12:43 pm

If you need to cite going to hls to win an argument you must either have a horrible argument or weak persuasive skills.

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XxMVPxX
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby XxMVPxX » Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:03 pm

acrossthelake wrote:If you need to cite going to hls to win an argument you must either have a horrible argument or weak persuasive skills.

I mean more like in a joking matter like "sorry, I go to Harvard law so I think I would know" or something stupid like that.

I just feel like going to Harvard law would give you bragging rights over everyone you know. Not saying you would ever rub it in anyone's face but that you could if you wanted and they'd have no argument.

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kulshan
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby kulshan » Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:07 pm

I've had the opposite happen a few times now. I'll be discussing something and other people jokingly say, "oh, well you got into Harvard, so..." It's sort of embarrassing :S

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acrossthelake
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby acrossthelake » Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:39 pm

XxMVPxX wrote:
acrossthelake wrote:If you need to cite going to hls to win an argument you must either have a horrible argument or weak persuasive skills.

I mean more like in a joking matter like "sorry, I go to Harvard law so I think I would know" or something stupid like that.

I just feel like going to Harvard law would give you bragging rights over everyone you know
. Not saying you would ever rub it in anyone's face but that you could if you wanted and they'd have no argument.


Not really. There are a LOT of impressive people who don't go to Harvard Law. I think it's really erroneous to think that just because you were admitted to a competitive school to somehow think that you're impressive or that you've contributed anything to society. Imo, wait until you've actually contributed something before you pat yourself on the back too much.

I just feel like that's a really...inappropriate and rude thing to say, even jokingly. Harvard has, in my opinion, a very undeserved reputation for being full of people who are full of themselves. In reality, a lot of people are down to earth and humble, though there is an annoying minority who reinforces that reputation. I think it's wise to be cognizant of that reputation, and to make an effort to defray it.

I used to get really upset in undergrad on the rare occasion where I heard of someone making really rather elitist remarks ("He suggested I was jealous of her, but why would I be jealous? I go to an Ivy and she went to a state school"). It ruins it for the rest of us. So, while I suppose it depends somewhat on the context, I'd be rather disapproving of HLS students who took that attitude.

Plus, I know a fair number of individuals who don't go to HLS who are much smarter than me(not in law at all). They'd laugh at your face and win the argument on the merits. Nobody I'm close to was impressed that I got in. They were proud, sure, but not impressed. I'm not particularly impressed, either, tbh. I'm impressed with a friend who managed to pull a 4.0 in electrical engineering, publish a few research articles, and graduate in 3 years from MIT. But impressed with myself for pulling an okay GPA in undergrad matched with a high LSAT? Whoop-de-doop I did well on a standardized test. I'm much more proud of things I did in undergrad that actually...helped people, and contributed to something.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby thederangedwang » Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:51 pm

kulshan wrote:I've had the opposite happen a few times now. I'll be discussing something and other people jokingly say, "oh, well you got into Harvard, so..." It's sort of embarrassing :S

+1...it sucks now actually cause whenever i screw up and/or say something stupid my friends will say "and YOU got into harvard" followed by a :roll:

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XxMVPxX
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby XxMVPxX » Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:56 pm

acrossthelake wrote:
Harvard has, in my opinion, a very undeserved reputation for being full of people who are full of themselves. In reality, a lot of people are down to earth and humble, though there is an annoying minority who reinforces that reputation. I think it's wise to be cognizant of that reputation, and to make an effort to defray it.

I used to get really upset in undergrad on the rare occasion where I heard of someone making really rather elitist remarks ("He suggested I was jealous of her, but why would I be jealous? I go to an Ivy and she went to a state school"). It ruins it for the rest of us. So, while I suppose it depends somewhat on the context, I'd be rather disapproving of HLS students who took that attitude.



True, I think most people assume Harvard students are something like the Winklevoss twins in Social Network. If the people like that are a small minority than it's a shame such a small number of people give thousands a bad name.

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kulshan
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby kulshan » Wed Feb 22, 2012 3:31 pm

thederangedwang wrote:+1...it sucks now actually cause whenever i screw up and/or say something stupid my friends will say "and YOU got into harvard" followed by a :roll:


This.

freestallion
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby freestallion » Wed Feb 22, 2012 3:48 pm

kulshan wrote:
thederangedwang wrote:+1...it sucks now actually cause whenever i screw up and/or say something stupid my friends will say "and YOU got into harvard" followed by a :roll:


This.

+1000

ignatiusr
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby ignatiusr » Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:20 pm

kulshan wrote:I've had the opposite happen a few times now. I'll be discussing something and other people jokingly say, "oh, well you got into Harvard, so..." It's sort of embarrassing :S


Yeah, I've been surprised by how sheepish I am about going to HLS when someone prods me about it. I think, because of the (pre-)(mis-)conceptions about Harvard students being elitist/condescending, there is a certain faction of people--usually acquaintances rather than close friends--who measure your words very carefully when you talk about Harvard, just waiting for you to say something that they can construe as smug or bragging. Or, alternatively, I may just be paranoid.

splbagel
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby splbagel » Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:26 pm

ignatiusr wrote:
kulshan wrote:I've had the opposite happen a few times now. I'll be discussing something and other people jokingly say, "oh, well you got into Harvard, so..." It's sort of embarrassing :S


Yeah, I've been surprised by how sheepish I am about going to HLS when someone prods me about it. I think, because of the (pre-)(mis-)conceptions about Harvard students being elitist/condescending, there is a certain faction of people--usually acquaintances rather than close friends--who measure your words very carefully when you talk about Harvard, just waiting for you to say something that they can construe as smug or bragging. Or, alternatively, I may just be paranoid.


I'm totally with you on this.

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euskadi
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby euskadi » Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:33 pm

splbagel wrote:
ignatiusr wrote:
kulshan wrote:I've had the opposite happen a few times now. I'll be discussing something and other people jokingly say, "oh, well you got into Harvard, so..." It's sort of embarrassing :S


Yeah, I've been surprised by how sheepish I am about going to HLS when someone prods me about it. I think, because of the (pre-)(mis-)conceptions about Harvard students being elitist/condescending, there is a certain faction of people--usually acquaintances rather than close friends--who measure your words very carefully when you talk about Harvard, just waiting for you to say something that they can construe as smug or bragging. Or, alternatively, I may just be paranoid.


I'm totally with you on this.


Add one more to the group. Ignatiusr couldn't have said it any better, and (s)he explains perfectly how I've felt since being admitted. I don't much appreciate the conclusions that people draw off of one minor accomplishment (admission) - I'd like for people to be interested in me for being a decent guy.

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kilgoretrout66
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby kilgoretrout66 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:30 am

ignatiusr wrote:
kulshan wrote:I've had the opposite happen a few times now. I'll be discussing something and other people jokingly say, "oh, well you got into Harvard, so..." It's sort of embarrassing :S


Yeah, I've been surprised by how sheepish I am about going to HLS when someone prods me about it. I think, because of the (pre-)(mis-)conceptions about Harvard students being elitist/condescending, there is a certain faction of people--usually acquaintances rather than close friends--who measure your words very carefully when you talk about Harvard, just waiting for you to say something that they can construe as smug or bragging. Or, alternatively, I may just be paranoid.


Same here, though I`ve realized that in many instances the only thing douchier than dropping the `H-bomb` is trying too hard to avoid saying the words `Harvard Law School.` Excessive embarrassment can come across as another form braggery :oops:

All in all a good problem to have, though 8)

ignatiusr
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby ignatiusr » Fri Feb 24, 2012 9:45 am

kilgoretrout66 wrote:
ignatiusr wrote:
kulshan wrote:I've had the opposite happen a few times now. I'll be discussing something and other people jokingly say, "oh, well you got into Harvard, so..." It's sort of embarrassing :S


Yeah, I've been surprised by how sheepish I am about going to HLS when someone prods me about it. I think, because of the (pre-)(mis-)conceptions about Harvard students being elitist/condescending, there is a certain faction of people--usually acquaintances rather than close friends--who measure your words very carefully when you talk about Harvard, just waiting for you to say something that they can construe as smug or bragging. Or, alternatively, I may just be paranoid.


Same here, though I`ve realized that in many instances the only thing douchier than dropping the `H-bomb` is trying too hard to avoid saying the words `Harvard Law School.` Excessive embarrassment can come across as another form braggery :oops:

All in all a good problem to have, though 8)


I heard second-hand that, when one of the attorneys in my office heard I'd gotten into HLS, he shouted across the room "He got into Harvard? That DOUCHEBAG." I think he was at least partially joking, but it's still more evidence of why I'm reluctant to broach the subject.

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sharktankdean
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby sharktankdean » Sat Feb 25, 2012 11:49 am

I was wondering if any of the current students have had a talk with some of the dean sand know how the HELD process works.

Do they really just put our files aside until a certain time or do they continue to evaluate the group and divide the group into its various subgroups (held-admit, held-WL, etc)
Also when it comes to LOCIs are they read when they come in or do they just put them in your file until they are ready to look into the hold pile?

Any successful held-admit people out there? What do you think you did that helped your app?

Thanks!

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acrossthelake
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby acrossthelake » Sat Feb 25, 2012 3:39 pm

sharktankdean wrote:I was wondering if any of the current students have had a talk with some of the dean sand know how the HELD process works.

Do they really just put our files aside until a certain time or do they continue to evaluate the group and divide the group into its various subgroups (held-admit, held-WL, etc)
Also when it comes to LOCIs are they read when they come in or do they just put them in your file until they are ready to look into the hold pile?

Any successful held-admit people out there? What do you think you did that helped your app?

Thanks!


I haven't talked to a dean, but I'm friends with two people who were originally held. Both had applied around mid to late October. One got a JR1 request maybe a week after being held, and then got in a week or so after that. The other got waitlisted, then got in for the very first waitlist round. I don't think either did anything that particularly helped their app get in off being held.




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