Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
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Doorkeeper
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Doorkeeper » Wed Dec 18, 2013 11:59 am

HarvardHopeful wrote:Any of you regret passing up a full ride to T10 and instead going to Harvard? Or do you believe Harvard has been/will be worth the debt that you take on?

Considering my interests (government/PI), it has been absolutely worth it. If your goal is just to grab a nice biglaw gig in NYC, then Columbia or Chicago on a full ride might make more sense, but if you want government/PI/clerking/academia, then Harvard is the way to go.

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TripTrip
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby TripTrip » Wed Dec 18, 2013 1:39 pm

HarvardHopeful wrote:Any of you regret passing up a full ride to T10 and instead going to Harvard? Or do you believe Harvard has been/will be worth the debt that you take on?

I would have considered Columbia full-ride over Harvard. However, it's important to remember most people don't pay sticker at Harvard. The needs-based grants can be very generous.

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whippersnappery
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby whippersnappery » Wed Dec 18, 2013 1:42 pm

Doorkeeper wrote:
HarvardHopeful wrote:Any of you regret passing up a full ride to T10 and instead going to Harvard? Or do you believe Harvard has been/will be worth the debt that you take on?

Considering my interests (government/PI), it has been absolutely worth it. If your goal is just to grab a nice biglaw gig in NYC, then Columbia or Chicago on a full ride might make more sense, but if you want government/PI/clerking/academia, then Harvard is the way to go.


Can you expand on this? This is super relevant to my interests. It seems like Harvard is about on par if not below PI placement compared with schools like NYU. Is it just a prestige thing?

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Doorkeeper
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Doorkeeper » Wed Dec 18, 2013 1:52 pm

whippersnappery wrote:
Doorkeeper wrote:
HarvardHopeful wrote:Any of you regret passing up a full ride to T10 and instead going to Harvard? Or do you believe Harvard has been/will be worth the debt that you take on?

Considering my interests (government/PI), it has been absolutely worth it. If your goal is just to grab a nice biglaw gig in NYC, then Columbia or Chicago on a full ride might make more sense, but if you want government/PI/clerking/academia, then Harvard is the way to go.


Can you expand on this? This is super relevant to my interests. It seems like Harvard is about on par if not below PI placement compared with schools like NYU. Is it just a prestige thing?

This totally depends on what type of PI work you want to do. The % of people going into PI is a self-selection bias that doesn't account for the quality of placements. If your dream in life is to work at the ACLU, well then you need to get a Fellowship there, which you can only be competitive for after a circuit clerkship. You have a much better chance of accomplishing that at Harvard than NYU. Further, Harvard's connections into the federal government are definitely bar none.

Also, TripTrip is right to consider the impact your need based aid will make on your bottom line loans.

kcam1991
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby kcam1991 » Wed Dec 18, 2013 8:09 pm

When can 1Ls expect grades?

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ph14
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby ph14 » Wed Dec 18, 2013 8:10 pm

kcam1991 wrote:When can 1Ls expect grades?


Thursday or Friday of the 1st week of Spring semester.

despina
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby despina » Wed Dec 18, 2013 8:11 pm

Last year grades came out Jan 28, which was first day of the spring semester.

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Mr. Elshal
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Mr. Elshal » Wed Dec 18, 2013 8:13 pm

despina wrote:Last year grades came out Jan 28, which was first day of the spring semester.


Do they all come out at once, or is it just as professors submit them?

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby despina » Wed Dec 18, 2013 8:16 pm

Mr. Elshal wrote:
despina wrote:Last year grades came out Jan 28, which was first day of the spring semester.


Do they all come out at once, or is it just as professors submit them?


All at once -- we got an email from the registrar when they appeared on Helios.

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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby justinp » Wed Dec 18, 2013 10:03 pm

HarvardHopeful wrote:Any of you regret passing up a full ride to T10 and instead going to Harvard? Or do you believe Harvard has been/will be worth the debt that you take on?


Don't regret it at all, but that's largely a function of what I wanted to do. Agreed w/ above poster that if you want NYC biglaw then you should almost certainly take the Hamilton/Rubenstein(? the UChi one...) if you get it. (And obvi if you want Chicago biglaw and get offered a Rubenstein, run don't walk.) But if you want to practice in a competitive secondary market (Atlanta, Seattle, etc.) the HLS network makes a huge difference. Every top firm in a decent-sized American city has a couple HLS grads around who for whatever reason wanted to go back to their/their spouse's home city. That's not really the case for most other schools, which despite national placement ability do tend to open fewer doors in small, competitive markets. Case in point: one of the top TX firms has an Austin summer class this year composed only of HLS students.

Same deal for clerkships-- it's just a little bit easier from HLS. They'll go deeper into the pool, you'll have a better shot at getting something in a city you want to live in, you might be able to lock it down earlier in the hiring season (which is a big load off), etc.

Feel free to PM if you want to hear more.

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HarvardHopeful
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby HarvardHopeful » Wed Dec 18, 2013 11:27 pm

justinp wrote:
HarvardHopeful wrote:Any of you regret passing up a full ride to T10 and instead going to Harvard? Or do you believe Harvard has been/will be worth the debt that you take on?


Don't regret it at all, but that's largely a function of what I wanted to do. Agreed w/ above poster that if you want NYC biglaw then you should almost certainly take the Hamilton/Rubenstein(? the UChi one...) if you get it. (And obvi if you want Chicago biglaw and get offered a Rubenstein, run don't walk.) But if you want to practice in a competitive secondary market (Atlanta, Seattle, etc.) the HLS network makes a huge difference. Every top firm in a decent-sized American city has a couple HLS grads around who for whatever reason wanted to go back to their/their spouse's home city. That's not really the case for most other schools, which despite national placement ability do tend to open fewer doors in small, competitive markets. Case in point: one of the top TX firms has an Austin summer class this year composed only of HLS students.

Same deal for clerkships-- it's just a little bit easier from HLS. They'll go deeper into the pool, you'll have a better shot at getting something in a city you want to live in, you might be able to lock it down earlier in the hiring season (which is a big load off), etc.

Feel free to PM if you want to hear more.


Thank you that is really helpful!

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Sourrudedude
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Sourrudedude » Thu Dec 19, 2013 1:20 am

HarvardHopeful wrote:
justinp wrote:
HarvardHopeful wrote:Any of you regret passing up a full ride to T10 and instead going to Harvard? Or do you believe Harvard has been/will be worth the debt that you take on?


Don't regret it at all, but that's largely a function of what I wanted to do. Agreed w/ above poster that if you want NYC biglaw then you should almost certainly take the Hamilton/Rubenstein(? the UChi one...) if you get it. (And obvi if you want Chicago biglaw and get offered a Rubenstein, run don't walk.) But if you want to practice in a competitive secondary market (Atlanta, Seattle, etc.) the HLS network makes a huge difference. Every top firm in a decent-sized American city has a couple HLS grads around who for whatever reason wanted to go back to their/their spouse's home city. That's not really the case for most other schools, which despite national placement ability do tend to open fewer doors in small, competitive markets. Case in point: one of the top TX firms has an Austin summer class this year composed only of HLS students.

Same deal for clerkships-- it's just a little bit easier from HLS. They'll go deeper into the pool, you'll have a better shot at getting something in a city you want to live in, you might be able to lock it down earlier in the hiring season (which is a big load off), etc.

Feel free to PM if you want to hear more.


Thank you that is really helpful!

+1

acrossthelake
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby acrossthelake » Thu Dec 19, 2013 2:27 am

TripTrip wrote:
HarvardHopeful wrote:Any of you regret passing up a full ride to T10 and instead going to Harvard? Or do you believe Harvard has been/will be worth the debt that you take on?

I would have considered Columbia full-ride over Harvard. However, it's important to remember most people don't pay sticker at Harvard. The needs-based grants can be very generous.


Although sometimes not too generous. I got a decent amount of need-based grants in undergrad, but nothing for law school.

AllTheLawz
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby AllTheLawz » Thu Dec 19, 2013 12:20 pm

acrossthelake wrote:
TripTrip wrote:
HarvardHopeful wrote:Any of you regret passing up a full ride to T10 and instead going to Harvard? Or do you believe Harvard has been/will be worth the debt that you take on?

I would have considered Columbia full-ride over Harvard. However, it's important to remember most people don't pay sticker at Harvard. The needs-based grants can be very generous.


Although sometimes not too generous. I got a decent amount of need-based grants in undergrad, but nothing for law school.


Yep. There is a sweet spot where it is generous (say 75 to ~150k family income) but below or above that range it may get disappointing. One of the posters above is spot-on with the comments on HLS being a huge bonus in secondary markets. During my recruitment process I also found that it helped for well-regarded but not elite law firms in major markets (e.g. Wiley Rein in DC, Katten in Chicago, etc.).

Another place the HLS provides a huge bonus is if you are thinking about a career other than law. At top firms in management consulting and even some parts of finance an HLS student has a better shot than an MBA from outside the top 15-20 or so business schools.

justinp
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby justinp » Thu Dec 19, 2013 1:21 pm

AllTheLawz wrote:Another place the HLS provides a huge bonus is if you are thinking about a career other than law. At top firms in management consulting and even some parts of finance an HLS student has a better shot than an MBA from outside the top 15-20 or so business schools.


I don't *disagree* with this, but I would just reiterate the usual warning-- don't go to law school if you don't think you want to be a lawyer. HLS does place better into other "prestige professions" than most law schools, but it still doesn't place well relative to going to b-school or whatever. If you weren't competitive to get into a good b-school, odds are you won't be able to get BB/Big 3 out of HLS.

AllTheLawz
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby AllTheLawz » Thu Dec 19, 2013 1:42 pm

justinp wrote:
AllTheLawz wrote:Another place the HLS provides a huge bonus is if you are thinking about a career other than law. At top firms in management consulting and even some parts of finance an HLS student has a better shot than an MBA from outside the top 15-20 or so business schools.


I don't *disagree* with this, but I would just reiterate the usual warning-- don't go to law school if you don't think you want to be a lawyer. HLS does place better into other "prestige professions" than most law schools, but it still doesn't place well relative to going to b-school or whatever. If you weren't competitive to get into a good b-school, odds are you won't be able to get BB/Big 3 out of HLS.
\

You are right, I should clarify. Definitely don't come to law school if you have no interest in becoming a lawyer. But if you value flexibility, in the sense that there are other career paths you may be interested in, then you should give an extra point to HLS. The c/o 2014 has a fair number of people who will be entering non-legal business roles (Management consulting, investment management, wealth management, etc.) and, at least of the handful I know, many would not have been competitive for an M7 business school without an additional couple of years of work experience on top of their resumes at the time they applied to law school.

tomwatts
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby tomwatts » Thu Dec 19, 2013 3:17 pm

Obligatory shoutout to joint degrees/cross-registering. Only a few schools have comparable offerings as far as JD/MBA or JD/MPP. Obviously the Harvard JD/PhD is absolutely top-notch, but that's a little less dependent on rankings and more on specific academics at the school. I was interested in a joint degree, so it made my decision between HLS and full-tuition scholarship at a slightly lower-ranked school pretty obvious.

And even if you're just a plain vanilla JD, you can take a lot of the courses at the other schools, and you can interact with the people in other schools in other ways (e.g. I'm a Teaching Fellow for introductory economics at the college).

rathgra
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby rathgra » Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:27 pm

This is a completely stupid 1L paranoia question, but...

Has anyone/does anyone know anyone who failed a class?

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Searchparty
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Searchparty » Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:52 pm

acrossthelake wrote:
TripTrip wrote:
HarvardHopeful wrote:Any of you regret passing up a full ride to T10 and instead going to Harvard? Or do you believe Harvard has been/will be worth the debt that you take on?

I would have considered Columbia full-ride over Harvard. However, it's important to remember most people don't pay sticker at Harvard. The needs-based grants can be very generous.


Although sometimes not too generous. I got a decent amount of need-based grants in undergrad, but nothing for law school.


Although, generous or not.... it's still ~45k in loans every year.

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TripTrip
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby TripTrip » Thu Dec 19, 2013 5:00 pm

acrossthelake wrote:
TripTrip wrote:
HarvardHopeful wrote:Any of you regret passing up a full ride to T10 and instead going to Harvard? Or do you believe Harvard has been/will be worth the debt that you take on?

I would have considered Columbia full-ride over Harvard. However, it's important to remember most people don't pay sticker at Harvard. The needs-based grants can be very generous.


Although sometimes not too generous. I got a decent amount of need-based grants in undergrad, but nothing for law school.

That sucks. It does definitely depend on your situation.

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Doorkeeper
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Doorkeeper » Thu Dec 19, 2013 5:52 pm

rathgra wrote:This is a completely stupid 1L paranoia question, but...

Has anyone/does anyone know anyone who failed a class?

No? You can LP a class, but that's not failing.

acrossthelake
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby acrossthelake » Thu Dec 19, 2013 6:41 pm

rathgra wrote:This is a completely stupid 1L paranoia question, but...

Has anyone/does anyone know anyone who failed a class?


Haven't heard of failing yet. Know of various LPs.

owlofminerva
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby owlofminerva » Thu Dec 19, 2013 7:10 pm

rathgra wrote:This is a completely stupid 1L paranoia question, but...

Has anyone/does anyone know anyone who failed a class?


Not that I know of by direct knowledge. HOWEVER, my fiance--another HLS grad--once had lunch with a personal friend of hers who was in Cambridge to interview during EIP on behalf of their firm. During the lunch, the friend told my fiance, without any personal details, that she saw a transcript where somebody had failed and several LPs. So it CAN happen, but I can only imagine it is because you slept through the final exam or something. A fail at HLS is almost unheard of otherwise.

Mista Bojangles
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Mista Bojangles » Thu Dec 19, 2013 8:32 pm

I know someone who failed PSW

justinp
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby justinp » Thu Dec 19, 2013 9:45 pm

Mista Bojangles wrote:I know someone who failed PSW


Was it for attendance reasons? I feel like you'd really have to try otherwise.




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