Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
tomwatts
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby tomwatts » Sun Aug 25, 2013 6:12 pm

The difficulties involved in cross-registering include:

HLS chooses classes long before the other schools do, generally long before the other schools even post their schedules. So if there's something that you really want to take at another school, you'd better hope that it doesn't conflict with the law school classes that you need. This is frequently an issue because...

HLS operates on a consecutive-days-of-the-week model, so you have M/Tu classes or M/Tu/W classes, or W/Th/F classes, or whatever. All of the other schools I've paid attention to within Harvard (HKS, the College, the HGSE) operate on an alternating-days-of-the-week model, so they have M/W/F classes or Tu/Th classes or the like. (HKS has Tu/Th/F classes sometimes, too, but the Friday session is "optional" in theory.) So there's a LOT of overlap, partly because of this and partly because...

The campuses schedule classes in blocks that don't correspond. For example, HLS has no classes during the 12-1 pm block, but classes will run right up to that blank space or begin right after it. HKS, on the other hand, typically has an 11:40 to 1 pm block in which classes are scheduled. So you'll often have 10-minute or 20-minute overlaps of classes. The campuses are not necessarily all that close to each other, either (HBS is probably a 20-minute walk from HLS), so travel time can be an issue. And if that weren't enough of a scheduling nightmare, there's also the fact that...

The campuses take different holidays. For example, because I'm a JD/MPP and a TF at the College, I have to pay attention to HLS, HKS, and the College, and the first day of classes is 9/3 for the College, 9/5 for HKS, and 9/9 for HLS (for 2Ls and 3Ls). All three campuses take Columbus Day off, but HLS also takes the following day off, which HKS and the College don't. HLS and the College take Veterans Day off, but HKS doesn't. All three campuses have the same Thanksgiving, but the last day of classes is 12/3 for the College and 12/6 for HKS and HLS. Confused yet?

Once you've found a class that you want to take and think you can fit into your schedule, you may not be able to take it. As far as I know, cross-registrants go into the back of the line of people trying to register for the class. Thus, HLS students typically can't take (or have to apply into) the most impacted (best?) classes at the other schools. For example, I know that many of the best HKS classes don't allow students from other campuses.

There's also some annoying paperwork to be done, but that's usually not the biggest issue. Also a maximum of 12 cross-registration credits count towards the credits you need to graduate, so if you cross-register a lot, some of the classes may not count towards your law degree. (This is a big issue for joint-degree students, often, but less so for everyone else.)

Despite all of the above, people cross-register all the time, and it's often a very good experience. There are non-impacted but good classes that you can take at other campuses that are really worthwhile, if you can get past the scheduling nightmares.

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wert3813
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby wert3813 » Sun Aug 25, 2013 7:55 pm

Lincoln Inn Society. Worth it? What it is, do most people do it, etc.

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bosmer88
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby bosmer88 » Mon Aug 26, 2013 10:04 am

tomwatts wrote:The difficulties involved in cross-registering include:

HLS chooses classes long before the other schools do, generally long before the other schools even post their schedules. So if there's something that you really want to take at another school, you'd better hope that it doesn't conflict with the law school classes that you need. This is frequently an issue because...

HLS operates on a consecutive-days-of-the-week model, so you have M/Tu classes or M/Tu/W classes, or W/Th/F classes, or whatever. All of the other schools I've paid attention to within Harvard (HKS, the College, the HGSE) operate on an alternating-days-of-the-week model, so they have M/W/F classes or Tu/Th classes or the like. (HKS has Tu/Th/F classes sometimes, too, but the Friday session is "optional" in theory.) So there's a LOT of overlap, partly because of this and partly because...

The campuses schedule classes in blocks that don't correspond. For example, HLS has no classes during the 12-1 pm block, but classes will run right up to that blank space or begin right after it. HKS, on the other hand, typically has an 11:40 to 1 pm block in which classes are scheduled. So you'll often have 10-minute or 20-minute overlaps of classes. The campuses are not necessarily all that close to each other, either (HBS is probably a 20-minute walk from HLS), so travel time can be an issue. And if that weren't enough of a scheduling nightmare, there's also the fact that...

The campuses take different holidays. For example, because I'm a JD/MPP and a TF at the College, I have to pay attention to HLS, HKS, and the College, and the first day of classes is 9/3 for the College, 9/5 for HKS, and 9/9 for HLS (for 2Ls and 3Ls). All three campuses take Columbus Day off, but HLS also takes the following day off, which HKS and the College don't. HLS and the College take Veterans Day off, but HKS doesn't. All three campuses have the same Thanksgiving, but the last day of classes is 12/3 for the College and 12/6 for HKS and HLS. Confused yet?

Once you've found a class that you want to take and think you can fit into your schedule, you may not be able to take it. As far as I know, cross-registrants go into the back of the line of people trying to register for the class. Thus, HLS students typically can't take (or have to apply into) the most impacted (best?) classes at the other schools. For example, I know that many of the best HKS classes don't allow students from other campuses.

There's also some annoying paperwork to be done, but that's usually not the biggest issue. Also a maximum of 12 cross-registration credits count towards the credits you need to graduate, so if you cross-register a lot, some of the classes may not count towards your law degree. (This is a big issue for joint-degree students, often, but less so for everyone else.)

Despite all of the above, people cross-register all the time, and it's often a very good experience. There are non-impacted but good classes that you can take at other campuses that are really worthwhile, if you can get past the scheduling nightmares.


Seriously, this is really helpful! Thanks for the info.

I'm going to still try to cross-register, but I will keep all this in mind as I do.

The holiday thing...that is so bizarre.

kcam1991
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby kcam1991 » Mon Aug 26, 2013 5:34 pm

Is the orientation casual?

lawschoolboundfuture
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby lawschoolboundfuture » Mon Aug 26, 2013 6:56 pm

What's the deal with the Lincoln Inn Society.

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MyNameIsFlynn!
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby MyNameIsFlynn! » Tue Aug 27, 2013 12:01 pm

I see people posting in the FB group about readings and cases. Are the current-year syllabi up somewhere?

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bosmer88
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby bosmer88 » Tue Aug 27, 2013 12:55 pm

MyNameIsFlynn! wrote:I see people posting in the FB group about readings and cases. Are the current-year syllabi up somewhere?


You can log in here http://myhls.law.harvard.edu/icb/icb.do and check to see if any syllabi are posted for your classes.

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Doorkeeper
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Doorkeeper » Tue Aug 27, 2013 2:23 pm

MyNameIsFlynn! wrote:I see people posting in the FB group about readings and cases. Are the current-year syllabi up somewhere?

The fuck? Orientation hasn't even started yet for you all. The discussion should be about drinking and meeting people.

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Luchando
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Luchando » Tue Aug 27, 2013 4:37 pm

lawschoolboundfuture wrote:What's the deal with the Lincoln Inn Society.


It is a ponzi scheme. Avoid at all costs. Literally no one I know fell for that trap.

Doorkeeper wrote:
MyNameIsFlynn! wrote:I see people posting in the FB group about readings and cases. Are the current-year syllabi up somewhere?

The fuck? Orientation hasn't even started yet for you all. The discussion should be about drinking and meeting people.


This. If you are trying to do your readings at this point, you are taking this whole law school thing way too seriously.

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Mr. Elshal
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Mr. Elshal » Tue Aug 27, 2013 4:57 pm

Luchando wrote:
lawschoolboundfuture wrote:What's the deal with the Lincoln Inn Society.


It is a ponzi scheme. Avoid at all costs. Literally no one I know fell for that trap.


What do you mean by this? I know almost nothing about it so I'm not sure whether joining is worth it.

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Luchando
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Luchando » Tue Aug 27, 2013 5:16 pm

Mr. Elshal wrote:
Luchando wrote:
lawschoolboundfuture wrote:What's the deal with the Lincoln Inn Society.


It is a ponzi scheme. Avoid at all costs. Literally no one I know fell for that trap.


What do you mean by this? I know almost nothing about it so I'm not sure whether joining is worth it.


Don't know what else to say. Joining is not worth it. It is a "social" organization that virtually no one is a member of and it hosts events no one wants to attend.... and you pay for the privilege? It is a ponzi scheme in the sense that your outrageous dues subsidize the strange folks that run the organization (they live at the Inn...) Think really bad, tragically un-cool fraternity.

Mista Bojangles
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Mista Bojangles » Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:33 pm

Luchando wrote:
Mr. Elshal wrote:
Luchando wrote:
lawschoolboundfuture wrote:What's the deal with the Lincoln Inn Society.


It is a ponzi scheme. Avoid at all costs. Literally no one I know fell for that trap.


What do you mean by this? I know almost nothing about it so I'm not sure whether joining is worth it.


Don't know what else to say. Joining is not worth it. It is a "social" organization that virtually no one is a member of and it hosts events no one wants to attend.... and you pay for the privilege? It is a ponzi scheme in the sense that your outrageous dues subsidize the strange folks that run the organization (they live at the Inn...) Think really bad, tragically un-cool fraternity.


Dude, really? It's one thing to have a strong opinion but another entirely to preach it as though it's objective truth, when it's based in objective falsehood. Lincoln's Inn used to be a physical building where the board members lived, but that hasn't been the case for years now. Seriously, what a misleading and bizarre randomly vitriolic post to put ITT.

Anyway, to the asker: my impression is that most 1Ls don't end up joining, though a good number still go to an event or two of theirs (buying slightly pricier tickets per individual event rather than a yearlong membership). I didn't join but still went to a couple events and had a good time. Basically, join if it sounds fun to you, and you prob won't regret it - or pass on membership and you can still go to individual events if you want. No biggie either way

roranoa
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby roranoa » Wed Aug 28, 2013 8:25 am

Do you know ppl who weren't able to get a decent job even with a degree from HLS?
What do they do?

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Searchparty
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Searchparty » Wed Aug 28, 2013 10:23 am

Okay I paid $32 for a 12 pk of Sierra Nevada and 2 6-pks of Coors lt. Wtf?! Somebody tell me where I don't have pay an obnoxious amount for beer. Is this a Cambridge problem? Or should I just get used to it?

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kulshan
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby kulshan » Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:14 pm

Searchparty wrote:Okay I paid $32 for a 12 pk of Sierra Nevada and 2 6-pks of Coors lt. Wtf?! Somebody tell me where I don't have pay an obnoxious amount for beer. Is this a Cambridge problem? Or should I just get used to it?


I heard it's a MA problem. I paid about $5 more than I'm used to paying for a bottle of scotch. :/

Mista Bojangles
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Mista Bojangles » Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:45 pm

Searchparty wrote:Okay I paid $32 for a 12 pk of Sierra Nevada and 2 6-pks of Coors lt. Wtf?! Somebody tell me where I don't have pay an obnoxious amount for beer. Is this a Cambridge problem? Or should I just get used to it?


Yep this is Taxachusetts at its finest. Protip: New Hampshire has no alcohol tax, so if you can put together an expedition there (and take delivery orders from friends etc), you can stock up on a ton at prices substantially lower than you'd find in MA

delusional
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby delusional » Wed Aug 28, 2013 5:05 pm

roranoa wrote:Do you know ppl who weren't able to get a decent job even with a degree from HLS?
What do they do?
I know one person, although the story is that he was never interested in law school, and much prefers to do what he's doing now - non-legal public interest stuff. I would bet there are more though, it's just not the subject of polite conversation. Even after everyone has a job, you'll run into someone who has always been interested in public interest, and they'll say that they're headed for the Random County PD's office, and you're not going to ask if it's a paying position.

I wish I could say that there's always a clear reason for it, but I don't know that there is. The good news is that it's fairly uncommon.

despina
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby despina » Thu Aug 29, 2013 2:58 pm

kcam1991 wrote:Is the orientation casual?


Yes, with two sort-of exceptions as far as I remember. There's a dinner for each section with Dean Minow, for which people tend to go business casualish -- collared shirts for guys, skirts or slacks for ladies (no strict dress code, just look nice). For the section photo, there's also no dress code, but since it's an official photo it's nice to look decent -- basically, nothing too scandalous for ladies, or too rumpled for guys.

acrossthelake
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby acrossthelake » Thu Aug 29, 2013 4:48 pm

roranoa wrote:Do you know ppl who weren't able to get a decent job even with a degree from HLS?
What do they do?


Depends very much on how you define "decent". The answer is they eventually settle for something else. Sometimes it turns out they genuinely really liked the other thing, and sometimes it's because you have to convince yourself of that to be happy.

roranoa
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby roranoa » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:54 am

acrossthelake wrote:
roranoa wrote:Do you know ppl who weren't able to get a decent job even with a degree from HLS?
What do they do?


Depends very much on how you define "decent". The answer is they eventually settle for something else. Sometimes it turns out they genuinely really liked the other thing, and sometimes it's because you have to convince yourself of that to be happy.

Decent job, as in a job conferring the prestige that a HLS degree supposedly warrants.
(Ex. Biglaw, federal clerkships, Big corporate job, IB, consulting, professorship etc)

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Eichörnchen
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby Eichörnchen » Fri Aug 30, 2013 9:29 am

Searchparty wrote:Okay I paid $32 for a 12 pk of Sierra Nevada and 2 6-pks of Coors lt. Wtf?! Somebody tell me where I don't have pay an obnoxious amount for beer. Is this a Cambridge problem? Or should I just get used to it?

It seems that we'll have to get used to it, though I recently stocked up on gin in NH. As I get more and more stressed and anxious as class approaches, I keep thinking this was a great idea.

So I have kind of another dress code question. The orientation schedule says that one of the days we have field games. A) What the hell does that mean B) Do I really have to play field games? The category of clothes I would play field games in and clothes I planned on wearing to orientation don't have a ton of overlap. Also adults playing field games is the worst.

despina
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby despina » Fri Aug 30, 2013 9:40 am

Eichörnchen wrote:adults playing field games is the worst.


No worries, all the social / recreational stuff is optional. It might be fun and a good way to bond and get silly with members of your section, but if you're not into it, nobody will force you or take attendance.

tomwatts
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby tomwatts » Fri Aug 30, 2013 10:21 am

roranoa wrote:
acrossthelake wrote:
roranoa wrote:Do you know ppl who weren't able to get a decent job even with a degree from HLS?
What do they do?


Depends very much on how you define "decent". The answer is they eventually settle for something else. Sometimes it turns out they genuinely really liked the other thing, and sometimes it's because you have to convince yourself of that to be happy.

Decent job, as in a job conferring the prestige that a HLS degree supposedly warrants.
(Ex. Biglaw, federal clerkships, Big corporate job, IB, consulting, professorship etc)

It also depends a little bit on what you mean by "able." I know a few people who ended up not doing any of these things, but basically by choice, not because they were shut out on job apps. If you're adequately flexible (that is, you're not focused on one geographic location or practice area) and work at it a little, you can get a firm job if you want one, even with pretty bad grades. It may not be at a "prestigious" firm, but it will pay market or near-market wages, anyway. Having better grades makes it easier, but OCS is pretty good about helping those with bad grades, or so I hear.

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wert3813
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby wert3813 » Fri Aug 30, 2013 11:19 am

tomwatts wrote:
roranoa wrote:
acrossthelake wrote:
roranoa wrote:Do you know ppl who weren't able to get a decent job even with a degree from HLS?
What do they do?


Depends very much on how you define "decent". The answer is they eventually settle for something else. Sometimes it turns out they genuinely really liked the other thing, and sometimes it's because you have to convince yourself of that to be happy.

Decent job, as in a job conferring the prestige that a HLS degree supposedly warrants.
(Ex. Biglaw, federal clerkships, Big corporate job, IB, consulting, professorship etc)

It also depends a little bit on what you mean by "able." I know a few people who ended up not doing any of these things, but basically by choice, not because they were shut out on job apps. If you're adequately flexible (that is, you're not focused on one geographic location or practice area) and work at it a little, you can get a firm job if you want one, even with pretty bad grades. It may not be at a "prestigious" firm, but it will pay market or near-market wages, anyway. Having better grades makes it easier, but OCS is pretty good about helping those with bad grades, or so I hear.

Also this stuff is measurable (at least big law, clerkships, BCJ-IB-Consulting is a bit more difficult to tell) go over to LST and check out the ABA report. Just know that LST counts those continuing their education against the job score, which in general is a defensible position but probably hurts HYS more where those students often are going to be professors, not people who couldn't get a job.

acrossthelake
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Re: Harvard Student(s) Answering Your Questions

Postby acrossthelake » Fri Aug 30, 2013 12:53 pm

roranoa wrote:
acrossthelake wrote:
roranoa wrote:Do you know ppl who weren't able to get a decent job even with a degree from HLS?
What do they do?


Depends very much on how you define "decent". The answer is they eventually settle for something else. Sometimes it turns out they genuinely really liked the other thing, and sometimes it's because you have to convince yourself of that to be happy.

Decent job, as in a job conferring the prestige that a HLS degree supposedly warrants.
(Ex. Biglaw, federal clerkships, Big corporate job, IB, consulting, professorship etc)


Oh, then yes, absolutely. They settle for a job that isn't decent by your definition and claim they wanted it all along. Which makes it difficult to count how many of them there are, since some people actually do also want those jobs all along, so you have to be close enough to them to know they're lying when they say that was their desired goal. Because they will lie to most people about that.




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